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The Comprehensive List of Japanese Symbols

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#151 EastAnglian

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 12:58 PM

I just bought an Astro labelled 76.2 x 1250 circle K scope. With it came two double circle V eyepieces. What I found of interest is that they both have APL stickers on them.
Max


Wow, there has been quite a lot of activity since I last stopped in here. Max, your Royal, Circle K scope with Double V APL eyepiece is a real stumper.

I started this post a couple years ago after about 10 years of research, and 6 years of postings by knowledgeable folks here on CN. It amazes me that now 2 years post, there are still more questions and less answers. Greg, I literally have hundreds of Japanese catalogs and documents that I have translated and reviewed. All tell a story, most get contradicted later :) About the only Japanese companies that seem to have some consistency in "the story" are Nippon Kogaku and Goto Kogaku. Other than that, it was a crazy time for manfacturers in Japan in the 1950's-1980's.

Hi Steve,
Firstly, as it may be relevant, it isn't a Royal Astro, just an Astro, see here:
http://www.cloudynig...t=7&thecat=3256
I'm intrigued by your research, do you intend to publish any of it? There's obviously a lot of interest, and even in just a crude cheap form, I'm sure it would be really appreciated.
Have you anything to add on the Swift/Takahashi saga? From what I've read here, it would appear that this rumour (?) started via an odd early connection? Is there any positive ID on the AVA/AMA mark?
Cheers
Max

#152 Steve_M_M

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 01:16 PM

I feel fairly confident AVA is Takahashi. There were several confirmations from sources during posts in 2008/2009. The main person who runs a website like CN in Japan also confirmed this on several occasions. Here is one post I found.. Swift There are more, just need to look around. Swift 831

#153 EastAnglian

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 07:51 PM

Hi Steve,
I wish I read Japanese! The 'bought from friend' story needs a lot more detail to be convincing I feel; it certainly wouldn't hold up in a court of law, unless the cross-examination brought out much more detail. 'bought from Takahashi', what does that mean? I'm guessing it infers that Takahashi only sold their own make of scope; is this a fact? Can Mr Galakuma give more details I wonder? I find it extraordinary that the AVA/AMA whatever it is, mark, has not been positively identified. I'll do some more searching as you suggest, but I'm seriously beginning to think that this is a quagmire from which there's no escaping!
Cheers
Max

#154 Steve_M_M

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Posted 11 February 2012 - 08:03 PM

I pretty much trust Hiroki Shirakawa (Galakuma) and symbols. If he is not sure, he states such. Here is a post where there seems to be no doubt.

http://www.cloudynig...5/o/all/fpart/1

This post also reminded me that I have ads from Sky & Telescope that say "Takahashi by Swift". Not the same telescope as the 831, but no doubt a relationship between the two. Swift AVA and "infinity" as Takahashi seem likely, if not 100%. There are tons of other unknowns :)

#155 EastAnglian

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Posted 12 February 2012 - 08:16 AM

I pretty much trust Hiroki Shirakawa (Galakuma) and symbols. If he is not sure, he states such. Here is a post where there seems to be no doubt.

http://www.cloudynig...5/o/all/fpart/1

This post also reminded me that I have ads from Sky & Telescope that say "Takahashi by Swift". Not the same telescope as the 831, but no doubt a relationship between the two. Swift AVA and "infinity" as Takahashi seem likely, if not 100%. There are tons of other unknowns :)

Hi Steve,
Firstly and importantly I'd like to say there is no question of me not trusting Galakuma. He is a very polite and enormously helpful man. But I've learnt through research of various kinds, that each and every piece of information must be double checked, or you can get into the realms of assumption.
Right, having said that, let me tell you what I now have in my mind, and ask you to correct me. A company called Swift started out making astronomical telescopes in 1961 (?) For some reason they called their scopes Takahashi (existing optical company they chose to use?) During the next six years they manufactured at least three models numbered 838, 839 and 831 and sold them principally to foreign markets. For some reason unknown, in 1967 Swifts optical makers Takahashi decided to go their own way. Is this when 831's ceased to be made? I have to say I find the TS 65mm (the first Tak) to be interesting for two reasons. Firstly the length of the dew shield, and secondly it's colour. It would be easy to see how Tak carried this area of design over initially.
This is all of course ignoring the AMA/AVA device. From what I've gatheres so far this is unlikely to ever be solved; but, never say never!
Cheers
Max

#156 Steve_M_M

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Posted 12 February 2012 - 12:49 PM

Hi Max,

The deciphering of the symbols is quite difficult. I just read some of the other recent threads on the 831 subject and I see lots of questioning, wanting proof, etc. Unfortunately, after years of research on this subject I think we will always be left with conjecture.

It reminds me of the story of an old watch I have. The watch has been passed down for many generations in my family. The story goes that the watch was owned by american outlaw Jesse James in about 1867. The watch is from 1867. CD Peacock in Chicago verified they sold the watch in about 1867. Is there proof it was owned by Jesse James? Nope, just stories.

I like to think I have a cool watch from Jesse James. Those with 831's like to think they have a cool Takahashi telescope. Both may be true :)

Steve

PS, no disrespect was meant on the Galakuma comment, I think we all trust eachother but also look for "proof"

#157 EastAnglian

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Posted 12 February 2012 - 12:56 PM

Hi Max,

PS, no disrespect was meant on the Galakuma comment, I think we all trust eachother but also look for "proof"

Hi Steve,
No disrespect taken. I do sometimes say stuff that I think afterwards I could have worded better!
Enjoy the watch, and in your secret moments.........
Cheers
Max

#158 nightfisher

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Posted 13 February 2012 - 12:24 PM

I have just bought a Towa 80mm f15, but its branded as "TOPIC PROFESSIONAL" It was Philj that confirmed it to be a Towa (circle T)i will be mounting it on a decent mount, selling the old mount and tripod along with the four 1" ep`s it came with,and fitting a crawmach 1 1/4 crayford

#159 Steve_M_M

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 11:22 PM

Over the years, I think this thread has gone through the washer and come out a different color. Even so, I thought I would add a new eyepiece/symbol to the thread.

Anyone care to guess what telescope this BOL Japan eyepiece goes to???

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#160 Ducky62

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 11:27 PM

What is the thread diameter?

#161 Steve_M_M

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 11:47 PM

30mm :)

#162 Ducky62

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 12:04 AM

How many elements?

#163 Steve_M_M

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 12:43 AM

5 elements in 3 groups-Erfle

I should have taken some pictures when I had it apart this evening. :(

#164 albert1

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 01:16 AM

Q?

#165 tim53

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 11:24 AM

Over the years, I think this thread has gone through the washer and come out a different color. Even so, I thought I would add a new eyepiece/symbol to the thread.

Anyone care to guess what telescope this BOL Japan eyepiece goes to???


Bushnell Optical Laboratories?

-Tim.

#166 Steve_M_M

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 01:19 PM

Q?


Correct. It is the 80-160x eyepiece from a 1972 Questar 3.5. The 40-80x eyepiece is not marked BOL. I find it interesting that Questar was using the same BOL manufacturer as many of our classic scopes.

#167 albert1

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Posted 24 November 2012 - 10:11 PM

My late 60's Questar had that same EP I believe.

#168 BobH

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Posted 28 November 2012 - 07:19 PM

Now, a couple impostors. First Circle W. Anyone know where this comes from?


I went through this entire thread, albeit rather quickly, and could not find an answer.....what is the Circle W?

Thanks,

Bob

#169 jimarshall

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Posted 29 November 2012 - 10:59 AM

Now, a couple impostors. First Circle W. Anyone know where this comes from?


I went through this entire thread, albeit rather quickly, and could not find an answer.....what is the Circle W?

Thanks,

Bob

Who knows...and to complicate matters, I have a circle "W" Jason that came with diamond "Z" eyepieces! :lol:

#170 eric_zeiner

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:06 PM

I just picked up a 1984 Swift 60/800 Aerolite and it has a KD on the underside of the focuser on the rack plate. I used to know this brand but have forgotten, any ideas? It has some Cartonesque features to it but it also has more plastic than I would have hoped for. It is a model 863.

#171 Steve_M_M

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 09:23 PM

I believe that is Kenko. Is it like this KD?

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#172 mgwhittle

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 10:38 PM

I believe KD is Koyu.....KD labeled parts and eyepieces can be found on early Vixen products and Koyu was the predecessor company to Vixen.

#173 CharlieB

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 10:40 PM

I just picked up a 1984 Swift 60/800 Aerolite and it has a KD on the underside of the focuser on the rack plate. I used to know this brand but have forgotten, any ideas?


I have a couple of .965 Celestron branded orthos with a similar KD logo.

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#174 joerbiker

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 11:18 PM

If you check out this post: Crescent "KD" on CN You'll see the same mark on a Crescent in my collection. I've been trying to track that down for almost a year.

Good to know that it may have some early Vixen ancestry.

#175 mgwhittle

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 11:31 PM

If you check out this post: Crescent "KD" on CN You'll see the same mark on a Crescent in my collection. I've been trying to track that down for almost a year.

Good to know that it may have some early Vixen ancestry.


And the silver sticker on yours is identical in shape and font color to Vixen labeled scopes. I also suspect it's not a D in what we call KD for a variety of reasons but some kind of stylized symbol around the K that we are interpreting as a D. However I still refer to it as KD in posts because everyone is familiar with that term. And I could be wrong.... :confused:






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