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My latest, earliest project.

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#1 tim53

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Posted 29 January 2011 - 11:31 PM

3 of the 4 boxes of parts from the Tulley and Sons 3.25" refractor arrove today!

For those who didn't see it on ebay, this is what I purchased:

-Tim.

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#2 tim53

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Posted 29 January 2011 - 11:32 PM

Engraving on the tube, "Tulley and Sons Islington, London"

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#3 jsiska

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Posted 29 January 2011 - 11:39 PM

WOW!!! WHAT A CLASSIC!!!

#4 tim53

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Posted 29 January 2011 - 11:42 PM

As a horsey friend of mine used to say "it was rode hard, and put away wet!"

There are a lot of light-years on this telescope!

From the first pic, I could tell there was a lot missing to the mount, not the least of which are the tripod legs. Those hinges at the base must have attached to the legs. The hinges are a lot more massive than they look, and I bet the legs were massive too. I'm not afraid of making replacements, but I do want to see if I can find something to copy, at least a general idea of the styles used at the time it was built.

From what I've been able to find on the internet, Charles Tulley had two sons who went into business with him making telescopes. Prior to 1826, it appears Charles was in business by himself, then included his sons in the company name and engravings on the scopes in 1826. Charles died in 1830, and one of his sons in 1835, but it seems his remaining son(s) kept the name "Tulley and Sons, Islington, London" perhaps up until 1848.

I'm still missing a USPS box of parts including the cell and lens elements. But nobody I've corresponded with so far believes that the lens is original. The seller even said he thought it must be modern because it's too clear and white. I guess I'm hoping that, if it is a replacement, that it's an old one, and not something like a 30-yr old Jaegers (not that there's anything wrong with that!). I'll have to wait and see.

-Tim.

#5 Ducky62

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Posted 29 January 2011 - 11:45 PM

What does the objective look like and how does it see?
Put any light on it yet? (edit:Missed your last post.)
I was following the discussion on the ATS group about this 'scope.

#6 tim53

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Posted 29 January 2011 - 11:47 PM

Closer view of the mount, from the ad. I'm getting goosebumpy here, because I like puzzles (at least if they appear to have a chance of being solvable) and the pictures didn't show some of the neatest things about this mount that are still there:

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#7 tim53

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Posted 29 January 2011 - 11:50 PM

What does the objective look like and how does it see?
Put any light on it yet?


The objective and cell haven't showed up yet. Hopefully monday.

Here they are from the ad, though. And this is why the seller thought (and the ATS guys think) it's a modern lens. Seller said he never had it mounted in the cell and on the tube in the 15 years he's had it.

-Tim.

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#8 tim53

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Posted 29 January 2011 - 11:54 PM

The two braces on the mount between the round thingy and the azimuth sector ("1st stage") were made by the seller. I'm thinking that the original was likely a wooden plate with bronze or brass fittings on it, but that it was likely rather simple. More about how it looks like it worked in a bit.

This is cool, and didn't show in the ad pics. The rod that the upper azimuth stage [edit: that should have said "altitude stage"] is mounted to has a rack and pinion with it, with a handle that would have been attached to a u-joint at the other end (one prong broken, handle missing):

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#9 tim53

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Posted 29 January 2011 - 11:58 PM

It's kind of dark, but the pinion gear for that rack is between the two altitude plates mounted to a cutout in the sleeve that the rack moves up and down in.

An, from the ad pics, there was a rack and pinion for azimuth adjustment. I was delighted to see that the pinion is still there, but the handle is missing

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#10 tim53

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 12:03 AM

One sad thing: See the pinkish spots in the wood in the picture above, just below that rod that crosses over the scope cradle? That's the end of the cradle board, and I thought it was just old putty. But it's broken there. When I first saw it, I thought it was damaged in shipping, which seemed odd because the seller REALLY, REALLY packed it well. But then I looked at the pic above again and realized it's probably an old break:

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#11 tim53

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 12:06 AM

A bummer, to be sure. While we're looking at the pic above, note the rod that goes across the board. It's got a knob on the right end, and is threaded on the left end. I thought a knob was missing, but it's a clamp. Tighten the knob and the brass ears it's attached to pinch the cradle from moving. I wish I could see what the end of that cradle looked like. It wasn't just another radius block like the one in the middle and the other end, because the board has the remnants of a rabbet at this end and there's none at the other end. Something to cogitate.

-Tim.

#12 tim53

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 12:14 AM

Here's another cool view. Underside of the azimuth sector, showing the rod and slider for what must have been the coarse altitude adjustment (the rod with the rack on it is for fine).

I had thought that the pinball-bumper-looking things at this end belonged on the upper side to keep the sector from swinging past the rack, but they are clamps to tighten agains two square rods (right one missing) that attach to the metal piece that slides back and forth along the rod. I wonder if there were handles on the ends of these rods to allow the user to grab hold and pull the scope up or down. But with two of them, how would you tighten the pinball bumpers when you got the scope where you wanted it?? So maybe they're just guide rods of some sort? Will need to figure that out!

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#13 sgorton99

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 08:33 AM

Now that is a classic! Looks like you are the right person to own this scope - have fun!

#14 Joe Cepleur

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 11:17 AM

Any speculation about the design of the unique mount? It certainly supports that long tube well, to prevent sagging, and it may also be resistant to vibration. It could also be more durable than a mount with a single pivot point (important when working with brass), easier to aim, and it would have all the range of motion necessary for pointing out one's window. Wonderful contraption, whatever it's for.

#15 tim53

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 11:33 AM

Hi Joe:

While the seller thought it had been some sort of ship's telescope or that it was part of a castle, I quickly recognized that mount as an early 19th century altazimuth mount for astronomical use. Unfortunately (so far) I haven't found any pictures of any Tulley mounts quite like it. Elements of it can be seen in other mounts, of course, but a couple of things I think I need to see at least a picture of a mount like it to be able to replicate missing parts.

What I'll probably do, while I'm restoring the mount (doing as little as possible to the original mount, but replicating missing parts so it can be made functional), is make a set of rings to mount the OTA on one of my Super Polaris mounts, so I can use it.

-Tim.

#16 tim53

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 12:02 PM

I don't think I mentioned before, but other Tulley scopes I've seen pictures of have a finder scope mounted to the tube in the usual place at the eyepiece end, using brackets similar to the one supporting the focus knob. But there are no holes in the tube at this end, and it doesn't appear at first glance that any have been filled, either.

-Tim.

#17 clintwhitman

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 12:05 PM

Tim Quite the contraption!! I love it, has all the ear marks of a great antique telescope for sure. Man its old and wonderful for sure. The lens looks bigger than the cell, might be the camera angle? Well I think this is one of the "look at" telescopes anyways, You know you set it up in the parlor to look at because it is so cool looking. If you get to look through it it just an added plus!! Anyhow I am glad it found you. If anyone can put it in order you can...
Thanks for the posts and keep us posted!!
(aveman :bow:

#18 tim53

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 12:12 PM

Thanks Clint!

I think it's the camera angle that makes the lens look bigger than the cell, but I'll have to wait to make sure. The seller said he never mounted it because he didn't have a clue what order and which direction the lenses should go.

Here's a pic that Peter Abrahams scanned for me from Pearson 1829, of a 3" Tulley on an altaz mount. Not very similar to this mount, but handles, racks and cranks look along the same lines

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#19 tim53

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 12:17 PM

I should add that my impression is that this mount is a newer mount than most I've seen pictures of. Note, for example, in the scanned picture, the user would have to go around to the "front" of the tripod to coarse adjust the altitude with that crank midway up the tripod. And any coarse azimuth adjustment would require picking up and moving the whole telescope.

The ebay mount looks to have had a swivel (beneath that round thingy midway up the pier) for coarse azimuth, and the coarse altitude would be via the lower altitude stage. Then, knobs or cranks near the eyepiece would allow manually tracking for an hour or so (I'm guessing, of course). Moving to new objects wouldn't require moving the whole telescope.

-Tim.

#20 akman1955

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 01:10 PM

:)Nice one Tim.. :bow: can't wait till you get the lense. john :gotpopcorn:

#21 apfever

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 01:48 PM

Tim,

You do have that pier with the center section that you say looks like it pivots for azmuth? If you need any gear adapters to control position from the eyepiece, we both know where to go looking...Joss' house. Gramps has everything geared and extended to everything else everywhere all the time.

Can you identify the type of wood? You'll want to match that if you need to. I'd like to know your opinion of what finish it may have had. Hopefully it is originally a clear form that showed grain, and has just darkened through the years. That scope would look so awesome with the wood grain against nicely patina brass/metal works (just an opinion).

Neil

#22 mikey cee

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 01:55 PM

Tim....As per your first pic how does it stay balanced? Looks way front end heavy. Or is the pier real heavy and the tube assembly without lens and cell rather light? :question:Mike

#23 PiSigma

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 02:54 PM

Wow, that's neat. It will interesting to see if you can find any pictures or drawings of this scope.

#24 tim53

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 03:36 PM

Neil:

Yeah, Gramps probably had the gears, and if so, they're probably in that shed, but getting hold of Joss has been difficult, and I just got postponed this morning until this afternoon for perhaps the umpteenth time! At some point, I'm just going to give up on any further acquisitions from this guy and PM his email to anybody who's interested. I've lost track of the time I've invested in this already.

-Tim.

#25 tim53

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Posted 30 January 2011 - 03:39 PM

Tim....As per your first pic how does it stay balanced? Looks way front end heavy. Or is the pier real heavy and the tube assembly without lens and cell rather light? :question:Mike


There's got to be a rather substantial, squatty tripod or pier that's missing. I may be building something soon to serve temporarily as a tripod so I can set the scope up in the parlor (yes, our house is old enough to have two parlors - a formal and a "family" (they didn't call them "living rooms" in the 1880s) - and this scope will be in the roomier family parlor).

-Tim.






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