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Is this $35,000 7"refractor deal for real?

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#101 Napersky

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 08:04 PM

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#102 Darren Drake

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 08:42 PM

And napersky just got an AP 6 inch superplanetary today with this mount. I'll be there the next clear night to help set up and get going....

#103 Peter Natscher

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 10:30 PM

TEC is not producing 180's, or 160's for that matter -- no glass. Only 140's ;( Roland is producing only 130's. Big glass from AP and TEC is gone!! Roland is finishing up the last few of his 175's run right now. And that will be it.

At this price, I would either get the TEC 180 or a 17 RCOS and a Paramount.



#104 Peter Natscher

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 10:40 PM

The 140's were made from cut-down 160 f/7 glass blanks, and 160's are no longer able to be bought at the quality level that Roland, or TEC, is interested in. So, I won't see any more 140's being made, either. Let's see: no 140's, no 160's, no 175's, no 180's, no 200's. Gee, no big glass coming out of the US anymore. Maybe, China will start up production? Only 130's and 140's from AP and TEC, unless you go over to LZOS. And, you still have to get on that danged 6-8 year list for a little AP 130 ;(

You're too late to get on the list for APs, from what Roland is saying. But, there is a fellow with a BNIB AP130 EDFGT on sale on the other website, along with a low time unit with the rings and dovetail on a newer ad.

-Rich


Well, I just received the auto response email from AP that I'm on their 140mm F7.5 notification list. I guess the question is will Roland still be around to "oversee" production of my scope sometime in the next decade. I'll need those 10 years or so to save up my nickels and dimes any way.



#105 Mike Clemens

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 04:27 PM

Offer $17k on astromart for a TEC200 and you will probably get bites. (Though not from me.) I do not think all the TEC200 have yet fallen into "permanent owners".

#106 coz

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 04:38 PM

I believe he's making TEC 180s but they are FL.

#107 mgwhittle

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 05:12 PM

Offer $17k on astromart for a TEC200 and you will probably get bites. (Though not from me.) I do not think all the TEC200 have yet fallen into "permanent owners".


I hope that is not correct.....17K for a TEC200? Sounds like too good a deal to me.

#108 gillmj24

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 05:27 PM

A 180 recently sold for about that much.

#109 M13 Observer

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 05:45 PM

At this price, I would either get the TEC 180 or a 17 RCOS and a Paramount.

TEC is not producing 180's, or 160's for that matter -- no glass. Only 140's ;( Roland is producing only 130's. Big glass from AP and TEC is gone!! Roland is finishing up the last few of his 175's run right now. And that will be it.


TEC is currently producing 180FL OTA's. According to Yuri, they are also producing a few 110FLT's and a few 6" Maks but I think the Mak list is closed. That or they are just auctioning them off on eBay to the highest bidder. Not sure about the availability of the 180 or the 110 if you didn't get your name on the lists about a year ago.

#110 Mike Clemens

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 06:13 PM

I have seen a couple go for that price. I am referring to the TEC200 ED f/9 scopes. I haven't noticed a fluorite TEC200 trading in any recent times. Someone who offered that much got multiple bites I heard from TEC200 ED owners. I do not think it will take many shakes before they end up in their final owner hands.


Offer $17k on astromart for a TEC200 and you will probably get bites. (Though not from me.) I do not think all the TEC200 have yet fallen into "permanent owners".


I hope that is not correct.....17K for a TEC200? Sounds like too good a deal to me.



#111 maknewtnut

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 07:12 PM

I don't recall if the TMB designed/LZOS made 175/1400 has made it into the discussion yet. IMHO...still one of THE most overlooked, and (at least at one point) best 'value' for a large apochromatic refractor.

Mike can certainly comment on that optic (albeit IIRC, he experienced teething problems with his).

#112 MrGrytt

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 09:24 PM

I don't recall if the TMB designed/LZOS made 175/1400 has made it into the discussion yet. IMHO...still one of THE most overlooked, and (at least at one point) best 'value' for a large apochromatic refractor.


They seem to be a well kept secret for some reason, except to the people who have them. Maybe it's because they're slightly more expensive than the new AP 175 f/8, even at the present fairly low exchange rate.

If they came with a dedicated field flattener and case like the AP scope they would be significantly more expensive. Without those accessories the AP would be significantly less expensive. However, the TMB does come with rings and the AP doesn't.

Optically I would bet they are very close to identical. I wouldn't want to bet against either one.

Harvey

#113 Mike Clemens

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 10:00 PM

Did you get an AP175 Harvey?

Yes I loved the LZOS 175/1400 and have room in my heart to love another one some day....

I spent pretty much the entire time I had the 175/1400 on Mars. I looked at Saturn just enough to see that it looked remarkably sharp and pastel in the 175, before going back to the favorable Mars apparition of the time. Color correction to my eyes was completely perfect.

I wish I would have taken more photos through it. I was pretty much transfixed as a visual planetary observer at the time. I snapped a few single frame pics of Mars through a DSLR:
http://www.pbase.com...848526/original
http://www.pbase.com...848469/original

#114 MrGrytt

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 11:18 PM

Did you get an AP175 Harvey?

Yes I loved the LZOS 175/1400 and have room in my heart to love another one some day....

I spent pretty much the entire time I had the 175/1400 on Mars. I looked at Saturn just enough to see that it looked remarkably sharp and pastel in the 175, before going back to the favorable Mars apparition of the time. Color correction to my eyes was completely perfect.

I wish I would have taken more photos through it. I was pretty much transfixed as a visual planetary observer at the time. I snapped a few single frame pics of Mars through a DSLR:
http://www.pbase.com...848526/original
http://www.pbase.com...848469/original


Hi Mike,
Yes, the AP 175 will be coming soon. I actually could have had it several months ago but I told them I was in no hurry and they should feel free to back me up on the time table. I sent in the final payment some time ago but have asked them to try to back the shipping up until I can be home to receive it in a couple months.

The TMB/LZOS 175 was a fantastic scope to have for Mars in 2003 and we were lucky to be alive for that one. Certainly the best views of Mars I've ever had.

I'm fairly certain that the TMB/LZOS optics have the best polychromatic Strehl of any scopes that were available. I suspect that the recent AP air-spaced designs (160 and 175) are in the same ballpark along with the Tak TOA scopes.

Harvey

#115 Joe C

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 11:49 PM

Did you get an AP175 Harvey?

Yes I loved the LZOS 175/1400 and have room in my heart to love another one some day....

I spent pretty much the entire time I had the 175/1400 on Mars. I looked at Saturn just enough to see that it looked remarkably sharp and pastel in the 175, before going back to the favorable Mars apparition of the time. Color correction to my eyes was completely perfect.

I wish I would have taken more photos through it. I was pretty much transfixed as a visual planetary observer at the time. I snapped a few single frame pics of Mars through a DSLR:
http://www.pbase.com...848526/original
http://www.pbase.com...848469/original


Hi Mike,
Yes, the AP 175 will be coming soon. I actually could have had it several months ago but I told them I was in no hurry and they should feel free to back me up on the time table. I sent in the final payment some time ago but have asked them to try to back the shipping up until I can be home to receive it in a couple months.

The TMB/LZOS 175 was a fantastic scope to have for Mars in 2003 and we were lucky to be alive for that one. Certainly the best views of Mars I've ever had.

I'm fairly certain that the TMB/LZOS optics have the best polychromatic Strehl of any scopes that were available. I suspect that the recent AP air-spaced designs (160 and 175) are in the same ballpark along with the Tak TOA scopes.

Harvey


Harvey, You can just have them ship me yours. :grin: When mine is ready, they can send it to you. I have been eagerly waiting for mine to be finished and shipped.

#116 maknewtnut

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 01:14 AM

Great input fellas. Thanks.

That 'one point' I was referring to was when the TMB-LZOS 175/1400's were selling for around $12-14K. It seemed the market was asking for bigger and faster, so sales on the LZOS 180/1260 left some 175's sitting on the shelf.

In the context posed by the OP, one can draw a strong opinion about added collector's value...which IMHO is driven more by the heart than the mind.

#117 Maverick199

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 01:37 AM

I read somewhere an arab paid million dollars for a scope. What's $35,000?

#118 Mike Clemens

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 02:05 AM

> That 'one point' I was referring to was when the
> TMB-LZOS 175/1400's were selling for around $12-14K.

I undercut that by building the OTA myself. Paid $7900 for the TMB175/8 lens new in 2004. Built the tube for about $2000: http://www.pbase.com...nstruction_pics
Took a healthy loss on sale due to people having fear of a homebuilt tube. Someone got a killer deal.

#119 MrGrytt

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 06:00 PM

Harvey, You can just have them ship me yours. :grin: When mine is ready, they can send it to you. I have been eagerly waiting for mine to be finished and shipped.


That very well could happen. I certainly gave them my permission. Of course I also told them that it was okay if Roland wanted to keep picking away at it until it was around .997 Strehl or better.

Harvey

#120 MrGrytt

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 06:37 PM

> That 'one point' I was referring to was when the
> TMB-LZOS 175/1400's were selling for around $12-14K.

I undercut that by building the OTA myself. Paid $7900 for the TMB175/8 lens new in 2004. Built the tube for about $2000: http://www.pbase.com...nstruction_pics
Took a healthy loss on sale due to people having fear of a homebuilt tube. Someone got a killer deal.


Wow, how things change. The lens in cell alone now goes for $15,200. I don't doubt that someone got a killer deal. The tubes you built were very nice.

Harvey

#121 bremms

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 06:42 PM

For a really fine handmade instrument.. $35k is not a lot of money. I think we are too used to telescope prices from mass production. $35k is a lot of money and I wouldn't spend that n a scope. But I can understand why somebody would. I think +5k for an 80mm Zeiss is more out of line. Great scope but not that rare. A 5" D&G will eat it for breakfast with room left over. It's all about what it's worth to someone. I'm a bit of a car guy and have some friends with some great collections. (Mostly Italian exotics)Went to an picnic a couple years ago at somone's house. He had a Ferrari Enzo and Mclaren F1 just sitting there.. Doesn't drive them. What is the point? My buddy and I were sad. Two of the most fabulous road cars ever made and you don't drive them? Went to another event at Road Atlanta where the CFO of microsoft had a 250 GTO and Fangio's GP car. Flogging them and I mean flogging them on the track.. nice guy too. We were talking about how Enzo would be happy that the cars were being used.

#122 Mike Clemens

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 07:16 PM

Hey Harvey

Where do you see prices on lens alone?

#123 MrGrytt

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 07:51 PM

Hey Harvey

Where do you see prices on lens alone?


On the APM site.

http://tinyurl.com/bz2rhy7

Once you select a specific item it will also show you the export price in Euros. Then you have to multiply it by today's exchange rate, which right now is 1.3055.

Harvey

#124 Mike Clemens

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 01:08 AM

Wow! 4500 euro * 1.3 for a 130 f6 lens in cell... $5800...
Was $2600 when I bought one ten years ago. Not a good trend !!

I guess if I ever build a scope for old times sake it will be a 100/8. (Which I love.)

I see those prices "inkl. 19 % MwSt. zzgl. Versandkosten"

Maybe people in America don't pay that.

#125 Mark9473

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 05:17 AM

Like Harvey said, look for the export price, 3777 euro in this case.






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