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D=103mm F=1575mm Jaegers Homemade Refractor update

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#126 Z28500

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Posted 31 August 2013 - 09:23 PM

Another shot, The shoe actually puts pressure against the vertical shaft on a machined area on the lower end of the shaft above the lower shaft bearing. The pad was easy to make, just put a piece of fine sandpaper, all the way to about 400 grit on the shaft and then sand the pad on it until it conforms to the same shape, did the same thing to the brass pad housing. The shaft itself isn't just one smooth wall, it has been turned down smaller on each end a couple inches so that the bearings lock in place. I posted a picture of the shaft on top of the center tray last year on the 1st thread, 4th picture/post down (There is also a picture of the ascension brake/tension control on the same page, 7th post down:
http://www.cloudynig...&Board=atm&N...
:step:
Z

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#127 Z28500

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Posted 31 August 2013 - 10:10 PM

Just about finished, Soon I will start on the 6 inch APO. It's that real fast lens from OWL. I've already mocked it up and achieved focus on a star. Some other guys have already built working scopes out of that lens and the pictures they took through the lens were very impressive. The key to a success will be getting the corrector at the right distance then focusing the EP. I plan on utilizing a double crayford focuser configuration I'll have build myself, kinda tricky, but it will be like the corrector will move back and forth like an EP and then the EP itself will also move in and out in a focuser "on a focuser"! all in very close proximity, The EP has to be almost touching the corrector. And to make things even harder, I'm putting in a beamsplitter like the original had. (Already bought a 2 inch beamsplitter)

:step:
Z

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#128 Z28500

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Posted 31 August 2013 - 10:15 PM

Here is the coolest I've seen that one someone built from those lenses, looks like 1-1/4" focuser though. I going to have to go with 2". And why not? all it is is money! Got to throw it away on something!
:step:
Z

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#129 Z28500

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Posted 16 September 2013 - 03:22 PM

Looks like the telescope is going to be in the Sept/Oct issue of Astronomy Technology Today magazine! Maybe even on the cover, not sure. That is if I can get the pictures in by before the end of the week and we're taking them on Wednesday.
Finally, after almost a year & a half.
:step:
Z

#130 dawsonian2000

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 10:10 PM

Hey Z!

That issue rolled out recently! :shocked: I will be sure to check your article out. Welcome to the club of ATT contributing authors! Congratulations! :bow: :bow: :bow:

Mel

#131 brewer

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 10:27 PM

I just purchase one refracting telescope on http://refractingtelescopesreview.com,it is great!I need aluminum tubing,but I don't know where to buy it.If you know anything about this,please tell me.

#132 dawsonian2000

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Posted 04 October 2013 - 10:55 PM

Hi Brewer!

There are a number of places you can purchase aluminum tubing from. You just have to check each of the vendors to see there offerings and prices. You can also check out eBay for some deals. In any case, below is a list of vendors I have used before:

Air Flow Systems
Hastings Irrigation Tubing
Speedy Metals

I would also be happy to search around to see if we can find you a great deal. I just need to know the details about the scope you are constructing (i.e., objective size and focal length -- tube diameter and length)

Mel

#133 Z28500

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 01:31 PM

Hi Mel,
Thanks, but I didn't get the pictures in on time. That was something I hadn't anticipated, the photography! It was a lot harder than I expected! A friend of mine is taking the pic's because he has a high resolution camera I'm not to sure about the Christmas issue. Oh well, I've been talking to Gary and he's pretty cool and working with me.
Anyway now all I got left is 3 more scopes to build. A 60mm F/12 with a dual speed 2" focuser, A 155mm Fast Apo, and a 10" Schiefspiegler. The little 60mm will be cool for a grab and go and will pack a punch with the 2" EP. I've already held up a 2" 38mm 5 element to it and wow! I think I'm getting spoiled on 2" oculars.
By the way, the pic here is fully extended, it can be retracted for normal viewing and the silver alum. bar is hidden. But when the scope is straight up then it is desirable to extend it so that the EP is about close to 5 foot off the ground and easy to look through. Normally, I leave it down though. Straight up & extended, it is over 10 foot tall. It's about 5-1/2' to the top of the fork and 5'8" to the top of the brass weight, down and horizontal. Actually, building it with the double inner & outer extension shaft was easier because it enabled me to be able to take it apart real easy, just loosen the locking bolt that just twist-turns off, and lift the fork, ring mount assembly and scope up and out of the tripod. The gear drive is attached to the outer shaft and stays on the tripod. It's easily removed also because although there are 7 gears making up the declination gear drive 2 actually are rubber to steel shaft making the final gear ratio 312:1. Ascension is the same, 312:1. all gears but disengagable by either disengaging the worm gear or by taking the tension off the gear drive or both. The shafts are able to "free spin" or lock, or adjust the drag like on a fishing reel. That way if by accident, too much pressure was put on the gears, like pushing on the scope with the gears engaged, all that happens is the scope moves without the gears getting hurt!. When using the "point and look" feature, the gears are completely disengaged. And lastly the rest of the tripod breaks down easy, all that is necessary is to pull the outer shaft out and twist off the 3 large black round knobs under the tray, it comes out and the tripod legs fold together into a tight skinny section.
:step:
Z

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#134 Z28500

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 02:07 PM

Right side pic

:step:
Z

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#135 Z28500

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 02:08 PM

Next scope, a 155mm triplet, dual, dual speed focusing assemblies with planetary bearings, They're not really that hard to make, just a lot of machine work. I have to make three. 2 for the dual focuser, and 1 for the 60mm. It's possible that the corrector focuser may not be dual speed, it's not really necessary. The corrector isn't what does the focusing. I just changes the field of view. With the corrector in close, I believe the F ratio can get over 3.5 but the field of view is a lot less. I've seen this scope get built with the corrector fixed & non adjustable but the original assembly was adjustable and had a beamsplitter. I also have a beamsplitter which is just large enough to use with 2" EP's and not see it's edges, around 46mm
Some of the measurements may be changed, this scope is still in planning stage, I've already drawn the plans over 10 times
I have had this lens in mock up and focused it in on a star. It was a bright white one and there was NO chromatic aberration! It's kinda weird, the closer the corrector is to the objective lens, the farther away the EP is from the corrector. Which means the drawing is not exactly how the scope would be in focus in real time. This is nothing more than a diagram of the mechanics of the scope. Basically, I want the scope to be as nice as the red and silver scope a few posts above. I plan on shiny brass and polished aluminum though. And maybe an aluminum tripod unless I use my Velbon Victory 650.
:step:
Z

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#136 Z28500

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Posted 07 October 2013 - 02:57 PM

And last but not least the focuser, some of you guys may want to copy this, I don't care, that's why I'm putting it up, just a standard crayford with planet bearings. The secret to planet bearings is in the tension adjustment. Properly done, it's as smooth as glass, and I gotta admit, I'm spoiled on the dual speeds. I may even skinny up more on the thin shaft and make an even lower gear ratio! And it'll probably be necessary with that real fast scope anyway!
The lower housing will be shortened and by the way, the 2-3/4" tube assembly is the 60mm scope one of the focusers will be going on. The lower housing on that particular scope will be made out of brass. The tube assembly will probably be changed though with the EP tube being 2-1/2" O.D. and the I.D. being 2". E.P. Tubes are easy to make out of aluminum, in order to get rid of the glare you just put black threaded barrel sleeves inside the tube and stop it where the eyepiece will come into contact with it as the E.P. shoulder is resting on the tube's end!
Flatten the bottom of the tube for the focuser shaft leaving the lip on each end so the tube won't fall out and... done deal!
A precision bearing can used on the left side instead of the bearings in the pic. It is actually easier, all you have to do is order a 1/4" I.D bearing from a bearing site like: http://www.vxb.com/ & the O.D. & thickness doesn't matter, just make the O.D. fit into the knob, that's all. Super simple. You can do the same thing on the planetary side, the bearing just needs to be fixed to the main shaft by it's outer "O.D." by fitting it in tight into the sleeve attached to the main shaft and the I.D has to fit tightly to the small planetary shaft thereby eliminating the loose bearings and also eliminating machine work.
:step:
Z

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#137 Z28500

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 06:39 PM

I just purchase one refracting telescope on http://refractingtelescopesreview.com,it is great!I need aluminum tubing,but I don't know where to buy it.If you know anything about this,please tell me.



Here's a couple more places besides Speedy Metals (which by the way is where I bought the tube for the scope in this thread then turned it down to about .060" on a lathe)

Already painted alum tube:
http://www.parallaxi...ubingprice.html

BRASS:
http://www.lewisbras...d-brass-tubing/

http://www.dgoptical.com/tubing.htm

Fiberglass:
http://www.parksopti...glass Tubes ...

Concrete Forms up to 60 inch diameter!:
http://www.sonotube..../sizechart.aspx

I have a bunch more but I didn't want to stick them all on here, I think these are enough. Parallax tubes come already painted which is a plus but I think a $75.00 minimum is mandatory.
I didn't know about the Hastings site, they look pretty cool! I had the Air Flow Systems though, go all the way down to the bottom of the page and there is a 5" splitter, you could put in a couple dielectric mirror's and 2 people could look through at the same time - good for dating! Like 1 glass and 2 straws!
Hey - it's a joke!
Speedy Metals is by far my personal favorite, but the thinnest you can get is .125" (1/8") so a lathe is necessary unless you are just building a small scope, then who cares? I like being able to adjust the thickness of the metal to whatever I want, but that's just me. Others may like having it already painted and not having to do as much work. Some beautiful scopes have been made that way also. Almost every piece of metal you see on this thread for the F/15 I built was purchased from Speedy Metals! Including the brass and the aluminum for the star diagonal.
Are you redoing the scope you just bought? If it is 60mm or less I would go with Speedy Metals. I redid a 60mm a while back and used an aluminum tube and sanded it with 600 grit and polished it and it almost looks like a mirror. I'm going to rebuild it again and put a 2" dual speed focuser on it and polish it again, when I do it I'll start another thread on it entitled something like "Rebuilding a 60mmm F/12 w/2" Focuser to pack a Punch!" or something like that. Anyway, I'm really gonna do it.
Good luck with the tube.
:step:
Z

#138 Z28500

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Posted 08 October 2013 - 11:19 PM

Here is another focuser diagram I drew revised a little bit. It's probably the one I'll use except shortened a little bit.
As you can see, it's really not all that hard to build, maybe a little tedious, but not any harder than anything I fabricated on this entire F/15 over the last year and a half. The only thing that's really crucial is that the shafts & bearings have to be PERFECTLY centered. It's possible mistakes can be made, just throw the piece away and make it again!
Z

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#139 dawsonian2000

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 08:52 PM

Hey Z!

Thanks for sharing those great shots of your scope. The OTA reminds me a great deal of the SkyLight 15 refractors. An awesome design, as well.

You have really put your heart and soul into this scope build. The craftsmanship is outstanding!

I would not submit your article until you have good photos. You definitely want readers to see the awesome work you have done on this scope. Have you performed first light yet? If so, how does it perform?

Mel

#140 Z28500

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 02:11 AM

Hey Z!
Have you performed first light yet? If so, how does it perform?

Mel


Hi Mel,
Yes I have taken it out. However, it has been only the moon and stars. To be honest, it was the stars that were the most interesting. For example, point the scope at black sky with a 38mm E.P. which with the 1575 is about 41.44 power. The black sky turns into hundreds of stars, and whats more I've already split some of them! I can sweep the sky and everything is already in focus, from the center to the edge of the lens, especially since being able to fine tune is easier with the dual speed, and one in focus, it stays when sweeping. Having built my first refractor though, one thing I've learned is it's best to "tune" the tube length as long as possible because of the way crayfords are designed with the 2 bearings on each side of the E.P. tube. Some sag with a lot of weight on them. My Crawmach really doesn't really have that problem because I can keep a tight tension on it, it doesn't slip, and is easy to turn, especially with the fine tune. I have a 6' tube on the Crawmach and with the highest power E.P. in the tube, it only sticks out of the focuser body about 3/4", but that's with a star diagonal. Obviously, without that attachment the tube would be much farther out. I have to admit, after I finished building the entire project, I actually cut off 3/4" off the tube because higher power would only focus with the fosuser all the way in. And the "cone of light" is so long it doesn't get blocked by the long focuser tube.
The most fun is using the laser, just point it at whatever, and there it is, right in the center of the E.P! I don't think I have $25 in the whole brass & 5mw laser pen setup.(Brass is really easy to work with)
Anyway, the Jaegers lens is awesome, What a great company. Too bad they don't exist anymore. One of the guys at Surplus Shed told me that they will have more lenses made from the same Jaegers specs since they also bought those AND the lenses from Jaegers! That's an welcome piece of information! Hope they're cheap!
I only have 3 more scope at this time I'm building now that this 103mm is finished, the 60mm F/12 with 2" focuser, the fast dual focuser 155mm, and a schiefspiegler
Well, there it is, a bug they can't give you a pill for and cure. It's called ATM!
Z

#141 Chemisttree

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Posted 14 October 2013 - 04:12 PM

Hi Z! I've been following this thread for some time now. Very impressive!

How did you achieve the brass finish on the aluminum dew shield? Electropolish followed by anodize and then electrodeposit with ferric oxalate?

#142 dawsonian2000

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Posted 17 October 2013 - 01:56 AM

Z! You are just making me so very thirsty to get started on my 103/1575 Jaegers project! But, I have a custom equatorial head I will be constructing next year that will take precedence. In any case, I have the Carton 100/1300 I built that is a true gem in that size range. But once I get it built, I look forward to comparing the Jaegers 103/1575 to the Carton 100/1300. The Carton 100/1300 I constructed is able to resolve Epsilon Lyrae at 54x using A TeleVue 24mm Panoptic! I must admit that the eyepiece is highly rated, but to bust open E Lyrae at that low power is phenomenal! I can not wait to get these two scopes side-by-side.

Mel

#143 Z28500

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Posted 17 October 2013 - 10:32 AM

[quote name="Chemisttree"]Hi Z! I've been following this thread for some time now. Very impressive!

How did you achieve the brass finish on the aluminum dew shield? Electropolish followed by anodize and then electrodeposit with ferric oxalate?

No, it had to be real brass in order to be a match to the rest of the scope and since I couldn't find brass of the correct size I had to veneer it with no seam showing and veneer the outside circle edge using super glue, then used flat black epoxy guncoat on the interior, a coating I'm starting to use more often with telescopes due to it's ability of being able to be "misted" into a kind of a rough texture reducing glare.
Z

#144 Z28500

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Posted 17 October 2013 - 10:53 AM

[quote name="dawsonian2000"]Z! You are just making me so very thirsty to get started on my 103/1575 Jaegers project! But, I have a custom equatorial head I will be constructing next year that will take precedence. In any case, I have the Carton 100/1300 I built that is a true gem in that size range. But once I get it built, I look forward to comparing the Jaegers 103/1575 to the Carton 100/1300. The Carton 100/1300 I constructed is able to resolve Epsilon Lyrae at 54x using A TeleVue 24mm Panoptic! I must admit that the eyepiece is highly rated, but to bust open E Lyrae at that low power is phenomenal! I can not wait to get these two scopes side-by-side.

Mel

Hi Mel,
That should be interesting, not the daily double, but the nightly double double!. Since your Jaegers lens is a match to the 103mm I have, I don't see why you won't be able to split all 4 stars, but you'll have better magnification with the Jaegers. I haven't tried Epsilon Lyrae yet as I've only had the scope out a couple times so far. I really like using the Surplus Shed Erfle 2" 38mm for our low power, The amount of light it lets through is awesome.
Z

#145 Z28500

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Posted 18 October 2013 - 10:50 PM

Left side shot with the fork extended fully out of the main shaft, adjustable to any length.
Notice the weight bar. I found that weights work best when centered at the pivot point, Not towards the rear of the telescope, The weight would have to be increased in proportion to the amount of distance it is from the pivot point in order for it to offset the balance of the sliding focuser tube the same as if it was centered. Just a little common sense there guys! I'll just bet that some of you readers out there know the math for that one! If so, I would really be interested in seeing it. What I did was put in the most used eyepiece, adjust the focuser into focus, then have the telescope tube balanced at the pivot point with all of the tension released. It would then balance like a set of triple beam scales! of course the weight would also be centered. I could then exchange E.P.'s and only have to minutely adjust the weight to compensate for the difference in E.P. weight and focuser travel. Using that procedure, the gear drive become very sensitive making it easy to adjust ascension and declination. And of course, for you guys out there with computer mounts, (I have one too) obviously, it would be much easier on the gear drives in that type of mount also.
Well, there it is, my technique anyway! Seems to work pretty good though.
:step:
Z

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#146 Dr Morbius

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Posted 18 October 2013 - 11:23 PM

Wow, that is nice!!!

#147 Z28500

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Posted 19 October 2013 - 05:11 PM

Wow, that is nice!!!

Thanks Dr. Morbius.
:step:
Z

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#148 dawsonian2000

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Posted 30 October 2013 - 01:01 AM

The heavens declare the glory of God; the firmament sheweth His handiwork.
Psalms 19:1 KJV


Great passage, Z! Here's another great one to ponder!


Make it your ambition to lead a quiet life, to mind your own business and to work with your hands, just as we told you, so that your daily life may win the respect of outsiders and so that you will not be dependent on anybody. Thessalonians 4:11,12

You have most certainly performed a miracle with your own hands...

Mel

#149 Z28500

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Posted 31 October 2013 - 08:43 PM

The heavens declare the glory of God; the firmament sheweth His handiwork.
Psalms 19:1 KJV


Great passage, Z! Here's another great one to ponder!


Make it your ambition to lead a quiet life, to mind your own business and to work with your hands, just as we told you, so that your daily life may win the respect of outsiders and so that you will not be dependent on anybody. Thessalonians 4:11,12

You have most certainly performed a miracle with your own hands...

Mel


Hi Mel,
Thanks for the compliment, I DO like the scripture message you picked! When I look at the night sky, those are the types of things that go through my mind as I stand in awe of the Heavenly Majesty of God's creation.
Thanks again,
:step:
Z






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