Jump to content


Photo

Burgess back??

  • Please log in to reply
57 replies to this topic

#26 scblur

scblur

    Sputnik

  • *****
  • Posts: 38
  • Joined: 29 May 2007
  • Loc: Pittsburgh

Posted 06 November 2012 - 07:19 AM

The site claims you can ADD to CART - 91mm CaF2 Doublet. Planethunter. $895

but...
Ships from factory, 8 weeks delivery.

#27 Andy Howie

Andy Howie

    Mariner 2

  • *****
  • Posts: 210
  • Joined: 10 Sep 2005
  • Loc: Paisley, Scotland

Posted 06 November 2012 - 08:14 AM

Oh aye, so it does.
In fact there's been a heap of stuff added since I last looked. Site must have been in it's infancy, when I was on the first time.

#28 Starhawk

Starhawk

    Space Ranger

  • *****
  • Posts: 5546
  • Joined: 16 Sep 2008
  • Loc: Tucson, Arizona

Posted 06 November 2012 - 09:29 AM

Anyway, it turned out the Backpacker wasn't just possible, but is a great prescription. It's the TEC110FL, but Yuri isn't selling it for $695. Then again, when he showed me one at NEAF, it had glass in it.

More seriously, Bill's got some history to live down. If he was more like Gary Hand, things could have been much better.

-Rich

#29 bsim

bsim

    Surveyor 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 1871
  • Joined: 04 Jan 2008
  • Loc: Miskatonic

Posted 06 November 2012 - 09:36 AM

I hope Bill makes a production run of the APO 50 refractor with 2" focuser.

Thread on APO 50

Picture of APO 50

#30 Jon Isaacs

Jon Isaacs

    ISS

  • *****
  • Posts: 43862
  • Joined: 16 Jun 2004
  • Loc: San Diego and Boulevard, CA

Posted 06 November 2012 - 09:38 AM

Anyway, it turned out the Backpacker wasn't just possible, but is a great prescription.


At 101mm and F/5.5 it shared some specifications of the NP-101...

Bill's a good sort but has/had an overactive enthusiasm gland that seemed to get him in trouble on a regular basis...

Jon

#31 Starhawk

Starhawk

    Space Ranger

  • *****
  • Posts: 5546
  • Joined: 16 Sep 2008
  • Loc: Tucson, Arizona

Posted 06 November 2012 - 09:47 AM

The NP-101 is a Petzval, though. The backpacker was supposed to be a triplet.

Anyway, with the steadily escalating prices from China and comedians like StellarVue openly threatening to sue anyone who gets a product from their Far East suppliers without their OK, it would seem we are at a natural end to the enthusiasm.

-Rich

#32 bsim

bsim

    Surveyor 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 1871
  • Joined: 04 Jan 2008
  • Loc: Miskatonic

Posted 06 November 2012 - 11:14 AM

Anyway, with the steadily escalating prices from China and comedians like StellarVue openly threatening to sue anyone who gets a product from their Far East suppliers without their OK, it would seem we are at a natural end to the enthusiasm.
-Rich


This is the first time I've heard this. Care to elaborate?

#33 Starhawk

Starhawk

    Space Ranger

  • *****
  • Posts: 5546
  • Joined: 16 Sep 2008
  • Loc: Tucson, Arizona

Posted 06 November 2012 - 12:13 PM

Read it from the original source:

www.stellarvue.com/about.html

I went to look at their site after the thread where someone had bought a new SV scope and had the impression it was made in the US, despite coming from China. So, I looked on their site to see what it said these days. And there in the About Us they have the heart-warming story of how Vic is a lifelong astronomer and started building all his own stuff and then how StellarVue hand-crafts everything they build. Then, they take a turn and there is their open threat. So, apparently they have learned when you buy from China, they'll fill your order, and make 6 times that many to sell elsewhere. So, you can try legal action in China (good luck with that), or maybe you can attempt something even Wal-Mart doesn't think they can do- get anyone reselling products from China to believe they should check with StellarVue, first. If one had US suppliers, of course, there is legal standing to go after a supplier who starts reselling your proprietary intellectual property to third parties. I've never heard of going after somene who bought weldments with your proprietary welding schedule used on them.

It would be interesting to find out what the legality of this really is. All in all, I'm not so sure what I think about SV's practices after reading this.

-Rich

#34 ckwastro

ckwastro

    Apollo

  • -----
  • Posts: 1260
  • Joined: 23 Nov 2005
  • Loc: Tempe, AZ

Posted 06 November 2012 - 12:17 PM


Anyway, with the steadily escalating prices from China and comedians like StellarVue openly threatening to sue anyone who gets a product from their Far East suppliers without their OK, it would seem we are at a natural end to the enthusiasm.
-Rich


This is the first time I've heard this. Care to elaborate?


+1

#35 Starhawk

Starhawk

    Space Ranger

  • *****
  • Posts: 5546
  • Joined: 16 Sep 2008
  • Loc: Tucson, Arizona

Posted 06 November 2012 - 12:28 PM

Look above your post. I already responded with a link. By they way, the threat is at the bottom of most of their site.

-Rich

#36 ckwastro

ckwastro

    Apollo

  • -----
  • Posts: 1260
  • Joined: 23 Nov 2005
  • Loc: Tempe, AZ

Posted 06 November 2012 - 12:36 PM

Thanks Rich.

#37 RussD

RussD

    Sputnik

  • -----
  • Posts: 39
  • Joined: 20 Apr 2006
  • Loc: Minnesota

Posted 06 November 2012 - 01:00 PM

A good friend of mine always points out that he has had trouble with a lot of the companies selling astro gear over the years. He describes many of them as "a work in progress". Burgess seems to fit that Bill ( :foreheadslap:).

I have purchased a few things from Burgess over the years and the only thing that did not show up at my front door was the Ultramono. I put in a $50 deposit and like a lot of people never heard a thing. The Burgess yahoogroup gradually dried up to a trickle of posts like water drops echoing in an abandoned cave.

I figured it was a lost bet and I moved on. I did not pursue a refund either. That is until yesterday. I used the "contact us" form yesterday and Tammy refunded my money today. Not sure why it was so easy for me while others have had such difficulty getting a refund. Who can say. I can say for sure that Tammy is on the other end of that "Contact Us" form.


Russ

#38 tomharri

tomharri

    Messenger

  • *****
  • Posts: 489
  • Joined: 19 Sep 2008
  • Loc: along the I-10 corridor

Posted 06 November 2012 - 01:21 PM

I got a no name 90mm f/6.7 triplet lens in cell direct from China 2 years ago, an ebay sale, that had the 'Burgess' lettering painted over, and it is 'Takahashi quality'.

#39 Mike Clemens

Mike Clemens

    Frozen to Eyepiece

  • *****
  • Posts: 7577
  • Joined: 26 Nov 2005
  • Loc: Alaska, USA

Posted 06 November 2012 - 05:54 PM

Is there any reality to it though? I've never heard of anyone trying to import the same stuff and getting attacked by Stellervue as a result, has it happened?

#40 Pinbout

Pinbout

    Cosmos

  • *****
  • Posts: 7734
  • Joined: 22 Feb 2010
  • Loc: nj

Posted 06 November 2012 - 10:53 PM

Read it from the original source:

www.stellarvue.com/about.html



when I read it in the last paragraph from the link, I see they are speaking about dealers, not individuals, who will resell their knocked off designs.

so they won't persue "anyone" only u.s. dealers who, without knowledge, are purchasing with the intent to resell patent pending designs that are not licensed.

#41 Starhawk

Starhawk

    Space Ranger

  • *****
  • Posts: 5546
  • Joined: 16 Sep 2008
  • Loc: Tucson, Arizona

Posted 06 November 2012 - 11:10 PM

Yeah, well, that's just it. Doing a search on the US patent office website yields zero patents in the name of Stellarvue or Victor Maris.

Pretty weak.

-Rich

#42 Jon Isaacs

Jon Isaacs

    ISS

  • *****
  • Posts: 43862
  • Joined: 16 Jun 2004
  • Loc: San Diego and Boulevard, CA

Posted 06 November 2012 - 11:25 PM


Read it from the original source:

www.stellarvue.com/about.html



when I read it in the last paragraph from the link, I see they are speaking about dealers, not individuals, who will resell their knocked off designs.

so they won't persue "anyone" only u.s. dealers who, without knowledge, are purchasing with the intent to resell patent pending designs that are not licensed.


Smoke and mirrors, the optics in these scope are not proprietary designs, the mechanicals in these scopes are basic standard stuff. Long Perng and Kunming United Optics sell versions of their scopes to vendors around the world including SV. The Astro-Tech version might be spec'd a little differently but they are the same basic scopes from the same manufacturers.

The AT-102 ED and the SV-102ED.. it was kind of funny. The SV-102ED had a particular issue with the collimation screws being too tight. It was no surprise that AT-102ED had exactly the same problem.

What I found distasteful was the implication that other similar scopes sold be other vendors were inferior versions of the SV scopes. Back in the days when SV was selling the AT-1010 NightHawk, their website featured disparaging remarks about "colorful Chinese glass". It was only later that it became clear the AT-1010 was coming from Taiwan...

Jon

#43 Pinbout

Pinbout

    Cosmos

  • *****
  • Posts: 7734
  • Joined: 22 Feb 2010
  • Loc: nj

Posted 06 November 2012 - 11:34 PM

Smoke and mirrors



totally agreed.

#44 Pinbout

Pinbout

    Cosmos

  • *****
  • Posts: 7734
  • Joined: 22 Feb 2010
  • Loc: nj

Posted 06 November 2012 - 11:46 PM

Doing a search on the US patent office website yields zero patents in the name of Stellarvue or Victor Maris.



patent pending. they wouldn't have any info if it's not issued yet.

but as jon says, "smoke and mirrors".

from wikipedia

"Fraudulent use of the patent pending warning is prohibited by the law of many countries and inventors should be cautious when marking products or methods that may arguably not be covered by any pending patent application. In some jurisdictions, such as the United Kingdom, a warning notice should ideally mention the number of the pending application."

so you could persue a action to have them take it down if they don't provide the number of the pending application. :grin:

#45 Starhawk

Starhawk

    Space Ranger

  • *****
  • Posts: 5546
  • Joined: 16 Sep 2008
  • Loc: Tucson, Arizona

Posted 07 November 2012 - 01:50 AM

You know, you're absolutely right.

From the Wiki article:

In the United States, according to the United States Patent and Trademark Office, the expression "Patent Pending" as such does not protect an invention until the actual patent is published and/or issued:

"A patentee who makes or sells patented articles, or a person who does so for or under the patentee is required to mark the articles with the word "Patent" and the number of the patent. The penalty for failure to mark is that the patentee may not recover damages from an infringer unless the infringer was duly notified of the infringement and continued to infringe after the notice.

The marking of an article as patented when it is not in fact patented is against the law and subjects the offender to a penalty. Some persons mark articles sold with the terms "Patent Applied For" or "Patent Pending". These phrases have no legal effect, but only give information that an application for patent has been filed in the Patent and Trademark Office. The protection afforded by a patent does not start until the actual grant of the patent. False use of these phrases or their equivalent is prohibited". [5]

The use of the term "patent pending" or "patent applied for" is permitted so long as a patent application has actually been filed. If these terms are used when no patent application has been filed it is deemed as a deceptive act and a fine of up to $500 may be imposed for every such offense.[6] Under the current interpretation of "offense", each mis-marked article constitutes an offense, which permits theoretical damages in the hundreds of millions of dollars for high-volume consumer goods.

Anyone seen a "Patent Pending" label on a SV scope?

-Rich

#46 DCS

DCS

    Surveyor 1

  • -----
  • Posts: 1930
  • Joined: 03 Dec 2005
  • Loc: Cypress, Texas

Posted 07 November 2012 - 06:53 AM

Smoke and mirrors



totally agreed.


.. but then it'd be a reflector.. :help:

-Pete

#47 Jon Isaacs

Jon Isaacs

    ISS

  • *****
  • Posts: 43862
  • Joined: 16 Jun 2004
  • Loc: San Diego and Boulevard, CA

Posted 07 November 2012 - 07:59 AM

Smoke and mirrors



totally agreed.


.. but then it'd be a reflector.. :help:

-Pete


Well, smoke and coke bottles...

Anyway it seems this thread is getting off topic. This is thread is about Bill Burgess. In my experience Bill Burgess seemed to often have unrealistic expectations about what was possible and that got him into trouble but I think his mistakes and errors were honest mistakes, he simply "bit off more than he could chew."

And he did have some notable successes, the Burgess Optical/TMB planetary eyepiece series was probably his greatest. These were the first decent short focal length, decent eye relief eyepieces on the market, at least the first I ever saw and I still use mine the majority of the nights I view from my backyard.

Jon

#48 csrlice12

csrlice12

    Voyager 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 10801
  • Joined: 22 May 2012
  • Loc: Denver, CO

Posted 07 November 2012 - 02:34 PM

What next, a "Do Not Remove This Tag Under Penalty of Law" tag?

#49 BillP

BillP

    Voyager 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 11645
  • Joined: 26 Nov 2006
  • Loc: Vienna, VA

Posted 07 November 2012 - 04:27 PM

Anyway it seems this thread is getting off topic. This is thread is about Bill Burgess. In my experience Bill Burgess seemed to often have unrealistic expectations about what was possible and that got him into trouble but I think his mistakes and errors were honest mistakes, he simply "bit off more than he could chew."

And he did have some notable successes, the Burgess Optical/TMB planetary eyepiece series was probably his greatest. These were the first decent short focal length, decent eye relief eyepieces on the market, at least the first I ever saw and I still use mine the majority of the nights I view from my backyard.

Jon


I just got an email from Tammy FYI. She says that yes it is indeed an available product. Further says that It is better than 1/4 wave from 435-656nm and 3 color crossings and that images taken from this scope by T. Davis is on the Astro Images section of the website.

#50 BillP

BillP

    Voyager 1

  • *****
  • Posts: 11645
  • Joined: 26 Nov 2006
  • Loc: Vienna, VA

Posted 07 November 2012 - 04:36 PM

Is there any reality to it though? I've never heard of anyone trying to import the same stuff and getting attacked by Stellervue as a result, has it happened?


I don't believe it is feasible to even do this since the customer has no signed contract with SV. If SV has a contract with Vendor A to exclusively supply them scopes, and Vendor A decides to sell me one direct, all SV can do to my knowledge is to sue Vendor A for breach of contract. Can do nothing to me. And since these are overseas transactions...probably not much he could do to Vendor A either other than terminate the relationship. Just a lot of scare tactics IMO. :imawake:






Cloudy Nights LLC
Cloudy Nights Sponsor: Astronomics