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New Edition of Uranometria 2000

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#51 turtle86

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Posted 06 December 2012 - 09:35 AM

I received it yesterday.
1) It's thinner than I thought it would be.
2) The 22 page star atlases in the front of each of the separate volumes are gone.
3) The index tabs at the edges of the pages are gone!!
4) The Common Names list is no larger than before.
5) The transparent overlays are gone!!!!!!!

Essentially, it's the same. If any refinement of positions took place, it isn't mentioned. The only thing I'll really miss is the Edge-of-Page tabs.

It's definitely more cost effective that getting the 2-volume set.
But no tabs? No transparencies?


I wish they had kept the tabs and the 22 page atlas at the front. The one volume all-sky version is really more cost effective only if you don't care about the overlays, which are now $15 a la carte. IIRC, the two volumes with overlays included were $100 total; now, the one volume all-sky version plus overlays totals $85. Personally, I'd rather pay the extra $15 and get the tabs and the 22 page atlas at the front, though unfortunately that's no longer an option.

#52 HfxObserver

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 12:29 AM

My UA2000,0 all sky Ed. arrived this week.

I'm not a fan of the overlays and appreciate the new text, definitely worth having such detail in the field, a snowfield at present awaiting clearer sky and cooler temps..

It's a good sized book, little larger than NSOG or Star Clusters but not that heavy. Pages are a nice heavy pile.

-Chris

#53 Daniel Mounsey

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 12:56 AM

BTW Don,

It no longer bothers me that the 1st edition pages are structured more difficult than the 2nd edition. Uranometria isn't really the kind of atlas you flip from page to page anyway. It's really about opening a page and observing each target in detail in my opinion. Is that what you're doing Don?
:)

#54 mayidunk

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 11:55 AM

While the way that the charts connect with each other in Ver. 1 seems counter intuitive at first, it doesn't take long to get the hang of it once you see it. That's been my experience, anyway.

#55 Starman1

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 11:59 AM

I'm looking for a galaxy I haven't seen before, but is in my list "To Be Observed".
I use my DSC to dial in the location.
I see a field of 7 galaxies.
Which is my target? Let me look in U2000 to see...
Hmmm. It's 41 degrees north and about here in RA, flip, flip, flip.
Ah, there's the page.
Now, let me see....
Ah there's the group of galaxies I see. Ah, my target is the one on the right.
Let me get my note pages......

The ability to find the object quickly in the charts is paramount. Having one volume instead of two is great, but I will miss the declination tabs because I used them all the time.

So I don't systematically view every object on a page. I view objects from a pre-planned script. Uranometria helps me identify the target when it's in a crowded field, which seems to be happening more and more as the targets I seek get fainter.

#56 Daniel Mounsey

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 10:26 PM

It's interesting you turn the pages that way Don. Heck, deep sky observing is an intense and sensational experience. My night is already plotted when using Uranometria in fact if I'm turning a page, I already know which page I'm turning it to with stick notes. I don't even have to think about it. I thought you had that planned. :question:

#57 Starman1

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 01:21 AM

I only use it for ID on about 1 in 50 objects, Daniel.
It's only used when I'm in really crowded fields.
Otherwise, the DSC is accurate enough.

#58 Daniel Mounsey

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 09:58 PM

It's time to plan! :grin:

#59 Sarkikos

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 06:52 AM

I wouldn't buy the new edition of Uranometria 2000. I have some old editions that I bought used for cheap. I cut them up and put them in clear covers, and divided them into a half-dozen binders. That's much more convenient and comfortable than one single, large and heavy atlas. I don't put an atlas on a table or leave it in the van. It has to be right there with me at the eyepiece.

But I'm done buying hard copy star atlases. I have Sky Safari Pro on an Android tablet. The only thing that my U2K binders display that SSP doesn't very well are the dark nebulae. SSP shows the DN as various sized boxes, while U2k displays them with discrete boundaries. If SSP were to start showing DN more naturalistically like U2k does, then I'd never take U2k to the dark site again.

I'm not buying any more hard copy atlases! :p During the last half-dozen trips to my dark site, I never even looked at a printed atlas. Stick a fork in them. They are done!

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#60 Sarkikos

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 07:03 AM

Don,

I still find that the direct light of a smartphone, tablet, or laptop is FAR more injurious to my night vision than the indirect light of a dim red LED flashlight on a printed page. Of course, that's not without difficulties, either, but it's a matter of degree.

In the event you are at a place where full dark adaptation is not possible, or the targets being viewed don't require it, then pretty much anything goes.

The proliferation of phones, tablets, and laptops at dark sky sites, though, is becoming quite annoying.


Yes, many observers do not set the tablets dim enough or they use the wrong kind of red filter. Any filter - such as AstroGizmo or Red Eyes - which lets colors other than red through, is not good enough. I set my tablet on night vision mode, turn it down low, and put on a sheet of Rubylinth AND a sheet of AstroGizmo (the AstroGizmo adheres better to the tablet screen than does Rubylinth). That is dim indeed! Set like this, my tablet is no brighter - I think it's actually dimmer - than a dim red light shining on a printed page. It can be done.

A good electronic atlas is much more convenient and adaptable than a printed atlas. I doubt if I'll ever buy another printed atlas.

Mike

#61 Sarkikos

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 07:12 AM

Daniel,

RED EYES

Red Eyes doesn't look dark enough. Look at the photo showing Red Eyes filter over the iPad and iPhone. I can still see non-red colors bleeding through! Not too good.

Also read this ad copy from the Red Eyes site:

"Unlike other darker red films, and less transparent Rubylith products, this lighter shade of red is the perfect transparency."

Nope, Red Eyes lets through too much light and too many colors for dark sky observing. It should only show a dim red. IME & IMO, they don't know what they're talking about. :shrug:

Mike

#62 Sarkikos

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 07:26 AM

How do I plan my dark sky sessions? I already have an observing list set up on Sky Safari Pro for each constellation. Each list contains DSO I've never seen before and that are possible to be seen with my 10" Dob. During the night, I use the constellation lists to go through each constellation as it presents itself. Easy sneezy. Best method I've found yet. I can locate and observe 30 or more "new" DSO in a good night ... if I want to.

I don't even use goto or DSCs. I don't need them. I use Sky Safari Pro, a Telrad and a closely-aligned 70mm optical finder.

Mike

#63 Dave Ittner

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 10:05 AM

How do I plan my dark sky sessions? I already have an observing list set up on Sky Safari Pro for each constellation. Each list contains DSO I've never seen before and that are possible to be seen with my 10" Dob. During the night, I use the constellation lists to go through each constellation as it presents itself. Easy sneezy. Best method I've found yet. I can locate and observe 30 or more "new" DSO in a good night ... if I want to.

I don't even use goto or DSCs. I don't need them. I use Sky Safari Pro, a Telrad and a closely-aligned 70mm optical finder.

Mike


This makes a lot of sense. Constellation mopping so to speak. I know it can be a bit time consuming to create an observing list but heck that's what cloudy nights are for right?

I love printed atlases - all of them. And will one day have purchased all of them if not most.

But am getting better at using SF Pro on an IPAD at the eyepiece. Once I get the IPAD mounted on a swing arm that is attached to a stalk I will upload a picture. Of course I also plan to hook up a dew heater strip to the IPAD as well.

#64 Sarkikos

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 12:32 PM

Dave,

This makes a lot of sense. Constellation mopping so to speak. I know it can be a bit time consuming to create an observing list but heck that's what cloudy nights are for right?


I'm always open to trying new methods, but so far this works best for me. I already have a DSO spreadsheet I've put together from various lists, and filtered out all the DSO that are too dim for my 10" Dob. It includes a column that I check off when I've bagged an object. It's a simple matter to sort the list in "Not Seen"/Constellation/NGC/Other Objects order. From this information I create Constellation lists by hand within Sky Safari Pro.

I've recently acquired Astro Planner which can export lists in SSP format. That should make the whole process easier.

IME & IMO, creating a list for each constellation will probably make more sense to many observers than RA order. Most people are visually and verbally oriented, not so much numerically. When I'm at the dark site, the first thing I look for are constellations and bright stars. I'm not thinking about RA or Dec. :shrug: Now, sorting the objects within a constellation list in RA order might be useful, especially for long constellations such as Hydra.

Mike

#65 Dave Ittner

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 03:43 PM

Astro Planner looks pretty similar to that of Deepsky 2000
http://www.deepsky2000.com/

I had a ton of observations in that software but on a computer that crashed. :foreheadslap:

Either software package is a great way to create lists that can be exported to SSP but also keep track of what you have observed to date.

#66 Starman1

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 04:02 PM

Dave,

This makes a lot of sense. Constellation mopping so to speak. I know it can be a bit time consuming to create an observing list but heck that's what cloudy nights are for right?


I'm always open to trying new methods, but so far this works best for me. I already have a DSO spreadsheet I've put together from various lists, and filtered out all the DSO that are too dim for my 10" Dob. It includes a column that I check off when I've bagged an object. It's a simple matter to sort the list in "Not Seen"/Constellation/NGC/Other Objects order. From this information I create Constellation lists by hand within Sky Safari Pro.

I've recently acquired Astro Planner which can export lists in SSP format. That should make the whole process easier.

IME & IMO, creating a list for each constellation will probably make more sense to many observers than RA order. Most people are visually and verbally oriented, not so much numerically. When I'm at the dark site, the first thing I look for are constellations and bright stars. I'm not thinking about RA or Dec. :shrug: Now, sorting the objects within a constellation list in RA order might be useful, especially for long constellations such as Hydra.

Mike

My big observing list (over 20,000 objects, a lot of which are blank), which always goes to the field with me, is arranged by Constellation>>RA>>Numerical order (often the same as RA).
i start out with a constellation, then view the constellation from west to east to allow for the passage of time while observing.

#67 Starman1

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 04:04 PM

I'll put in a plug for Deep Sky Planner 6 when it comes to pre-arranging an observing session.

#68 Rick Woods

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 04:20 PM

It's interesting, the different needs and preferences of different folks at the eyepiece. I have no interest at all in charting software. Paging through a printed atlas, and comparing star fields on a page with those in the eyepiece, is an integral part of the experience for me. I was raised in a very bookish environment, and books are important to me.

I just hope there are enough people who feel as I do that printed atlases will continue to be published, and we'll all continue to be able to get the tools we each prefer!

#69 Daniel Mounsey

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 06:06 PM

I'm with you there Rick. The only thing where I would add mention though is with regard to Uranometria. There's no way I would be shuffling through its pages in the dark. It's much more efficient to simply put stick tabs in the pages you plan to go to rather than trying to shuffle through some RA DEC numbers in the book. That's like trying to do a messier marathon with Uranometria on the fly. You'd go nuts!

#70 Rick Woods

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 12:28 AM

I'm with you there Rick. The only thing where I would add mention though is with regard to Uranometria. There's no way I would be shuffling through its pages in the dark. It's much more efficient to simply put stick tabs in the pages you plan to go to rather than trying to shuffle through some RA DEC numbers in the book. That's like trying to do a messier marathon with Uranometria on the fly. You'd go nuts!


Well, sure, it's much more efficient if you know what you want to look at ahead of time. Unfortunately, I rarely do that, and end up shuffling in the dark. That's why I like SA2000 the best, usually.

#71 Sarkikos

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 08:46 PM

Don,

My big observing list (over 20,000 objects, a lot of which are blank), which always goes to the field with me, is arranged by Constellation>>RA>>Numerical order (often the same as RA).
i start out with a constellation, then view the constellation from west to east to allow for the passage of time while observing.


My "big" list contains only about 2500 DSO ... brighter skies and smaller aperture. And no double stars, of course. (In any case, are doubles really deep sky objects? :thinking: Well, maybe deep sky but not dark sky. :grin:)

Yep, listing by constellation and then west to east by RA does seem the most practical way to go about it. It's only a bother if you have a long list and want to look up some NGC numbers quickly within that list. But you can always resort a spreadsheet. I wish that SkySafari would let you sort an observing list on-the-fly. I've suggested that to Southern Skies. Maybe in the next upgrade ...

Mike

#72 Rick Woods

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 08:46 PM

Here's a question: Does the Deep Sky Field Guide still index correctly to the one-volume U2K?

#73 Sarkikos

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Posted 15 December 2012 - 08:55 PM

Rick,

Paging through a printed atlas, and comparing star fields on a page with those in the eyepiece, is an integral part of the experience for me. I was raised in a very bookish environment, and books are important to me.


I do the same thing with SkySafari on my tablet ... except for the part about paging through. :grin: I have nothing against books. The last time I bothered to count them, I had over 4000. That was about five years ago. Lately, though, I have started to give some away. Hardly a day goes by when I don't think about which ones I should let go.

Well, I guess I do have something against books: they take up a lot of space at home and are not so good for star hopping at my dark site. :ubetcha:

:grin:
Mike

#74 Rick Woods

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 01:33 AM

Well, there's no right and no wrong here. Just preferences.

#75 desertstars

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 09:20 AM

Well, there's no right and no wrong here. Just preferences.


You know, you just summed up about 95% of the discussions found on Cloudy Nights.

Among other places... ;)






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