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APM 152 ED APO #002

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#51 James Ling

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 02:21 AM

James, does the binoviewer come to focus without an OCA? i assume it does if you remove the extension tube?


Hi Bro...

If you are in Singapore, you shouldn't miss yesterday side walk session, as there are so many of our Singastro forum members present, to show both their support for this planned event.....

I am very sorry on the WO bino viewer that Gary last night is so eager to test it on this new 152 APM ED APO..., as I cannot recall we remove the extension tube or not , when observing it with or without the 2X barlow...

he uses the WO bino viewer 1,6X barlow, then change to celestron ultima 2X barlow, to get a much bigger image....

Not sure this close up photo I took last night can figure out , which is which....

Regards

James Ling

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#52 Radim

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 05:47 AM

Would be very interesting to compare this new kid to LZOS triplet 6inch ... visually ... not so many LZOS reviews out there ....

Radim

#53 F60.4

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 07:17 AM

Great thread and thanks to the OP for this.

Yes as Radim says, I'd love to hear how it compares to the LZOS triplet.

#54 orlyandico

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 08:25 AM

James, am overseas. Got the invite from Gary but you know how it is...

According to Markus in the other thread, you can use the BV without an OCA with the extension removed.

#55 Richard Low

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 09:15 AM

James, my APM/LZOS 152 Triplet was packed and ready to go....but I was stuck in a bad traffic jam driving back to Singapore, so I'm disappointed that I didnt get to see your new APM152ED, and to compare with mine. I hope you can bring it down one of these nights and I will be happy to bring mine over, since I'm only 5 mins drive away :)

#56 RGM

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 07:59 PM

James, a little off topic - are you still using your Istar 204 f9 or has this replaced it? Can you comment on the views through the 152 compared to the 204.

Great looking scope.

#57 junomike

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Posted 09 December 2012 - 08:30 PM

James, I'm interested in more clarification to this statement:

Is almost like total absence of CA, as the edges of jupiter is very crisp...



So was there CA on the perimeter of Jupiter? If so, how much?

Just curious as I thought Markus reported zero in focus CA.

Mike

#58 James Ling

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 01:44 AM

James, a little off topic - are you still using your Istar 204 f9 or has this replaced it? Can you comment on the views through the 152 compared to the 204.

Great looking scope.


Hi Bob....

Sorry for the late reply, as I am now working oversea, and now is lunch break....Thanks for your comment on the new 152 APE ED APO.....

As for your question on the Istar, I think many other CN members, especially those who are like me, as members of ISTARSCOPECLUB, very much like to know how is this ED APO compared to the 8" Istar achro...

Yes. I am still holding on to the 8" ISTAR F9 achro, and it is supposed to be the main star for the night, but since the new 152 ED APO arrives earlier, I think is better to show to those who heard about the scope and wants to see it in public in Singapore....,as well as those who are outside Singapore....

Hi Bob and All....

The following is my comments for the two scopes I owned, the 8" ISTAR F9 and 152 APM ED APO.................

One month ago, at the very same place, the Istar is put up for the Jupiter and M42 night observing, and the full report is in CN outreach section....

The detail of last weekend report will continue in this outreach section, when I have time this evening , after my working hours...

Last weekend , is a pity that M42 is not in such a good situation to get the 152 ED APO to show the trapezium stars in M42,due to heavy clouds over that sector.
And we are interested in picking up star E and F, which the Istar easily picks up both mag 10+ in such a heavily light polluted city... And the best is the Istar does not even have the extended dew shield, while for the 152 APM ED APO, I am extending it out to beat the glaring lights form the nearby lamp posts...

Last weekend, another different situation also arises, GRS is not seen until early morning, so unlike last month the Istar easily picks up the GRS , so easily...., during last month side walk...at around 1.30am.

But last Thursday after midnight, around 3.30am, in my home , from the window, the 152 APM ED APO picks it up easily....during my indoor 1st light test of this new scope after I assembled it...

Since I have already seen through the 8" Istar for 2 years, and now with the 152 APM ED APO, for two occasions, I will give my personal opinion, on these two scopes, which are not being placed side by side, for their performance....

1. CA
The Istar has CA, which is tolerable to some of us, but not to those who are really looking for the perfect scope with zero CA, but for the 152 APM ED APO, it is color free, to most of us, when it is in focus, which I am referring to Jupiter, not the moon or Venus, as i have not tested it yet...
( I will explain on my next CN reply , later )

2. Magnification
The magnification that I can pushed for the Istar has reached 450X , with my 4mm ep, although the image has broken down slightly..., but is still acceptable....
If I will to lower it down to almost 300X, the image is razor sharp and contrast is good....
But for the 152 APM ED APO, at this moment I could not pushed it over 300X and still get a good and razor sharp image.....My best magnification is 300X for both occasions I tested it....
One good comment from one of our snr forum member, is that the APM ED APO , is easily snap on, in focus , when we tested it our on last Saturday.....

3. DSO....
The reason why I brought the Istar to oversea star gazing is simply I wanted to test its wide field on DSO, whereas my C14 at F11, is not suitable for wide field..
There are numerous report from me with regards to the Istar at oversea stargazing trip, in both CN outreach and Istarscopeclub forum.. , which you refer to...
As for the 152 APM ED APO, I only tested it on M45, that night, around 3am, with my baader zoom at 24mm, or 50X, and the view really surprised me that my light polluted area, can see such a good and nice view of this star cluster...You will not believe it , with your own eyes, is not 20 stars, in the field shining , but much more, which should have counted it....
The istar has seen this but in a different location...( overesa star gazing )

And lastly, I do not want to do the scope to scope comparison at this moment, until ISTAR release their raycorr , which I think is a more interesting comparison, as we can subtract away the CA, and see how well the scope performs against the 6" ED APO....

Regards

James Ling

#59 James Ling

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 06:05 AM

James, I'm interested in more clarification to this statement:

Is almost like total absence of CA, as the edges of jupiter is very crisp...



So was there CA on the perimeter of Jupiter? If so, how much?

Just curious as I thought Markus reported zero in focus CA.

Mike


Hi Mike....

under the vendor and group announcement column, Markus reported under this thread, New 6"F/8 APM ED arrived today, the following, which I have not checked upon....

chromaticle aberration: coming from infocuse to focuse, you see the typical deep blue fringe, which gets fully absent in-focuse. The highest power for this test was a Ethos 3.7 mm = 325 power, twice the aperature, normaly called maximum usefull power. Vega is infocuse colorfree

As for my comments on the following with regards to the new scope that I have received...

Is almost like total absence of CA, as the edges of jupiter is very crisp...

This is the actual finding................

1. During our last Saturday night when using the new 152 APM ED APO , at Jupiter, initially as Jupiter is quite low, from 8pm till 10pm, I only use the baader zoom ep at 8mm, which is only 150X....
I even tried the 4mm TMB planetary ep,at 300X, the image starts to breakdown slightly, so I use back my baader zoom ep at 8mm or 150X...
As others just enjoyed looking through the APM ED APO, my friend, after taking closer look, point to me about something he saw form the both edges of Jupiter...
When I took a look at the scope, what I have seen, concur to what my friend has told me, is that on one side of the edge of jupiter , there is a very thin , sort of color in red...., and on the opposite end, there is a very thin, sort of color in green....
My friend told me it could be due to the atmosphere or eye piece...
I immediately took out my Tv 9mm nagler, and still we saw the very slight color of red and green on opposite side of Jupiter...So I guess could be from the atmosphere....

When after 10pm, as Jupiter is rising very high up, I insert my celestron utlima 2X barlow, and together with the baader zoom, I crank up the power to 250X, and the image we have seen is still very crisp and sharp, no breakdown of image at all....
I have to admit I don't realize whether there is still the color at the edges opposite each other...., as i am trying many times, to compare the image contrast of the 152 APM ED APO against the ES127 triplet APO....

By the time around 11pm , knowing that the best moments has come, we insert the WO bino-viewer....and we also try to barlow it.... And the stero effect of viewing at Jupiter also make me forgotten about the color issue....

Perhaps I should seriously check the CA issue on this coming weekend, when i am back from oversea, whereby I can do the scope to scope comparison with Richard's 152 APM Triplet APO....., and do another update again....

Regards

James Ling

#60 mblack

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 12:17 PM

James,

Thanks for reporting in such detail on this scope. I've pre-ordered through the US vendor and thanks to your posts I've a good idea of what to expect.

When I took a look at the scope, what I have seen, concur to what my friend has told me, is that on one side of the edge of jupiter , there is a very thin , sort of color in red...., and on the opposite end, there is a very thin, sort of color in green....
My friend told me it could be due to the atmosphere or eye piece...



Yes, that's an atmospheric effect, not the scope or eyepiece.

Please share any further comments/observations you care to on this scope James, it has been great reading so far :>

#61 Mr Onions

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 01:26 PM

David you do realize that you too will have to do a series of unboxing photos.
It's imperative.

#62 mblack

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 02:03 PM

David you do realize that you too will have to do a series of unboxing photos.
It's imperative.


Happy to oblige, Steve.

#63 James Ling

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 02:12 PM

Hi David....

Yes... I now also agreed to what you have just commented on the CA of this APM ED APO, after I have seen through this scope by myself at home at both the moon and the Sun...during these 2 weeks....

And today from another post, under the topic, APM 6" doublet on OPT's site, one of my astronomy friend who is present during the side walk also commented there is no CA seen on Jupiter...on this APM ED APO...

Hi All....

Sorry that there isn't any update from me, on the APM ED APO, for the past 2 weeks...., which is mainly due to the bad weather for any outdoor scope testing...

Last weekend I used the scope to view the 3 days and 4 days old moon, and it did not show any or even tiny trace of CA that i can see it with my other achros..when viewing the moon.
Today afternoon ( I am 12hrs ahead USA ), I set it up to view the Sun, with my Lunt Solar wedge, and comparing the view with my C6R F8, which I made numerous test on the solar wedge, the 152 new APM ED APO, shows a very distinct disc of the Sun.....
And tonight I used the scope to view the 10 days old moon, and again concur there isn't any trace of CA, even I tilt my sight of view. But due to the sky is very hazy, I will test it again, another day , if weather is better....

As for the APM triplet scope to APM ED scope test on Jupiter, due to the past two weeks of poor weather, both my friend and myself did not meet up to do any testing...

Will keep everyone updated again, once I have any outdoor scope testing....


Regards

James Ling

#64 mblack

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 04:05 PM

Thanks for the update James.

And today from another post, under the topic, APM 6" doublet on OPT's site, one of my astronomy friend who is present during the side walk also commented there is no CA seen on Jupiter...on this APM ED APO...



Very encouraging that observation. Hope your weather clears up James, a comparison between the APM 152 doublet and your friends triplet will be quite interesting. The doublet should lag behind, on paper anyway, but to what extent I wonder?

Here's to hoping your skies are clear and this comparison comes to fruition. :fingerscrossed:

#65 Mr Onions

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 04:24 PM

Looking forward to both you guy's futher comments and findings.
I'm pulling my hair out with envy.
And I haven't much to start with.

#66 dbs

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 12:11 AM

James,

Thanks for reporting in such detail on this scope. I've pre-ordered through the US vendor and thanks to your posts I've a good idea of what to expect.

When I took a look at the scope, what I have seen, concur to what my friend has told me, is that on one side of the edge of jupiter , there is a very thin , sort of color in red...., and on the opposite end, there is a very thin, sort of color in green....
My friend told me it could be due to the atmosphere or eye piece...



Yes, that's an atmospheric effect, not the scope or eyepiece.

Please share any further comments/observations you care to on this scope James, it has been great reading so far :>


I have field tested this scope from James on the very night of the public outreach.

I can confirm there is no CA on Jupiter. The "red and green band", is the atmospheric effect which is usual even when one use a SCT or Mak to view that planet. I have viewed Jupiter through all my scopes from SCT to reflectors, and that effect is quite common.

James, didn't have time to tell you that on that night because there are just too many people. But I know that Gary made that observation.

I know James has given his comments about the scope, and they are right on. I am very impress by the image from this scope. James forgot to mention that the image snaps into focus even at 300x or so. I am particularly fussy about CA and ease of focus on an APO. If you need to guess the focusing point, then that APO ain't good enough for me.

There is also a 5" ES triplet nearby for comparison, and the surface on Jupiter is much "whiter" on this 6" scope. However, Jupiter surface details are about the same on both scopes, which also tells me that the ES scope is very contrasty as well. The image on the 6" is very close to white, and the image on the 5" ES is much "warmer", giving an impression that the image on the 6"is "brighter". I am not sure if that's an effect of a triplet or that the triplet was using Plossls at that moment and the 6" was using Naglers and Baader Zoom, but it is still a very lovely image on the 5" ES.

All in all, for 4k, I think Markus has outdone himself. I believe 90% of the buyers will be very pleased with this scope as long they know what kind of weight and handling they need to manage.

James, I can't wait to do a comparison with Richard's LZOS 6" APO. Please contact me me when you guys meet up.

Merry Christmas everyone!

#67 Rinaldo

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 03:43 AM

James, did you pop each and every single bubble on all of your bubble wrapping??? ;) Enjoy the scope!

#68 James Ling

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 09:18 AM

Hi Rinaldo...

This scope come with so much bubble wrapper that I am keeping it for future use, both to protect the big long case, as well as for the scope.....since I have plan to use it for coming February and March travel to Malaysia star gazing expedition.....

As for the scope, I really enjoy using it coz of its light weight and portability....

I can use my GM8 mount instead of G11 mount.......

Regards

James Ling

#69 Scott Beith

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 11:06 AM

James that was a great write up on the scope. Congrats on the new gear - it really looks good. Thank you for sharing astronomy with people through your outreach nights. :bow:

#70 James Ling

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 12:00 AM

James that was a great write up on the scope. Congrats on the new gear - it really looks good. Thank you for sharing astronomy with people through your outreach nights. :bow:


Hi Scott Beith...

Thank you so much for your comments....

And I wanted to admit that I am really the lucky one to receive the 1st unit , rather than need to wait until March 2013, for the production units....

Hi All....

Although I knew this s/n#002 is being displayed at the Tucson Astronomy show, but from the sample I received, I knew how dedicate APM is handling this shipment, and without any cosmetic defects....
Except one advice to Markus, is that some buyers may not want to see some dust settling onto their precious glass surface....
As for me , is alright, as I can use cotton to move them away.....

Hi Scott Beith and All...

As for the outreach nights that I have participated, I may not do as often as what a few of my other astronomy friends are doing ....

But I always want to add new things , for the outreach activities, and once I have upgraded my other big scope, on its planetary performance, I will bring it out again.....

REgards

James Ling

#71 Pete-LH

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 09:05 AM

Great Report James.
Personally I'm interested in the weight of the OTA. I am looking at downsizing from my G11 to a GM-8. I see the package was 26KG but I did not see the actual weight of the OTA. My apologies if I missed it elsewhere in this thread.
I briefly owned a C6R as well but feel it would be a little heavy for a GM-8. Is this OTA lighter than your C6R?
Regards,
Pete

#72 Mr Onions

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 11:36 AM

22lbs for OTA according to the posts.

#73 James Ling

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 09:19 PM

Hi Pete...

Mr Onions is correct...
The OTA itself is 22 lbs...
I cannot recall the exact weight, is around 23 lbs, inclusive of the tube rings, losmandy dove tail, APM focuser, finder and brkts, APM 2" diagonal and extension tube....

As for the C6R , I have not weighed it against the APM ED APO..
Come to this weekend , when I am back from oversea , I do the weight comparison for this 2 OTA again and advice you....

Regards

James Ling

#74 Pete-LH

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 10:46 AM

Thanks James, Mr. Onions in New Castle/Tynes(is that actually New Castle England? I have been there-Work Related)

I should have seen that weight information but was scanning the thread too quickly. My apologies. I am interested though on your thoughts of weight balance versus mount.

For visual as I am aging like everyone, I am trying to determine a minimal setup for the maximum practical aperture refractor and SCT on my GM-8(or Vixen GP). That's why I was interested in your GM-8/APM evaluation.

Right now I'm at a 4" refractor and 8" SCT as being optimum but I have an AP 5" Superplanetary that is fairly light (<20 lbs with finder, rings and average lens). It is OK on the GM-8 although the vibration settling time is close to my limit.

#75 Mr Onions

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Posted 27 December 2012 - 12:48 PM

Hi Pete.
Yes, Newcastle upon Tyne, in north east England.
Geordieland.
Capital of Northumberland.
Haidrian's Wall etc.






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