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#1 Aboy

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 01:24 PM

Hello Everyone. I have a question about the modification on the Canon XS 1000D and I was following the modifications instructions from Here:

Self modification


But didn't show how to add the Astronomik MC Clear Glass. After thinking about it I discover where I need to add the Astronomik MC Clear Glass, I just need to replace the low pass filter or self cleaning sensor unit. I did and also add the low pass filter underneath the board in
order to conect the ribon cable, I re-assembly the camera; but the camera didn't turn ON, so I check all the cables and all was good.. Them after trying, and trying I deside to re-install the low pass filter and the camera and remove the Astronomik MC Clear Glass them the camera works. It's already full spectrum but without the Astronomik MC Clear Glass.

So...I asking somebody: What I need to do in order to add the Astronomik MC Clear Glass and make the camera works?

If anyone can answer me that I'll really happy . :)

Thanks for all the help.

And likes always: sorry for my English :jump: :grin:

#2 Aboy

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 07:23 PM

Never mind guys I did already.

Thanks any ways

#3 nofxrx

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 10:53 PM

The filter(s) have nothing to do with the functioning of the camera.
Even the self clean element, when removed, *on most models* still operates fine(meaning, obviously the self clean element is no longer there, so NOTHING HAPPENS, BUT, the camera WILL go through the self clean routine and not throw up any errors).
On other models, you will get an error when you first turn the camera on. Err 70 IIRC.
you simply go into the menu and disable the self cleaning routine, and you will be shooting in seconds.

What it sounds like to me, is that something was not fully seated properly (most likely ribbon cable) during your first attempt, and when you went back in and then reassembled, you reassembled so that EVERYthing was PROPERLY seated/connected/etc...

Also, yes. Gary's instructions clearly show how/where to install the Astronomik filter(or ANY replacement filter, Baader/AstroDon/Astronomik/Edmunds/etc) at the bottom of page 4, and the top of page 5...

Either way, glad you got it sorted out! :)

Cheers

#4 Aboy

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 11:33 PM

lol... Sorry I didn't notice that.... But just thinking I did like the manual said.

:D

#5 LeCarl

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 12:47 AM

Hummm, I know that we must never use a camera without IR and UV cut, in particular with refractor, it give huge blue puffy stars, no sharpness, details and sky will be red (a lot red! damage the balance of the sky, and hard to ballance if near not possible... result will be horrible!)

MC Clear glass don't cut UV and IR... (this not help)

The best you can do is add an UV IR cut filter, or better again an clip on cls-ccd filter (that cut iv ir and increase Ha and nebulosity contrast... or reduce light pollution)
My friend have this setup ans very pleased with this!

I found:
On some scope or lens, if you stack stock filtered camera with the cls-ccd will give blue/green stars (hard to balance)
This mean it is better to keep the 2 filter at same time option away...

#6 Aboy

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 07:52 AM

Hummm, I know that we must never use a camera without IR and UV cut, in particular with refractor, it give huge blue puffy stars, no sharpness, details and sky will be red (a lot red! damage the balance of the sky, and hard to ballance if near not possible... result will be horrible!)

MC Clear glass don't cut UV and IR... (this not help)

The best you can do is add an UV IR cut filter, or better again an clip on cls-ccd filter (that cut iv ir and increase Ha and nebulosity contrast... or reduce light pollution)
My friend have this setup ans very pleased with this!



I hear about it too.. Francisco told me to get a clip filter and I got a: Astronomik EOS clip CLS-CCD filter.

I found:
On some scope or lens, if you stack stock filtered camera with the cls-ccd will give blue/green stars (hard to balance)
This mean it is better to keep the 2 filter at same time option away...



Do you mean un-mod cameras with the CLS-CCD? or what do you mean? sorry I got lost. :grin:

Edit: Note: Also I do have a 2" Orion Extra-Narrowband Hydrogen-Alpha Filter to help if I need it. :jump:

#7 LeCarl

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 06:17 PM

Yes, the CLS CCD is PERFECT! ;p
(and you don't need any other filter or glass, as your camera is for astro only (you don't use the metering and autocus))

''''Do you mean un-mod cameras with the CLS-CCD? or what do you mean? sorry I got lost. '''
Yes, the cls-ccd with a un-moded camera is painfull to maintain balance, if the background is neutral, the stars will look greenish, and if stars look as they should, the background is not correct...

Ha filter best use with a modded unfiltered camera, this is used as filter and cut all UV, lower spectrum and IR (I don't have much experiences, but I will receive mine soon, already ordered...) ;p

But I think that you must not use cls-ccd with the Ha...

#8 Aboy

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 09:09 PM

Yes, the CLS CCD is PERFECT! ;p
(and you don't need any other filter or glass, as your camera is for astro only (you don't use the metering and autocus))



Astro only

Yes, the cls-ccd with a un-moded camera is painfull to maintain balance, if the background is neutral, the stars will look greenish, and if stars look as they should, the background is not correct...




Tell me about it... :foreheadslap:


Posted Image


Ha filter best use with a modded unfiltered camera, this is used as filter and cut all UV, lower spectrum and IR (I don't have much experiences, but I will receive mine soon, already ordered...) ;p

But I think that you must not use cls-ccd with the Ha...



That's correct... That's why I mod the camera Full spectrum.. I can shoot even in the full moon with the H alpha...

#9 fco_star

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 09:42 PM


I hear about it too.. Francisco told me to get a clip filter and I got a: Astronomik EOS clip CLS-CCD filter.

[quote name="Aboy"]

You will be very please with your modded + CLS-CCD filter, there are many ways to get reed of the bluish or green color.
I think that what you have now is a full spectrum camera which is great :) mine is full spectrum too.
Are you using RAW or JPG to process?
Many guys here in CN use this recipe with excellent results specially if they live in high LP areas, and many others even use the CLS-CCD filter in dark sites too, just practice with it.

#10 Aboy

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 12:13 AM

:jump: :jump: thanks my friend

#11 nofxrx

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 12:33 AM

Hummm, I know that we must never use a camera without IR and UV cut, in particular with refractor, it give huge blue puffy stars, no sharpness, details and sky will be red (a lot red! damage the balance of the sky, and hard to ballance if near not possible... result will be horrible!)

MC Clear glass don't cut UV and IR... (this not help)

The best you can do is add an UV IR cut filter, or better again an clip on cls-ccd filter (that cut iv ir and increase Ha and nebulosity contrast... or reduce light pollution)
My friend have this setup ans very pleased with this!

I found:
On some scope or lens, if you stack stock filtered camera with the cls-ccd will give blue/green stars (hard to balance)
This mean it is better to keep the 2 filter at same time option away...


But you do not NEED an IR/UV Cut filter.
Why?
Because the camera already has one! ;)
We DO NOT REMOVE THE IR BLOCK Filter when performing modifications for AP.

THere are TWO stock filters.
1) LPF-1. Also known as the Self Cleaning Element, or Low Pass Filter, this is a filter WITH IR/UV Block!
2) LPF-2. this filter is ONLY a WB filter. It ONLY restricts wavelengths to mimic the human eye...
LPF-2 is the "Bad for AP" filter. This is the ONLY filter we remove for a "Standard/Baader" type of mod, which leaves the system with an IR/UV Block filter INSIDE the camera!!!

We ONLY remove/replace **LPF-2**!!!
****LPF-1 remains INTACT****
LPF-1 has to be kept in the system unless you want a Full Spectrum Mod(removal of BOTH stock filters and no replacement filters are used).

Ask anyone here. LPF-2 is the filter you remove....NOT the "IR/UV Block" filter of the system!!

Why do people THINK we remove the IR block filter for mods?
Easy.
Years ago the only option you had for replacement filters was a Baader IR Block filter.
But this was on models that have ONE stock filter. ONE stock filter that does everything mentioned above.
If you remove that ONE, and ONLY filter, you have a Full Spectrum(UNfiltered) camera.
So, your ONLY choice was the Baader IR Block if you wanted a system with an IR block INside the camera.

This is why people are confused. For years people have been saying "you have to remove the IR Block filter and replace it with another IR cut, but one that has more transmission at Ha, in order to get properly filtered images".
That WAS the case, on models upto the 30D(which is ANCIENT in camera years!!)

This is NO LONGER the case!

What is the purpose of a replacement filter for LPF-2??
AF calibration remains intact. **THAT IS IT!**
Whether the replacement for LPF-2 is a Baader, Astronomik Clear Glass, AstroDon, Edmunds Clear, etc, etc, etc... the only point of installing a replacement filter is to keep AF intact. that's it..
Otherwise, your system will actually perform BETTER, with tighter stellar images(less bloat), with the least amount of glass/filters installed. it is simple physics. not rocket science. ;)

Again, this is all assuming that ****LPF-1 remains INTACT**** post-mod.
If LPF-1 is in there, you can use ANYthing or NOTHING for the replacement of LPF-2!

IMHO, if you wanted the absolute best performance, that would be a full spectrum modified camera and then install a CLS-CCD filter, or any IR/UV Block or Luminance Filter in the mix somewhere to block IR/UV..that will deliver the absolute sharpest stellar images, least amount of star bloat, and possibly even slightly more data!!

But for 90% of us, the "Standard" mod(also known as the Baader Mod, even though a Baader filter is NOT needed!!) does the trick just fine.


I am not saying I am an expert on this, and you by no means have to take my word for it, you can do what you like..
But with 6+ years of modifications, 400+ ASTRO mods(not including other mods!), I would like to think my opinion holds some kind of value.. ;)
If not, that is perfectly fine, too!


Here is an image showing the dual filter system used in 90% of newer models(ALL Canon from the 400D and newer, and most Nikons)

Good luck!

Attached Files


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#12 Aboy

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 02:32 AM

Hey Francisco do you have your cameras with Tyne low pass filter and use the CLS-CCD Filter?

#13 Aboy

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 02:37 AM

Hummm, I know that we must never use a camera without IR and UV cut, in particular with refractor, it give huge blue puffy stars, no sharpness, details and sky will be red (a lot red! damage the balance of the sky, and hard to ballance if near not possible... result will be horrible!)

MC Clear glass don't cut UV and IR... (this not help)

The best you can do is add an UV IR cut filter, or better again an clip on cls-ccd filter (that cut iv ir and increase Ha and nebulosity contrast... or reduce light pollution)
My friend have this setup ans very pleased with this!

I found:
On some scope or lens, if you stack stock filtered camera with the cls-ccd will give blue/green stars (hard to balance)
This mean it is better to keep the 2 filter at same time option away...


But you do not NEED an IR/UV Cut filter.
Why?
Because the camera already has one! ;)
We DO NOT REMOVE THE IR BLOCK Filter when performing modifications for AP.

THere are TWO stock filters.
1) LPF-1. Also known as the Self Cleaning Element, or Low Pass Filter, this is a filter WITH IR/UV Block!
2) LPF-2. this filter is ONLY a WB filter. It ONLY restricts wavelengths to mimic the human eye...
LPF-2 is the "Bad for AP" filter. This is the ONLY filter we remove for a "Standard/Baader" type of mod, which leaves the system with an IR/UV Block filter INSIDE the camera!!!

We ONLY remove/replace **LPF-2**!!!
****LPF-1 remains INTACT****
LPF-1 has to be kept in the system unless you want a Full Spectrum Mod(removal of BOTH stock filters and no replacement filters are used).

Ask anyone here. LPF-2 is the filter you remove....NOT the "IR/UV Block" filter of the system!!

Why do people THINK we remove the IR block filter for mods?
Easy.
Years ago the only option you had for replacement filters was a Baader IR Block filter.
But this was on models that have ONE stock filter. ONE stock filter that does everything mentioned above.
If you remove that ONE, and ONLY filter, you have a Full Spectrum(UNfiltered) camera.
So, your ONLY choice was the Baader IR Block if you wanted a system with an IR block INside the camera.

This is why people are confused. For years people have been saying "you have to remove the IR Block filter and replace it with another IR cut, but one that has more transmission at Ha, in order to get properly filtered images".
That WAS the case, on models upto the 30D(which is ANCIENT in camera years!!)

This is NO LONGER the case!

What is the purpose of a replacement filter for LPF-2??
AF calibration remains intact. **THAT IS IT!**
Whether the replacement for LPF-2 is a Baader, Astronomik Clear Glass, AstroDon, Edmunds Clear, etc, etc, etc... the only point of installing a replacement filter is to keep AF intact. that's it..
Otherwise, your system will actually perform BETTER, with tighter stellar images(less bloat), with the least amount of glass/filters installed. it is simple physics. not rocket science. ;)

Again, this is all assuming that ****LPF-1 remains INTACT**** post-mod.
If LPF-1 is in there, you can use ANYthing or NOTHING for the replacement of LPF-2!

IMHO, if you wanted the absolute best performance, that would be a full spectrum modified camera and then install a CLS-CCD filter, or any IR/UV Block or Luminance Filter in the mix somewhere to block IR/UV..that will deliver the absolute sharpest stellar images, least amount of star bloat, and possibly even slightly more data!!

But for 90% of us, the "Standard" mod(also known as the Baader Mod, even though a Baader filter is NOT needed!!) does the trick just fine.


I am not saying I am an expert on this, and you by no means have to take my word for it, you can do what you like..
But with 6+ years of modifications, 400+ ASTRO mods(not including other mods!), I would like to think my opinion holds some kind of value.. ;)
If not, that is perfectly fine, too!


Here is an image showing the dual filter system used in 90% of newer models(ALL Canon from the 400D and newer, and most Nikons)

Good luck!


Them if this is true.... Why in the hell I waste my money for an Astronomik Clear Glass and one CLS-CCD filter.... Damn... I am an IDIOT

#14 JustinLT

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 06:18 AM

Holy *BLEEP*...
This post just ruined all my knowledge on all DSLR modification thing... I was planning to do this for a while, but wanted to collect some more info.
If the first filter really filters IR/UV, why the hell people are buying all those baaded IR/UV cut filters? Does it mean, that only the 2nd filter filters the H-alpha light?

#15 Aboy

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 07:30 AM

It's no like the filter it's bad...

The CLS vs the CLS-CCD:

CLS:
Technical Data
92% transmission at 486nm (H-beta)
92% transmission at 496nm (OIII)
92% transmission at 501nm (OIII)
97% transmission at 656nm (H alpha)
pass from 450 to 540nm and beyond 650nm

CLS-CCD:
Technical Data
95% transmission at 486nm (H-beta)
95% transmission at 496nm (OIII)
95% transmission at 501nm (OIII)
97% transmission at 656nm (H-alpha)
pass from 450 to 520nm and from 640 to 690nm

I do prefer the CLS-CCD. My complain it's about the Low Pass Filter... I read around before mod my camera and at least the 92% or 93% agree to remove the Low Pass Filter when you Use the CLS-CCD... But now with the information from nofxrx I just feel like..... I still have the Low Pass Filter... But Now I don't know what to do. :tonofbricks: :tonofbricks: :tonofbricks:

#16 mmalik

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 07:35 AM

There are TWO stock filters.
1) LPF-1. Also known as the Self Cleaning Element, or Low Pass Filter, this is a filter WITH IR/UV Block!
2) LPF-2. this filter is ONLY a WB filter. It ONLY restricts wavelengths to mimic the human eye...
LPF-2 is the "Bad for AP" filter. This is the ONLY filter we remove for a "Standard/Baader" type of mod, which leaves the system with an IR/UV Block filter INSIDE the camera!!!


Brent, if I could get 'true'/'false' answers to these two questions, would appreciate:

1. Stock LPF-1 (IR/UV Block) does NOT block H-alpha?
2. Stock LPF-2 (WB filter) blocks/restricts H-alpha?

#17 fco_star

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 08:47 AM

Hey Francisco do you have your cameras with Tyne low pass filter and use the CLS-CCD Filter?


Hi Aboy, I have the full spectrum modded by Brent, having a CLS-CCD is a plus if you decided in the future to go for a full spectrum, I´m not an expert and I dont want to confuse you more.

#18 Aboy

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 09:39 AM

Hey Francisco do you have your cameras with Tyne low pass filter and use the CLS-CCD Filter?


Hi Aboy, I have the full spectrum modded by Brent, having a CLS-CCD is a plus if you decided in the future to go for a full spectrum, I´m not an expert and I dont want to confuse you more.


I mod my camera to full spectrum already.... I don't confuse me at all.. You give me your opinion and I do really appreciate it.

The thing is if it's better the Low Pass Filter or like I did with the Klarglass... Just that... Cuz I'm already spend the money on the Glass. :question:

#19 LeCarl

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 10:26 AM

I mean, never remove the LPF1 filter...

When I talk full spectrum, it mean no filter on sensor, but the LPF1 is on, because it's a cleaning filter, supposed to don't have any filter activity, NOT cut any uv or ir...

I never remove this one! the cmos is like static charge magnet to the dust... so you need the LPF1! ;p

#20 Aboy

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 10:56 AM

I mean, never remove the LPF1 filter...

When I talk full spectrum, it mean no filter on sensor, but the LPF1 is on, because it's a cleaning filter, supposed to don't have any filter activity, NOT cut any uv or ir...

I never remove this one! the cmos is like static charge magnet to the dust... so you need the LPF1! ;p


But with the clear class I put from Astronomic I can fit the low pass filter on... Is no space for it...

Them if the same ... I just waste my money in the clear glass

#21 WhitenerJ

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 10:58 AM

I have the clear glass standard mod by Brent with the LPF-1 left in place and can confirm no additional IR filter is required.

Jason

#22 CA Stargazer

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 12:43 PM

Aboy,
If you wanted Full Spectrum (Removed both LPF1 and LPF2)
Then the clear glass is your dust protection and will protect your CMOS from debris. I don't think it is a waste of money for that piece of mind.

Removing LPF1 also gets rid of the anti-aliasing function effect, some may prefer that.

Elsewhere in these forums are very good plots of LPF1 LPF2 spectral range.

#23 Aboy

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 03:06 PM

Thanks... I did that already no LPF1 and LPF2. I'll use the CLS-CCD and sometimes the H alpha to shoot some pictures.

#24 nofxrx

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 04:28 PM

There are TWO stock filters.
1) LPF-1. Also known as the Self Cleaning Element, or Low Pass Filter, this is a filter WITH IR/UV Block!
2) LPF-2. this filter is ONLY a WB filter. It ONLY restricts wavelengths to mimic the human eye...
LPF-2 is the "Bad for AP" filter. This is the ONLY filter we remove for a "Standard/Baader" type of mod, which leaves the system with an IR/UV Block filter INSIDE the camera!!!


Brent, if I could get 'true'/'false' answers to these two questions, would appreciate:

1. Stock LPF-1 (IR/UV Block) does NOT block H-alpha?
2. Stock LPF-2 (WB filter) blocks/restricts H-alpha?


I can try ;)

1: TRUE!! LPF-1 is ONLY a "clear filter" with IR UV blocking. "Clear" meaning it has NO tint to it at all and means it passes 100% of the visible spectrum, Ha included!...which leads me to the second question/answer:
2: TRUE! LPF-2 is ONLY a "WB" filter. Meaning it IS the ONLY filter that is "restricting"/blocking wavelengths to match the typical or wanted output of digital cameras..it has a greenish-blue tint to it. That is the tell-tale sign of a "WB filter".

Now, trying not to add anymore confusion, let me clarify a couple things.
LPF-2 DOES block IR/UV as well..it has to...but this is not because it is an "IR/UV Block(only)" filter, it is because the WB it is creating just happens to block MOST of the unwanted IR and UV...its purpose is NOT to block IR/UV, it is ONLY to manipulate the wavelengths closer to how WE see things..so the fact that it blocks IR/UV is just a side effect of the WB characteristics.
If these filters were designed to BOTH be IR/UV block, why would they install TWO filters? why not just use the ONE LPF-2 filter and be done with it?
Because they CANT, LPF-1 HAS TO REMAIN INtact IF you want an IR/UV Block filter INside the camera, regardless of whether LPF-2 is installed or not.
With LPF-2 removed, we now have removed the filter that restricts Ha transmissions to ~7-10%(stock camera transmissions) and it will now pass 100%(98-99.9999%) Ha.

SO. at this point, we have:
LPF-1 INstalled and LPF-2 *removed*, right? so we get a camera that has 100% transmission BETWEEN 400nm(UV) and 700nm(IR), the entire VISIBLE spectrum. Which is what is NEEDED for "proper" astro images.

You are DONE at this point. You have the wanted spectrum passing, and the unwanted being blocked.
Whether or not you install a replacement for LPF-2 is COMPLETELY up to YOU!

If you need AF calibration to remain intact, you need to replace LPF-2 with SOMETHING..ANYthing.
But, the higher quality the filter, the better, right? YES!
SO. Baader(IR Block OR Clear(Baader's FBCF-5D MarkII filter is NOT an IR block!!)), AstroDon(IR block), or Astronomik(clear glass only), or even the clear glass I use, Edmunds Optics High Transmission Clear Glass with AR(Anti-Reflection) coatings.
It doesnt matter which you use. THe only REAL purpose of using these filters is to keep AF calibration.
But, since there are many options, and all that I mentioned are VERY high quality filters, they are perfect for this application.
But, the fact that you are using an IR Blocking filter for the LPF-2 replacement just means that the majority of the expense for the AstroDon and Baader (IR blocking) filters is wasted $ and is redundant when LPF-1 is still in the camera since both filters serve the EXACT same purpose..

The reverse of this is true as well..think about it..
If you were to remove BOTH stock filters, and then install an AstroDon or Baader IR Block filter, you would have the EXACT same performance as a system with only LPF-1 in it.
Actually, since LPF-1 is a Low Pass Filter(blurs the images ever so slightly), you could actually have sharper images by doing this method.
But WHY!? When the FREE stock filter is already in there doing what these filters do, why bother? Just keep LPF-1, remove LPF-2 and go shoot some Ha rich images! and it didnt cost you ANYthing(except maybe time/$ for the actual mod!)


Why do "some people" (professionals, not your average Joe on CN that is voicing his opinion) tell you that you NEED to use a Baader or AstroDon filter? I have no clue. If you went and did the research, and looked at the tons of data on the net showing that an LPF-1 system works EXACTLY like an "AstroDon, or Baader" camera, or just ask the MANY people right here on CN that have this system, you would see there is no reason.

Let me just add this.
I know for a fact that anyone doing these mods professionally, myself included, gets these filters as VERY nice discounts! We MAKE MORE $ when people want the Baader/AstroDon/expensive filters...so why tell anyone the truth when it will cut into your profits? ;)
I am not saying in any way that is what other's do..at all..
But what other reason could they have for not telling people the truth.

I for one think everyone should know as much about ANY subject as possible so that they can make a more informed decision..which is why I sit here on CN year after year and tell people this exact same info..
Sometimes I get jobs from it, other times I help people do the mod themselves..
I never intended to make tons of money off of my fellow imagers when I started this. I have the tech background and experience..so I just do whatever comes across my desk..
Either way, if I do the mod or not, people are HAPPY with my services. I answer emails daily on people just looking for help or opinions on what they should do, what mod to do, what equipment works best with that mod, how to do the mod themselves, and obviously, how much I charge to do the mods..
Some are paying jobs, some aren't, but I consider ALL of them to be customers. And customers deserve the best possible service and they have the right to know EVERYTHING that is relevant to the job/tech/service/etc. period.

SORRY!
Back on topic..I ramble sometimes.. :o


I mean, never remove the LPF1 filter...

When I talk full spectrum, it mean no filter on sensor, but the LPF1 is on, because it's a cleaning filter, supposed to don't have any filter activity, NOT cut any uv or ir...

I never remove this one! the cmos is like static charge magnet to the dust... so you need the LPF1! ;p


This is COMPLETELY WRONG!!! Sorry, but you are WAY off base here..

If LPF-1 is still inside the camera, YOU DO NOT HAVE a Full Spectrum Mod.
You CANT!!!
It IS 100% without a doubt the IR/UV Block filter of the system.
It also has the Piezo Electric Element(that thingy that vibrates the dust off of the filter) attached to it...but that doesnt mean it is "only a cleaning filter" :help: :rolling:
Dont believe me? easy to prove.
A REAL Full Spectrum Modified camera SHOULD be able to take VERY, VERY short exposures with an IR PASS filter, think "Daytime IR" shots..the black and white, with trees and grass all white, the sky black, etc..etc..
Take YOUR camera out with an IR PASS filter, any one..Hoya R72, it doesnt matter.
Try and take an image. you will see that IR is being FULLY blocked by LPF-1, and you will HAVE to use LOOOOONG exposures and a tripod for ANYthing in the IR.
Full Spectrum=FULL SPECTRAL TRANSMISSIONS! i.e. ALL light passes to the sensor, INCLUDING IR and UV!! ;)
With my REAL Full Spectrum Modified cameras, I take daytime IR(pass) images at 1/4000th exposures at ISO100 and F/8!!
You would need 10seconds, ISO1600, and F2.8!
You are wrong.

I am not trying to be rude, but this is just so wrong, I have to say something..

ALSO.

I never remove this one! the cmos is like static charge magnet to the dust... so you need the LPF1! ;p


Umm..no. you dont.
The sensor is NEVER exposed. the sensor itself is a DIP(dual in line package), ceramic encased, with a CLEAR window on the front. The sensor is ALWAYS inside this package and behind this window. If you removed the glass from the sensor, then you are asking for trouble.
This window IS NOT a "filter", or even removable! It is permanently attached to the ceramic package.
So even if you have a Full Spectrum mod camera with no filters inside, the sensor, the **ACTUAL silicon sensor** is NEVER exposed, or even remotely in danger from anything..let alone "charged dust particles"?? seriously??

Also, think about this in terms of "cleanliness or possible debris issues"..
A stock camera, or a Baader/AstroDon camera has FIVE optical surfaces for dust/debris to cling to.
1) LPF-1. both sides=surfaces 1 & 2
2) Baader/AstroDon/ or Clear Glass. both sides=surfaces 3 & 4
3) optical window on sensor(only one side accessible)= surface 5

A full spectrum camera has ONE surface to keep clean!
ONE! the sensor's window..that's it!
Not FIVE! ONE!

I wish we could have systems that have ONE surface that needed cleaning and still have IR/UV Blocking, or even stock cameras..but that is not the way it works.

LPF-1 only cleans ITSELF. NOT THE ENTIRE SYSTEM!!!!


I really think there is a lot about electronics and optics that you need to learn before making statements like these..

Again, I dont mean to be rude or harsh, but I do not know how else to explain this stuff..and do not want people getting very confused over your 'advice'..


Aboy,
If you wanted Full Spectrum (Removed both LPF1 and LPF2)
Then the clear glass is your dust protection and will protect your CMOS from debris. I don't think it is a waste of money for that piece of mind.

Removing LPF1 also gets rid of the anti-aliasing function effect, some may prefer that.

Elsewhere in these forums are very good plots of LPF1 LPF2 spectral range.


EXACTLY!!!
Aboy, you in NO WAY wasted your money. You actually did something that makes perfect sense...problem was that you didnt know what you were doing when you did it lol :D
But, you will be fine!!
Since you have it, install the Astronomik filter...
But, seeing your recent posts about the camera not working the first time, then after you went back in and did something it worked again, and IS working now...I would just leave it as is...
but that is just my opinion...
Yes it means that you paid $ for the filter and didnt use it..but so what..sell it! you might make back some or most of that $..

Or, if you do install it, just be careful and take your time and use the tutorials available and I think you will be fine.

Your AF is going to be way off now that both filters have been removed..so even installing the Astronomik is not going to bring that back to PERFECT calibration, it will be close, but still not accurate enough for daytime use.



Wow...think this is my longest post ever.. :tonofbricks:
If ANYone suffered through that, I would be surprised LOL!!

Cheers!
  • Midnight Dan likes this

#25 Aboy

Aboy

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 05:09 PM

Aboy, you in NO WAY wasted your money. You actually did something that makes perfect sense...problem was that you didnt know what you were doing when you did it lol :D
But, you will be fine!!
Since you have it, install the Astronomik filter...
But, seeing your recent posts about the camera not working the first time, then after you went back in and did something it worked again, and IS working now...I would just leave it as is...
but that is just my opinion...
Yes it means that you paid $ for the filter and didnt use it..but so what..sell it! you might make back some or most of that $..

Or, if you do install it, just be careful and take your time and use the tutorials available and I think you will be fine.

Your AF is going to be way off now that both filters have been removed..so even installing the Astronomik is not going to bring that back to PERFECT calibration, it will be close, but still not accurate enough for daytime use.


Thanks for the post and help me to clear some question.. I'm really glad that you people takes time and answer my question.

Also:

1: jajajajaja yes, I did mod my camera with no much knowledge about it how to mod it.. But everyone do the same the first time. We learn with the practice XD


2. Believe me... I'll.

3. I don't care about the AF. I want my camera for astrophography. If I want to shoot some day time pictures, I'll use manual focus.. :)

Also I'll practice hard in order to learn how to takes good pictures.

Thanks again. :bow:






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