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Baader SHAME - Mark V bino package

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#26 Paul G

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 04:02 PM

IMO, the lack of a case is no big deal. It is not advertised as coming with one, so you know what you are getting when you pay your money.

In spite of two previous posters making light of it, I would be highly PO'd if I had laid down $1800 of my hard earned money and then received this binoviewer with a ding in the paint. I buy most of my gear used, so I expect the occasional scratch, ding, etc. On the rare occasion that I do buy new I expect the item to arrive looking pristine.


+1

I would expect the same, would not accept less.

#27 pftarch

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 04:25 PM

When I reviewed my Earthwin purchase I commented that the case was kind of cheesy, BUT, that I was ok with that because I would rather have them put there effort into the powerswitch rather than the case. (I don't really use the case now either.)

And yes, at $1800, I would be upset about dings on a new purchase.

#28 BadClams

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 04:52 PM

and maybe what caused the paint chips was enough to cause some internal alignment issues???

#29 rfr66

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 06:56 PM

I had similar paint chips on a MK V that I purchased from AP last year. After giving a little resistance that they carefully inspect all of their units for chips before shipping, they promptly exchanged it for another new one.

#30 mikey cee

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 09:07 PM

Oh God how I wish they would sell their cosmetic blems at half price. :praying: :praying: :praying:Mike

#31 Doug D.

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 10:18 AM

A small cheap case for a binoviewer is just one more thing to lug out to the field, possibly forget/lose/drop resulting in one more thing between me and getting set-up and viewing in the shortest possible time. My MkV's live in my dark sky eyepiece case with well, my eyepieces.... and my Maxbrights are dedicated to solar with one scope, a couple of dedicated pairs of EPs and a single compensator. The latter all goes into one Pelikan case that is a heck of a lot more durable and useful than the one that came with the BVs. Carboard box and foam were enough to get my Mk Vs to me safe and sound - and my Maxbright "case" was opened once to retrieve the BVs and other bits and now lives in a storage cabinet with my MK V cardboad box and foam should I ever end up selling on Amart to someone expecting a box/case.

I wouldn't call the lack of a MkV "case" a shame, just one less near-useless thing to end up in a landfill some day.

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#32 MrGrytt

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 04:00 PM

I had similar paint chips on a MK V that I purchased from AP last year. After giving a little resistance that they carefully inspect all of their units for chips before shipping, they promptly exchanged it for another new one.


A few years ago I decided to buy a second Mark V from Astro-Physics. At that time they only had one pair in stock and told me that there were some small paint chips on it. I opted to wait for their next shipment and get one with no paint issues. They were very up-front about it and told me right away about the chips. Something may slip by from time to time but I do believe they check everything out prior to selling and shipping.

As far as a case is concerned I think something as good and expensive as the Mark V deserves a good one. I use the Pelican 1200 case and it works very well. It can hold all three correctors, a extra nosepiece for straight through viewing and a thin adapter for a little extra backfocus if needed.

Harvey

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#33 Grandpa Jim

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Posted 05 January 2013 - 10:34 PM

Regarding the paint chips, yes they are small and probably easy to touch up, but if this was a new set of Mark V's, then one should expect a perfect finish on them considering the high cost, and more important, how did the chips get there? were the MarkV"s dropped at the factory or dealer? and if so, are they still in alignment? all good questions and issues for the OP to pursue with his dealer.
Rex


I just find it a shame that we have become a nation of complainers, even over small meaningless things. Yes....it is too bad that they came through production with tiny paint chips, but if they are not intrinsically damaged, why go to the trouble (and expense) of returning them to a manufacturer when they can be "touched up" for next to nothing?? If they have more extensive damage, YES, by all means return them. But, for the chips only......why bother??
Besides, I would be willing to bet that the manufacturer *might* "touch up" the pair you returned and send them right back to you...........

#34 Aquarist

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 06:20 AM

Hmmm. My MARKV came with no case. Hmmm, my Takahashi TOA150 came with no case either. On the other hand I did not have to pay for cases for those instruments that I will never use. There is no free lunch; if a case is supplied, you are going to pay for it. If you are not going to use it, you just wasted a bunch of money. If you want a case, buy one, then at least you get exactly what you want.

#35 StarStuff1

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 07:01 AM

OR, make your own case. 1/4-in, 3/8-in or 1/2-in plywood and foam is not that expensive and can make a great protective case. The hinges and other hardware and be a little costly. Be sure to save those parts if you are about to throw away a used case that was originally purposed for something else.

#36 tomcody

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 01:45 PM

Regarding the paint chips, yes they are small and probably easy to touch up, but if this was a new set of Mark V's, then one should expect a perfect finish on them considering the high cost, and more important, how did the chips get there? were the MarkV"s dropped at the factory or dealer? and if so, are they still in alignment? all good questions and issues for the OP to pursue with his dealer.
Rex


I just find it a shame that we have become a nation of complainers, even over small meaningless things. Yes....it is too bad that they came through production with tiny paint chips, but if they are not intrinsically damaged, why go to the trouble (and expense) of returning them to a manufacturer when they can be "touched up" for next to nothing?? If they have more extensive damage, YES, by all means return them. But, for the chips only......why bother??
Besides, I would be willing to bet that the manufacturer *might* "touch up" the pair you returned and send them right back to you...........

Since you chose to quote me and I assume to call me a complainer, I am going to reply to you, Grandpa!
First reason to be concerned, the Mark V's cost over $1300, and for that price should not come damaged (if purchased new) . If you purchased a new car and it came out from final servicing with a foot long scratch in the fender down to the metal ( a fair analogy, given the size difference), I bet you would complain and to the dealer and not just except it that way! Why? it reduces the value of your purchase and that is not what you paid for.
Second, sure the chips may be able to be touched up? but with what? how much money would you spend on different paints and painting sample patches to try and match the finish on the Bino's? Or would you call the vender or manufacturer and ask about a touch up paint? and when they asked why you needed it for a new purchase, and why you did not just return them as damaged? what would you say?
Third, the issue of how the paint was chipped, I owned two sets of Mark V's and I can say the paint on them is very tough and durable, It would take a lot to damage it, perhaps a drop from a height onto a hard rough surface and what of the alignment? after that event? who is going to check out that?
Again, all good questions for the OP and the dealer to discuss.
Rex

#37 Stellarfire

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 02:20 PM

I agree with Rex. No one should accept a chipped Baader Mark V bino sold as new condition and payed accordingly. I did a lot of business with Baader and I appreciate their honest and reliable business style. Baader inspects their goods carefully before shipping and shipping chipped Mark V's is simply not the style of Baader.

Stephan

#38 panhard

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 02:36 PM

Ok guys don't make me lock this thread. Lets play nice. Be respectful to each other. :4

#39 Grandpa Jim

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 02:59 PM

Regarding the paint chips, yes they are small and probably easy to touch up, but if this was a new set of Mark V's, then one should expect a perfect finish on them considering the high cost, and more important, how did the chips get there? were the MarkV"s dropped at the factory or dealer? and if so, are they still in alignment? all good questions and issues for the OP to pursue with his dealer.
Rex


I just find it a shame that we have become a nation of complainers, even over small meaningless things. Yes....it is too bad that they came through production with tiny paint chips, but if they are not intrinsically damaged, why go to the trouble (and expense) of returning them to a manufacturer when they can be "touched up" for next to nothing?? If they have more extensive damage, YES, by all means return them. But, for the chips only......why bother??
Besides, I would be willing to bet that the manufacturer *might* "touch up" the pair you returned and send them right back to you...........

Since you chose to quote me and I assume to call me a complainer, I am going to reply to you, Grandpa!
First reason to be concerned, the Mark V's cost over $1300, and for that price should not come damaged (if purchased new) . If you purchased a new car and it came out from final servicing with a foot long scratch in the fender down to the metal ( a fair analogy, given the size difference), I bet you would complain and to the dealer and not just except it that way! Why? it reduces the value of your purchase and that is not what you paid for.
Second, sure the chips may be able to be touched up? but with what? how much money would you spend on different paints and painting sample patches to try and match the finish on the Bino's? Or would you call the vender or manufacturer and ask about a touch up paint? and when they asked why you needed it for a new purchase, and why you did not just return them as damaged? what would you say?
Third, the issue of how the paint was chipped, I owned two sets of Mark V's and I can say the paint on them is very tough and durable, It would take a lot to damage it, perhaps a drop from a height onto a hard rough surface and what of the alignment? after that event? who is going to check out that?
Again, all good questions for the OP and the dealer to discuss.
Rex


No!......it was not my intent to call "you" a complainer - sorry it came off that way.
In my mind, it just made more sense to touch up the paint, (and I think I was clear.......*if* that was the only issue).
Just did not make sense to me to spend the probably close to $50 or more to return it to the manufacturer by insured shipping (which would NO way be cheap w/ a $1300 item) when the materials to touch up those tiny chips would be less than $10? How hard would it be to match "white"??
On some level, I agree that it would aggravate me to receive something like that from a high end manufacturer, but beings I'm a bit cheap & broke, my approach would be to use it "as is" if it wasn't damaged otherwise, touch it up when I could, and be damn careful about buying anything else from that vendor again. Just sayin'...........

It was not my intention to make anyone mad, I apologize if I did. I HATE trying to communicate on the internet.

#40 tomcody

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 04:37 PM

Jim,
Thank you for the nice reply, and no offense taken. I see your point, ( I have tried that approach, making repairs myself, instead of sending the item back and some times it works for me, other times, not so much! and I wish I had just returned the item and let the vender deal with it. Both viewpoints are valid and I respect yours.
Rex

#41 panhard

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Posted 07 January 2013 - 04:53 PM

Thanks guys. I do appreciate it. :bow:

#42 Geo557

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Posted 08 January 2013 - 11:01 PM

Indeed :ubetcha:

#43 SteveTheSwede

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Posted 12 January 2013 - 08:08 AM

I think the only problem is that many people think of included stuff as "free", which of course it isn't. So, somebody is paying for the "free" and "included" stuff, now guess who that is. :)

#44 Mike Clemens

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Posted 13 January 2013 - 08:41 PM

Both my Baaders over time (the ?mark 4?) and the Mark V came with little chips in their paint. Still nothing I've seen has touched their even light throughput, even color balance per eye, and extremely low - almost absent - scatter on bright subjects.

You pay for what you get, evidently they mean the optics and not the paint... this image is getting a little old but I have no intention to repeat the experiment I'm settled on the Baader Mark V.

Light/dark curves are left eye / right eye.
Three peaks are R,G,B


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#45 ohioalfa64

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 07:53 PM

Anyone have views on whether a Mk V or a Denk Binotron 27 is better for a 6" Mak? If a Baader Prism 2" diagonal is so much superior over the mirror, why does Baader force the purchase of the dielectric mirror in the Mk V package? No comment on flaked paint. Things get damaged in shipping.

#46 johnnyha

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 10:41 PM

I had thought the reason Baader sells the 1.25" dielectric T2 mirror with the MkV now is they quite literally ran out of the 1.25" prisms? I didn't think it was simply to cut costs or some other nefarious reason. Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong?

BTW Baader/Astro-Physics sells the Mark V Binoviewer with a 1.25" diagonal, it includes a 2" nosepiece to give maximum clear aperture in fast scopes.

PS - altho I have become a fan of the Baader T2 system, if I were buying new today might very well go with the new Binotron-27, I've owned Denk IIs before and they are excellent. I'm excited to hear reviews of the new Denk and I have almost ordered it several times. :grin:

#47 RodgerHouTex

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 06:39 AM

Exactly what are the graphs supposed to be showing?






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