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Upgrade 10" to 12"-is this worth?

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#51 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 09:09 PM

We both seem to agree how what that difference is, some but not a lot, not a WOW but rather but maybe an "ah yes."

Reasonable expectations are the key to satisfaction...


:waytogo:


Of course that "ah yes" just might turn into a :whee: when you finally see a long sought after object for the first time. I hunted for Stephen's quintet in the 10 inch but never saw it. Saw it in the 12.5 inch.

Jon

#52 Starman1

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 02:00 AM

We both seem to agree how what that difference is, some but not a lot, not a WOW but rather but maybe an "ah yes."

Reasonable expectations are the key to satisfaction...


:waytogo:


Of course that "ah yes" just might turn into a :whee: when you finally see a long sought after object for the first time. I hunted for Stephen's quintet in the 10 inch but never saw it. Saw it in the 12.5 inch.

Jon

I was like that with the Horsehead nebula (B33). Looked for it for 11 years with an 8" and never spotted it.
Then spotted it without a filter on my first try with the 12.5" and have seen it many times since.
When you cross the Rubicon, you better have elephant feed (i.e the DSOs not visible in smaller apertures). :grin:

#53 gaz-in

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 08:20 AM

I was in the reverse situation. I have an excellent Teeter 12 with high end optics. I wanted something slightly more grab and go. I chose a Dobstuf 10 inch with standard optics. Light enuff to quickly setup and take down. When I have the time (and eneregy), I get the Teeter 12 and EQ platform out. For me a High end optics 12 and a standard optics 10 work just great...

#54 RocketScientist

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 08:41 PM

"Knowing what I think I know now, if I had to get a new scope all over again I'd definitely go with a 12" or 12.5" truss dob from a high end manufacturer - and perhaps an 8" solid tube as a goto scope for the back yard."

Anyone with a large truss tube scope needs some kind of grab-n-go for the back yard, and I would suggest that that backyard scope be no larger than 10". Anything in the 6 - 10" could work (or a 4" refractor) depending on your situation.

Some nights you won't observe at all if your only choice is to assemble and collimate a truss scope.

#55 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 07:16 AM

"Knowing what I think I know now, if I had to get a new scope all over again I'd definitely go with a 12" or 12.5" truss dob from a high end manufacturer - and perhaps an 8" solid tube as a goto scope for the back yard."

Anyone with a large truss tube scope needs some kind of grab-n-go for the back yard, and I would suggest that that backyard scope be no larger than 10". Anything in the 6 - 10" could work (or a 4" refractor) depending on your situation.

Some nights you won't observe at all if your only choice is to assemble and collimate a truss scope.


A fast 4 inch refractor on an alt-az mount is a great companion for a larger scope... I agree that a smaller scope is almost a necessity but one can leave a truss Dob assembled in the garage and just roll it out to use it.

Jon

#56 azure1961p

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 09:35 AM

"Knowing what I think I know now, if I had to get a new scope all over again I'd definitely go with a 12" or 12.5" truss dob from a high end manufacturer - and perhaps an 8" solid tube as a goto scope for the back yard."

Anyone with a large truss tube scope needs some kind of grab-n-go for the back yard, and I would suggest that that backyard scope be no larger than 10". Anything in the 6 - 10" could work (or a 4" refractor) depending on your situation.

Some nights you won't observe at all if your only choice is to assemble and collimate a truss scope.


I don't know if that assembly of a truss is do bad. Mi d you - lol - I've never done it but if you figure that first hour the mirror is cooling down anyway who cares if your putting it together and how long can it take at most 30min? I'd bet half that without collimation - I'm thinking of a 12" f/5 truss.

My 8" reflector gets a full hour of cooling even with two fans blowing. It's 5 min to set up then I listen to the radio, look through binos, or the Ranger.

My point that even if a truss was already while, its still got cool down time.

Pete

#57 RocketScientist

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 03:22 PM

Some nights you won't observe at all if your only choice is to assemble and collimate a truss scope.

I don't know if that assembly of a truss is so bad. Mind you - lol - I've never done it but if you figure that first hour the mirror is cooling down anyway who cares if your putting it together and how long can it take at most 30min? I'd bet half that without collimation - I'm thinking of a 12" f/5 truss.


You care if you don't have the 30 minutes to spare. A scope cooling down does not require human intervention; I can be cooking, eating, cleaning, etc. while the scope is cooling down. I cannot do those things and assemble or collimate a scope at the same time.

I typically stick my Z10 out on the deck, plug in the fan, and come back inside. It takes about 2 - 3 minutes. Then I wait an hour for cooldown and do my other tasks. After dinner, the scope is ready.

Some nights you'll have time to assemble and collimate; some you won't. I agree with the poster who said that if you can leave the truss scope assembled in a shed or garage, the problem largely goes away. And I agree with Jon that a 4" refractor would be a great companion scope.

#58 azure1961p

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 04:48 PM

Ah, see that's the difference. I've been observing from my backyard this winter but typically I drive somewhere and well - like it or not that thing is gonna take its hour. Hence the binos and refractor and radio.

Pete

#59 johnnyha

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 01:06 AM

I don't know if that assembly of a truss is do bad. Mi d you - lol - I've never done it but if you figure that first hour the mirror is cooling down anyway who cares if your putting it together and how long can it take at most 30min?


Setting up a truss scope while it's cooling down is one thing... breaking the scope down at the end of the night is another. I am a backyard observer and I keep my scope assembled in the living room, mainly so i don't have to break it down at the end of the night.

#60 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 11:04 AM

Regarding the discussion of cool down... Viewing through a scope that is cooling down is like observing in less than perfect seeing... there is no reason to wait if the skies are dark and there are no clouds. Pick your targets based on usable magnifications. When the scope is cooled down and thermally stable, push the limits of the seeing. Until, then, just have fun.

Jon

#61 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 11:05 AM

Regarding the discussion of cool down... Viewing through a scope that is cooling down is like observing in less than perfect seeing... there is no reason to wait if the skies are dark and there are no clouds. Pick your targets based on usable magnifications. When the scope is cooled down and thermally stable, push the limits of the seeing. Until then, just have fun.

Jon

#62 csrlice12

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 11:19 AM

A few BIG questions to ask yourself before getting a truss dob:
1. are you a clutz?
2. Do you drop things easily?
3. Is seven years bad luck cumulative, or consecutive?

If you know the answer to #3 already, chances are a truss dob is not for you....

#63 stratocaster

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 01:49 PM

"Knowing what I think I know now, if I had to get a new scope all over again I'd definitely go with a 12" or 12.5" truss dob from a high end manufacturer - and perhaps an 8" solid tube as a goto scope for the back yard."

Anyone with a large truss tube scope needs some kind of grab-n-go for the back yard, and I would suggest that that backyard scope be no larger than 10". Anything in the 6 - 10" could work (or a 4" refractor) depending on your situation.

Some nights you won't observe at all if your only choice is to assemble and collimate a truss scope.


A fast 4 inch refractor on an alt-az mount is a great companion for a larger scope... I agree that a smaller scope is almost a necessity but one can leave a truss Dob assembled in the garage and just roll it out to use it.

Jon


I actually do have a 4" f7 refractor on an alt-az mount as my grab n go, and it does complement the 10" solid tube dob perfectly. If I did things over again and got a slightly larger truss, though, I wonder if my GnG would have been a smaller dob or a 4" refractor. I dunno. The refractor is awfully nice, though.

#64 Jon Isaacs

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:13 PM

If I did things over again and got a slightly larger truss, though, I wonder if my GnG would have been a smaller dob or a 4" refractor. I dunno. The refractor is awfully nice, though.



4 inch F/7 refractors on alt-az mounts have capabilities a Newtonian doesn't. They are just so handy, they provide nice, wide fields of view... few thermal issues, nice for terrestrial viewing.

Jon






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