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Making fake meteorites

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#26 StarWars

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 11:43 AM

I'm very concerned about how fake meteorites made with 3D printers could dramatically alter meteorite values. Is this something that is already starting to happen? I don't know if 3D printers can make fakes YET. I do know that something shook me up that is in the current Astronomy magazine on page 13 (April 2013) It stated that 3D printers can create small objects out of synthetic Moon rock material.
Several weeks ago I posted my concern about 3D printers on the Off Topic Observatory but the vast mojority of responders only had high praise for these gizmos. Is there any concern at all from meteorite collectors?



I believe 3D printers use a special resin which will melt at a low temperature compared to a rock. Just apply some heat to the meteor in question the resin should melt when tested. :grin:

#27 oblako

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Posted 11 March 2013 - 09:43 PM

Carey is right, there are properties inherent to meteorites that cannot be replicated on Earth - such as the formation of chondrules.
Best regards,

MikeG

Well, that's right, chondrules are found only in meteorites, except sometimes there are some spherical inclusions in the Earth rocks, inclusions that look as chondrules. For example I looked at a rock I found under a microscope and found a few inclusions that do look as chondrules
http://farm9.staticf...fee07d5a1_b.jpg
I emailed the image to an expert, and she still does not believe my rock is a meteorite. :(

And as I mentioned earlier there's no need to make a fake meteorite, just find a rock and sell it on Ebay like this guy is doing http://www.ebay.com/...&_armrs=1&am... I doubt that any of the rocks he offers as meteorites have anything at all to do with meteorites, yet he gets some bids.

#28 BSJ

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 11:34 AM

There are printers capable of printing with titanium…

#29 CygnuS

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:38 PM

There are printers capable of printing with titanium…

Is there anything (non liquid or gas) they're not capable of printing with?

#30 BSJ

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 09:17 AM

I dunno. If you can heat/melt it with a laser or arc, I'd say you can "print" with it.

#31 Mister T

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 02:12 PM

Simple solution #8471:

When buying meteorites from a source of unknown reputation, scan and print the cash and send the copies.

if the Meteor proves to be real, then you send the real bills.

if not you have just lost some effort...

:shameonyou: :rules: :tonofbricks:

#32 Glassthrower

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 03:33 PM

There are limited scenarios where I could envision a 3D-printed pseudometeorite being successfully passed off as a genuine meteorite. But, even under those circumstances, the specimen would not stand up to close scrutiny.

For example, let's suppose you make a visual replica of a meteorite and then encase the specimen in a "protective" glass dome for display - or, put the specimen into lucite. Either way, the specimen cannot be readily touched or examined very closely because of the limitations imposed by the container or display vessel. It might look very convincing and could be listed on eBay or some online venue where the buyer can only see photos and not the item first-hand.

In such a scenario, an uninformed or overly-eager buyer could be duped. They might receive the specimen and be pleased with it, put it on their mantle, and treasure it. But, if it is ever removed from the display container, the ruse is likely to be exposed quickly.

In this kind of case, one wouldn't need a 3D-printer to achieve similar results. A potato covered in textured polymer clay and painted to resemble a meteorite would pass muster if the prospective buyer can only see photos to make their judgement.

It's kinda fun coming up with hypothetical scenarios for this. :lol:

Anyone wanna buy a painted space potato?

Best regards,

MikeG

#33 Mister T

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Posted 14 March 2013 - 10:10 PM

Sure!

Can you make change for a $300 bill? :money:

#34 Paraclete

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 11:59 AM

Me personally, I feel a whole lot better since this thread came up. In the past, I wanted to buy some meteorites, but I was a little skeptical about their authenticity.

Since this thread came up, I have whole lot more confidence in making the purchase from a reputable seller of meteorites.

Long story short, next paycheque, some of that money is going towards some meteorites. (And I am reasonably confident that they will be the real deal!) :)

#35 cpsTN

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 06:08 PM

I would gladly get rid of all the nuclear weapons in the world if the cost was losing all the nuclear power plants.


Why are people always so willing to get rid of all the good to reduce the small possibility of bad? The bad that comes with something will always be managed well if the good it brings is worth it. As far as fake meterorites go, I agree that only the expensive ones will be faked if at all. This is the same reason no one fakes $1 bills, unless there is a rare one.

#36 CygnuS

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Posted 16 March 2013 - 06:51 PM

I would gladly get rid of all the nuclear weapons in the world if the cost was losing all the nuclear power plants.


Why are people always so willing to get rid of all the good to reduce the small possibility of bad? The bad that comes with something will always be managed well if the good it brings is worth it.

I understand why you feel that way. I had a best friend killed in a car accident years ago and I never proposed to outlaw cars. Nuclear weapons that could destroy all life on earth are different though. In regards to 3-D printers I'm not proposing to outlaw them, just warning of what can come. In the off-topic observatory nobody agreed with my argument of how they could upset the global economic balance...but nobody disagreed either. I guess it all boils down to fear of the unknown. When every nation has nukes there will be no unknowns. Nuclear war will be certain. Since nuclear armed nations won't stop proliferation there is nothing to stop this thing from following the path to its natural conclusion.

#37 csa/montana

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Posted 17 March 2013 - 08:43 AM

I thought we were discussing meteorites. :confused:

#38 darklighteditor

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Posted 18 March 2013 - 11:09 AM

I thought we were discussing meteorites. :confused:


Agreed. Let's keep this thread on-topic by discussing meteorites. It's a good thread and doesn't need to go off-topic.

#39 CygnuS

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 11:25 AM

I agree. Any further discussions of 3D printers should be addressed in the off topic observatory if it isn't meteorite related. A 3D printer thread is currently on page 4 since nobody's posted on it for a few days. Thankfully we've established here that 3D printers aren't a serious danger to meteorite collectors. In the meantime if anybody thinks that there are no downsides to technology I would be happy to engage in a friendly and constructive debate in the off topic observatory.






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