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CPC to CG5?

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#1 dragonslayer1

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 12:21 PM

I currently have a CPC 9.25 XLT Wedge Mount. I was entertaining the idea of de-forking it and mounting on a E/Q other than Wedge.. I saw the CG5 for $550.00.. From what I can gather the load max for it is 35lb. Another route is the CGEM. I don't think de-forking is too big a deal? The other mount type offers more versatility and can mount different scopes with a simple dovetail,, Right???
Thank you, Kasey

#2 Psyire

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 12:50 PM

In my opinion you need a CGE or CGEPRO to do better than the CPC mount if you intend to image with a large SCT. If you want to do the smaller refractor imaging then a CGEM would be fine. My CPC1100's periodic error was very similar to that of the original CGE. (now discontinued) I have also decided to upgrade and defork my CPC but I'm moving up to the Paramount MX as I'm also looking for a substantial upgrade.

#3 dragonslayer1

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 01:30 PM

Thank you but you mean the CGEM/ or CGEM DX/ or CGE PRO/ as options??? I didn't see a CGE on their web site.. The PRO is beyond my pay grade LOL Also aren't you the one that rebuilt your CPC 1100?? Made dampners for mirror flop??
Thank you Kasey

#4 dragonslayer1

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 02:24 PM

I was reading on scopes, weights, capacities, etc. Says CGE PRO 90lbs, CGEM DX 50lbs, CGEM 40lbs, CG5 35lbs. for max weight capacities... Weights for OTA either Edge or XLT are C-14 45lbs, C-11 28lbs, C-9.25 21lbs.. They are saying those are payload capacity on mounts.. The CGEM or the CGEM-DX @ 40-50 lbs payload is a C-11 OTA with 10-20 lbs to spare???? You have reservations on that?? Your probably a lot more experienced at this than I am so your opinion is worth something. Also was scrambling on last post and see where I erred on the CGE reading of your text Thank you
Kasey

#5 MikeBOKC

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 05:54 PM

I often set up at the club dark site next to a 9.25 on a CGEM and it seems to carry it just fine. Another option to consider might be the Ioptron IEQ 45, which has had some nice notices from visual and imaging observers alike. I would probably look at either of those if I ever decided to defork my CPC1100 for visual only; imaging does require the maximum possible mount. From what I understand deforking a CPC is not a major mechanical challenge; you just need to install a mounting dovetail and you are good to go.

#6 mclewis1

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 07:14 PM

Kasey,

The CGE is an older and now discontinued mount that has a 60lb carrying capacity.

Putting a C9.25 on a gem for imaging means that your starting with a 20lb ota, then you've to to add camera, focal reducer, filter(s), and an autoguiding setup so you're probably now pushing 30lbs. For popular mounts the rated capacity is for visual use and for imaging you generally cut that number in half or by a third. With high end mounts you tend to be able to image at or even sometimes above their rated capacities.

So a CGEM rated at 40lbs would be borderline with a fully configured C9.25. You'd definitely need to be using a focal reducer to cut the effective focal length (imaging with shorter focal lengths is easier on the mount) and use an autoguider. I think you'd be happier with the DX model. I also agree with Psyire that the CPC with a solid wedge is also no slouch at imaging.

#7 Psyire

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 08:50 PM

What I'm saying is that if you want an 'upgrade' then you need to go with something bigger than a CGEM/DX. The CPC on a decent wedge provides as good or better results than the CGEM/DX if you are interested in imaging with a big SCT. If you want to stay Celestron then you're only real upgrade option is the CGEPRO. (or used CGE) Now if you are talking more flexibility with the same caliber of mount then a CGEM might be a consideration. An example would be if you have multiple scopes that are too large to piggyback on your CPC 9.25

#8 Psyire

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 08:54 PM

If you are interested in the hard PE numbers to back up what the CPC mounts are capable of then you can read this thread on my mounts performance: http://www.cloudynig.../Number/3720564

Also remember that those PE numbers are with the C11 and a 80mm refractor piggybacked on the wedge mounted CPC.

#9 RTLR 12

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 09:25 PM

I didn't see that you asked about doing AP with this setup, so I would tell you that the CG-5 and the 9.25 for visual would work just fine. I have an ADM dual saddle on 2 of my CG-5s and I can mount any scope with a 'V' or 'D' style dovetail. I have use my CG-5s for AP and have had good success with as much as 30+ lbs payload. The $550 price for the CG-5 is a pretty good deal.

Stan

#10 A. Viegas

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Posted 20 March 2013 - 10:50 PM

kasey,

I have both Cpc1100 and Cg5. I recently got a wedge for the cpc which previously I could scarcely get 25 second exposures with my mallincam before star trailing. I have not yet tried imaging with the wedge but I expect to get much better and be able to guide. Now as for the Cg5 I have had a C8 plus a C80ed with finder, telrad and mallincam and filter wheel. All told it was 29 lbs. and the little cg5 was able to go 2-3 minutes with guiding without any trailing.

You already have a good setup with the 9.25 cpc. I agree the cg5 is a good deal now. Why not but a refractor or other wide field scope as a complement to your. 9.25 SCT? Mount that on the cg5 and leave your fork mounted cpc as is...

Al

#11 dragonslayer1

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 08:09 AM

You guys are good... I bought my CPC from the planetarium here, was a floor model,,, had many problems when tried long exposure and found that alt clutch was bad (way too tight, could never get it to move without friction). The way I finally realized it was bad was went on vacation to So. Calif. and stopped in OPT CORP. and loosened the clutch on their floor model and freaked out when it dropped from horiz to vert so fast I thought it was broke... Sent mine into Celestron and they worked on it and moves free enough so am able to balance it now..
Then had tracking, Go-To, and alignment problems,,, handset fixed that... Now when its on its awesome.. Was just thinking all the viewing/photo oportunities I lost with the problems,,,, May be one of those "Grass always greener on the other side" :p... As always geat advice,,, and may do as Al suggested, a CG5 for the Orion 80 on my CPC to use as portable for star parties etc...Just use Mallincam and little DVD player.. :question:,, AL do you have the GPS addition on your CG5??
Thank you all, Kasey

#12 mclewis1

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 09:01 AM

Kasey,

I also like Al's suggestion of a smaller wide field scope on the CG-5 as an alternative platform. For star party and any remote site work the KISS philosophy is very valuable. I think you'd find a smaller and easier to setup and take down scope with very basic video control and viewing a really nice addition to your CPC.

GPS? ... that's just one more thing to plug in, suck power, or fail ... remember the KISS philosophy.

#13 dragonslayer1

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 09:20 AM

Your always a wealth of good info and sound advice Mark,,, :bow: As soon as they open will order one. I tried online but wanted to charge shipping and is supposed to be free shipping. And was brain dead on GPS, can just enter coordinates and time on my own,, :foreheadslap: I am just learning to use my VSS+ and love that I don't need a computer with the remote feature it comes with, just camera and small viewer and good to go.. And sense won't be doing really long exposures don't think will need to polar align the mount?? Thank you again, Kasey

#14 Psyire

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 09:46 AM

My mistake, I was under the assumption that you wanted to image with the C9.25 and that's why you were going to defork it. IMO, for visual there is no need to defork as a fork mount is much nicer to use anyway. The C9.25 fork mounted would be 10x more stable than mounted on a CG5. ie. way less prone to vibrations. I do agree with the above posters on the portable 80mm setup.

#15 dragonslayer1

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 10:48 AM

well was thinking of deforking it due to all the headache I have had and wanting it to be more portable..But looking at other options for portability with smaller scope and hoping CPC is finally working right,,, Kasey

#16 A. Viegas

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 03:04 PM

kasey,

GPS and polar finder scope are superfluous to the CG5, save the $ and use it for something else. In today's gps equipped cell phone world it's easy enough to get coords and just type them in

Al

#17 dragonslayer1

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 03:24 PM

yes was a brain freeze or something,, I pulled the trigger on the CG5 today. I downloaded a I-Pad ops called theodolite and is pretty awesome. I just hold my I-pad upto CPC backside and get true north everytime...Can't wait to get it and see if Orion 80 will mount with rail it has for top of 9.25 mount... will be a good set up to take camping too,, Kasey

#18 mclewis1

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 06:09 PM

Kasey,

When you put a rail/bar onto a C9.25 you need both the appropriate length rail and a couple of radius blocks. The blocks are curved to match the tube on one side and mount to the pairs of raised head bolts on the front and rear cell that are spaced about 1.75" apart. The dovetail bar is then bolted to the flat side of the radius blocks.

You then have a couple of choices to mount the 3 point rings for the refractor to the bar. 1) bolt the rings directly to the bar. This is how the Orion autoguider package is setup. It's cheap and nice and solid but very inflexible. You'll need to ensure that you've got everything well balanced before you go and drill the bar. 2) bolt the rings to a pair of small Vixen/CG-5 saddles. This setup costs and weighs a bit more but gives you the flexibility of moving the scope up and down the bar.
With either option you can also add other items like DSLR mounting points and the like.

#19 dragonslayer1

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Posted 21 March 2013 - 06:20 PM

I did not clarify that, sorry. The 80mm is already mounted TDC on my 9.25 now. I got it as a package with the SSAG. The 80mm tube has clamped to it a base that is a receiver for the rail with two clamp like screws on front and rear that allow it to slide fore and aft on rail and then tighten up. Is a pretty neat package, came from OPT CORP. I saw somewhere someone talking about ADM for mount adapters. Will have to see when it gets here but should be a very easy change over,,,,
Kasey






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