Jump to content


Photo

Zeiss Microhead Conversion, anyone try?

  • Please log in to reply
16 replies to this topic

#1 chrisg

chrisg

    Mariner 2

  • *****
  • Posts: 250
  • Joined: 15 Feb 2009

Posted 02 May 2013 - 08:11 PM

Curious if anyone here has actually tried to convert a Zeiss stereo microscope head to convert to telescope. Anyone here with any in-depth knowledge? :help:

#2 Astrojensen

Astrojensen

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 5247
  • Joined: 05 Oct 2008
  • Loc: Bornholm, Denmark

Posted 03 May 2013 - 04:21 PM

No, but hint of the day: The Zeiss microbayonet on the microscope turrets is the same as used on the Baader Mark V and the Baader quick-coupler in the T2 accesory adapter line.


Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark

#3 denis0007dl

denis0007dl

    Mariner 2

  • ***--
  • Posts: 273
  • Joined: 17 Apr 2012
  • Loc: Croatia

Posted 03 May 2013 - 04:30 PM

Of course you can use microscope head in astronomy, BUT, head must be compatibile with some adapters that you can adapt it into astronomy binoviewers!

You can see here microscope head
http://www.ebay.com/...oscope-CARL-...

with same optics as Mark IV bino
http://www.company7....ons/apbino.html

so, optics are same here!
Many other examples are out there!
All in all, it depends whics head you use, but best quality are Carl Zeiss heads!
BUT, not all microscope heas are compatibile for astronomy remake!

#4 chrisg

chrisg

    Mariner 2

  • *****
  • Posts: 250
  • Joined: 15 Feb 2009

Posted 03 May 2013 - 07:00 PM

Aside from the eyepiece collets that can't take 1.25" without modification, is there a difference optically between these micro heads and Baader equipment? What's the actual difference between the Baader Mark IV and V's optics? I've read that there are differences but does any of us actually KNOW that there's a difference? Not to get too far from the original topic, but is there a perceptible difference between the Mark IV and Mark V optically?

#5 Astrojensen

Astrojensen

    Fly Me to the Moon

  • *****
  • Posts: 5247
  • Joined: 05 Oct 2008
  • Loc: Bornholm, Denmark

Posted 04 May 2013 - 02:49 AM

I believe the difference between the Mark IV and the Mark V is in the coatings and the eyepiece collets.


Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark

#6 denis0007dl

denis0007dl

    Mariner 2

  • ***--
  • Posts: 273
  • Joined: 17 Apr 2012
  • Loc: Croatia

Posted 04 May 2013 - 04:14 AM

Difference between Baader Mark IV and V's optics exists, but it is small, new version (Mark V) has better coatings, and because that slightly 8,9% better overall light transmittion what ih hard to notice to nackled eyes or not noticed at all, and Mark V has diopter adjustment for both eyes.
Other differences does not exists, even Clear Aperture prisms are 28mm on both, and size of prisms are 30mm on both.
Difference between Mark IV Zeiss micro head and astro head optically does not exists, but there is slightly difference in diopters made, and screws on astro head that holds eyepieces, which is not necessary when looking almost all time of observing, because it is rare position that people observe in position upside down.

#7 denis0007dl

denis0007dl

    Mariner 2

  • ***--
  • Posts: 273
  • Joined: 17 Apr 2012
  • Loc: Croatia

Posted 04 May 2013 - 04:25 AM

So conclusion is simple: you can use microscopy head for astronomy and reverse, astro head for microscopy, you just need to able to adapt them for your purpose, BUT, you must to watch out which head to use, you must to have two holes for eyes, and one hole (exit) for telescope side, so for example look bino head which can not use for astronomy
http://www.ebay.com/...90825851953?...
Format of eyepieces is not problem if they are bigger or smaller format, but most important is that they are NOT to large, for example, not everyone can use 2" formats eyepieces because eyes spacing, and 3" and larger noone can use, and they are too heavy!
Hope this helps!

#8 C. Thieullet

C. Thieullet

    Vendor - astromist

  • -----
  • Vendors
  • Posts: 51
  • Joined: 18 Dec 2004

Posted 07 October 2013 - 02:45 PM

I discover this post one month ago, bought this head and did the conversion ;-).
Thanks !

The link to a doc that describes the adaptations I did :
Home made Binoviewer with Zeiss Binocular head

The "default" collimation is better than the one of my old denk II :
With 2 lasers, in the same positions :
3cm between the two eyepiece axes at 8m against 5cm for my well collimated denk II.

I find the result great and far less expansive than the true MarkV !

Attached Files



#9 R Botero

R Botero

    Apollo

  • -----
  • Posts: 1239
  • Joined: 02 Jan 2009
  • Loc: Kent, England

Posted 07 October 2013 - 04:24 PM

Great write-up!

#10 Scott99

Scott99

    Mercury-Atlas

  • *****
  • Posts: 2892
  • Joined: 10 May 2007
  • Loc: New England

Posted 10 October 2013 - 12:51 PM

Great write-up!


yes, very cool! Isn't there another possiblity - just use it with microscope eyepieces? you see heads come up all the time on ebay with eyepieces.

#11 C. Thieullet

C. Thieullet

    Vendor - astromist

  • -----
  • Vendors
  • Posts: 51
  • Joined: 18 Dec 2004

Posted 10 October 2013 - 01:49 PM

Thanks for yours feedbacks !

Yes I think it is possible. Some guys made nice analysis of the microscope eyepieces. And some seems to be excellent.
Using Microscope Eyepieces for Astronomy
The FOV may be reduced (<50°).

I my case I already had 40mm and 32mm plossl for doing H-Apha and a pair of panoptic and radian for the DSO and planets with my denk.

Cutting the eyepieces holders may seems risky and complicated. It is quiet easy by hand with a saw . Grinding to a flat surface can be done manually too with some patience.
I used a glue that supports 270kg/cm2 so I can hold myself on the eyepiece holder without any risk.
The link where I bought it :
Strong Glue
I find this glue wonderful. It helps me a lot when I did my dobsons to fix aluminum parts together.

May be someone know a similar glue in the US market?

#12 chrisg

chrisg

    Mariner 2

  • *****
  • Posts: 250
  • Joined: 15 Feb 2009

Posted 10 October 2013 - 04:15 PM

Great write up! I've been thinking of doing this too..
I wonder if this can be done successfully with Baader's 1.25" clicklock eyepiece holders?

#13 C. Thieullet

C. Thieullet

    Vendor - astromist

  • -----
  • Vendors
  • Posts: 51
  • Joined: 18 Dec 2004

Posted 10 October 2013 - 05:28 PM

Yes you can adapt them :) it is the same mod to do. They are better.
I hesitated a lot but the price of 2 holders was close to half of the price of the head....

#14 chrisg

chrisg

    Mariner 2

  • *****
  • Posts: 250
  • Joined: 15 Feb 2009

Posted 14 November 2013 - 06:14 PM

So, I'm now waiting for my second Zeiss Jena head in the mail, this one to convert!

So - C. Thieullet - how did you saw your eyepiece collet to size? What kind of saw? How long did it take? How did you hold it still enough to apply force? How were the eyepiece holders collimated exactly?

I'm also considering using the Baader Click-lock eyepiece holders for the conversion, currently studying the feasibility vs the ones you used.

Anyone here have any suggestions of which kinds of eyepiece holders could do the job like the click-locks?

Thanks to all, pictures to come with a successful conversion!

#15 C. Thieullet

C. Thieullet

    Vendor - astromist

  • -----
  • Vendors
  • Posts: 51
  • Joined: 18 Dec 2004

Posted 10 December 2013 - 05:37 PM

Hello Chris,

Sorry for the delay.
A manual metal saw can do the trick. You have to remove all the parts of the eyepiece holder to keep only the tube.
Caution because when you attach the tube to your workbench you can deform it. I had the trouble. The best would be to put a tube inside to prevent this.
You can use a milling machine as well.
30mn - 45mm per holder to get a flat surface.

An easier option is to glue a T2 male thread on the eyepiece support and screw the holder on it.
You lost 4mm of optical path but you save time and you can change your eyepiece holder later.

collimation : I put tube+teflon to center the eyepiece holder when gluing.
Teflon because the glue do not glue on it. Your can do this with T2 male thread too.

After, the screws of the zeiss bino let you to achieve a perfect collimation of the eyepieces holders.
I did mine on moon during day time by putting craters at the top of each eyepieces and adjust the eyepiece holder supports so left and right views are matching.
You do not have to touch to the screw of the prism at all !

My advise : use quick lock. The screw annoys me more than helps me and I found that the eyepiece could be better centered sometime.

If you accept to not being able to adjust the focus at your eyepiece, you can use the taka eyepiece holder. They are the best I know.

hope that's help
Cyrille

#16 chrisg

chrisg

    Mariner 2

  • *****
  • Posts: 250
  • Joined: 15 Feb 2009

Posted 11 December 2013 - 09:12 AM

Thanks Cyrille,

At this point I'm trying to use a 3D printer to make a custom diopter for the Zeiss binoviewer.

Can the glue that you use support heavy eyepieces such as a 10mm Delos with confidence?

Also, I'm a little unclear about your use of a tube + teflon to center the eyepiece holders. Would you mind giving explicit details about your process?

Interesting about the screws vs. quick lock. I had a pair of Maxbrights and I really disliked using screws for every eyepiece change..not easy at night, very fussy!

Chris

#17 C. Thieullet

C. Thieullet

    Vendor - astromist

  • -----
  • Vendors
  • Posts: 51
  • Joined: 18 Dec 2004

Posted 11 December 2013 - 05:11 PM

Great idea the 3D printer! It could be useful to share the result to the community!

Yes. No trouble. The glue can support 270Kg/cm2. A Delos is 0.5kg. I can hold myself (90kg) on 2 aluminum part glue together….I made the test...
Once glued, you can check and try to remove by hand the eyepiece holder. If glued correctly (clean surface, enough glue, >20mn drying) nothing move anymore.

Centering:
Find a piece of 1.25 tube (pvc tube) so the eyepiece holder can be locked and centered on it.
Enlarge the bottom of the tube with the teflon so it fits exactly into the hole of the head of the bino (34mm on one side and less into the other).
Put the focuser at the minimum position to protect the thread from the glue.
Check and try before glueing.
Apply glue at the bottom of the eyepiece holder (all around) then put the 2 pieces together and press by hold 5mn.
Because the bottom of the eyepiece holder is flatten and leveled (parallel from its top : you have to take care of this) the centering is ok.
The glue do no glue on pvc and Teflon. So you can remove the tube after without trouble.
The centering will be good enough to do fine collimation with the screws that hold the top of the bino.

About screw, I do agree!
Before I was not changing eyepieces often : I was using a denk II. So no need with the powerswitch.

Since I did this other bino head with an other 21mm CA Zeiss bino head. The OP is 95mm ;-). I put a T2 connector at the nose.
Zeiss 21mm bino head

I spent tonight 15mn on the moon with this Mark IV head and my mewlon.
I am using a baader T2 diagonal + a x1 Siebert OCA to get only 25mm back focus more.
The results are incredibles…






Cloudy Nights LLC
Cloudy Nights Sponsor: Astronomics