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Cg5 vs Sirius?

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#1 scottk

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Posted 23 August 2013 - 09:41 PM

I am slowly putting together an ap setup. Yesterday my AT6IN arrived. It looks very well put together btw. Some time in the next month or so, when I have enough money saved I will buy a mount to put it on.

I like the looks of the orion sirius, but I just noticed that the cg5gt can supposedly handle 5 lbs more, and is about half the price.

I like the noise from the sirius I've heard in video clips, but I don't like the noise from the celestrons. Surprisingly enough, that is a factor for me.

The astro tech optical tube with rings and finder and camera will probably be 17 - 18 lbs.

Would there be a big difference in the way these mounts would handle the setup? I don't mind the extra cash for the orion if there is a big difference in handling quality, or quality in general.

Thanks.

Scott

#2 cn register 5

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 04:58 AM

You might want to look at the AVX. It's a bit more beefy than the CG5 and has a RTC and PEC. Also better gears so the PEC is good.

My RC6" with a ST80 guide scope piggy backed and cameras, filterwheel and focuser comes to about 25 lbs and it's OK with that.

The price is about mid way between the two.

Chris

#3 terry59

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 07:10 AM

The quality difference is substantial. I can't tell you how many times I've read about tracking issues and workarounds people do with the CG5. I have a Sirius and while not perfect, it works very well for AP. A few things that may be of interest:

Orion will not support a subsequent owner of their gear. That hurts resale value.

If you need to get it worked on it needs to be sent to them. Labor after the warranty (last I checked) is $25 per half hour

About $300 of the cost is for the SynScan hand controller. EQMOD, a $45 cable, and a program such as Stellarium are far superior.

I have no experience with iOptron other than seeing them both recommended and complained about on here. It sees to be hit or miss to me. Not where I would want to be when doing AP.

If you can bear the cost, the best mount in this weight class is the Losmandy GM-8. They are easy to work on and support from Scott Losmandy is excellent, regardless of where you got it. Gemini II is stable but evolving. I love mine.

#4 rmollise

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 08:00 AM

The quality difference is substantial.


The quality difference is there somewhat, but frankly, these two mounts, built by the same company, are more alike than different. "Tracking problems" are not common in the CG5, its payload capacity is about the same as the Sirius, and its HC/go-to system is considerably better. I've had a CG5 for going on nine years and it has never let me down. ;)

#5 terry59

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 08:16 AM

The quality difference is substantial.


The quality difference is there somewhat, but frankly, these two mounts, built by the same company, are more alike than different. "Tracking problems" are not common in the CG5, its payload capacity is about the same as the Sirius, and its HC/go-to system is considerably better. I've had a CG5 for going on nine years and it has never let me down. ;)


Perhaps I should not pass judgement on gear I haven't used. I use my Sirius for long exposure AP and it just works without issues. I can't say that is my impression from what people post about the CG5 in the AP forums. My results, FWIW, are at the link.

Anyway, for the OP, best of luck with your choice.

#6 ourobouros2k2

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 10:06 AM

I have had both, and I prefer the Sirius. The motors are so much quieter and the movement seems smoother. My c8/ST80 combo clocks in at around 19 pounds and this gives it issues as I cannot balance it out with 2 11' counterweights on the stock bar. It is just an inch or two too short. I know that across the pond there are CW bar extensions, but I am not sure if there are still any such extensions stateside (anyone know? a screw in extension compatible with Sirius bar?).

I use EQMOD and a netbook as my used mount did not come with a hand controller. EQMOD is amazing and far superior, but more time consuming to initially setup. It can be a pain sometimes to launch EQMOD, launch CdC, sync times, connect to telescope. Set and align to stars, etc... but the tradeoff is that after initial setup, you point-click-slew. From EQMOD screen all options are just a mouse click away, and you can use a wireless game pad to control the scope as well. It is nice to point and click then to have to surf through a bunch of menus.

Apples and oranges kindof thing, but the Sirius is quieter, does seem to be built to a higher quality, fit and finish seem better and just (to me at least) seems like a better mount. Honestly though, there is not that much of a price difference between the Sirius and the Atlas so I would go with the latter if I could.

#7 Falcon-

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 01:09 PM

I have a CG5 and can attest to the "tracking problems" for astrophotography. Actually the mount tracks very well, but for long-exposures the DEC axis is prone to stiction making auto-guiding problematic (the RA axis does not have that problem).

The Sirius on the other hand is mechanically similar to the Orion Atlas, with ball-bearings on both RA and DEC (instead of just the RA for the CG-5). This solves the DEC guiding problems the CG-5 has.

If we where talking a visual only or mostly-visual scope I would say go with the CG-5 as the DEC guiding problem is not a problem at all for visual usage, the hand controller is nice to use, and the price is very good right now (while they last). I *do* like my CG-5.

HOWEVER for astrophotography I would definitely recommend the Sirius (or HEQ5). If you have some spare room in your budget go for the Atlas (or EQ6) as it is not too much more $ but is quite a bit more capacity. The CGEM and iOptron iEQ45 are other alternatives in the atlas-class range.

#8 john strnck

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 01:29 PM

actually between the 2, i think the CG5 is a better choice, my current model CG5 is around 10 years old, i sent it in for repair and got it serviced,lubed,HC/MC reflash and RA motor replaced- Orion has absolutely no such support for something like this- at you weight OTA though plus cameras and stuff, i think you might consider a heavier mount though then either of these too

#9 groz

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 01:32 PM

I have had our HEQ5 (Sirius is same mount, different paint) side by side with CG5 numerous times at star parties. There is absolutely no comparison, the HEQ5 is _at least_ twice the mount for tracking and capability.

for photography, I wouldn't even consider a CG5, unless finances were so tight, I had no other options. Even then, not sure it's worth the frustration, one can spend a lot of time / effort / money trying to apply quick fix solutions, and ultimately the solution will be 'upgrade the mount'.

#10 dragonslayer1

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 01:34 PM

If your sticking in dec, dont they reccomend cleaning the old grease out and re-greasing with a lighter lube to addrsss that?
Kasey

#11 scottk

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 01:51 PM

I originally was looking at the Atlas, but if I read the specs correctly, it's 33lbs heavier? I used to have an old c8 on a fork mount so I know it can get tiresome carrying something so heavy around.

Do you guys think the Sirius could hold my setup - AT6IN, large finder scope that came with it, canon t3i, coma corrector, rings, etc. Without a problem, or is this really more of a job for an Atlas class mount?

Thx.

#12 Agatha

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 01:51 PM

Andrew,

Try here for extension. I have one for my HEQ5 Pro (Sirius) but don't remember what thread size and can't check at the moment (it's in another state).
ScopeStuff Link

Hope this helps.

Best,

#13 terry59

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 02:07 PM


Do you guys think the Sirius could hold my setup - AT6IN, large finder scope that came with it, canon t3i, coma corrector, rings, etc. Without a problem, or is this really more of a job for an Atlas class mount?

Thx.


The most I have put on my Sirius is 22 lbs and had no issues.

#14 rmollise

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 02:31 PM

I have a CG5 and can attest to the "tracking problems" for astrophotography.


The CG5 would not be my choice for imaging (neither would the Sirius), but I was able to do 10-minute subs with my ST-2000 with the mount anyhow.

If imaging is the main function of the mount, I'd suggest the Atlas rather than either the CG5 or the Sirius. ;)

#15 rmollise

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 02:32 PM

Perhaps I should not pass judgement on gear I haven't used.


That would be a first on the Cloudy Nights BBS. :lol:

#16 john strnck

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 03:10 PM

actually my RA motor was bad, but when i got the repair form- they also adjusted the RA/DEC and regreased them- what they did exactly, i dont really know

#17 ourobouros2k2

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Posted 24 August 2013 - 03:32 PM

Andrew,

Try here for extension. I have one for my HEQ5 Pro (Sirius) but don't remember what thread size and can't check at the moment (it's in another state).
ScopeStuff Link

Hope this helps.

Best,


thanks for the heads up, I will check into it!

#18 Falcon-

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Posted 25 August 2013 - 01:45 AM

If your sticking in dec, dont they reccomend cleaning the old grease out and re-greasing with a lighter lube to addrsss that?
Kasey


Yes, and having done that myself I can say that indeed helps, sometimes significantly for the older CG-5s, but alas does not totally solve the problem.

I *have* managed 10-minute subs with my rather heavy M606 MCT on my CG-5. Those sessions though involved a lot of tweaking and failed nights before I got that far, and even when it was working also involved rejected frames due mostly to DEC issues.

#19 neptun2

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Posted 26 August 2013 - 11:59 AM

I have HEQ5 (Sirius) mount and am very happy with it for astrophotography. For your load you should not have problems with guiding. Currently i use mine with around 15 lbs load.

#20 scottk

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Posted 26 August 2013 - 05:22 PM

Thanks neptun. I am still undecided; I guess now, I'm teetering between the sirius and atlas. I think my payload will be something like 15 or 16lbs rather than what I figured it up to be before. It sure would be nice to have something as light as the sirius, and still have really good stability and tracking ability.

#21 frito

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Posted 26 August 2013 - 11:31 PM

if you find that the Sirius is not enough mount for you the used value of the Sirius vs the atlas is not a whole lot so you could sell it and get an atlas. the weight differience is significant and the sirius can do better if its put onto a sturdier tripod than it comes with stock, the smaller tripod it ships with is probably one of its biggest downfalls when it comes to doing AP with heavier loads, its a pretty solid mount otherwise.






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