Should I get a telescope for these light pollution
Posted 07 October 2013 - 07:31 AM
Hi, new member here. I have enjoyed reading a lot of your posts already before joining. I live in Gwacheon, South Korea which I doubt any of you know but who knows...Anyway, it's 10 miles outside of Seoul, which is probably one of the most light polluted areas on earth.
I would say the air pollution is actually worse than the light pollution overall, but thankfully in the fall and winter siberian air clears that out for the most part. I'm okay with just observing for half the year, but I'm mainly interested in seeing deep sky objects like galaxies and nebulae. The planets and the moon are cool, but it seems everytime I go to an observatory that's what I see, so if I'm going to be limited to Jupiter, Saturn and the moon, I think I might hold off till I move to the countryside (won't be happening anytime soon unfortunately...)
If you guys could take a look at this link and help me to tell me whether I'd be able to see galaxies in a fairly defined way in my light pollution conditions that would be great. This will be another thread, but I'm considering probably an 8" 9.25, or 11" celestron or possibly a 12" dobsonian. Weight is a consideration so I may end up on the low end of that, but certainly no lower.
So here's the link http://astroscanenth...-pollution-w...
(It shows various sky conditions you might encounter in the city, suburbs etc.)
When I look at the sattelite, basically I'm in a huge white spot, but we're blocked off from seoul by a mountain so I don't think it's quite that bad.
I would say we're between a 5 and a 7 in the best conditions, but that said I'd be observing a lot in 7 conditions.
Would I be wasting my money? I'm not expecting hubble telescope stuff, but I'd like to see spiral arms possibly, stuff like that....
Posted 07 October 2013 - 07:40 AM
Posted 07 October 2013 - 07:45 AM
Posted 07 October 2013 - 07:52 AM
Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:14 AM
I won't be moving for years probably. What size scope would you recommend to have an idea of what galaxies I would be able to see? Money isn't a huge issue, I'm okay with spending a few bucks...
I think C11 is better because its F10 that you can enjoy look at Juipter, Saturn, Mars, Moon , etc in light pollution. C11 get more light that you might see faint galaxies and nebula. I used 10 inch dobsonian and I can see all 3 galaxies (M31, M32 and M110)so near Chicago. Chicago is terrible light pollution. (White zone) I think C11 F10 is great for many years to use and if you don't mind that C11 is heavy. C11 at low power for galaxies, nebula and open cluster while use medium and high power for planets and Moon, etc. That's me to pick C11! Good luck!
Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:18 AM
Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:20 AM
When I bring out the 6" or 10" telescopes I can see a few more stars but I also see a lot more light pollution. In the 80mm f/5 the sky is a dark blueish color. With the 10" f/4.5 the sky is almost light grey when looking at the exact same stars at the exact same time.
The big telescopes scoop up more light pollution. They do grab a bit more detail in nebula but it's not like they exclude light pollution either. I would vote for a smaller refractor like an 80mm-100mm or so and when you get a big 10"+ reflector in the future you can still use the refractor as a grab-and-go.
If money isn't an issue I'd go for an apochromatic refractor. I was surprised at the amount of double stars and galaxies I could see with my ED80. I am going to send you an IM to my online archive. You will get an idea of what I can see in the red/white zone with small telescopes.
Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:24 AM
Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:28 AM
If you have your telescope looking straight up, is this still an issue? I can see hundreds of stars straight up, it's the stars near the horizon that really suffer from being close to the city.
Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:44 AM
You'll be able to see a lot with it. I think you will be satisfied until you can get to the country and buy a larger telescope. I know mine got lots of usage before I rebuilt it.
Posted 07 October 2013 - 08:51 AM
Posted 07 October 2013 - 10:01 AM
Posted 07 October 2013 - 10:07 AM
Posted 08 October 2013 - 01:16 PM
Wow that's a lot better than I expected. Didn't look that much better at the observatory here which has a 20 incher. The moons did look a good bit larger though.
Visual and photography can't be compared. What you'll see in such a small scope will be MUCH less detailed.
Posted 09 October 2013 - 08:23 AM
Posted 09 October 2013 - 09:07 AM
Posted 09 October 2013 - 09:12 AM
^ Thanks, I was just reading about this, apparently photographers usually leave the aperture open for minutes or longer which allows for a lot more light collection. I have a lot to learn apparently.
I intentionally took those photos to represent what the objects looked like through the eyepiece. They aren't very long exposures.
Posted 09 October 2013 - 09:37 AM
White zone seeing conditions-check
Posted 12 October 2013 - 12:17 PM
Yangpyeong has relatively good sky to observe. But, it would take around 2 hours to go there.
Yongin is closer than Yangpyeong. From my home, it takes 35 min to go to Yongin Football Center. Yongin FC shows a grade lower than Yangpyeong(forget about western sky for the terrible light pollution from Seoul). But you can see Eastern Veil Nebular w/ 12 inch Dob.
You might see a few nabulae or deep sky objects in Gwacheon. But even though you might find them, they won't show any spectables to you in such a bad sky condition.
Posted 12 October 2013 - 09:03 PM
Posted 13 October 2013 - 09:02 AM
How clear are the skies in the Suwon area?
Anyway, after doing lots of naked eye observations over the past two weeks and reading lots of posts on here and on other sites, I think I'm going to downgrade my location to white zone Yes I had a day where it looked a lot better, but I don't think I can buy a telescope based on an anomaly.
I've come to the conclusion that although opinions vary, the majority say you actually need more aperture in a white zone, so I'll be buying either an 8" 9.5 or 11" SCT. So I'm pretty much down to an aperture vs weight situation. I'm not a big guy about 125 pounds soaking wet, so anything over 80 pounds would be out of the question. IF the 8" SCT is 65 pounds total than that's still a lot so I think I'll live with carrying another 15 for the much better views I'll get. If I can find a much lighter 8" say 45 or 50 pounds well then I think I'll take my chance on missing a little aperture.
Any posts by experienced red/white zone people would be appreciated as well as advice on SCTs. Thanks.
Posted 13 October 2013 - 09:06 AM
I'm excited to take a look at double stars I think those will be my first target if galaxies aren't realistic. If you have any pertinent advice on SCT's it would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.
Posted 13 October 2013 - 02:41 PM
Stargazing from light-polluted locales can be quite challenging. However, a fair number of celestial objects can be successfully observed from cities. The Moon, the bright planets, bright binary stars, bright open and globular clusters, bright nebulae, and bright galaxies are all possible targets.
A number of articles on the subject appear at http://www.astronomy...spx?c=ss&id=152
Tips on city observing are posted at the following sites:
http://www.astronomy.../Setup is ke...
Urban astronomy is also discussed at these sites:
Books on the subject include Urban Astronomy by Denis Berthier and The Urban Astronomer's Guide: A Walking Tour of the Cosmos for City Sky Watchers (Patrick Moore's Practical Astronomy Series) by Rod Mollise.
Lists of deep-sky objects that are visible from urban areas can be found at the following URLs:
Posted 13 October 2013 - 08:08 PM
I agree that at least Gwacheon is quite better than Seoul. But it is not enough dark to observe deep sky objects. You can find how bright Gwacheon are at Dark Sky Map .
Suwon also is not good to observe deep sky. Past two weeks, the sky condition was fairly good. A lot better than usual Korean sky.
Anyway, it will be good to have a car to do observations. Yonging Football Center that I said is placed in Kyunggi-do. Yangpyeong is placed in Kyunggi-do also. Gangwon-do has better sky but it is too far from Gwacheon or Suwon.