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Imaging Challenge Understanding

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#51 Magellan

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Posted 13 November 2013 - 01:58 PM

I also almost didn't enter either, mine was Ha only because I didn't have time to shoot unfiltered. After seeing that amazing image I knew I wouldn't win, I had detail but no color, but I also didn't get a single vote, which is discouraging but challenges me to do better, I since added color.

Most of the images I post here only get 1 - 3 replies, thats ok, I do more posting on Facebook, google+ and Flickr.

I suggest for "Beginner" we stick to the Messier list, most objects are relatively easy although M42 being bright is a tough one to process due to the high dynamic range.

I remember I won beginner once with my M13. I try to pick objects that both modded and unmodded camera's can shoot nearly equally. m13, Open clusters, M45.

Perhaps we should just ban narrowband images for the Beginner challenge?

I am going to continue to enter, regardless! however I think this months is M42, unless I can use the data earlier in the year I won't enter. I shot M42 so many times I just want to shoot something else :)

#52 Charlie Hein

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 04:14 PM

As an example, I would not consider narrowband imaging and processing to be a skill set that a beginner would be able to easily master even if they decided from the start to buy the gear and learn it - it takes time and practice to develop the skill set. Your average beginner needs time just to work out the basics, like guiding and basic stacking and processing. This should rightly show in their work, as well as improvements they make over time. We should keep all this in mind when judging a beginner contest and vote accordingly.

Charlie


Hmmmm..... well stated Charlie, but it looks like 45% of the voters believe taking NB, using multiple scopes, and cameras over a few days to be that of a beginner's level. while the rest of the contestants finished as well as a one-legged man in an arse kicking contest. ohh well... it is what it is.


It's easy to see that when folks who have advanced skills post to beginner contests it chases away legitimate beginners because they do not feel as if they can compete.

This issue is compounded and possibly even rewarded by folks voting for the advanced photos.

We're having this conversation because *it* doesn't really *have* to be what *it is*... we just need to work out the best way to change it.

If simply pointing out out the problems with what's going on and asking the people involved to help fix it doesn't seem to help, then we at least need to make sure that these folks quickly "graduate" out of the competition.

We have typically dealt with this by applying what I've called the "three and out" rule. If a person wins the contests three times (uncontested wins do not count) then they will "graduate" and be ineligible to enter that contest again.

It's intended to move folks along to greater challenges in the CCD, DSLR and Solar System forums. So far it's only active in the main Imaging/Sketching contest.

I think we should apply the "three and out" rule for the challenges as well - but I'm considering a twist.

Typically, folks who go uncontested do not have their win counted against the "three and out" rule. Perhaps we should remove that exception, and in its place have a poll put up whenever someone hits three wins - contested or not - to determine if the entrant has displayed enough skill to "graduate" or not.

In this way folks could continue to vote for what they consider to be the "best" image without regard to the experience level of the entrant if they want to. Three wins under these conditions and then we ask these same folks to decide that they are good enough to "graduate". A few rounds of this should level the playing field a bit.

#53 Jeff2011

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 11:31 PM

Perhaps we should remove that exception, and in its place have a poll put up whenever someone hits three wins - contested or not - to determine if the entrant has displayed enough skill to "graduate" or not.



I don't know Charlie. Voting on an image is one thing, but voting on someone's skill level is another. This could cause some hard feelings. Perhaps it should be left as win three times and you move on. Just my thoughts.

#54 Charlie Hein

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 01:36 PM

Hmmm... sorry to seem a bit disconnected, there are lots of (good) things going on for me personally at the moment that are taking more of my time than usual. I'm going to read back through this and try to encapsulate what we've discussed into "resolutions" to consider. Once we have those set I'll put up a poll to vote each up or down, and then we'll amend things as required.

Charlie

PS - Jeff, I see your point. We'll just consider "three and out" as we do in the main contest. CH

#55 iverp

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 11:03 PM

Fret not, Charlie. We are all here for the enjoyment. It's not like a corporate web site. Thanks for what you do, and enjoy the other good things in your life.

#56 Framis

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Posted 02 December 2013 - 04:05 PM

Personally I am on the 1 and out track... I think if I can win the beginner DSO then its time for me to invest more time and effort to compete at the intermediate level. I am not saying that everyone should do that... that is just for me...






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