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#1 zsb04

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 01:21 PM

question for you guys, i am looking to get a SCT to compliment my other scopes. The scopes i have now are a 4" refractor and a 6" mak-newt. I am looking to get an SCT that will provide a noticeable difference for DSO, especially on M13 and other clusters. at a dark site neither of my scopes can fully resolve M13 and i am looking for an SCT that will be able to. Here are the contenders:

celestron c8
celestron c9.25
meade 10"
celestron c11
meade 12"

i technically won an ebay auction for a meade 12". it looks in good shape but the seller seems to be backing out of it, it went for very cheap, so most likely will not be getting that scope :(

#2 KerryR

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 01:28 PM

8" provides a visibly meaningful improvement in resolution and light over a 6". It's worthwhile IMO.

However, larger aperture is always going to do more. My 11" SCT is visibly brighter than my 8" SCT, and frighteningly close to my 16" Newt. But, it's also quite a bit more of a chore to move out.

If you don't mind the weight, I'd go with the most aperture you can afford and move around. I feel comfortable heartily recommending a CPC11-- great blend of aperture and comparatively diminutive weight.

#3 drollere

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 01:42 PM

the main constraint for remote set up will be the weight of the mount/OTA combination. i'm in my 60's and i found my 12" LX200 to be manageable but not at all easy to set up by myself.

i think the consensus of purchase and comparison is that the 8" to 10" range is the sweet spot. the C11 might be pushing it by weight, depending on your quality of back. if you mount on a GEM and mount the OTA with a dovetail plate, then it will be more tractable (although getting the dovetail to slide into the clamping plate is not easy).

i've seen M13 through some pretty large scopes (24", 28") and it was not resolved at those apertures either. just more stars scattered over a shimmering gray center. at 10" and above, the view is pretty nice.

#4 BWAZ

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 01:49 PM

For your mount, a C8HD or a C9.25 would be a good choice.

#5 zsb04

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 02:04 PM

ota weight isn't much of a concern i am fairly young at 28 and used to be into bodybuilding a bit so i can lift some weight, as far as my avx mount, that can go up to a c9.25, but i am thinking maybe get a cpc so it has its own mount and i can setup 2 scopes.

#6 RAKing

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 02:16 PM

To resolve globular clusters you want aperture.

M13 is a special case in the northern hemisphere. An 8 inch can resolve quite a few stars in it sometime, but it's always better with a bigger scope. M3 and M5 are okay, but most of the other globulars are still fuzzy in an 8 inch most of the time.

On your current mount, the C925 is probably the biggest that will work, so get it. If you can afford a better mount, go bigger. A friend of mine loves globulars and he has determined that his 10 inch is not enough - so he is shopping for a 12. :)

In my case, my mount can handle much more than my back and I am hoping the doctors let me try a C925 soon. :p

Cheers,

Ron

#7 PowellAstro

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 02:28 PM

The guy on ebay should provide the scope you won. Unless this is his first auction or two, you should contact ebay with this info. If he is new and just didnt know the rules I would let it pass otherwise he should provide the goods.

#8 zsb04

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 02:35 PM

The guy on ebay should provide the scope you won. Unless this is his first auction or two, you should contact ebay with this info. If he is new and just didnt know the rules I would let it pass otherwise he should provide the goods.


he had to go out of town right after i won, i told him because of my schedule i need to pickup before august, then he said he will be returning august 1st, so not looking very good, i didnt pay him yet because it says pay upon inspection, which i thought would be nice to see it first

#9 zsb04

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 04:17 PM

i think the 8 inch sct might be a little too close in performance to the 6 inch mak-next, i think 9.25 minimum, just need a nice deal to popup on ebay, astromart or here :)

#10 Bill Barlow

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 04:31 PM

I would think any one of the three you are looking at (C9.25, Meade 10, C11) would be a noticeable increase in resolving globulars and any other deep sky object. The Meade 12 OTA would weigh around 40 pounds, 10 pounds more than a C11. From all the SCT's I have owned, probably the C11 is the best for decent aperture and manageable weight.

Bill

#11 zsb04

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 04:34 PM

does anyone know how much the forkmount and ota weigh for the meade lx200 12" i hear a lot of people say it is too large for one person?

#12 BillP

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 07:23 PM

IMO 10, 11, or 12.

#13 dr.who

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 07:26 PM

To use even the Meade 10" you will need a bigger mount.

The 8" will be too close to your ES Comet Hunter so you will want at least a 9.25 with a 10 or 11 being better. It will nicely compliment your ES ans WO.

The Celestron AVX will handle the 11" Celestron scopes for VISUAL (capitalized to head off the usual protests) fine. I have personally done it. As have many others including Uncle Rod here save he does it with a CG5. There will be jitter but it dampens after a second or so. You will also need two 17 lbs weights for it.

#14 jrbarnett

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 07:33 PM

LX200 12" is enormously heavy for a 12" scope. It can be set up by one person but it is a major chore. The Celestron CPCs are a lot lighter per inch of aperture is you must have a forker and care about weight and convenience.

The other thing to consider is a Dob. You can get a 12" Dob with DSCs from Orion for around $1000. It covers your desire to be able to set up two scopes at once, gives you glob busting aperture and is much lighter and easier to set up than a 12" Meade forker.

If you want a more compact scope, for around $1500 Orion has the truss tubed version of the same 12" Dob.

If you don't need DSCs and prefer to star hop, you can get one of the GSO 12" Dobs for around $700 (Zhumell, Apertura, etc.).

- Jim

#15 moonnerd

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 10:01 PM

Is a 9.25 closer to a C8 or C11? The 9.25 might be the rout to go since it only weighs about 20 pounds and you could use your current mount.

#16 dpippel

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 10:34 PM

I went from the 11" Edge to the 8" Edge to the 9.25" Edge, and IMO it's definitely closer to the 11" than the 8" performance-wise. I love mine.

#17 Dan McConaughy

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Posted 30 July 2014 - 10:53 PM

Go for a C11 if you can. It's almost 12" but a whole lot lighter than the Meade 12". A good C11 is fantastic - great observing and resolution and fairly light weight for the OTA.

#18 RAKing

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 03:44 PM

I went from the 11" Edge to the 8" Edge to the 9.25" Edge, and IMO it's definitely closer to the 11" than the 8" performance-wise. I love mine.


Agreed! I always thought my C925 was the "just right" size and I never saw anything in my C11 that I couldn't see in my C925. :waytogo:

Ron

#19 swix

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 06:26 PM

Back when I was young (before there was dirt), I had a C11 on a Losmandy mount. Total weight 135 lbs. I loved it !!
Now, I have a C6.. not aging well I guess..

#20 MitchAlsup

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Posted 31 July 2014 - 08:04 PM

In comparing our clubs C8 and M10 to (used to be my) C11 the C11 always blew them away.

Translating this back to your 6" MakNewt, you should be looking at the C9.25 minimum.

#21 Patrick

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Posted 01 August 2014 - 08:40 AM

i am thinking maybe get a cpc so it has its own mount and i can setup 2 scopes.



For purely visual use, you would be hard pressed to beat a CPC1100, especially the Edge version....nice, nice setup. They are very easy to use and views are wonderful both for planetary and on deep sky objects. I much prefer the fork mounts for general observing. I've found them to be much easier to setup and USE than an EQ mount. Setup the tripod and level it, put the fork assembly on the tripod, fasten it down. Then align the mount and you're off to the races. You don't need to wait until dark to align it either. You can do a one star alignment using the first star that pops out and if you've leveled it well and balanced it you can be up and running while the guys with EQ mounts are fussing with getting their mounts polar aligned.

As far as cooling goes, I use a cat cooler on mine, but it's the non-edge version. If you get the Edge scope you can add the DeepSky Products Tempest cooling fans which will aid greatly in cool down times. Cooling is the single most important factor for good views in an SCT and is often neglected to the hurt of the observer.

In addition, you should think about adding an ADM counterweight bar to your CPC to help balance it and then you can add a dovetail bar on top as well to mount a small refractor for wide field views.

Patrick

#22 Patrick

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Posted 01 August 2014 - 09:12 AM

does anyone know how much the forkmount and ota weigh for the meade lx200 12" i hear a lot of people say it is too large for one person?



You can look up the weight online, but I can attest that they are significantly heavier than a CPC1100. Aside from the weight though, the big difference between the Meade 12" and the CPC line is that the CPC line is much more ergonomic. I can carry my CPC1100 by myself (which weighs 65 lbs) because Celestron designed it with nicely placed hand grips. The C11 OTA fits in between the forks while the Meade OTA does not. That's what makes the Meade such a beast to carry for one person...it's heavier and the load is cantilevered. The CPC1100 has ergonomic carry points and the center of gravity can be hoisted onto your chest/shoulder for a much more balanced carry. Trust me, there's a big difference. I have seen grown men cry trying to carry the Meade 12" scope... :smirk:

Patrick

#23 herrointment

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Posted 01 August 2014 - 04:03 PM


In addition, you should think about adding an ADM counterweight bar to your CPC to help balance it and then you can add a dovetail bar on top as well to mount a small refractor for wide field views.

Patrick


My version. I like it!

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#24 areyoukiddingme

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Posted 02 August 2014 - 01:41 PM

I have an 11 edgehd. The aperture is nice, and the views are excellent.

For me it comes down to your situation. Carrying my edge out to my balcony for views of planets and globulars is grab and go. Carrying out and getting set up on my alt az mount takes less than 2 minutes.

So, if you are merely traveling to your backyard, the 11 is hard to beat.

The cooling really is an issue to. In TN that might not be much of a problem. I frequently get 20F deltas, and that means never getting to equilibrium on temperature (and I have the Tempest fans which are a great help).

If you have to travel further afield for good skies--as I do--then the 11 does get a bit old. This has me going for a 12.5" dob. I don't have it yet, but hope that it'll be an easier move, plus more aperture, and less problems cooling with the open tube.

Anyway, those are the issues for me. Go for as much aperture that you can comfortably move around given your situation, and consider temperature w.r.t. cool down.

If the dob works out for me, I think I will probably get an 8" edge for a 'one bag' grab and go set up.

#25 Patrick

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Posted 03 August 2014 - 11:13 PM

If you have to travel further afield for good skies--as I do--then the 11 does get a bit old. This has me going for a 12.5" dob. I don't have it yet, but hope that it'll be an easier move, plus more aperture, and less problems cooling with the open tube.

 

 

Hmmm...uh, I suspect a 12.5" dob is going to be less portable than an 11" CPC once you factor in the longer tube length and the dobsonian rocker box.  Cooling may be a touch easier, but a 12.5" mirror is going to take a while to cool down as well.  Optically there is certainly a case to be made favoring the Newt such as better contrast and the ability for it to go a little deeper.

 

Patrick


Edited by Patrick, 03 August 2014 - 11:17 PM.







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