Sgt
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 12/17/05
Posts: 1027
Loc: Under the southern horn of the...
|
|
10x56 Victory Fl? For handheld astronomy? I know this isn't the best use of my astrobudget and a much cheaper 15x70 will show me more but dare I? It does intrigue me, for probably the same reasons that I imagine people like questars. Extrapolating from the 7x42 i tried out in the shop they're just nice things. But... that.. pricetag...
|
KennyJ
The British Flash
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 20139
Loc: Lancashire UK
|
|
Sgt. ,
I'm sure the 10 x 56 Zeiss Victory FL is a very fine glass , and certainly not just for astronomy .
But just because a 7 x 42 version of a model feels good , looks good , and by golly it does you good , does NOT necessarily mean the 10 x 56 version will be equally to your liking .
It MAY be even MORE to your liking , for all I or anyone else knows .
I'll be honest though , if I were SERIOUSLY contemplating paying SERIOUS money for a 10x binocular for HAND HELD astronomy , I would give very serious consideration to the Canon 10 x 42 ISL before splashing out that kind of dosh .
Or if you are not particularly attracted by Image Stabilisation , and specifically want a 56m size and / or 5.6mm exit pupil , I would take a look at a Leica Ultravid Minox 10 x 58s. and I dare say quite a few others too before diving in headlong .
That said , it's really NICE to treat ourselves every once in a while , to something perhaps just a LITTLE out of the ordinary and eccentric . :-)
Good Luck !
Kenny
--------------------
Milton Wilcox R.I.P
|
15x60
member
Reged: 09/19/06
Posts: 74
Loc: Milan, Italy
|
|
I also would like to know something more about the Zeiss 10x56 FL. Have you ever tested them? How about chromatism?
Thanks!!!!!!
Fabio
--------------------
Zeiss 15x60 B/GA T*
Carl Zeiss 7x50W Jenoptem
Zeiss Victory 10x56 FL
Miyauchi BJ-100 iC
|
Mark9473
Postmaster
Reged: 07/21/05
Posts: 6459
Loc: 51°N 4°E
|
|
there's no discussion, sgt, you need the Zeiss FL 10x56 ... just like we need a review of it! 
Seriously though, I guess we can expect it to have the sharpest, most contrasty, brightest, best quality view possible. The only thing to keep an eye on is the field curvature.
--------------------
Mark
Leica 8x20; Nikon 7x35; Vixen 8x42; Orion 15x63; Docter 15x60
WO Megrez II 80 FD / APM 107mm f/6.5 / Mewlon 210 on DM-6 + Berlebach Planet
|
KennyJ
The British Flash
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 20139
Loc: Lancashire UK
|
|
Fabio ,
I realise this opening sentence may sound like one typically written by fellow CN member Brocknroller , but I although I've never actually held or looked through a 56mm Zeiss FL. I HAVE held and looked through several 42mm FL models .
Based upon my impressions , I would say that the reduction of " chromatism " is INDEED one of the ( very few ) improvements I could detect upon my impressions of the ORIGINAL Zeiss Victory models , which admittedly was a few years ago now , but ( thanks , I suspect , mainly to this forum ) my eyesight has not exactly improved over the past five years ! :-)
There are things I DON'T particularly like about the Zeiss Victory FL range , but that is irrelevant here .
In summary , I COULD detect lateral C.A , even in the 7x FLs ( I'm particularly sensitive to C.A and see it in my Nikon 10 x 42 SE too ) but it was as well controlled as I've seen through ANY binoculars .
Good luck , Kenny
--------------------
Milton Wilcox R.I.P
|
KCN
sage
Reged: 04/12/06
Posts: 411
Loc: Calgary, AB, Canada
|
|
I will quote another of my posts here, as I think it fits in this topic, too, and it will spare you the time it takes to click on a link, and the page loading time 
Quote:
Back in my country in Europe, the name Zeiss is a sinonym with "super high quality" in such a way that we use this word (Zeiss) as an adverb (i.e. "this thing works zeiss", instead of saying "this thing works like a charm") or an adjective ("this thing is zeiss": "this thing is super"). The word has been in the "informal vocabulary" for such a long time that I actually learned to use it from my 80 yr. old grandpa
P.S. Not a joke. Really.
Zeiss skies everyone! 
--------------------
KCN, the Potassium Cyanide 
16" ATM Dob w/ Argo Navis (I kept modding my Lightbridge until I realized it's not a Lightbridge anymore)
William Optics FLT98 DDG Apo
Garrett Optical Gemini 30x100 WP-IF Binoculars
Half-ton pick-up truck
|
15x60
member
Reged: 09/19/06
Posts: 74
Loc: Milan, Italy
|
|
Thanks Kenny!
Quote:
There are things I DON'T particularly like about the Zeiss Victory FL range , but that is irrelevant here .
Anyway it would be interesting to know what you don't like about Victory FL; your experience is precious.
Thanks,
Fabio
--------------------
Zeiss 15x60 B/GA T*
Carl Zeiss 7x50W Jenoptem
Zeiss Victory 10x56 FL
Miyauchi BJ-100 iC
|
KennyJ
The British Flash
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 20139
Loc: Lancashire UK
|
|
Hello Fabio ,
FOUR things I don't like about the Zeiss FLs.
1. To MY eyes , same as on my Zeiss FL scope with the zoom lens set at 20x. , which could be described as " too much visual rubbish -- C.A excepted " , in the outer 20% field of view .
2. The " locking " right diopter adjustment being incorporated into the central focus wheel .
This is because , probably as a result of my age and visual ( in ) capacity , I tend to need to slightly re - adjust diopter settings when altering from very close to mid - distance objects , and again to long distance or infinity focus , and for central focus binoculars , I much prefer the tried and trusted independent right ocular diopter arrangement , as found on the Nikon HGLs , for example .
3. I am not particularly keen on either the LOOKS or the FEEL of the " plasticy " ribbed outer surface .
4. Price !
As with ALL the " Premium Showpiece " models of binoculars from Leica , Swarovski and Zeiss , I think they are ALL great in their own ways , but ALL overpriced in REAL terms , when compared with SOME binoculars which can be purchased for little more than HALF as much .
It would be interesting to see how many people would continue to buy Zeiss FLs. if the price were REDUCED by around 20% , but not as interesting as it MIGHT have been , if the range had been INTRODUCED at prices around 20% BELOW those of it's main competitors !
I hope this helps !
Regards , Kenny
--------------------
Milton Wilcox R.I.P
|
15x60
member
Reged: 09/19/06
Posts: 74
Loc: Milan, Italy
|
|
Very kind of you Kenny! 
Fabio
--------------------
Zeiss 15x60 B/GA T*
Carl Zeiss 7x50W Jenoptem
Zeiss Victory 10x56 FL
Miyauchi BJ-100 iC
|
Erik D
Post Laureate
Reged: 04/28/03
Posts: 4066
Loc: Central New Jersey, USA
|
|
Quote:
3. I am not particularly keen on either the LOOKS or the FEEL of the " plasticy " ribbed outer surface .
4. Price !
Regards , Kenny
I concur with the look and feel comment. I prefer the Leica Utravid design. But that's another way overpriced bino for US customers because of the weak US$. Get a Zeiss if you must have a Zeiss. Otherwise go to your local Audubon Center and check out other quality binos side by side. You may be surprised.
Erik D
|
Ortho2000
sage
Reged: 01/09/07
Posts: 280
Loc: Northern Virginia
|
|
I have some old Zeiss 10x40 roof prisms. The optical performance of some different power Leitz 8x20 and Olympus 10x25 roof prisms is similar. The " feel " of the Zeiss is wonderful and hard to fully characterize with words alone. Better than the others.
Buy the Zeiss and you will grow into them. Concerns about the role, if any, of image stabilization for your particular viewing needs would be the only other factor.
--------------------
Ancient Orange Astro C-90 Celestron
Ancient Meade 2080 8 inch Schmidt-Cassegrain
Vixen ED115S APO 4 1/2 in Refractor & GPD2 Mount.
Meade ETX125 Mak
Unitron 60 mm F/15 Equatorial Refractor
Unitron 100 mm F/15 Equatorial Refractor
Stellarvue 80mm NHNG on Vixen Portamount
Meade 80mm DS-80AT F/11 GoTo Refractor (yardsale)
Vixen 16x80, Zeiss 10x40, Tasco #124 7x50 WA, Leitz 8x20 Roof Prism, Olympus 10x25 Roof Prism
Canon 12x36II, & lots of other wacko binoculars
|
John F
professor emeritus
Reged: 02/16/04
Posts: 556
Loc: Washington State
|
|
With its 25% increase in light gathering power over a 10x50 I'm sure the Zeiss 10x56 FL would give you some great views and particulary so if you can use them at a very dark sky site.
However, a reservation I'd have about them for use as a hand hold-able binocular for astronomy is their weight. For mounted use they'd be great.
Another 10x binocular that would perform very well for astronomy is the Fujinon 10x50 FMT-SX and a new pair can be purchased for about half the price of the Zeiss 10x56 FLs. Other 10x binoculars that are in the same quality league as the Zeiss 10x56s are the Leica 10x50 Ultravids and the Nikon 10x42 LX's and both of those are significantly lighter than the Zeiss 10x56s.
John Finnan
--------------------
BINOCULARS
Nikon 7x50 Prostar
Swarovski 8.5x42 EL SV
Zeiss 10x56 Night Owls
Nikon 10x70 Astroluxe
Zeiss 15x60 B/GAT
SCOPES
Questar 3.5-Inch
Tele Vue NP127
EYEPIECES
Binoviewing: 24-19 Pans, 16-13-11-9-7 Naglers
Monoviewing: 31N, 17-13-10-8-6 Ethos & 2x PM
|
brt209
sage
Reged: 09/18/05
Posts: 233
Loc: London
|
|
Hi sgt,
There are some good deals on the old victory 56mm at the moment and even if the new FL version has less CA,I don't believe that there will be much difference between the two,espcially in terms of spherical abberation and other basic optical properties,so if really you want to buy that model then go for the regular victory range if you want to save a lot of money.
A 56mm aperture will give you 25% more gathering light than a 50mm and a whopping 78% over a 42mm!
I haven't tried the 56mm Zeiss unfortunately,but I've read lots of comments about them,they all state that viewing through them is like switching on the light on the object that you observe!
One last thing though,I will agree with what's been previously said: for this sort of money you could buy for instance a very good 10x50 AND a very good 20x80,or a Myauchi 20x77,or a Helios Quantum 5 20/40x100...
--------------------
Zeiss Victory 10x25
Helios AM-6 10x50
Pentax DCF SP 8x32
Helios Ultimate HR 7x50
Celestron Ultima 80 spotting scope
|
Rich N
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/22/04
Posts: 5618
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, Calif...
|
|
Hi Sgt,
I have a Zeiss 10x42FL. I'm very happy with it. The 10x56 is heavier but I'm sure it will give very nice views of the night sky.
Have you used a 10x50 binocular for astro observing? I like 10x for the feild of view but two of my favorite astro binoculars are the Nikon 12x50 SE and Leica 12x50 BA. Sometimes 12x just seems to give me the view that is just right. I don't use a mount but I often rest my elbows on the arms of a lawn chair when observing.
If you really like the image scale a 10x binocular gives you and you don't mind the weight of the Zeiss 10x56FL... go for it. IMHO, a little extra weight in a hand held astro binocular isn't a bad thing. As long as I don't have the binocular hanging around my neck I don't mind a "heavy" binocular.
All the best,
Rich
|
KennyJ
The British Flash
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 20139
Loc: Lancashire UK
|
|
< As long as I don't have the binocular hanging around my neck I don't mind a "heavy" binocular. >
I feel the same way myself , Rich .
As I've mentioned several times previously , it's not so much the WEIGHT of binoculars which cause arm fatigue , but the mere act of keeping the arms inclined at a unnatural angle for long periods .
It affects me just the same if I'm not even holding any binoculars , and in fact , of the two , when it comes to binoculars , I would MUCH rather hold an item of some SUBSTANCE , as in length , girth and weight , than a fiddly little compact unit .
Regards , Kenny
--------------------
Milton Wilcox R.I.P
|
15x60
member
Reged: 09/19/06
Posts: 74
Loc: Milan, Italy
|
|
Quote:
Based upon my impressions , I would say that the reduction of " chromatism " is INDEED one of the ( very few ) improvements I could detect upon my impressions of the ORIGINAL Zeiss Victory models
Hi Kenny,
What about the stars through your 42mm FL? I mean, are they pinpoints?
Fabio
--------------------
Zeiss 15x60 B/GA T*
Carl Zeiss 7x50W Jenoptem
Zeiss Victory 10x56 FL
Miyauchi BJ-100 iC
|
camvan
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 05/02/05
Posts: 2142
Loc: British Columbia
|
|
not to sidetrack this discussion by a whole lot, I'm wondering what the Zeiss' 'mechanical' feel is like? by that I'm meaning the diopter and focus adjuster. are there other binoculars out there that don't cost nearly the same price that would rival, meet or beat the Zeiss on their mechanics if it's as good as the optics are? 
--------------------
Cameron
"Aperture can only be replaced by even more aperture. Dark transparent skies cannot be replaced by anything else." - Stathis Kafalis
Intes MN66
Meade SN8
handfull of cheap ep's
|
Erik D
Post Laureate
Reged: 04/28/03
Posts: 4066
Loc: Central New Jersey, USA
|
|
Quote:
Hi Kenny,
What about the stars through your 42mm FL? I mean, are they pinpoints?
Fabio
Fabio,
Just to help you keep track of the regulars and their optics: Kenny J has a Nikon Superior E 10X42, A Zeiss Classic 7X42 roof, Ziess Diascope 85 FL.....No 42mm FL.
Rich N has the Zeiss 10X42 FL, Nikon 12X50 SE, Canono 15X50 IS, Fuji FMT 10X70, Kowa 32X82 FL....Leicas, Swaros, Clestron... and many others.
Erik D
|
KennyJ
The British Flash
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 20139
Loc: Lancashire UK
|
|
Thanks Erik -- you beat me to it !
So Yes -- I mean NO -- Fabio -- I haven't got a Zeiss 42mm FL binocular , and the only ones I've tried have been in daylight .
The acquisition of my most recent prescription glasses has greatly improved my impression of stars appearing as " pin points " of light , but I would say in that respect the Zeiss 7 x 42 classic lags behind the Nikon 10 x 42 SE , possibly at least partly as a result of the smaller exit pupil reducing the effects of astigmatism .
The Zeiss 7 x 42 classic IS a classic hand - held instrument for DAYTIME use , as is my Swift Audubon Kestrel HR5 10 x 50 -- neither are PARTICULARLY outstanding for stargazing .
The Captain's Helmsman 7 x 50 IF Marine is a better binocular for stargazing in my opinion .
I posted a review of the Helmsman to EdZ for inclusion in the CN main articles section in November 2006 , but it has still not appeared .
Are you reading this Ed ? :-)
Regards , Kenny
--------------------
Milton Wilcox R.I.P
|
Paul G
Post Laureate
Reged: 05/08/03
Posts: 4063
Loc: Freedonia
|
|
Quote:
not to sidetrack this discussion by a whole lot, I'm wondering what the Zeiss' 'mechanical' feel is like?
I have the 7x42 FL's and, while I like their fov (main reason I bought them), they have a cheap "plastic" feel to me. The Zeiss Classics and the Leicas have a much better, quality feel.
Bino preference is as individual as spouse preference; you really need to get your hands on it to see how it feels to you.
--------------------
Gus
"Coffee leads men to trifle away their time, scald their chops, and spend their money, all for a little base, black, thick, nasty, bitter, stinking nauseous puddle water." ~The Women's Petition Against Coffee, 1674
If it ain't broke, fix it 'til it is.
|
Previous
Index
Next
Threaded
Edit
Reply
Quote
[Re: