Robert A.
sage
Reged: 01/21/05
Posts: 433
Loc: Milwaukee, WI Northern USA
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In terms of ergonomics, the Mariner series has very large eye pieces and a large prism assembly. I have two of the 8x40 Mariners. (I had given one to my Dad, but he returned it when he felt it did not fit his usage style.) Back to my own usage and ergonomics-- The views through it reminds me of the Nikon Action Extreme. My eyes are close enough together that I would close the hinge to where the metal would touch to look through it. It works fine and the views are very enjoyable.
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Oberwerk 11x56, Nikon 12x50se, Fujinon 16x70, William Optics 22x70, Oberwerk 25/40 45degree 100mm
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EdZ
Professor EdZ
Reged: 02/15/02
Posts: 18806
Loc: Cumberland, R I , USA42N71.4W
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Quote:
My eyes are close enough together that I would close the hinge to where the metal would touch to look through it.
A good point for users to remember is the Mariner's closest IPD settings are all 61-62mm. That could be a problem for some users, it's not for me, but I'm 62mm so I'm at or near the limit with this binocular. My brother can't use my Mariners, he's 58mm. Also I can't use the Mariners for my Astro classes. Many of the kids in my classes are in the 55mm to 58mm range.
edz
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Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21
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johnno
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 05/03/04
Posts: 807
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Post deleted by johnno
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EdZ
Professor EdZ
Reged: 02/15/02
Posts: 18806
Loc: Cumberland, R I , USA42N71.4W
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Quote:
Without apeture,only the 10x60,(10x52)is the only one useful for Astronomy
Well , I wouldn't go so far as to say they aren't useful. In fact, my recent 4 to 5 months of testing Small Binoculars shows me that even as small as 40mm or even 8x binoculars are quite useful for astronomy. In fact, I'm finding some favorites in that range.
As far as actuals being smaller than specified, our readers here would do well to review the data I've published on small binocular apertures. There you will find about 1/3 of all the binoculars tested are actually operating at significantly less than specified.
edz
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Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21
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DJB
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 02/23/05
Posts: 1742
Loc: Lisle NY
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Hi EdZ,
I am impressed when you state that ~1/3 units tested are operating at SIGNIFICANTLY less than advertised aperture! Perhaps the mfg. should state both specs. Lot of luck, right?
Best regards,
Dave.
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johnno
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 05/03/04
Posts: 807
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Post deleted by johnno
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Randy Cordell
super member
Reged: 09/16/07
Posts: 196
Loc: Cedar Rapids IA
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Without apeture,only the 10x60,(10x52)is the only one useful for Astronomy
Well , I wouldn't go so far as to say they aren't useful. In fact, my recent 4 to 5 months of testing Small Binoculars shows me that even as small as 40mm or even 8x binoculars are quite useful for astronomy. In fact, I'm finding some favorites in that range.
As far as actuals being smaller than specified, our readers here would do well to review the data I've published on small binocular apertures. There you will find about 1/3 of all the binoculars tested are actually operating at significantly less than specified.
edz
Hi Edz,
Thanks for Your response.
I do agree,8x40 is quite usefull for Astronomy,as are 7x50,s,etc.
OR,ANYTHING,that improves the Capability of our eyes.
My Main point was this.
Anyone,Buying/EXPECTING,an 8x40,and Getting an 8x32.
Is Going to be slightly annoyed with the lack,of light Gathering Ability,
Put it this way.
IF,we went to Macdonalds Drive Through,asked for a "BIG MAC",PAID, for a "BIG MAC"
1,Mile down the road,
Discovered,
WE
GOT a Junior Burger.
Equalls, STRESS,= "inate desire to choke the living daylights,out of someone who desperately deserves it."
SAME THING,With Binoculars.
Forgive,my Aussie Humour Edz.
ALTHOUGH,you should be used to it by Now.
Regards.
John
If the 7x43 w/ 90% clear view is still more *useful* aperture than anything else in it's price range....what is to be upset about?
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Randy Cordell
Meade StarFinder 10" F/4.7 Dob, Telrad, Craford, Fans
Bogen 3040 and 3050 Tripods with Orion Paragon-Plus Parallelogram or 3047 head
Oberwerk Mariner 7x50
Pentax PCF WP 8x40
Garrett Optical Gemini 15x70 WP-IF
Laptop running Kubuntu and Stellarium 0.9.1
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johnno
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 05/03/04
Posts: 807
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deleted by moderator
Edited by EdZ (01/30/08 05:45 AM)
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Randy Cordell
super member
Reged: 09/16/07
Posts: 196
Loc: Cedar Rapids IA
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deleted by moderator
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Randy Cordell
Meade StarFinder 10" F/4.7 Dob, Telrad, Craford, Fans
Bogen 3040 and 3050 Tripods with Orion Paragon-Plus Parallelogram or 3047 head
Oberwerk Mariner 7x50
Pentax PCF WP 8x40
Garrett Optical Gemini 15x70 WP-IF
Laptop running Kubuntu and Stellarium 0.9.1
Edited by EdZ (01/30/08 05:44 AM)
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KennyJ
The British Flash
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 20139
Loc: Lancashire UK
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< I have every confidence that someday you'll amount to something. >
What a terribly insulting statement to be allowed to stand unedited on a so - called " friendly " internet forum .
-- I'm glad I stopped posting here when I did , but just HAD to make an exception here .
Regards to anyone who remembers me -
- although , unlike the post above which OUGHT to have been , I've little doubt this post will be deleted before 99% of you will even get the chance to see it .
Kenny
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Milton Wilcox R.I.P
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Wes James
Postmaster
Reged: 04/12/06
Posts: 5477
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Kenny-
So nice to see you pop in!  Even if only to sadly have to make a comment like that...You have not been forgotten...
you are missed here by some of us!
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Wes
Atlantic Beach, FL
Bino’s- Tak's, Fuji's, Nikon's, Canon IS and Garrett 20x110 Signature's,
Some telescopes from Carton & Zeiss 60mm's up through a couple of 8” reflectors… Orion 3.6" O/A- and a wonderful 4.25" Delmarva Schiefspiegler!
Some good friends, made here on C/N.
Oh- several cats and a wonderful wife!
Anyone want a cat???? :-O
"When your work speaks for itself- Don't Interrupt" -Gamble Rogers
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Rich V.
Post Laureate
Reged: 01/02/05
Posts: 3143
Loc: Lake Tahoe area, Nevada, USA
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Hi, Kenny, we've missed you!
I'm sure Randy's remark was made in jest; but he forgot the obligatory " " to keep everyone happy.
Johnno's point remains; if a binocular is advertised as 50mm but is really 43mm or whatever it is false advertising. Whether one likes the view through the 43mm aperture doesn't take away from the fact the binocular was misrepresented and not providing what was expected.
Rich V
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Binoculars:
33/50/71/150x100 Saturn III, 22x70ED, 16x70 FMT-SX, 10x50 PCF-V, 10x43 DCF-SP, 10x35 EII, 7x35 E, 8x30 EII,
7x26 Custom, 8x23CF AS Diplomat, 6.5x21 Papilio
Scopes:
C9.25, TMB130SS, SV80S-LOMO 80/480
IDA member
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RichD
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 11/08/07
Posts: 1782
Loc: Derbyshire, UK
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Hey Kenny, good to see you back.
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So this cabbie says: "Know who I had in this cab last week? Bertrand Russell! Wisest man in the Western World. And I says to him 'Bertie, what's it all about?' And do you know, he couldn't tell me..."
Kenneth Williams
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richtea
sage
Reged: 02/01/05
Posts: 309
Loc: UK Yorkshire
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Hi Kenny
Hope alls well with you and i am another who misses your brand of indivdual input on the Forum
I would hope the comment you refer to was more of a tongue in cheek response without the humour icon
At least i hope so !
Good viewing
Regards
Rich T
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12x Canon IS MK11 Porro
10x C/Zeiss Jenoptem/Nikon SE/E11/Swift Ultralite/Hawke B/Watch WP/ Praktica WA Porro/Olympus Wide /Brunton Porro
10 x Belomo Loupe + 10/20 x Silver Geo Loupe
10 x Celestron Regal LX Roof
9x Opticron Minerva Porro
8.5x Swift Audobon FMC Porro
8x Nikon E11/Minolta Activa WPFP/Praktica WA Porros/Smith Wesson(Pentax)Roof/Bushnell Discoverer Roofs/Olympus Wide PC Porro
7x Fujinon CDPC Roof
6.5x Pentax Papilo reverse porro
Nikon ED78A/38 x WA Scope/Eyepiece
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EdZ
Professor EdZ
Reged: 02/15/02
Posts: 18806
Loc: Cumberland, R I , USA42N71.4W
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Quote:
I would hope the comment you refer to was more of a tongue in cheek response without the humour icon
At least i hope so !
I hoped so too, but this is not the first complaint about the same exchange of comments, and even given the recent attempt by one member towards explaining humor, if our other members can't figure out whether it's humorous or not, then exchanges like that don't belong here.
edz
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Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21
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johnno
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 05/03/04
Posts: 807
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Hi Kenny,
Good to see you back,and thanks for your support.
I decided Not to reply,to "That" post.
As it would serve no purpose,and only make a difficult situation worse.
Take care My Friend.
Regards.
John
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patter1
professor emeritus
Reged: 01/19/05
Posts: 597
Loc: Canada
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Quote:
If the 7x43 w/ 90% clear view is still more *useful* aperture than anything else in it's price range....what is to be upset about?
Aside from misrepresentation (only getting about 86% of the aperture and about 74% of the light gathering area you paid for), my main issue would have less to do with optical performance, and more to do with the fact you're carrying around un-necessary size and weight.
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Patrick
8" f/6 NewStar dobsonian
Orion Starblast 4.5" f/4 mini dobsonian
42mm SuperView, 17mm Nagler T4, some other cheapies
Omcon 7x50, Oberwerk 11x56, Olympus DPS-R 7x35, Olympus Magellan 8x25
homemade 50mm right-angle bino-scope prototype
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EdZ
Professor EdZ
Reged: 02/15/02
Posts: 18806
Loc: Cumberland, R I , USA42N71.4W
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Quote:
if a binocular is advertised as 50mm but is really 43mm or whatever it is false advertising. Whether one likes the view through the 43mm aperture doesn't take away from the fact the binocular was misrepresented and not providing what was expected.
Rich V
Accusations of false advertising here are out of line and have no place in this discussion. That's vendor bashing. This supplier makes no false advertisement. The measurement found are by rigorous testing that would not be expected of ANY supplier.
edz
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Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21
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patter1
professor emeritus
Reged: 01/19/05
Posts: 597
Loc: Canada
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Ed, if any vendor knew that a binocular has less aperture than advertised, due to an internal aperture stop, why would that not be false advertising? Wouldn't it be false advertising if a vendor were advertising a '100mm' refractor that was known to be 85 or 90mm clear aperture? ...I can't see why it wouldn't.
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Patrick
8" f/6 NewStar dobsonian
Orion Starblast 4.5" f/4 mini dobsonian
42mm SuperView, 17mm Nagler T4, some other cheapies
Omcon 7x50, Oberwerk 11x56, Olympus DPS-R 7x35, Olympus Magellan 8x25
homemade 50mm right-angle bino-scope prototype
Edited by patter1 (01/30/08 08:35 AM)
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EdZ
Professor EdZ
Reged: 02/15/02
Posts: 18806
Loc: Cumberland, R I , USA42N71.4W
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Quote:
Ed, if any vendor knew that a binocular has less aperture than advertised, due to an internal aperture stop, why would that not be false advertising? Wouldn't it be false advertising if a vendor were advertising a '100mm' refractor that was known to be 85 or 90mm clear aperture? ...I can't see why it wouldn't.
For your assumption to be correct, the vendor would have to knowingly misrepresent based on prior knowledge. Rest assured, information such as this is not being provided by the manufacturer. So, unless the vendor provides for rigorous testing, the information is not available. Further, it is not incumbent upon the vendor to conduct such rigorous testing. This is outside the norm. This isn't like testing for alignment.
There are hundreds of individuals in this forum who like to test and measure optics. Some do a better job than others. There are perhaps a dozen, or several dozen at most that have displayed an understanding of practicing refined methods of measurement. NONE of them previously used a method of measurement to show this particular model of binocular is operating undersized.
I'll repeat, suggestions of false advertising in this instance are out of place in this discussion.
edz
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Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21
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