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Swedpat
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 02/18/05
Posts: 1144
Loc: Boden, Sweden, Scandinavia
Oberwerk 10x60 Mariner WP new
      #362461 - 03/03/05 11:11 AM

Hi Ed!

I see you mention the Oberwerk Mariner 10x60. Do you have any review to give about it, especially interest would be a comparison to the Oberwerk 11x70.

Patric

--------------------
*2,3x40 Constellation View Wide-Bino
*Leupold Katmai 6x32
*Nikon Sporter I 8x36
*Swarovski SLCNew 7x42B
*Bresser (Lidl) 10x50
*Oberwerk 11x70
*Stellarvue SV50 spottingscope
*Meade 5000 26mm Plössl, Vixen LV 10/5mm

Psalm 19:2

Edited by EdZ (03/03/05 11:26 AM)


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EdZ
Professor EdZ


Reged: 02/15/02
Posts: 18806
Loc: Cumberland, R I , USA42N71.4W
Re: Oberwerk 10x60 Mariner WP new [Re: Swedpat]
      #362482 - 03/03/05 11:47 AM

This Oberwerk Mariner 10x60 is a new acquisition. Just starting to have a good look at it and thru it.

This is a large binocular and heavy. The Mariner weighs 3#2oz, the same as the Obie 15x70. It is almost the exact same physical size as the Orion 15x63 Mini Giant. However, the prism housings on the Mariner are much larger. The prism housings on the Mariner are more on the order that you would associate with the 10x70 and 16x70 Fujinon.

I measured the field of view at 4.9°
Rechecked the filed of view more accurately and got 5.1°

I observed a 36" double still cleanly separated all the way to within the very edge of the field stops. That is outstanding sharpness of 360 arcseconds apparent resolution at the edges, exceeding most every other binocular I own. The only binoculars I own that exceed that degree of edge resolution are the Pentax 16x60 and the Oberwerk BT100, but keep in mind, the Pentax has only a 2.8° field of view and the BT100 maxes out at about 2.5°.

It has twist out eye cups similar to those on the Nikon AE series. No slip. Eye relief is quite long. I was still able to see the entire field of view with my glasses on and the eye cups fully extended.

It's waterproof. Comes in a hard case.

edz

--------------------
Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21

Edited by EdZ (03/22/05 02:12 PM)


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Swedpat
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 02/18/05
Posts: 1144
Loc: Boden, Sweden, Scandinavia
Re: Oberwerk 10x60 Mariner WP new [Re: EdZ]
      #362490 - 03/03/05 12:08 PM

Thank you Ed!

One problem I have with my 11x70 is that it's not possible to adjust the rubber eye cup to an optimal position. I get either to long ER (it,s "blackening") or it will not be enough ER. I suppose the twist out eye cups on 10x60 mariner is better in this respect?

If I think 11x70 is to heavy and big to handhold comfortably (weight * length results in that the center of gravity is "distant" from the face) I guess I should not take in consider to get the 10x60? The slightly lower power is here of course an advantage.

Patric

--------------------
*2,3x40 Constellation View Wide-Bino
*Leupold Katmai 6x32
*Nikon Sporter I 8x36
*Swarovski SLCNew 7x42B
*Bresser (Lidl) 10x50
*Oberwerk 11x70
*Stellarvue SV50 spottingscope
*Meade 5000 26mm Plössl, Vixen LV 10/5mm

Psalm 19:2


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EdZ
Professor EdZ


Reged: 02/15/02
Posts: 18806
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Re: Oberwerk 10x60 Mariner WP new [Re: Swedpat]
      #362583 - 03/03/05 01:49 PM

The 10x60 Mariner is about 2" shorter than the Obie 15x70. The Mariner is almost exactly the same size as the Pentax 16x60, the pentax just maybe 6-8mm taller. Sorry, no 11x70 to compare to.

The balance point of the Mariner is right on the seam between the barrels and the prism housing. The balance point on the 15x70s is about 2" forward of that seam. On the Pentax 16x60, balance is just about 1 cm forward of that seam. On the Orion 15x63 mini Giant, balance is about 1 cm foraward of the seam.

The prism housing on the Mariner is much larger than the prism housing on the Obie 15x70.

68mm long by 69mm wide by 58mm high on the Obie 15x70

70mm long by 74mm wide by 65mm high on the Obie Mmariner 10x60

edz

--------------------
Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21


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Swedpat
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 02/18/05
Posts: 1144
Loc: Boden, Sweden, Scandinavia
Re: Oberwerk 10x60 Mariner WP [Re: EdZ]
      #362612 - 03/03/05 02:26 PM

Ed, If I understand your information right the 10x60 is better handhold than 11x70 because of the balance point is nearer the face? But maybe the prism housing isn't the best for this purpose?

I think it had been better if Pentax PCF WP had been even in a 10x version, that was actually one of the first thought I had when I read about the PCF WP serie, I would like a 10x60 PCF WP...

However, the best compromise is according to everything I have read likely to be satisfied with a 10x50 model, with its lower weight and shorter body. It's just so tempting to get the largest possible aperture, even if it involves the risk to get too big binoculars. I think you use to call it "Aperture fever". But no doubt about that, the views with the Oberwerk 11x70 on a dark sky is more impressive than I experienced with my former Celestron 8x56 Ultima. I dare to state that even if it's 7-8 years ago I sold it.

Patric

--------------------
*2,3x40 Constellation View Wide-Bino
*Leupold Katmai 6x32
*Nikon Sporter I 8x36
*Swarovski SLCNew 7x42B
*Bresser (Lidl) 10x50
*Oberwerk 11x70
*Stellarvue SV50 spottingscope
*Meade 5000 26mm Plössl, Vixen LV 10/5mm

Psalm 19:2


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EdZ
Professor EdZ


Reged: 02/15/02
Posts: 18806
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Re: Oberwerk 10x60 Mariner WP new [Re: Swedpat]
      #653927 - 10/23/05 01:50 PM

While testing some binoculars today I took a much closer look at the exit pupil of the Oberwerk Mariner 10x60. It does not measure 6mm. I found that the Oberwerk Mariner 10x60 has an aperture stop ring behind the objective lens. Several measurements seems to indicate the Oberwerk Mariner 10x60 is operating at an effective aperture of about 56mm.

edz

Also,

The Oberwerk Mariner 10x60 lens recess is only 1.5mm and the metal rim surrounding the eye lens is not recessed at all. So a very strong caution to any eyeglass wearers when using this binocular with the eye cups closed down. Depending on the curvature of your eye glasses perscription, your eye glasses may come in contact with the binocular eye lens. And the metal rim will definitely come in contact with your eye glasses. However, on this binocular you can still see the entire fov while wearing glasses even when the eyecups are fully extended.

edz



--------------------
Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21

Edited by EdZ (10/30/05 08:42 AM)


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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05
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Re: Oberwerk 10x60 Mariner WP new [Re: EdZ]
      #654045 - 10/23/05 03:10 PM

Ed, could you go a bit deeper into the balance point issue. Somewhere in the vicinity of 15x70 size I expect the optimal hand-holding position to shift from the prism end to the objective end. In the latter case it would actually be advantageous if the balance point is a bit more forward.

--------------------
Mark
Leica 8x20; Nikon 7x35; Vixen 8x42; Orion 15x63; Docter 15x60
WO Megrez II 80 FD / APM 107mm f/6.5 / Mewlon 210 on DM-6 + Berlebach Planet


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EdZ
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Reged: 02/15/02
Posts: 18806
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Re: Oberwerk 10x60 Mariner WP new [Re: Mark9473]
      #663439 - 10/30/05 09:35 AM


Quote:

could you go a bit deeper into the balance point issue. Somewhere in the vicinity of 15x70 size I expect the optimal hand-holding position to shift from the prism end to the objective end.




I had stated above
The balance point of the Mariner is right on the seam between the barrels and the prism housing. The balance point on the 15x70s is about 2" forward of that seam. On the Pentax 16x60, balance is just about 1 cm forward of that seam. On the Orion 15x63 mini Giant, balance is about 1 cm foraward of the seam.

On several of my 50s the balance point is slightly further back (1cm) under the prism housing. On my Nikon SE 12x50, the balance point is exactly at the junction of the prism housing anf the barrels. That's where it is on the Mariner.

edz

--------------------
Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21


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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05
Posts: 6459
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Re: Oberwerk 10x60 Mariner WP new [Re: EdZ]
      #663876 - 10/30/05 02:33 PM

thanks Ed for confirming the facts again.

The question was really whether, with the 15x70s, the forward balance point is a disadvantage because they're of a size one still generally holds at the prisms, or rather whether it's actually an advantage because one would hold them close to the objectives.

--------------------
Mark
Leica 8x20; Nikon 7x35; Vixen 8x42; Orion 15x63; Docter 15x60
WO Megrez II 80 FD / APM 107mm f/6.5 / Mewlon 210 on DM-6 + Berlebach Planet


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mplkn1
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Reged: 08/28/05
Posts: 393
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Re: Oberwerk 10x60 Mariner WP new [Re: Mark9473]
      #817503 - 02/09/06 09:53 PM

Dr. Ed-

This seems to me a quite positive report, albeit early in your time with these glasses.

Just to follow up, and in the interest of replacing my non-irreplaceable 10x50s (I'll "officially" give them to my ten year old who always wants to carry them around anyway whenever we're hiking, camping, etc), could you take a moment, when you get the time, to indicate how the Oberwerk 10x60 Mariners have "worn" with you.

Do you still bring them out? Do I take it correctly that you would put their exit pupil at 5.6mm? What are your general thoughts and impressions now, with the perspective of some time?

Only when you get around to answering, and many thanks,

--------------------
Michael -

"I am obliged to confess that I should sooner live in a society governed by the first two thousand names in the Boston telephone directory than in a society governed by the two thousand faculty members of Harvard University."
William F. Buckley, 1963.

Orion (Celestron) 8" SCT on SkyView Pro, Telrad.
Garrett Optical Gemini 25x100 WP IF,
Bogen 3051 tripod w/ 3063 head.
Oberwerk 10x60 Mariner.
Palm Planetarium.
Stellarium on a Motion Computing tablet PC.


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