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Equipment Discussions >> Eyepieces

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RAKing
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Reged: 12/28/07

Loc: West of the D.C. Nebula
Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: Doug D.]
      #5549950 - 12/02/12 09:02 AM

Doug,

Even though I use my Mark V 80 - 90 percent of the time, I think I'll continue to be a "Single Leica Owner" for now. Please let us know what happens.

Cheers,

Ron


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Doug D.
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Reged: 08/23/05

Loc: Virginia
Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: RAKing]
      #5550222 - 12/02/12 11:59 AM

I was there with you Ron but curiosity has gotten the best of me. I'll keep you posted but it may be a while because I have no idea when the adapter will arrive. And if you are ever in C'ville maybe we can arrange a test viewing..?

best,

Doug


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RAKing
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Reged: 12/28/07

Loc: West of the D.C. Nebula
Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: Doug D.]
      #5550527 - 12/02/12 03:19 PM

IIRC, your IPD is plenty for this test. Mine is more like Bob's and it really would be 'iffy' for me to spend that much extra money unless I was absolutely sure of the outcome. It would certainly be worth a trip to C'ville to check things out after you have both zooms up and running.

BTW - I also have that adapter on order from Starlight. Let's hope they get those lathes turning ASAP!

Cheers,

Ron


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andydj5xp
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Reged: 05/27/04

Loc: 52.269 N/10.571 E
Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: Doug D.]
      #5550665 - 12/02/12 04:53 PM

Quote:

I intend a head to head with the ZAO IIs in the MkV over an extended period.




Doug, you sure better should do.

I've sold the ZAOIIs only after 2.5 years of very thoroughly comparing them to the Leica ASPH zoom. And this decision was the right one. OTOH, if I would have sold the ZAOIIs after may be just three months with comparisons the rightness of this decision would indeed be the same. BUT (a large "but") I'm suspecting that I might have been regretting the sale for may be not having allowed for enough time of testing.

Now I'm very content having taken the time for in-depth tests which resulted in the decision: Leica ASPH zoom will stay, ZAOIIs will go.

Andreas


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Doug D.
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Reged: 08/23/05

Loc: Virginia
Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: andydj5xp]
      #5550953 - 12/02/12 08:04 PM

Very wise counsel Andreas - you are absolutely right. Any single night or even extended viewing period does not guarantee a lasting impression and second guessing and/or long term regret over a hasty decision is not where I'd want to be. I think you do have to "live with" eyepieces and scopes over multiple nights, differing viewing conditions, seasons and skies - going back and forth to tease out an evolving impression. That is why I decided to get another zoom; I'm quite sure a single night or two at the ep is simply not enough to make me say "oh yeah, I'm ready to sell the ZAO IIs (or one of the Leica ASPH for that matter - I'm sure I wouldn't part with both!), based on a night or two of wow moments at the ep"..

In any event, what is the rush...? I don't think the ZAO IIs are going to be getting any cheaper on the used market...., LOL. I can likely sell 2-3 years from now and even increase my "profit" margin. I already know I like the ZAO's and would like to think I'll want to hang onto them in any event... but you never know. If I find myself reaching for one or the other sets 5% of the time I think I'll have my answer.

I'll keep you posted on progress Ron ....


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Bob S.
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Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: Doug D.]
      #5551630 - 12/03/12 08:15 AM

Andreas, I finally had a very good seeing night with my Leica ASPH and new Baader VIP barlow. I removed the very top portion of the barlow(about 38mm) and screwed the 42mm portion which was about 58mm in length into my 2" adapter with the 42mm threads on the Leica. I have no idea what magnifications this produced but the views of Jupiter at the lowest mag (25x) with the barlow and then about half way between the 25x and 30x position for the best views of the night. The Great Red Spot was exceptionally beautiful with a lot of detail surrounding the spot and a host of very distinct and interesting white ovals following the GRS. I am thinking about digitizing the instructions that are provided in German and having you summarize their contents if you wouldn't mind? I also tried the views without the barlow and that slight bit of magnification helped to get me right where I needed to be on this lovely evening. It was a nice several hours of planetary viewing. Before I launched into the planetary viewing, I did about an hour tour of galaxies, open clusters, planetary nebula with the Leica/VIP combination and it was a lot of fun. Bob

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andydj5xp
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 05/27/04

Loc: 52.269 N/10.571 E
Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: Bob S.]
      #5551736 - 12/03/12 09:45 AM

Quote:

Andreas, I finally had a very good seeing night with my Leica ASPH and new Baader VIP barlow. I removed the very top portion of the barlow(about 38mm) and screwed the 42mm portion which was about 58mm in length into my 2" adapter with the 42mm threads on the Leica. I have no idea what magnifications this produced but the views of Jupiter at the lowest mag (25x) with the barlow and then about half way between the 25x and 30x position for the best views of the night. The Great Red Spot was exceptionally beautiful with a lot of detail surrounding the spot and a host of very distinct and interesting white ovals following the GRS. I am thinking about digitizing the instructions that are provided in German and having you summarize their contents if you wouldn't mind? I also tried the views without the barlow and that slight bit of magnification helped to get me right where I needed to be on this lovely evening. It was a nice several hours of planetary viewing. Before I launched into the planetary viewing, I did about an hour tour of galaxies, open clusters, planetary nebula with the Leica/VIP combination and it was a lot of fun. Bob




Bob, I would be pleased to be of help. Just send the instruction sheet and I will prepare the English translation.

As a suggestion: have a look onto the "VIP Modular Barlow Schematic" supplied by Alpineastro (VIP schematic). Near the right bottom the VIP lens is shown to be screwed into the 1.25" adapter #14 with the T2-thread on top.

If you now measure the distance D from the thin flange of #14 (about 6mm down at the bottom of the T2 thread) to a point about 4.5mm within the body of the Leica ASPH zoom you have all the neccessary information to fairly accurately determine the actual barlow factor. This distance D can be varied to your demand by inserting or not inserting T2 extension rings resulting in different barlow factors.

Now divide the measured distance D of your actual set-up (in millimeters) und divide this distance by 64mm (the focal length of the barlow lens). Finally add 1 (one) to arrive at the actual barlow factor. If for instance you choose this distance D to be 64mm, then you divide 64mm by 64mm (which is 1) and adding 1 yields 2, which now is your barlow factor 2x.

It's as simple as that.

Andreas


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Bob S.
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Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: andydj5xp]
      #5552477 - 12/03/12 05:37 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Andreas, I finally had a very good seeing night with my Leica ASPH and new Baader VIP barlow. I removed the very top portion of the barlow(about 38mm) and screwed the 42mm portion which was about 58mm in length into my 2" adapter with the 42mm threads on the Leica. I have no idea what magnifications this produced but the views of Jupiter at the lowest mag (25x) with the barlow and then about half way between the 25x and 30x position for the best views of the night. The Great Red Spot was exceptionally beautiful with a lot of detail surrounding the spot and a host of very distinct and interesting white ovals following the GRS. I am thinking about digitizing the instructions that are provided in German and having you summarize their contents if you wouldn't mind? I also tried the views without the barlow and that slight bit of magnification helped to get me right where I needed to be on this lovely evening. It was a nice several hours of planetary viewing. Before I launched into the planetary viewing, I did about an hour tour of galaxies, open clusters, planetary nebula with the Leica/VIP combination and it was a lot of fun. Bob




Bob, I would be pleased to be of help. Just send the instruction sheet and I will prepare the English translation.

As a suggestion: have a look onto the "VIP Modular Barlow Schematic" supplied by Alpineastro (VIP schematic). Near the right bottom the VIP lens is shown to be screwed into the 1.25" adapter #14 with the T2-thread on top.

If you now measure the distance D from the thin flange of #14 (about 6mm down at the bottom of the T2 thread) to a point about 4.5mm within the body of the Leica ASPH zoom you have all the neccessary information to fairly accurately determine the actual barlow factor. This distance D can be varied to your demand by inserting or not inserting T2 extension rings resulting in different barlow factors.

Now divide the measured distance D of your actual set-up (in millimeters) und divide this distance by 64mm (the focal length of the barlow lens). Finally add 1 (one) to arrive at the actual barlow factor. If for instance you choose this distance D to be 64mm, then you divide 64mm by 64mm (which is 1) and adding 1 yields 2, which now is your barlow factor 2x.

It's as simple as that.

Andreas




Andreas, I had frankly never noticed the additional information offered as a link on the Alpine Astro site for the Baader VIP. I printed off a copy and studied it and find the barlow much more capable than I originally imagined. It does however share some of the same design complexity of the Baader Mark V binoviewers. Since they are manufactured by the same company from the same country being Germany, I am surprised that I am surprised You Germans are known for your ingenuity and attention to detail. This product follows well in the time-honored tradition. I will just have to do some math and figure out the various combinations. When reading the literature, I did not realize that the barlow is designed for apochromatic capabilities. Bob


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andydj5xp
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 05/27/04

Loc: 52.269 N/10.571 E
Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: sixela]
      #5553660 - 12/04/12 09:55 AM

Quote:

The focal length is -68mm (but measured into the barlow 4mm from the flange), as far as I can tell.

Andy seems to measure it as -64mm, but I don't know if he was using the same reference as I was or was measuring distances to the flange.

In other words, measure the distance D from the eyepiece focal plane to the flange, add 4mm yielding D', and the magnification is then

M=1+D'/68mm.

Given I trust Andy to measure things as precisely as I do, take that as correct +-6% ;-).




After looking into my old notes (from 2007) when the focal length of the VIP lens had been determined as -64mm I got some doubts about the accuracy of the results.

Therefore, today I've very carefully repeated the measurements described in post #5548297
(@Sixela: the focal length of the VIP barlow has been determined by inserting an extension ring of known length Delta_D between the barlow lens and the eyepiece and calculating the difference Delta_B of the two barlow factors with and without extension ring. The focal length of the barlow now is Delta_D/Delta_B. Example: Delta_D=40mm and Delta_B=0.625x yield a focal length of 64mm. )
but with a longer Delta_D=70.2mm (Remark: in 2007 Delta_D was chosen to be 22.5mm, not 40mm as mentioned in the example).

The focal length now has turned out to be -66mm which should be accurate within +/- 1mm. BTW, on the alpineastro-site the focal length is given as 68mm, while on the Baader site there is no data given.

Andreas


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t.r.
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Reged: 02/14/08

Loc: Upstate NY
Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: andydj5xp]
      #5560653 - 12/08/12 10:41 AM

Just a follow up, I have now completed my bino set of the Leica Vario 7-22 zooms thanks to Bob S. passing one on to me. I have had a single zoom for about two years now and knew that I wanted to skip the Asph and pick up another one of these smaller versions having been completely satisfied with it. My theory was that the smaller diameters would allow my IDP of 60.5mm to work more comfortably than take a chance with the larger Asherics. I'm not disappointed. I just did a dry run check on a distant woodline and am happy to report that I can zoom through the full range, while holding the FOV at the low and middle powerswitch positions of my Denk II's. I have no real reason to use the high powerswitch, but I have no doubt that it will work as well and will report back with first light of the combination and the full range. Everything fits in the Denk case now, 2 zooms, Denks and all accessories...what a magnification range in a portable package!

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Bob S.
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Reged: 07/14/05

Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: t.r.]
      #5561091 - 12/08/12 03:42 PM

Quote:

Just a follow up, I have now completed my bino set of the Leica Vario 7-22 zooms thanks to Bob S. passing one on to me. I have had a single zoom for about two years now and knew that I wanted to skip the Asph and pick up another one of these smaller versions having been completely satisfied with it. My theory was that the smaller diameters would allow my IDP of 60.5mm to work more comfortably than take a chance with the larger Asherics. I'm not disappointed. I just did a dry run check on a distant woodline and am happy to report that I can zoom through the full range, while holding the FOV at the low and middle powerswitch positions of my Denk II's. I have no real reason to use the high powerswitch, but I have no doubt that it will work as well and will report back with first light of the combination and the full range. Everything fits in the Denk case now, 2 zooms, Denks and all accessories...what a magnification range in a portable package!




Tim, I am tickled that the Leica zoom worked out so well. The one I kept is working wonders for my solar rig. Bob


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Peter Natscher
professor emeritus


Reged: 03/28/06

Loc: Central Coast California
Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: t.r.]
      #5561426 - 12/08/12 08:10 PM

Do you use your two Leica zooms attached to your bino with a 1.25" adapter or 2"? Is there a 1.25" adapter for the Leica zooms? My Leica ASPH zoom uses the 2" adapter. Either way, you need one of the adapters since this zoom uses a native bayonet mount.

Quote:

Just a follow up, I have now completed my bino set of the Leica Vario 7-22 zooms thanks to Bob S. passing one on to me. I have had a single zoom for about two years now and knew that I wanted to skip the Asph and pick up another one of these smaller versions having been completely satisfied with it. My theory was that the smaller diameters would allow my IDP of 60.5mm to work more comfortably than take a chance with the larger Asherics. I'm not disappointed. I just did a dry run check on a distant woodline and am happy to report that I can zoom through the full range, while holding the FOV at the low and middle powerswitch positions of my Denk II's. I have no real reason to use the high powerswitch, but I have no doubt that it will work as well and will report back with first light of the combination and the full range. Everything fits in the Denk case now, 2 zooms, Denks and all accessories...what a magnification range in a portable package!




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Bob S.
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Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: Peter Natscher]
      #5561911 - 12/09/12 06:26 AM

Quote:

Do you use your two Leica zooms attached to your bino with a 1.25" adapter or 2"? Is there a 1.25" adapter for the Leica zooms? My Leica ASPH zoom uses the 2" adapter. Either way, you need one of the adapters since this zoom uses a native bayonet mount.

Quote:

Just a follow up, I have now completed my bino set of the Leica Vario 7-22 zooms thanks to Bob S. passing one on to me. I have had a single zoom for about two years now and knew that I wanted to skip the Asph and pick up another one of these smaller versions having been completely satisfied with it. My theory was that the smaller diameters would allow my IDP of 60.5mm to work more comfortably than take a chance with the larger Asherics. I'm not disappointed. I just did a dry run check on a distant woodline and am happy to report that I can zoom through the full range, while holding the FOV at the low and middle powerswitch positions of my Denk II's. I have no real reason to use the high powerswitch, but I have no doubt that it will work as well and will report back with first light of the combination and the full range. Everything fits in the Denk case now, 2 zooms, Denks and all accessories...what a magnification range in a portable package!







Peter, Tim received his Leica 7-22 zoom with a 1.25" adapter. Markus sells 1.25" adapters for the Leica zooms. The zoom that Tim was referring to is the precursor from Leica to the ASPH. It has something like a 38-60 AFOV. I could not get the images to merge properly for binoviewing so kept one to use with my solar scope and it is about perfect for that application. It frames the Sun ideally with its smaller AFOV than the ASPH.


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t.r.
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Reged: 02/14/08

Loc: Upstate NY
Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: Bob S.]
      #5562002 - 12/09/12 08:39 AM

Here is the 1 1/4" adapter Markus provides. A nice quality piece for $70 euro. A 2" is also available to order...

http://www.apm-telescopes.net/de/Okulare/Okular-Zubehoer/Adapter-125-fuer-Lei...


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Doug D.
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Reged: 08/23/05

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Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: t.r.]
      #5562161 - 12/09/12 10:36 AM

Thanks for posting info about the APM 1.25" adapter. I am currently using a Starlight Instruments adapter, which is a 2" adapter convertible to 1.25" by screwing in a Baader 1.25" nosepeice (#T2-14). I just received my second ASPH and now waiting for another Starlight adapter. However, not only is the 1.25" adapter from Markus a good deal less expensive but it looks like it would seat the EP a little lower in the Mark V - reducing my in focus distance correspondingly. Maybe I'm mistaken on this point but very hard to tell just looking at the respective adapters online!

I know it is a long shot, but does anyone have any experience with both and/or can confirm that the APM adapter would mount the EP closer?

On the other hand, I could get two of the Markus 1.25" adapters for less than a single Starlight version even at the new reduced price. Then I'd save on the T2-14 adapter and can keep my existing Starlight adapter for those times when I use the zoom in cyclops mode with a 2" diagonal.... Does that make sense to anyone else?

Anyone maybe have a photo of the APM 1.25" adapter with the ASPH attached that you could post/send? thanks.



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Peter Natscher
professor emeritus


Reged: 03/28/06

Loc: Central Coast California
Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: t.r.]
      #5562268 - 12/09/12 11:34 AM

I've got the 2" adapter for one-eyed zoom use. My IPD is also 60.5mm and am not sure that this zoom would work for me side-by-side in my Mark V bino.

Quote:

Here is the 1 1/4" adapter Markus provides. A nice quality piece for $70 euro. A 2" is also available to order...

http://www.apm-telescopes.net/de/Okulare/Okular-Zubehoer/Adapter-125-fuer-Lei...




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Tamiji Homma
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Reged: 02/24/07

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Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: Peter Natscher]
      #5562410 - 12/09/12 12:49 PM

Hi Peter,

My IPD is about same as you, 60.5mm.

A pair of Leica zoom eyepieces worked for me.
Nose clearance may get in the way, though.

To be honest, it is too bulky. I rarely use the combination.



Tammy


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t.r.
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Reged: 02/14/08

Loc: Upstate NY
Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: Tamiji Homma]
      #5562463 - 12/09/12 01:32 PM

And that is precisely why I chose the older Leicas. The quality is just as good with alot less bulk. Compare the side-by-side pic on page one of this thread. Perfect for binoviewing! And I got two old zooms for the price of one Aspheric. But most people have to have the latest and greatest(the Aspheric is newer and wider fov) and as a result...can't see the forest for the trees.

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Peter Natscher
professor emeritus


Reged: 03/28/06

Loc: Central Coast California
Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House new [Re: t.r.]
      #5562490 - 12/09/12 01:47 PM

What's the OD of the barrel (in mm) of your two non-ASPH Leica zooms? Is there enough nose clearance between the two when set at 60.5 mm IPD? How much smaller and lighter in weight are they compared to the ASH's?

Quote:

And that is precisely why I chose the older Leicas. The quality is just as good with alot less bulk. Compare the side-by-side pic on page one of this thread. Perfect for binoviewing! And I got two old zooms for the price of one Aspheric. But most people have to have the latest and greatest and as a result...can't see the forest for the trees.




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t.r.
Post Laureate
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Reged: 02/14/08

Loc: Upstate NY
Re: Second Leica Vario 25x-50x ASPH Zoom In the House [Re: Peter Natscher]
      #5562511 - 12/09/12 01:58 PM

Peter, If you go into the vendor forum and go back through APM/Markus's posts about the zooms being available, in one of them he gives the dimension differences. I don't have an ASPH to compare to. There is no problem for my 60.5 IDP and the bridge of my nose fitting. The zooms don't touch, but there isn't much room either. My nose bridge just rides over the gap. There was one combination where I did have to put the eye cups down to take in the full view, but can't remember which position (lowest or highest power) it occurred. Mine measured approx 52.38mm.

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