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Equipment Discussions >> Eyepieces

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csrlice12
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Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: Damo636]
      #5679820 - 02/14/13 04:20 PM

Quote:

Quote:




Save your pennies kiddies, grab yourself a few Pentax XW's while supplies on the used market lasts.





I did save my pennies and have just added the 5mm to the stall




Trying to add the 10mm XW as we type.


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ROBERT FREE
sage
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Reged: 03/20/11

Loc: SARASOTA,FL
Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: HTJ]
      #5679833 - 02/14/13 04:23 PM

thx htj i just got the hyperion 8mm to try out.139.00 i want to see what its like vs my 25 year 30 year celestron ultimas which do the job but quite old. i can always return the 8 an get a pentax 8 279.00 costly but probably worth it.i have an 8" f-10

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Starman1
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Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: ROBERT FREE]
      #5680150 - 02/14/13 08:12 PM

Quote:

thx htj i just got the hyperion 8mm to try out.139.00 i want to see what its like vs my 25 year 30 year celestron ultimas which do the job but quite old. i can always return the 8 an get a pentax 8 279.00 costly but probably worth it.i have an 8" f-10



The "TO", meaning "toward" in your signature line should read "TOO", meaning "too much", and the attribution should be to the poet Sarah Williams:
"Though my soul may set in darkness, it will rise in perfect light;
I have loved the stars too fondly to be fearful of the night."


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Scanning4Comets
Markus
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Reged: 12/26/04

Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: Starman1]
      #5680165 - 02/14/13 08:28 PM

Quote:

Trying to add the 10mm XW as we type.




I'm thinking about getting a 5mm XW even though I can barlow my 10mm XW, because I'd rather just plop a 5mm in instead of fiddling with a barlow!....Too bad they didn't make a 4.5mm XW as that would be better in my case!

And. NO, I don't want a 4.5mm Delos. I prefer the ergonomics of the XW's much more!

Cheers,


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Tank
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Loc: Stoney Creek, Ontario, CANADA
Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: Scanning4Comets]
      #5680175 - 02/14/13 08:33 PM

Pentax XW are great i doubt the Baader Hyperion can hang with them but i bet the BGO can!
The 5,7,10 are awesome EPs just a bit expensive!
The reason i dont have then is because i have some exotic glass in those FLs
5 XO
7 Pentax SMC ortho .965
10 CZJ


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wirenut
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Reged: 09/21/06

Loc: m'dale Pa
Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: Starman1]
      #5680186 - 02/14/13 08:41 PM

Watch out robert, it's the literature/grammer police LOL they are coming to take you away!!! just kidding if it was me and my wife saw that, it wouldn't end till I fixed it.

I hope you enjoy your new EP I have found the best features of the hyperions are eye relief and AFOV. stars are pretty sharp to edge in my F6 scope. what I don't like about them is the background doesn't seem as dark or planetary images as crisp as with my plossls. I think that's contrast.


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Starman1
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Reged: 06/24/03

Loc: Los Angeles
Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: Tank]
      #5680195 - 02/14/13 08:52 PM

Quote:

Pentax XW are great i doubt the Baader Hyperion can hang with them but i bet the BGO can!
The 5,7,10 are awesome EPs just a bit expensive!
The reason i dont have them is because i have some exotic glass in those FLs:
5 XO
7 Pentax SMC ortho .965
10 CZJ



Alas, the BGOs are no more, unless purchased used.
The BCOs (Baader Classic Orthos) are available only in 6, 10, and 18mm.
One hopes that more focal lengths will be avail. in the future.
In the meantime, Abbé orthos are available direct from Kasai, and from:
University Optics (some focal lengths), Edmund Scientific.
The PL Orthos from Carl Zeiss don't appear to be classic Abbé orthos though they are listed as othoscopic (meaning without distortion).


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FoxTrot
sage


Reged: 06/01/06

Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: Starman1]
      #5680225 - 02/14/13 09:17 PM

Robert, I reiterate the statements of the majority of those above, the answer is 'no'. I have a Pentax XW 7mm, and LVW 13mm and most recently a Orion Stratus 24mm (similar to the Baader line), and I've now had more time to evaluate the latter since I got it a few weeks ago. Notwithstanding these are all different focal lengths, the Pentax XW out classes the lot, by a long mile. Even in my f/5 fast refractors, the XW provides incredible distortion free control over the image. The LVW is not bad, but I can tell its not perfectly suited for my f/5 scopes. The Orion Stratus is nice for the price I got it for, but shows quite a degree of field curvature in my scopes. It cleans up better with barlowing. Completely subjective rating, but if the Pentax XW is 100%, the LVW would be 90% and the Stratus say a 60-70% - the difference is substantial in my book.

Now having said all that, I do rate the Stratus an excellent buy for the second-hand price I got it for ($100 AUD). Its a gift for a friend who has an Skywatcher 80ED and I have no doubt he will love the Stratus, given he only has bottom rung no brand plossls at the moment. The 68 deg wide view, great eye relief, and "reasonable" performance make it a good buy at this level.

Cheers, Fox


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Jon Isaacs
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Reged: 06/16/04

Loc: San Diego and Boulevard, CA
Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: FoxTrot]
      #5680750 - 02/15/13 07:01 AM

Quote:

Even in my f/5 fast refractors, the XW provides incredible distortion free control over the image.




I know this might seem to be "picky, picky" but did you mean to say "aberration free control over the image" rather than "distortion free control over the image."

A distortion free field is one where the relation of of the stars to one another is correct, that is orthoscopic. With a 70 degree AFoV, distortion is unavoidable. An aberration free field means the stars are round and sharp across the field. Aberrations include field curvature, astigmatism and coma.

Jon


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FoxTrot
sage


Reged: 06/01/06

Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: Jon Isaacs]
      #5680808 - 02/15/13 08:09 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Even in my f/5 fast refractors, the XW provides incredible distortion free control over the image.




I know this might seem to be "picky, picky" but did you mean to say "aberration free control over the image" rather than "distortion free control over the image."

A distortion free field is one where the relation of of the stars to one another is correct, that is orthoscopic. With a 70 degree AFoV, distortion is unavoidable. An aberration free field means the stars are round and sharp across the field. Aberrations include field curvature, astigmatism and coma.

Jon



Thanks Jon, much more well put - 'aberration' free the XW 7mm certainly is.
Indeed, even comparing my Panoptic 27mm to the Stratus 24mm, the difference is startling as well; clarity, sharpness and brilliance of the image are miles ahead in the Panoptic. Definitely a case of ' you get what you pay for'.


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MRNUTTY
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Reged: 11/22/11

Loc: Mendon, MA
Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: Jon Isaacs]
      #5680876 - 02/15/13 08:51 AM

I bought the lot of XW's due to the productuon halt fear-factor of the XO's. I had heard great things about them, and I wasn't going to miss out on the remaining Pentax product line. It turned out to be the best EP purchase yet! They are the first thing into the trunk when I travel to my dark site :-) I haven't had enough time to compare them agrainst my Televue's yet, but based purely on popular vote it will be a neck-and-neck race all the way to the finish line. If I were to go through the whole purchase process again, I wouldn't get sidelined by bargain EP's again with the exception of the Seibert's; they have a charm all their own, and the Explore Sceintific 82 and 68's; stopping at them would be a no fault choice, and the Circle-T Ortho, Kelner and Erfle's; can't be beat by wieght alone :-)

Edited by MRNUTTY (02/15/13 12:28 PM)


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csrlice12
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Reged: 05/22/12

Loc: Denver, CO
Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: MRNUTTY]
      #5680921 - 02/15/13 09:09 AM

See Kids? See what happens when you look thru a telescope? Do you want to end up like this? Hi, my name is (insert name here), and I'm an Ocularholic. (But then, Hey, if you're gonna be one, be the best).

I even heard he donated an eye for his CollinsI3....


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MRNUTTY
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Reged: 11/22/11

Loc: Mendon, MA
Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: csrlice12]
      #5681350 - 02/15/13 12:29 PM

It was my third eye :-)

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Jon Isaacs
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Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: FoxTrot]
      #5681393 - 02/15/13 12:47 PM

Quote:

Indeed, even comparing my Panoptic 27mm to the Stratus 24mm, the difference is startling as well; clarity, sharpness and brilliance of the image are miles ahead in the Panoptic. Definitely a case of ' you get what you pay for'.




It is my understanding that of all the Stratus/Hyperion line, the 24mm is the weakest. For a while I had the 13mm Stratus. At the same time I had the 16mm Type 2 Nagler. At night, it is easy to mistake the Stratus 13mm for the 16 mm Nagler and vice versa, they are similar is size, shape and weight. I made many side by side comparisons, essentially blind.

When I mistook the 16mm Nagler for the 13mm Stratus, my reaction was always the same. For a few seconds I would remark to myself that the Stratus was really quite a good eyepiece with none of the bright edge and off-axis aberrations I had remembered. The field of view was sharp and evenly illuminated from the center to the edge.

After a moment of admiration, I realized, "This is the 16mm Nagler, not the 13mm Stratus."

Jon


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Scanning4Comets
Markus
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Reged: 12/26/04

Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: Jon Isaacs]
      #5681503 - 02/15/13 01:28 PM

Quote:

I know this might seem to be "picky, picky" but did you mean to say "aberration free control over the image" rather than "distortion free control over the image."

A distortion free field is one where the relation of of the stars to one another is correct, that is orthoscopic. With a 70 degree AFoV, distortion is unavoidable. An aberration free field means the stars are round and sharp across the field. Aberrations include field curvature, astigmatism and coma.

Jon




Jon, where do you get this notion that distortion is unavoidable in some 70 degree eyepieces? There is zero distortion in my 10mm and 7mm Pentax XW's. I have said this for years. Pinpoint stars across the field in both.

Cheers,


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photiost
professor emeritus
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Reged: 12/14/06

Loc: Montreal, Canada
Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: Starman1]
      #5681507 - 02/15/13 01:29 PM

Quote:

Color filters definitely improve the view of Mercury, both by filtering out the brightness of the sky in which the planet is usually viewed, and by reducing the chromatic issues with the lower atmospheric viewing of the planet.
My records show:
Effective at sharpening: #25 red, #23A red-orange
Effective at seeing albedo markings: #15 deep yellow, #12 Yellow
The "in-between" filter: #21 orange.




Personally I have found Mercury is best observed when in the morning sky.

Find Mercury then track it until it comes up higher on the horizon. Yes the background sky is brighter but the atmosphere is "steadier" and the planets disk is also clearer -

Using Filters also helps.

.


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russell23
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Loc: Upstate NY
Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: Scanning4Comets]
      #5681531 - 02/15/13 01:41 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I know this might seem to be "picky, picky" but did you mean to say "aberration free control over the image" rather than "distortion free control over the image."

A distortion free field is one where the relation of of the stars to one another is correct, that is orthoscopic. With a 70 degree AFoV, distortion is unavoidable. An aberration free field means the stars are round and sharp across the field. Aberrations include field curvature, astigmatism and coma.

Jon




Jon, where do you get this notion that distortion is unavoidable in some 70 degree eyepieces? There is zero distortion in my 10mm and 7mm Pentax XW's. I have said this for years. Pinpoint stars across the field in both.

Cheers,




Markus,

What Jon is saying is that there is a difference in the meaning of the words "distortion" and "aberration". He even defines them in his post. The Pentax XW's are not free from "distortion" meaning that the stars do not maintain the same relation across the entire field. You may see this if you adjust the position of a grouping of stars to different points in the FOV. What Jon is saying is that an eyepiece can present pinpoint sharp stars across the field and still have distortion.

Dave


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Mark9473
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Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: Scanning4Comets]
      #5681538 - 02/15/13 01:43 PM

Quote:

Jon, where do you get this notion that distortion is unavoidable in some 70 degree eyepieces? There is zero distortion in my 10mm and 7mm Pentax XW's. I have said this for years. Pinpoint stars across the field in both.




Well, pin-point stars is not a test for distortion but for aberration. Distortion shows itself as straight lines becoming curved, or the Moon becoming oblong, or the magnification changing at the edge.


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photiost
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Loc: Montreal, Canada
Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: Jon Isaacs]
      #5681652 - 02/15/13 02:25 PM

Quote:


It is my understanding that of all the Stratus/Hyperion line, the 24mm is the weakest. For a while I had the 13mm Stratus. At the same time I had the 16mm Type 2 Nagler. At night, it is easy to mistake the Stratus 13mm for the 16 mm Nagler and vice versa, they are similar is size, shape and weight. I made many side by side comparisons, essentially blind.

When I mistook the 16mm Nagler for the 13mm Stratus, my reaction was always the same. For a few seconds I would remark to myself that the Stratus was really quite a good eyepiece with none of the bright edge and off-axis aberrations I had remembered. The field of view was sharp and evenly illuminated from the center to the edge.

After a moment of admiration, I realized, "This is the 16mm Nagler, not the 13mm Stratus."

Jon




I have the complete set of Hyperions (5mm to 24mm) and use them on my 15in f5 Reflector with no issues.

They are good eyepieces and for the price you cant go wrong.

On a side by side the Hyperion 10mm vs Pentax 10mm XW (on Saturn and M13) the Pentax is a better eyepiece (overall) however the Hyperion was not a pushover.
.


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howard929
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Reged: 01/02/11

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Re: DO BAADER HYERIONS COME CLOSE TO PENTAX XW new [Re: Jon Isaacs]
      #5681659 - 02/15/13 02:26 PM

Quote:



I know this might seem to be "picky, picky" but did you mean to say "aberration free control over the image" rather than "distortion free control over the image."

A distortion free field is one where the relation of of the stars to one another is correct, that is orthoscopic. With a 70 degree AFoV, distortion is unavoidable. An aberration free field means the stars are round and sharp across the field. Aberrations include field curvature, astigmatism and coma.

Jon




This may be moot and just theoretical but isn't that curvature due to AFOV and eyepiece format size? For instance, wouldn't a 70 degree 12mm 2" eyepiece be capable of displaying less curvature then the same in 1.25"?


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