Anonymous
Unregistered
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Now that the initial wave of fervor re the RCX announcement has abated, I was wondering who has had any actual "pre" experience with the RCX (beta tested it and can talk about it, seen it at a show and/or looked at something through it, works at Meade and wants to talk, ha, ha, or any real experience)? Thought even if its one person it might be interesting or if any of you got close to this thing.
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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It is interesting based on lack of response to this question how few people actually know anything about RCX first hand. Is anyone out there?
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Grizz
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 04/24/03
Posts: 2172
Loc: Waldwick,New Jersey USA
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I guess we will have to wait for user reports. I read the 10" will be shipping before the end of Feb. The 12's? I guess sometime after that. Beta testers? Thats usually us. 
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Craig
LX200GPS 10" UHTC SMT
ETX90EC
Orion ED80 APO
Meade LPI Canon 10d Meade DSI
My Photo Gallery
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jrcrilly
Refractor wienie again
Reged: 04/30/03
Posts: 22464
Loc: NE Ohio
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There are units in beta test, but the testers are forbidden to discuss it until later in the process. I don't know who they are but with any luck some are or will become CN members.
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John C
Urban Observatory
Tele Vue Pronto
A&M/Astreya 76mm F/6 APO
TMB/LOMO 80mm F/7.5 APO
Tak FSQ-106N F/5 APO
Meade 152ED F/9 "APO"
152mm F/10 achromat
Tak CN-212 8" F/12 classical Cass/ F/4 Newt
Teeter 20" F/3.8 truss Newt w/ServoCat
LXD750, EM-200, CI-700
ST-10XME
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Strgazr27
Scope Junkie
Reged: 10/04/04
Posts: 6018
Loc: StonyHill Observatory
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My question is this. If this is supposed to be an amazing platform for imaging, than where are the images being shot with it? Why is it we have not seen a single one? Sounds to me like we could be headed down another DSI superhighway again. I remember hearing about it, than 2 months later a bunch of pics shot with it, than 10 more months of waiting.
I would think that a scope that is supposed to start shipping this month would have had concrete figures as far as weight, what wedge etc.
The lack of firm facts and ZERO images taken with a scope meant for it are a little disconcerting if you as me. This is MOST frustrating as I have finalized my setup down to either a 10" RCX with the wedge or a G-11 w Gemini/ST-80 combo both using a Modified D20. The wait for Meade to show it's cards is very quickly pushing me towards the LOMO.
JMO.
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Bobby
StonyHill Observatory
Atlas w EQMOD
Vixen R200SS
Orion ED-80
AT-111
AT66-ED
QHY-8
SSAG
YAHOO TMB 130SS Group
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Stargazer27: You reasoning was why I posed the question. I certainly understand that Beta testers can't talk, but it is surprising (I think) that a product which is going to ship in 30 days or less isn't finished Beta testing. And the lack of images is also interesting. My guess is that they are not that near to shipping. Also, even if Beta testers can't talk about the specifics of what they learn from the beta test, you mean they can't even say they're beta testing? I've beta tested software and was under no such restriction. Also, this forum has over 4,000 members and its viewed worldwide, you mean that not ONE PERSON has any more info than we see on the web pages? I'm just curious and its fun to be a sluth, but it does seem to point to the fact that delivery is farther off than this month and that the units themselves may be going under significant revision. I guess all we have is guesses.
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melvy
professor emeritus
Reged: 10/17/03
Posts: 710
Loc: Shoreline WA
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Quote:
My question is this. If this is supposed to be an amazing platform for imaging, than where are the images being shot with it?
JMO.
I belive the NDA is still in effect... sorry.
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WO Megrez 80 SAPO
WO 66 SD APO
TMB SS 130 APO
C8 XLT SCT
Losmandy GM-8 w/Gemini
Losmandy G-11 w/Gemini
Discmount DM6
SBIG ST-2000XM/AO7
Marc Elvy
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Do you believe the non disclosure agreement will be lifted upon first delivery or do you think it extends well beyond that? The other unsual aspect of this is that typically trade magazines (and even reviewing forums such as this) get advance copies of a product so that their reviews can coincide with release. Has this happened? I believe that will probably be the public's next sign that shipping is imminent.
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jrcrilly
Refractor wienie again
Reged: 04/30/03
Posts: 22464
Loc: NE Ohio
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Quote:
The other unsual aspect of this is that typically trade magazines (and even reviewing forums such as this) get advance copies of a product so that their reviews can coincide with release.
Review venues, such as the magazines and course CN, tend to be granted some priority in delivery of new gear but most refuse to review preproduction models. Most reviewers also don't want to look at preselected gear handpicked and supplied by the manufacturer for review purposes - though I've noticed that S&T has apparently abandoned this policy. We want to see the gear that is actually being produced and offered to the public, which means we need to acquire the equipment through the normal distribution channels.
This means that the magazines, with their tremendous lead times, usually don't get the reviews out until long after the product begins shipping. Online sources such as CN can get the word out more quickly, but it still takes however long it takes to thoroughly evaluate the gear after it's received. For those of us who happen to live in areas like Ohio there can be additional delays while we wait for the weather to cooperate!
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John C
Urban Observatory
Tele Vue Pronto
A&M/Astreya 76mm F/6 APO
TMB/LOMO 80mm F/7.5 APO
Tak FSQ-106N F/5 APO
Meade 152ED F/9 "APO"
152mm F/10 achromat
Tak CN-212 8" F/12 classical Cass/ F/4 Newt
Teeter 20" F/3.8 truss Newt w/ServoCat
LXD750, EM-200, CI-700
ST-10XME
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JerryWise
Postmaster
Reged: 12/26/03
Posts: 6876
Loc: Lexington, SC
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"This means that the magazines, with their tremendous lead times, usually don't get the reviews out until long after the product begins shipping."
____________________________________________________
Interesting point. Also of interest is the latest issues of both magazines don't have any ads for the RCX.
I once had a great salesman head of the sales department. I would bring everybody in and we would brainstorm a new product. We would talk to customers about what this future fantastic product should be. Then, in meetings we would say this is what we are going to build. It will be ready in 8 months for beta but won't ship for a year. Would not be 30 days before this product was getting sold with delivery promised in 6 months. The reasons you would hear for pre-selling: beat the competition, they wouldn't buy anything else, losing business, on and on. Sales will outrun development to meet numbers and make money. The pre-production software had all the look and feel of the final product but many areas were untested (or not even started).
Meade seems to carry this a bit further than most. The LXD55 was clearly pre-sold, took forever and was "Sanford and Son" material in the early shipments (to those from other countries, "Sanford and Son" was a tv series about a junk yard). The LXD75 I have now seems fine.
In a very weak defense for them, until you have designed, created, tested, marketed and sold a complex product in the face of competitive restraints the reasons for doing it will not be clear. It's not fair to most but that's the way it is.
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Jerry
LX200ACF 14", Tak FS 152 & TOA 150
AP-1200 & Mach1
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Strgazr27
Scope Junkie
Reged: 10/04/04
Posts: 6018
Loc: StonyHill Observatory
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Quote:
Quote:
My question is this. If this is supposed to be an amazing platform for imaging, than where are the images being shot with it?
JMO.
I belive the NDA is still in effect... sorry.
Why should this carry over to images shot with the scope? I geuss a camera as revolutionary as the DSI was supposed to be carried no NDA ?? Even if it is an NDA issue, how does releasing a photo shot with the scope reveal any specifics about it? Unless the images aren't what they are saying they will be 
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Bobby
StonyHill Observatory
Atlas w EQMOD
Vixen R200SS
Orion ED-80
AT-111
AT66-ED
QHY-8
SSAG
YAHOO TMB 130SS Group
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Clearly there is something that is delaying the scope's appearance. No ads, no photos, etc. post such a big announcement is peculiar. Its hard for me to believe the "sell it then create it theory". I would think more likely what is going on is: create it, beta test and sell it, then based on the amont of issues that the beta test revealed, fix them before you actually ship. I'm actually pleased if that is what they are doing. I'd rather have them be very careful before relase then release a dog. We can't hae it both ways - a quick release and then complain if its not good. Now if I was CEO of Meade (and not my company) I would do it a little differently: R&D, Beta test, bring back for improvements, beta test again, the advertise, sell, ship. But maybe I'm not such a cut throat person.
-Steve (the soft CEO!)
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jrcrilly
Refractor wienie again
Reged: 04/30/03
Posts: 22464
Loc: NE Ohio
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Quote:
Clearly there is something that is delaying the scope's appearance. No ads, no photos, etc. post such a big announcement is peculiar.
Don't read too much into it. They haven't yet failed to meet even the most optimistic projections for a ship date. Remember that if ads had been placed several weeks before the big announcement they wouldn't have appeared yet. If they had been placed months before the big announcement and a problem had cropped up, a cancellation would not yet have taken effect and the ads would now be out, so we know they didn't suddenly pull their ads. We know that Meade took a great deal of flak regarding their 14" LX200GPS ad campaign in which artist's representations were used rather than actual photos - it's likely that they delayed placing their ads until they were very near production so they could have photos of the final production version.
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John C
Urban Observatory
Tele Vue Pronto
A&M/Astreya 76mm F/6 APO
TMB/LOMO 80mm F/7.5 APO
Tak FSQ-106N F/5 APO
Meade 152ED F/9 "APO"
152mm F/10 achromat
Tak CN-212 8" F/12 classical Cass/ F/4 Newt
Teeter 20" F/3.8 truss Newt w/ServoCat
LXD750, EM-200, CI-700
ST-10XME
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jrcrilly
Refractor wienie again
Reged: 04/30/03
Posts: 22464
Loc: NE Ohio
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Quote:
Why should this carry over to images shot with the scope?
Hi, Bobby.
I can reveal that I'm not a beta tester and I haven't signed an NDA or used an RCX. If I were a beta tester, I don't know how I could publish images without revealing that fact and thus violating the NDA. Meade probably has some images submitted to them by the testers, but unless they are CERTAIN that the beta test units will precisely represent the production units they'd be crazy to release those images and open themselves up to the kind of rabid accusations any deviations would surely draw.
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John C
Urban Observatory
Tele Vue Pronto
A&M/Astreya 76mm F/6 APO
TMB/LOMO 80mm F/7.5 APO
Tak FSQ-106N F/5 APO
Meade 152ED F/9 "APO"
152mm F/10 achromat
Tak CN-212 8" F/12 classical Cass/ F/4 Newt
Teeter 20" F/3.8 truss Newt w/ServoCat
LXD750, EM-200, CI-700
ST-10XME
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Strgazr27
Scope Junkie
Reged: 10/04/04
Posts: 6018
Loc: StonyHill Observatory
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Quote:
Hi, Bobby.
I can reveal that I'm not a beta tester and I haven't signed an NDA or used an RCX. If I were a beta tester, I don't know how I could publish images without revealing that fact and thus violating the NDA.
The images couldbe provided by Meade themselves. No names or locations etc. just the images so that optical quality could at least be seen. I would be much more willing to jump on the pre-order bandwagon with some proof of optical/mount excellence.
Quote:
Meade probably has some images submitted to them by the testers, but unless they are CERTAIN that the beta test units will precisely represent the production units they'd be crazy to release those images and open themselves up to the kind of rabid accusations any deviations would surely draw.
You mean they wouldn't pull another DSI on us. I still haven't seen anyone pull off images like they show the first night out. I would think that with ship dates of late Feb as they have stated, they should be well past final beta testing and into actual production. To me it's typical Meade advertising and operating procedure. Announce a product, get the juices flowing, ask for pre orders with no additonal info besides the website and nothing specific about the scope other than the specs they released on the website. To me it's just weird marketing strategy.
Are you SURE your not a Beta tester
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Bobby
StonyHill Observatory
Atlas w EQMOD
Vixen R200SS
Orion ED-80
AT-111
AT66-ED
QHY-8
SSAG
YAHOO TMB 130SS Group
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jrcrilly
Refractor wienie again
Reged: 04/30/03
Posts: 22464
Loc: NE Ohio
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Quote:
Are you SURE your not a Beta tester
As an early adopter of several recent new models by Meade and Celestron I've certainly done some of what the beta testers should have done (as have all the early adopters)! 
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John C
Urban Observatory
Tele Vue Pronto
A&M/Astreya 76mm F/6 APO
TMB/LOMO 80mm F/7.5 APO
Tak FSQ-106N F/5 APO
Meade 152ED F/9 "APO"
152mm F/10 achromat
Tak CN-212 8" F/12 classical Cass/ F/4 Newt
Teeter 20" F/3.8 truss Newt w/ServoCat
LXD750, EM-200, CI-700
ST-10XME
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Grizz
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 04/24/03
Posts: 2172
Loc: Waldwick,New Jersey USA
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Steve,
As John said don't read too much into the delay in introduction of the RCX. Meade has rarely if ever hit their release dates for anything. The LXD55s were late as were the LXD75s, DSIs and the LX200GPSs. I don't agree with Meade's marketing procedure but thats the way they do it and at least they are consistent! 
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Craig
LX200GPS 10" UHTC SMT
ETX90EC
Orion ED80 APO
Meade LPI Canon 10d Meade DSI
My Photo Gallery
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melvy
professor emeritus
Reged: 10/17/03
Posts: 710
Loc: Shoreline WA
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Why should this carry over to images shot with the scope? I geuss a camera as revolutionary as the DSI was supposed to be carried no NDA ?? Even if it is an NDA issue, how does releasing a photo shot with the scope reveal any specifics about it? Unless the images aren't what they are saying they will be
I can't say for telescopes, but I have signed a lot of NDA's for Microsoft and other software developers. Microsoft like Meade has a lot of competitors and detractors. If I am say- doing beta for a game, I may be testing the physics of the game and none of the artwork is in yet. If I send in a screen shot of the game in beta it would look terrible because the art department has not added the "pretty" yet. Even though it plays great this screen shot could destroy the product before it is even launched once the detractors get a hold of it and publicize their spin to the masses. So NDA's say release no information at all, there is just less risk that way.
That is my thinking anyway 
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WO Megrez 80 SAPO
WO 66 SD APO
TMB SS 130 APO
C8 XLT SCT
Losmandy GM-8 w/Gemini
Losmandy G-11 w/Gemini
Discmount DM6
SBIG ST-2000XM/AO7
Marc Elvy
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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I created this thread not only for the interesting comments so far, but also so the first person who can talk about their experience with the RCX might be inclined to post here.
It'll be interesting...standing by....
Didn't anyone see the scope up close at the last convention?
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bluesman
sage
Reged: 01/14/05
Posts: 211
Loc: N Yorkshire. UK
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Aren't the consumer driven public to blame here? Lets face it there are many who have placed a pre-order on this scope without seeing any neutral reviews beyond Meades own advo. The DSI is a good analogy, and that started to appear on seconhand sites almost immediately!
Ed
UK
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