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General Astronomy >> Beginners Forum

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Arpita
newbie


Reged: 11/18/13

Beginners Telescope
      #6202934 - 11/19/13 01:10 AM

Hello,
I am new to telescopes.
I want to gift a telescope to my husband who is an amateur celestial viewer.
I have shortlisted two telescopes.
Need your opinion for the same.
First one is from a local shop in INDIA, who has more than 20 years of experience in making telescopes.
The specs are as follows:
Diameter/Aperture: 76mm
Focal Length: 700mm
Optical Design Newtonian
Lens Material Glass
Diameter 76mm
Focal Length 700mm
Scondary Mirror Diameter 20mm
F/ratio F/9.2
Faintest Steller Magnitude 12
Resoving Power 1.5
Focuser diameter 1.25”
Eyepiece(s) 1.25” - 25mm and 9mm
Barlow Lens 3x Barlow
Mount Type Alt-Azimuth
Slow-motion Control Vertical Only
Accessory Tray Wall-to-wall
Tube Weight 1.76Kgs
Tube Dimension(dia. x length) 12.5cm x 68.5cm
Tripod Height 67-119cm
Shipping Weight 9 Kgs
233x Magnification
Aluminized and overcoated mirrors
Smooth rack-and-pinion 1.25" focuser
Perfect for all-around astronomical observing
18% more light gathering power than 70mm. Enough to allow simple study of star clusters and nebulas
http://www.galileotelescope.com/productsdetails.php?pro_id=89
Next one is
Celestron Powerseeker 70AZ.
http://www.celestron.com/astronomy/celestron-powerseeker-70az.html

Both have same price range in INDIA.
But weight for the first one is 9KG and for celeston is only 2.9Kg.

Can you guys please suggest which telescope I should buy.


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Maverick199
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Reged: 02/27/11

Loc: India
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Arpita]
      #6202984 - 11/19/13 02:56 AM

Hi Arpita and welcome to CN! That's a nice gesture indeed. In my opinion neither of those scopes would help much in bringing out details in Planets or nebulae. Perhaps if you state your budget then we could help you make a better choice?

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Arpita
newbie


Reged: 11/18/13

Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Maverick199]
      #6203019 - 11/19/13 04:57 AM

My budget is 100 USD.
I am also thinking for Celestron AstroMaster 70AZ Telescope.
Kindly suggest.
web page


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Maverick199
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Reged: 02/27/11

Loc: India
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Arpita]
      #6203207 - 11/19/13 08:48 AM

In India due to Customs, sales tax and cess duties, costs are double compared to U.S. At this stage, unless you can pay for say a 4.5" Dobsonian, I wouldn't for the sake of buying a scope get either package. These scopes may well be suited for children starting out but for an adult, it may end in dissapointment. Why not tell him what you intend to gift him but with an intention to hold off till such time you save some more? Maybe he could chip in as well. Just a thought.

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csrlice12
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Reged: 05/22/12

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Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Maverick199]
      #6203245 - 11/19/13 09:06 AM

Maybe combine your monies into one pot and get the scope together for you both to spend some quality time together under the stars.......

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Tony Flanders
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Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Maverick199]
      #6203282 - 11/19/13 09:22 AM

Quote:

Hi Arpita and welcome to CN! That's a nice gesture indeed. In my opinion neither of those scopes would help much in bringing out details in Planets or nebulae. Perhaps if you state your budget then we could help you make a better choice?




Actually, both a 76-mm reflector and a 70-mm refractor can be pretty good telescopes, capable of resolving a surprising amount of detail on the Moon and planets.

I haven't seen either scope, so it's hard to guess which would work better. Optically, they should both be very comparable, so it comes down mostly to mechanical quality.

I would say that while better scopes are clearly available, they're both probably pretty good deals considering what they cost.

My hunch is that the reflector will work better. I've had better luck with low-cost reflectors than low-cost refractors. And I like the choice of eyepieces supplied with it better.

Edited by Tony Flanders (11/19/13 09:26 AM)


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Maverick199
Postmaster
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Reged: 02/27/11

Loc: India
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Tony Flanders]
      #6203335 - 11/19/13 09:53 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Hi Arpita and welcome to CN! That's a nice gesture indeed. In my opinion neither of those scopes would help much in bringing out details in Planets or nebulae. Perhaps if you state your budget then we could help you make a better choice?




Actually, both a 76-mm reflector and a 70-mm refractor can be pretty good telescopes, capable of resolving a surprising amount of detail on the Moon and planets.

I haven't seen either scope, so it's hard to guess which would work better. Optically, they should both be very comparable, so it comes down mostly to mechanical quality.

I would say that while better scopes are clearly available, they're both probably pretty good deals considering what they cost.

My hunch is that the reflector will work better. I've had better luck with low-cost reflectors than low-cost refractors. And I like the choice of eyepieces supplied with it better.




I am not going to pit myself against you. FWIW, I have viewed through a 71mm Refractor and have seen more details on M 31 and the Lagoon than through my 4" Refractor, perhaps due to seeing conditions or ED objective I don't know. However, the ED glass combined with a stable mount ( CG-5 ) is pretty well over the OP's budget.


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Joe Aguiar
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 02/10/07

Loc: none of your buss
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Tony Flanders]
      #6203338 - 11/19/13 09:54 AM

i think the 70mm refractor (2nd one) is a bit better than the reflector(1st one)but both mount and tripods are not good, iam afraid he may find keeping the image steady is going to be hard. If you can find that 70mm refractor on a AZ3 or EQ2 mount that will be much better for him as an adult.

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Joe Aguiar
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 02/10/07

Loc: none of your buss
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Joe Aguiar]
      #6203355 - 11/19/13 10:00 AM

heres a few link that show better scope altho more than a $100 these can last a lot longer and make his viewing better much better.

http://www.khanscope.com/productdetails.cfm?productID=4384

http://www.khanscope.com/productdetails.cfm?productID=2146

http://www.khanscope.com/productdetails.cfm?productID=2212

http://www.khanscope.com/productdetails.cfm?productID=4389

Edited by Joe Aguiar (11/19/13 10:03 AM)


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LDW47
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 03/04/12

Loc: North Bay,Ontario,Canada
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Maverick199]
      #6203394 - 11/19/13 10:16 AM

Quote:

In India due to Customs, sales tax and cess duties, costs are double compared to U.S. At this stage, unless you can pay for say a 4.5" Dobsonian, I wouldn't for the sake of buying a scope get either package. These scopes may well be suited for children starting out but for an adult, it may end in dissapointment. Why not tell him what you intend to gift him but with an intention to hold off till such time you save some more? Maybe he could chip in as well. Just a thought.


I agree, I don't think he will stay satisfied very long ! At that point he will either be turned off or the spending urge will begin so why not keep your hard earned $ a little longer, do some more research, ask some more questions and then spend a little more for a much better package !? I think you will find, many times, is that there is a fine line between a poor scope and great scope for just a small difference in cost !? Take some good advice from some very knowledgable people on here and I think in the end you and your hubby will be happy ! Until the fever / urge starts that is !! LOL !!

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Tony Flanders
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Reged: 05/18/06

Loc: Cambridge, MA, USA
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Joe Aguiar]
      #6203472 - 11/19/13 10:52 AM

Quote:

i think the 70mm refractor (2nd one) is a bit better than the reflector(1st one)but both mount and tripods are not good, iam afraid he may find keeping the image steady is going to be hard.




I have evaluated a number of inexpensive 70-mm refractors and 76-mm reflectors. In general, I would say that the optics on the refractors are better, but the reflectors are much stabler and easier to use. I'm not sure exactly why that is. It's obviously partly because you view from the top of a reflector and the bottom of a refractor, so the tripod can be a lot shorter -- and therefore more stable -- on the reflector than on the refractor. In addition, I suspect it's because the reflectors are better balanced.

I reviewed the Orion 76-mm alt-az reflector, which looks outwardly identical to the Galileo reflector mentioned by the OP, except that it has a (good) red-dot finder instead of an (undoubtedly terrible) 5x24 finderscope.

I and my ex-colleague Josh Roth, another small-scope enthusiast, found the Orion 76-mm reflector a true joy to use. You can read our review here.

If the Galileo scope is even close in quality to the Orion scope, there's no fear of it deterring a serious enthusiast from pursuing the hobby. Many of the people who write regularly for this group started with significantly worse telescopes.

Also, remember -- this is India, not the U.S. People don't expect to have everything served up on a silver platter; they're used to making do with balky tools, cars, and suchlike. A far more fruitful attitude, if you ask me.


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Arpita
newbie


Reged: 11/18/13

Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Tony Flanders]
      #6203699 - 11/19/13 12:50 PM

Hello,

Thanks you all for the above comments.
I would also like to know your comments on
Orion SkyScanner 100mm TableTop Reflector Telescope.
I was able to find a site who can import this scope from US.
I have to pay Rs.14000/- which comes to about to 280$.
Is it worth spending this much money in this telescope?
Waiting for your comments


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Maverick199
Postmaster
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Reged: 02/27/11

Loc: India
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Arpita]
      #6203709 - 11/19/13 12:54 PM

Yes, the Orion Skyscanner 100mm is a good serious scope for the money. Re-confirm price before payment.

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Joe Aguiar
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 02/10/07

Loc: none of your buss
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Maverick199]
      #6203731 - 11/19/13 01:04 PM

yes i think that can fit very nicely too.too bad shipping is abit expensive but you will like a scope like this much better then the first ones you mentioned.

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Tony Flanders
Postmaster
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Reged: 05/18/06

Loc: Cambridge, MA, USA
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Arpita]
      #6203735 - 11/19/13 01:06 PM

Quote:

Thanks you all for the above comments.
I would also like to know your comments on
Orion SkyScanner 100mm TableTop Reflector Telescope.
I was able to find a site who can import this scope from US.
I have to pay Rs.14000/- which comes to about to 280$.
Is it worth spending this much money in this telescope?
Waiting for your comments




Yeow! I wouldn't spend that much if I could get a 76-mm reflector for $100.


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Joe Aguiar
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 02/10/07

Loc: none of your buss
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Tony Flanders]
      #6203847 - 11/19/13 02:08 PM

altho sounds like whatever she buys will have alot of duties and taxes so maybe get a scope that will last many yrs and pay the fess only once.

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rnc39560
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 07/23/13

Loc: MS coast
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Joe Aguiar]
      #6203994 - 11/19/13 03:22 PM

I use my 60x700mm refractor A LOT! Even though I have an xt8 and a 114x500mm reflector. I would say probably MORE than either. I watch birds, animals, people, and observe stars, clusters, planets, and moon. You can't knock something cause its small or budget. I found it for $5 (probably saved it from the garbage can) and after I completely took it apart and cleaned it up its the most used one here. Its the person USING it that says how much its enjoyed.

Edited by rnc39560 (11/19/13 03:24 PM)


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rnc39560
Pooh-Bah
*****

Reged: 07/23/13

Loc: MS coast
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: rnc39560]
      #6204009 - 11/19/13 03:32 PM

if they also can order a decent smaller one WITHOUT all the shipping fees and such, it maybe a good idea. What if a more expensive one gets there with ALL the $ in shipping and they need a part later?

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SpaceConqueror3
super member


Reged: 09/19/13

Loc: Phinney Ridge, Seattle, WA
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Tony Flanders]
      #6204084 - 11/19/13 04:07 PM

Quote:

Quote:


I reviewed the Orion 76-mm alt-az reflector, which looks outwardly identical to the Galileo reflector mentioned by the OP, except that it has a (good) red-dot finder instead of an (undoubtedly terrible) 5x24 finderscope.

I and my ex-colleague Josh Roth, another small-scope enthusiast, found the Orion 76-mm reflector a true joy to use. You can read our review here.

If the Galileo scope is even close in quality to the Orion scope, there's no fear of it deterring a serious enthusiast from pursuing the hobby. Many of the people who write regularly for this group started with significantly worse telescopes.

Also, remember -- this is India, not the U.S. People don't expect to have everything served up on a silver platter; they're used to making do with balky tools, cars, and suchlike. A far more fruitful attitude, if you ask me.




I think that is very sage advise. I personally made hay with a 76mm reflector for several years when I started the hobby and wouldn't hesitate recommending that particular Orion telescope to anyone either.


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Kevdog
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Reged: 07/11/12

Loc: Desert Hills, AZ
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Arpita]
      #6207922 - 11/21/13 04:44 PM

Quote:

Hello,

Thanks you all for the above comments.
I would also like to know your comments on
Orion SkyScanner 100mm TableTop Reflector Telescope.
I was able to find a site who can import this scope from US.
I have to pay Rs.14000/- which comes to about to 280$.
Is it worth spending this much money in this telescope?
Waiting for your comments




I have no idea about ebay in India, but it looks like there might be some good deals there?

Celestron 130EQ for Rs 13,965 ?
http://www.ebay.in/itm/Celestron-AstroMaster-130EQ-Telescope-/271321346145?pt...

Or a Celestron 114 for Rs 9900 + 950 shipping?
http://www.ebay.in/itm/Celestron-powerseeker-114-EQ-Reflector-Telescope-for-a...

Hopefully that helps some?


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BigC
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 09/29/10

Loc: SE Indiana
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Kevdog]
      #6208253 - 11/21/13 07:48 PM

A 76mm reflector is capable of showing quite a bit if that is all you can afford. Ebay USA often has used ones rather cheap,mine wa $15 plus shipping several years ago. No idea how much or if shipping from USA to India is reasonable.

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Pinbout
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Reged: 02/22/10

Loc: nj
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Arpita]
      #6208373 - 11/21/13 09:08 PM

Would this be too much

http://m.snapdeal.com/product/celestron-powerseeker-114eq-telescope/1178694Would this be too much?


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JustaBoy
Post Laureate


Reged: 06/19/12

Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: BigC]
      #6208404 - 11/21/13 09:24 PM

Celestron 130EQ for Rs 13,965 ?
http://www.ebay.in/itm/Celestron-AstroMaster-130EQ-Telescope-/271321346145?pt...

Now this is a Very Nice scope, and capable of so much more than the ones mentioned in the OP.

If you can handle the additional cost, this would be my choice. - Wish I had one a 10th that good when I started out 55+yrs ago.

Thank you,

-Chuck


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hwhall
sage
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Reged: 09/22/08

Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: JustaBoy]
      #6210548 - 11/23/13 12:17 AM

Should they give some consideration to the possible. or eventual, need to collimate a reflector vs a refractor? Collimation seems to get confusing with all the different tools for it. Refractors shouldn't need such tinkering.

I got a 70mm Celestron Powerseeker refractor a few years ago and I wish I had had that good of a scope when I started playing with astronomy in high school. I have that, a 60mm refractor, a 114mm newtonian & a 76mm catadioptric. The 60mm one gets the most use, being light & easy to set up.

From my own limited experience, I think I'd always offer a newcomer a refractor first. But your mileage may vary!

--Wayne


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SpooPoker
sage
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Reged: 06/04/13

Loc: North Bay CA
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: hwhall]
      #6210597 - 11/23/13 01:19 AM

The most important aspect in astronomy: Ones budget and ones interest.

I do not buy into this idea that a small aperture instrument is nigh on useless. Ideally one would go for a 6" scope but this not being possible, go for what you can afford - and if that is a 70mm refractor, then go for it.

I play around with small scopes most nights, mainly to train myself to see better.

I think even the humble 60mm f/12 - f/15 achromat will surprise anyone that bothers to look through one. I find the Moon and Jupiter revealing many details and the 60mm splits many double stars effortlessly. I would imagine a 70mm refractor or reflector would be in the same ballpark.

Your husband will certainly enjoy the 70mm scope, the Moon is a very obvious target. Jupiter will show at least two bands to a casual observer, more details to an experienced observer. Saturn's rings will be resolved, the Cassini division would be challenge but it is nonetheless feasible for a small instrument. Mercury and Venus will show up in various phases that can be resolved by a 70mm scope. Brighter Nebula and open clusters will be good targets for a 70mm scope. Double stars with angular separation > 2" can be split.

There is plenty to see with a 70mm scope. It will not match up to a C14 or a 16" DOB, but it certainly is not useless. What you get for $100 is hours of enjoyment, that makes the scope a worthwhile purchase for your husband. I hope he enjoys it!


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beanerds
sage


Reged: 07/15/08

Loc: Darwin Australia
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Joe Aguiar]
      #6210801 - 11/23/13 07:28 AM

Good selection Joe , even tho these are way above the budget here they are better options and will keep you happy for years .
My personal choice here would be the 90mm refractor on the AZ3 mount , great scope .
Brian.
Quote:

heres a few link that show better scope altho more than a $100 these can last a lot longer and make his viewing better much better.

http://www.khanscope.com/productdetails.cfm?productID=4384

http://www.khanscope.com/productdetails.cfm?productID=2146

http://www.khanscope.com/productdetails.cfm?productID=2212

http://www.khanscope.com/productdetails.cfm?productID=4389




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scopeboy42
sage
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Reged: 03/06/06

Loc: Garner, NC USA
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Arpita]
      #6210957 - 11/23/13 09:57 AM

Why not buy a telescope made in India.

See:

http://www.sharpvisionindia.com/prod.htm

Based on online currency converter $100 USD = Rs 6,270.

The Astro View model will be closest to your budget at Rs 6,000 (+500 p/f).

Hope this helps.

Edited by scopeboy42 (11/23/13 11:31 AM)


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JustaBoy
Post Laureate


Reged: 06/19/12

Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: scopeboy42]
      #6212259 - 11/23/13 10:02 PM

I think one of those Sharp Vision scopes might keep someone happy for the time it takes to set it up, then...Not so much.

A real waste of money to buy a small aperture reflector like that when for around the same money you can get a refractor.

Please understand that the Obstructed Newtonian design does not scale well to very small apertures - You should consider a 3.5" to 4" Newtonian to be the minimum. - How do I know?...I've owned a 2.5", but more importantly have built many of various sizes. - Just to illuminate the field stop of a very modest 20mm eyepiece, the central obstruction must be an appreciable percentage of the primary's diameter in these very small sizes. - Not good.

I still say this one:

http://www.ebay.in/itm/Celestron-AstroMaster-130EQ-Telescope-/271321346145?pt...

Good luck,

-Chuck


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SpooPoker
sage
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Reged: 06/04/13

Loc: North Bay CA
Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: JustaBoy]
      #6212422 - 11/24/13 12:26 AM

The obstruction of the diagonal is one of the most overemphasized aspects of reflector type telescopes and one that yields itself more to myth than reality. Increasing a diagonal (relative to the primary) does not necessarily translate to a poorer image that is obvious through the eyepiece. To talk of the obstruction creating a large enough amount of shadowing on the primary and interference that would severely affect the quality of the image, one would be looking at obstruction ratio's over 0.4. Few if any companies routinely design telescopes with such a large diagonal relative to the primary mirror. Most of the time, the obstruction ratio for most designs is between 0.15 and 0.3. Both are entirely acceptable, and it would take a keen eyed observer to notice much of a difference. John Isaacs, a long time and prominent visual astronomer here uses predominantly fairly low focal ratio telescopes (and thus with so called large secondaries/diagonals) for all kinds of observations and I have never heard him complain his 12" f/4.5 is throwing up a poor image!

The most important aspect of the secondary size is that it is not too small, i.e. effectively stopping down the telescope aperture. Using some very simple design rules, it is possible to avoid this completely. Too large a diagonal can affect the image contrast and slightly dim the object, a conservative approach aiming to fully illuminate a .5" diameter field nearly always results in a very good all round telescope. Most, if not all, major brands/makers hit the .5" - 1" mark and this nearly always results in an aesthetically pleasing image.

A 3" f/10 Newt can be designed to accommodate a .75" diagonal, yielding an obstruction ratio of 0.25, which is respectable and would compare very well with a 70mm f/10 achromat. The refractor in this case would not give a major improvement in image quality or contrast (a slight improvement noticeable in the eyepiece perhaps to a keen eyed observer, but certainly not major). There is no particular advantage of the newtonian over the achromat, although an achromat could potentially throw up some false color on bright targets.

I personally would go with the 70mm achromat for a beginner scope. It will come on an easy to use ALT AZ mount and will be good to go out of the box.


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Arpita
newbie


Reged: 11/18/13

Re: Beginners Telescope new [Re: Kevdog]
      #6228956 - 12/02/13 11:50 AM

Hey thank you all for your replies...Atlast I have purchased Celestron Astromaster 70EQ for my husband

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