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EdZModerator
Professor EdZ
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Celestron Regal LX 8x42 and 10x42 Roof Minireview
      #2111201 - 01/10/08 08:13 PM

New binoculars in the house (so what else is new). Astronomics, our site sponsor, bought out the remaining stock of Celestron Regals and is selling them all (currently) at $169.95. So I bought these to include in my comparison of small binoculars. Thought I'd pass along what I know so far.

This Minireview includes Celestron Regal roofs in 10x42 and 8x42 comparison to Nikon Monarch 10x42 roof, Pentax HR II 10x42 roof, Bushnell Legend 8x42 roof, Oberwerk 8x42 roof and Garrett Optical Apo 8x42 roof.

The Celeston Regal LX 8x42 and LX 10x42 roof are exactly the same size. They are identical in size to the Nikon Monarch 10x42 roof. Body shape doesn't look like the Regal "LS" I've seen in photos. From what I read, I believe the LX is considered the "next generation" beyond the LS. The Bushnell Legend 8x42 is just a bit bigger than the Regal. The Pentax HR II 10x42 is quite a bit longer. Oberwerk's roof is larger than all others except the largest of these, the Pentax. The Garrett Apo 8x42 roof, the most compact of all the roofs I've used, is quite a bit smaller.

The Regal LX box says made in Japan and Japan is printed on the focus dial. There are no stickers found on the binocular anywhere that say made in China. Nikon Monarch also has Japan printed on the focus dial, but underneath is a sticker that says made in China and it says made in China on the box. All these other roofs are made in China.

The Regal LX is light, 25 ounces, but the smaller Garrett 8x42 roof is lighter at 23 oz. and the Nikon Monarch, same size as the Regal, is the lightest at 22 oz. The Pentax HR II 10x42 weighs in at 29 oz. The Bshnell Legend also weighs 25 oz. The Oberwerk roof is 24 oz. The Regal at 25oz. is right in the middle and is really quite light.

Eye relief is pretty long, not yet measured, but last night I was able to see the entire fov in the 8x42 while wearing my glasses and with the eyeguard locked out one position, also the same with the 10x42. On the 8x42 when the eyeguard was fully retracted, even with my eyeglasses I got minor blackout. For my eyeglasses, best position for most comfortable view with the 8x42 was with eyeguard one click out, with the 10x42 most comfortable with my glasses was with the eyeguard all the way in.

Depth to the eyelens with the eyeguards down is 5mm, so expect that to shorten usable eye relief to less than listed. Keep in mind, we eyeglass wearers WANT some depth to the eyelens. With the curvature of my eyeglass lenses, at least 3mm is need to keep eyeglass lenses from hitting and scratching binocular eye lens, or just as bad, scratching my eyeglass lenses (it would cost me more to replace my eyeglass lenses than it would to replace this binocular). The Celestron Regal LX has 4mm. The Pentax HR II, the Nikon Monarch and the Oberwerk all have 5mm clearance when the eyecup is down. The Bushnell Legend has 4mm. Also, all of these have the rubber eyeguard raised just enough above the metal eyepiece edge rim to prevent the metal from touching my eyeglasses. The Garrett Apo has only 2mm of depth to the lens, requiring that the eyecup be twisted out somewhat so my eyeglasses don't hit the binocular eye lens. However, the eyecup just won't stay put at any intermediate positions. To keep it from moving during use, it must be either all the way in or all the way out. So, while the Garrett roof has the most eye relief, and the most usable eyerelief with the cups down, it is the least accomodating to the eyeglasses wearer. The Regal LX gets good marks for use of eye relief, accomodation and protection. All of these have long enough eye relief for use with eyeglaasses.

The Regal has a push/pull eyeguard with one positive click midway. It did not move from the midway or full out click positions. The eyeguard on the Nikon Monarch is twist out and can be set to any number of positions with no movement and is much smoother than the Regal. The Pentax and Garrett both twist and lock only when full out. The GO slips at any position in between. The Oberwerk eyeguard twists is smooth with no detents and stays put. The Bushnell twists to three positive detent settings. The Nikon Monarch, the Oberwerk and the Busnell Legend offer the most positive positioning and adjustment for the user.

The Regal right eyeguard is also the right diopter dial, so nothing is in the way to grasp it. The diopter has click stop, but the clicks are quite coarse. Not only was best focus for me between two clicks on the 8x42, but the dial on the 8x42 was quite tight and coarse. The 10x42 is much quieter and has a smoother fluid-like motion. I don't recall noticing the same 'can't find the right spot' problem with the 10x42. The right dipoter on some of these others is very tight, and some are thin rings or low profile, and being under the eyecup are very difficult to grasp. The Regal dipoter is easy to grasp and turn. Both the Pentax and the Garrett have a click stop diopter and both move much smoother and finer than the Regal. The Bushnell is smooth and with raised tactile rubber is the easiest to use overall.

I like the Regal LX eyelens cover. I don't like the objective push-in caps. The Nikon, Pentax, Oberwerk and Busnell all have captive objective caps, something I think should be expected in a binocular designed typical for terrestrial use. The Pentax eyelens cover is so loose it falls off.

I measured the aperture by scale view in exit pupil using a loupe and I could see a full 41-42mm , so there are no baffles in the way, and the prism opening appears large enough for the full 42mm aperture. All of these roofs here measured 41-42mm by several methods of measurement, except the Oberwerk which has a deep baffel that reduces aperture to 34mm. About 1/3rd of all the twenty other 8x and 10x porros that I measured have mis-sized baffels that result in significantly less (12% to 20% less) than full aperture.

IPD range of the Regal LX measures 58-74mm, same as the Pentax and the Bushnell. The Monarch covers the range from 55 to 74mm. The Garrett adjusts from 57-71mm.

These are waterproof/fogproof, O-ring sealed, nitrogen purged. But, if I'm not mistaken, so are the Pentax HR II, the Nikon Monarch, the Bushnell Legend and the Garrett Apo. The Oberwerk is listed as waterproof, but unlike all these others which have internal focusing the Oberwerk has an eyepiece bridge and external focusing.

Close focus is 7 ft in the 8x42 and 6 ft in the 10x42. But view between right and left barrel is mis-lapped by 1/3rd of the view at this range, in other words only the central 2/3rds of the view is binocular vision. In my opinion these are un-usable at this close distance. The Bushnell Legend measures the same for close focus and mislapped barrel. Actually the Nikon Monarch at 7ft and the Pentax HR II at 12 ft also show the same amount of mislapped image. The Garrett focuses to within 5ft, maybe slightly less, and at this range the mislap in the images is greater than 50% of the image. What you really get with these binoculars when it comes to close focus (assuming at 10ft) is a "binocular vision" field of view about 8 inches wide. In these same binoculars, when vieweing at 100 feet the barrel overlap is off by less than 5% of the fov and you get a 10 foot wide view with binocular vision while only 6-8 inches is not overlapped.

In the Regal, interior baffles and blackening are pretty good. There are two metal baffle rings and the inside wall is cut with ridges and blackened. There is some grey metal near the prism housing, but it is pretty dull grey. The Pentax has the finest, darkest, dullest black/grey interior baffles. The Nikon Monarh is similar to the Regal. The Garret Apo roof and the Bushnell Legend have the most bright grey metal in near the prisms. None of the above are really poor in this respect. The Oberwerk is essentially molded plastic with no effective baffles at all, although it does have one improperly sized that is drastically reducing the aperture.

Coatings look very nice on the Regal. But, the best coatings do their job not by looking nice but by reflecting the least amount of light and allowing the most light to pass. The Regal most definitely reflects the least amount of light of all these. The Nikon Monarch and Bushnell Legend appear equal and reflect reflect only slightly more. The Oberwerk objective coatings are similar to the Nikon and Bushnell, but it appears the Oberwerk prisms are uncoated. The Pentax HR II coatings reflect more light than all of those four. The Garrett Apo reflects the most light off the objective lens. The difference here from best to worst is that it was very difficult for me to see my reflection in the Regal or the Monarch and no detaail at all could be seen, but in the Pentax it was easy to see detail in my reflection. In the Garrett, I could easily see facial features in detail and the color of my shirt. In tests done so far, the Garrett records the lowest LM, seemingly in agreement with the highest reflectivity in the coatings. All of them are listed as FMC and phase coated. I doubt the Oberwerk is FMC.

The Regal pouch has a snap clip and has an over the shoulder strap, but the thin material seems cheap. The Bushnell Legend IMO has the nicest pouch, zips fully closed and has an over the shoulder strap. The Pentax, Nikon and Garrett pouches are cordura nylon with velcro closures. If you like to wear your pouch on a belt loop then the Nikon Monarch pouch looks like the best. The Monarch is sturdy, has no pouch strap to dangle, and the belt strap holds securely, doesn't sag. The Garrett pouch also has a belt loop, but you need to do something with the pouch shoulder strap and when you fold it up and stick it inside the pouch to get it out of the way, there is not enough room for the binocular.

The binocular bracket hole cover cap is easy to get off (more than I can say for some of the other roofs), and there is plenty of room to fit an L bracket between the barrels of the Regal (also more than I can say for some of the other roofs). Keep in mind, you don't get a lot of room for an L bracket between the barrels of a roof prism binocular. At my IPD of 62mm, there's 14mm between the barrels for an L bracket. All the others have less room. The bracket that came with my Oberwerk Ultra 15x70 is only 10mm wide and works perfectly. No other standard L bracket I own would work. I do have a velcro strap style adapter from Eagle Optics that works well with all of them.

I checked collimation in the 10x42 and found it was adjusted to within about 1 arcminute, off slightly at an angle, mostly vertical. This is well within acceptable standards and is about the same as I saw last night in my 10x42 Nikon SE. Images merged easily. Checked again, this time both side by side, and the 8x42 has slightly more error in collimation than the 10x42. Still not much error, but it could be 2 arcmin in the 8x42, that's approaching allowable error. I'll need to get a view of a measuring double to check total error.

A few objects late just for first views included Mars, M42 and M45. Capella was bright white. I caught a view of M37 and orangish Mars in the same fov.

I compared views early this moring on just a few objects. I had the 10x42 mounted and used the 8x42 handheld, sometimes braced. Saturn could be seen oblong. Arcturus was quite red. I compared views to the Nikon 10x42 SE. In all three I saw M66 and M51. It was just a bit easier in the 10x42s. I found M51 in the 8x42 Regal hand-held unbraced, looking almost overhead.

Tonight I mounted the 8x42 and checked FOV, it's 6.3°. Rechecked the 10x42 FOV and got a better measure, it is 6.0°. Of the three 10x42 roofs, the Nikon Monarch is widest at 6.2°, the Pentax HR II and the Celestron Regal LX are both 6.0°. Of the three 8x42 roofs, the Celestron Regal is 6.3°, the Bushnell Legend is 6.5° and the Garrett Apo is 6.7°. The Oberwerk 8x42 is only 5.8°.

So far, I like the Regal LX. We'll see how they measure up after a few weeks of use. I need to check magnification, test LM, resolution, field sharpness, look at the exit pupil and compare how they measure up for contrast. But I can say this, based on what I see so far, with the exception of the very inexpensive Oberwerk here, I think I'm comparing this binocular with a good price group. All these other roofs range between $200 to $300, and I see some features on some of these others that I find I like better or simply function better than the Regal.

I really don't see anything so far that leads me to believe these Regals are worth much more than these others For the Regal LX, $169 is a great bargain, but $440 may be overpriced. If most of these remaining measures come out on top of this group, my opinion on this could change. (EDIT - Having checked the coatings for a second time and finding they appear to be the best, and further down in this post you will see also this Regal appears the have the least outer fov aberrations, maybe this first opinion was a bit hasty.)

The Celestron Regal has a lifetime no-fault warranty. If it breaks or becomes unusable, no matter whose fault, Celestron will repair or replace the binocular for just a $25 shipping and handling charge.

edz

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Wes James
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2111234 - 01/10/08 08:23 PM

Edz-
Nice to read your report on them, considering I just got a pair of the Regals. Have been comparing them with a couple of other bino's, Fuji 7x42CD's and Swift Audubons currently. I agree with your finding of the diopter adjustment on the Regal, initially had some difficulty focusing it- but finally got it in. Not bad, but for me- the jury's still out. On eBay- at $169.95 closeout price- I couldn't pass them up.

--------------------
Wes
Atlantic Beach, FL

Some bino’s from Miyauchi 5x32 Binon's up through Garrett 20x110 Signature's,
Some telescopes from a Stellarvue 80mm NHNG up through a couple of 8” reflectors…
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Teal'c
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Wes James]
      #2111269 - 01/10/08 08:36 PM

The diopter adjustment seems to be loosening up a bit on my 8x42. They were very tight at first.

EdZ, Glad to hear that the 10x42 are usable with glasses...I just ordered a pair. At this price, it's an easy decision.

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SV95T 95/650(LOMO)
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AP140.... Waiting......Waiting....

Etch-O-Sketch and an eraser. Although....the eraser dosn't work







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EdZModerator
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Teal'c]
      #2112146 - 01/11/08 06:56 AM

Quote:

The diopter adjustment seems to be loosening up a bit on my 8x42. They were very tight at first.

EdZ, Glad to hear that the 10x42 are usable with glasses...I just ordered a pair. At this price, it's an easy decision.




I quickly measured the er of the 10x42 Regal LX at total 17mm. With the cups fully retracted, the usable eye relief is 13mm. That's just enough for me with my thin eyeglasses to see the entire fov, but that might not be enough for some people. The 8x42 eye relief is several mm longer.

edz

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ronharper
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2112622 - 01/11/08 11:31 AM

Ed,
Woah, hoss. You said "my 10x42 Nikon SE". That's glass. Merry Christmas.
Ron


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EdZModerator
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: ronharper]
      #2112660 - 01/11/08 11:45 AM

Quote:

Ed,
Woah, hoss. You said "my 10x42 Nikon SE". That's glass. Merry Christmas.
Ron




Wanted one for a long time. finally got one. Eye relief much more accomodating then the 12x50 SE (which is a bit too long). More about this one some other time, but oh yes, it certainly is nice to have in there for comparisons.

edz

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2112966 - 01/11/08 01:39 PM

That's a good report, Edz. I've considered the Regal LS predecessor to be closely related to my Vixen Apex Pro, but it looks like the Regal LS is noticeably different in several points. Interesting.

--------------------
Mark
Leica 8x20; Vixen 8x42; Swift 8.5x44, 10x50 and 20x80; TS 7x50; Orion 15x63; Docter 15x60
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EdZModerator
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Mark9473]
      #2113196 - 01/11/08 03:05 PM

I read elsewhere, I think it was Celestron's site, that this Regal has a 4 element objective. Here's what I could see. Using a green laser pointer, I could see the primary objective lens is either a very wide spaced doublet, or, and more likely and I'm pretty sure this is it, a cemented/airspaced triplet.

But now, the part that I see in most of these roofs. These are all internal focus. In most of them I can observe the internal sliding mechanisim sleeve in front of the prism. If a binocular is internal focus, and therefore, the eyepieces do not move, then focal length and resultant light cone needs to be modified slightly to hit the unmoving eyepiece to change from close focus to infinity.

The sliding mechanism in front of the prism in the Regal can be seen to have a single element lens. That appears to be the fourth element in the Regal.

I did not see any sliding mechanism in the Bushnell. This may mean it comes after the prism assembly.

I'm going to check all of these binoculars for objectives/internal elements. I wonder what the make-up of these various roofs is?

edz

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EdZModerator
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2115252 - 01/12/08 01:05 PM

I tested these binoculars today for magnification and resolution. I realized some time ago (back in Nov) in order to post real values for resolution in apparent res, I first needed to have tested all the binoculars for magnification. Quite a few vary from specified, not by any amount that is significant for viewing, but definitely by a significant amount when you list resolution for 30 different binoculars in a table of data and try to compare which is best. (That was when I also realized if I wanted to put any meaningful value on boosted resolution, I also had to test my booster to find out actually what magnifiaction it was operating at. That came as a surprise when I found out my booster wasn't what I thought it was. I wonder if some of the other data tables published on the internet have gone to that extent? All data published in my most recent tables has been adjusted to these findings). Along with the Regals I tested the Nikon SE 10x42. All other sizes I needed to compare to have already been tested and published.

At normal power, the 8x42 Regal could see 10.3 arcsec. Both the 10x42 Regal and the 10x42 Nikon SE could see 8.1 arcsec. All three of these work out to an apparent resoltion (res reading times magnification) of 83 arcseconds apparent. This puts all three of these binoculars in the top results for normal resolution tested on USAF line pair charts equaling the best resolution in their 8x or 10x power group.

At boosted magnification of 62x for the 10x42 and 50x for the 8x42, resolution in the 8x42 was 4.1 arcsec and 3.6 arcsec in both 10x42s. This also puts these binoculars near the top of boosted resolution. I've got half a dozen binoculars that did better boosted, but 4 arcsec and 3.6 arcsec is pretty darned good. None of the other roofs came even close to that, with the next best roof at 5.4 arcsec and ranging all the way to a poor 6.5 arcsec.

Boosted resolution in 8x binoculars (all boosted to 50x) ranged from 6.8 down to the best reading of 3.8, 339 to 187 arcsec apparent. The Regal 8x42 was 4.1 (204 apparent), with only 1 out of 13 binoculars better.

Boosted resolution in 10x binoculars (all boosted to 62x) ranged from 6.1 down to the best reading of 3.0, 385 to 185 arcseconds apparent. The Regal 10x42 was 3.6 (227 apparent) with only 3 out of 13 better.

Interesting difference was when I attempted handheld resolution. I could not hold the Regals steady enough to get a better reading than the SE. The Regals ended up in the middle of the pack for handheld resolution, but the Nikon 10x42 SE was able to see approx 20% finer resolution than either Regal. The Nikon SE came out very near the top rank. In fact, the Bushnell Legend is the only roof among the top group for handheld resolution, all the rest are small porros.

Well the end result here is the Regals have fine normal power resolution, ranked with some of the best. Both the 8x42 and 10x42 had the same apparent resolution. Actually I tested this twice just to see if I got any different, but I got the same thing. Although a 10x binocular can see closer res, 8.1 arcsec versus an 8x42 which can see only 10.3 arcsec, that is to be expected since the increase in magnification allows you to see smaller objects. As I said above, this results in both having the same apparent resolution of 83 arcsec apparent. The Nikon Monarch and the Pentax HR II have apparent res of 97 and 94, quite a bit worse than the Regal (smaller apparent values is better resolution). The Bushnell Legend is 84 arcsec and the Garret is 87 arcsec.

edz

Some note about these resolution values:
There has been some comment in the past that normal magnified (unboosted) resolution in binoculars may be controlled by the maximum visual acuity of the eyes. As evidence that may not be the controlling factor, these Regals are part of a list of over 30 binoculars that have unboosted resolution ranging from 97 to 76 arcseconds apparent. Thats a range of approx 25%, showing there can be wide variation in resolution detected at normal power. Perhaps the lowest reading achieved is controlled by visual acuity, but that then may give good indication that all the other readings behind it fall into rank from best to worst.

Resolution on stars will never be achieved to the same values as these line pair charts. While line pairs in daylight produce resolution ranging from 97 to 76 arcseconds, the best double star reolution I have ever seen even with the finest binoculars has never been smaller than 140 arcseconds and is most often between 150-160 arcseconds.

Note that boosted resolution values are small arcseconds but very high in apparent resolution. This follows from the fact that magnification neded to achieve resolution near the diffraction limit gets very high. As an example, while I can see 15-16 arcscond double stars split with a 10x binocular for an apparent res of 150-160 arcseconds, it takes 300x to 400x with my small telescopes to see double stars as close as 1 arcsecond. As you can see this is a range of 150-160 arcseconds apparent to 300-400 arcseconds apparent as we approach the diffration limit. A few binoculars actually approach the diffraction limit of the objective aperture, for instance the Nikon SE 12x50. The 10x42 Regal is very close to that limit.



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wprince
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2115342 - 01/12/08 01:42 PM

edz,
Thanks for your thoughtful and detailed review and information of the Celestron Regal LX's. I decided to order a pair of 8x42's -- feeling confident now that I'm getting a good bargain.

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: wprince]
      #2115365 - 01/12/08 01:52 PM

The Regals are looking like more of a bargain all the time! Thanks for the report, Ed!

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: ngc6475]
      #2115412 - 01/12/08 02:09 PM

What about "phase coating"? Are these low price roof prism faces just metallized? Or, are they using multi-layer dielectric coatings, to keep overall transmission high? I think that there are some simple tests using polarizing sunglasses, or crossed pairs of them, but have not done any of this testing in this context. Does anybody have a working, calibrated photometer to lend to some tireless reviewer(s)? What is the phase problem/problem solution story on the erecting systems such as in the Baywatch telescopes and the various 45 deg Schmidt prism erectors for other telescopes?

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EdZModerator
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Gordon Rayner]
      #2115769 - 01/12/08 04:59 PM

I have a photometer. Just haven't used it to report any data yet. Patience.

edz

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2117518 - 01/13/08 01:43 PM

I'm glad you took the time to study the Regals EdZ,thankyou.This makes for some very interesting reading and (big AND) you've helped me feel a tad more confident about a few statements I have made,not that I wasn't confident to begin with .
I look forward to reading the rest of your review.

--------------------
Starblast6
Stratus 24mm,Speers Waler 4.9mm 7.2mm and 9.4mm
Noble 10x28,Regal LX 8x42,Skymaster 15x70


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EdZModerator
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Albie]
      #2121525 - 01/15/08 06:41 AM


Quote:

The Regal right eyeguard is also the right diopter dial, so nothing is in the way to grasp it. The diopter has click stop, but the clicks are quite coarse. Not only was best focus for me between two clicks on the 8x42, but the dial on the 8x42 was quite tight and coarse.





Well, the right dipoter on my 8x42 Regal is defective. It is now broken. The sliding eyecup also acts as the twisting dipoter. Twisting it no longer moves the right eyepiece. Somehow, in the mechanism, the eyepiece has become disconneted from the eyecup, so that twisting the eyecup to adjusst the dipoter setting no longer produces any affect. I can no longer focus the right eyepiece. Bummer. These need to go back. The 10x42 does not have any indication od the same problem.

edz

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2121533 - 01/15/08 06:54 AM

Not good! I hope this isn't a common issue?

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Teal'c]
      #2132523 - 01/19/08 11:44 PM

Hello all! Just received my 8x42 Regals and I wanted to give my subjective impressions -- so far I'm very impressed. I intend the Regal's to be used as "general purpose" binoculars. I wouldn't have paid $440 for these or even $350, but a good deal at $169.95. The only other binoculars I have to compare these to are my old (and presumably inexpensive) 7x35 Tasco porros received as a gift from my brother 33 years ago. The old Tasco's are suprisingly sharp but not collimated very well - so a pain for my eyes when looking at stars. The modern superior coatings and bafflings of the Celestron Regal's give them a definite advantage in contrast (much less glare) and a slight edge in sharpness compared to my Tasco's - although I'm comparing 8x to 7x. The Regal's also feel quite balanced and lightweight in my hands although I know that Ed pointed out that there are lighter roofs available. My Regal's also seem to be collimated very well, but haven't tried them on the night sky yet. The diopter as noted by others is stiff to adjust, but seems to do its' job so far. Eyeglass wearers will love the long eye relief. I don't wear glasses and I have to extend the eyecups all the way out when using the Regal's.

Question, one trait the Celestron's showed that my Tasco's don't was some very slight color fringing or lateral color on very bright objects off center - slight green fringe on edges toward the outer FOV and cyan fringe toward the center. I want to point out that the affect is minor and only an very bright objects. These are my first roof prism binos - so is this a trait caused by the roof prisms?

I think I still intend to purchase some "astronomy only" binoculars and I'm thinking either 7x50 or 10x50 porros - not sure what brand/price range yet.

--------------------
Wade




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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: wprince]
      #2133001 - 01/20/08 09:55 AM

I've had mine for a little while and find them to be excellent for the $211CA that I paid for them.I would pay as much as $300-$350 for them and consider them well worth it.
My biggest problem like most is with the ultra-stiff diopter adjust.I also find adjusting the IPD to be very stiff but have decided that's a good thing.Focusing is also very stiff,this is a very stiff binocular in every respect.
Yes the carrying bag is a poor excuse of a bag.Come on Celestron would it hurt to give us a better bag?
Edz I hope you have another 8x42 coming to replace the defective one so that you can continue your minireview.

--------------------
Starblast6
Stratus 24mm,Speers Waler 4.9mm 7.2mm and 9.4mm
Noble 10x28,Regal LX 8x42,Skymaster 15x70


Edited by Albie (01/20/08 09:57 AM)


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Teal'c
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Albie]
      #2133497 - 01/20/08 01:59 PM

Fortunately, the IPD & focuser on my 8x42 works as smooth as the 10x42. The diopter adjustment is much stiffer than the 10x.

--------------------
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Teal'c]
      #2133606 - 01/20/08 03:02 PM

The IPD and focuser is very stiff in mine at room temperature, but not objectionable. It takes only 1.5 turns of the focuser to go from near to far focus. The box was left outside my door by UPS in 20 degree weather which made the IPD and focuser very difficut to use - until they warmed up to room temperature.

--------------------
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: wprince]
      #2138333 - 01/22/08 03:24 PM

Quote:

It takes only 1.5 turns of the focuser to go from near to far focus.




Interesting comment. In fact on another website for the very exact same comment the reviewer branded these a fast focus binocular, most desired by birders.

The reality may be considered by many birders as quite different. As I've done with all the binoculars in the Small Binocular studies, I measured the dial degrees turn needed to go from 3Meters to 30Meters (10feet to 100feet) and then measured the degrees turn to go from 30M to 100M (100 feet to 300 feet).

The Regal takes only 30° of focus dial turn to focus from 30M to 100M. Typical fast focus binoculars have a total dial turn 20° to 60° for the 30M-100M range. half of all the binocular measured fall into this fast focus range. So for 30M-100M the Regal could be considered fast focus.

BUT, and here's the catch, the Regal takes 300° of dial turn to go from 3m to 30m. Based on the 30+ binoculars in my test group, this is very SLOW focus for this 3M-30M range. The fast focus binoculars in my test group cover this same distance range with anywhere from 100° to 180° of dial turn. Only ONE out of 20 binoculars I've measured was slower focus than that in this range. In the 3M to 30M range, the Regals are among the slowest focusing binoculars available, potentially not conducive to near birding in that range.

edz

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Edited by EdZ (01/22/08 03:31 PM)


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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2138584 - 01/22/08 05:20 PM

Ed,
I have to recheck the focusing again on my sample. I probably was too careless regarding the accuracy of my comment. At the time I was focusing on something perhaps 8 feet away and then changed the focus to something near infinity. I really don't mind the "stiffness" of the focusing of my Regal LX - pretty pleased with them.

--------------------
Wade




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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: wprince]
      #2138885 - 01/22/08 07:39 PM

Quote:

I really don't mind the "stiffness" of the focusing of my Regal LX - pretty pleased with them.



I'm quite pleased as well.The more I use them the more I like them.I am so tempted to get the 10x42's but I am having a hard time justifying having both.Why would a person need both a 10x42 and a 8x42 or do they?
I may have been a bit harsh with my comment about the stiffness of these bins.I was comparing them to my Noble's focusing abilities which are for lack of a better description,feathery.The truth is the Regals focus easily and smoothly.The IPD adjustment is very stiff and should be IMO.Pulling out the eyecups is a bit of a tug, I personally like the twistout style better.
The diopter setting well there's no denying it's stiffness.

--------------------
Starblast6
Stratus 24mm,Speers Waler 4.9mm 7.2mm and 9.4mm
Noble 10x28,Regal LX 8x42,Skymaster 15x70


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Teal'c
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Albie]
      #2138993 - 01/22/08 08:16 PM

"Why would a person need both a 10x42 and a 8x42 or do they?"

I didn't really need the 10x42, but at the price that Astronomics is selling them for, it felt like a justifiable purchase.

--------------------
------------------

SV95T 95/650(LOMO)
SV80S 80/480(LOMO)
Matthias Wirth 80/600(LOMO)
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AP140.... Waiting......Waiting....

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2140209 - 01/23/08 12:59 PM

Quote:

Quote:

It takes only 1.5 turns of the focuser to go from near to far focus.




Interesting comment. In fact on another website for the very exact same comment the reviewer branded these a fast focus binocular, most desired by birders.

The reality may be considered by many birders as quite different. As I've done with all the binoculars in the Small Binocular studies, I measured the dial degrees turn needed to go from 3Meters to 30Meters (10feet to 100feet) and then measured the degrees turn to go from 30M to 100M (100 feet to 300 feet).

The Regal takes only 30° of focus dial turn to focus from 30M to 100M. Typical fast focus binoculars have a total dial turn 20° to 60° for the 30M-100M range. half of all the binocular measured fall into this fast focus range. So for 30M-100M the Regal could be considered fast focus.

BUT, and here's the catch, the Regal takes 300° of dial turn to go from 3m to 30m. Based on the 30+ binoculars in my test group, this is very SLOW focus for this 3M-30M range. The fast focus binoculars in my test group cover this same distance range with anywhere from 100° to 180° of dial turn. Only ONE out of 20 binoculars I've measured was slower focus than that in this range. In the 3M to 30M range, the Regals are among the slowest focusing binoculars available, potentially not conducive to near birding in that range.

edz




I tried the focusing again today - takes about 1 1/16 turns on mine to focus between 7 feet and infinity. Ed is very accurate about the speed of the focus in the intermediate distance ranges.

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Albie]
      #2144794 - 01/25/08 12:26 PM

Quote:

Edz I hope you have another 8x42 coming to replace the defective one so that you can continue your minireview.





I do. Astronomics was very prompt with a reply to my problem.

edz

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2148342 - 01/26/08 11:46 PM

From all the good reviews I have seen on the Regals, I decided to order a pair of the 10x42's. I ordered from astronomics, and before I filled out the online order form, the product was listed as "In stock." Afterwards, I checked the listing again and it is now shown as "Low Inventory." Just a heads up, in case you may be thinking about these but waiting. They claim to have bought out all of Celestron's stock. I am curious: Are these binos are still in production? Will prices remain at this level?

--Tad

--------------------
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Tad S.]
      #2148506 - 01/27/08 01:24 AM

The Regals are or have been discontinued.It also looks like the Ultimas are being discontinued as well.The Skymaster series of Celestron binoculars has a few new members as well and two of them(8x56,9x63) look suspiciously like Ultimas and are priced like them as well .

--------------------
Starblast6
Stratus 24mm,Speers Waler 4.9mm 7.2mm and 9.4mm
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Tad S.]
      #2148773 - 01/27/08 08:56 AM

I think that you'll like them. I bought the 8x and 10x due to the price. The 10x is a little tight on ER if you wear glasses, but still manageable.

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Teal'c]
      #2148849 - 01/27/08 09:59 AM

Well, I do wear glasses. Eye relief was my biggest hesitation. I thought about getting the 8x42's but I felt that the 10x would complement my current stable of binos better. I figured they would likely have better reach than my Pentax 8x40 porros, and they would be lighter weight and have slightly bigger exit pupils than my Nikon 12x50 AE. Although, the 8x42's would be nice just to do a shootout with the Pentax. However, if I spent $340 on two new pairs of binocs, there would be a different kind of shoot out in my house, and I would not live to do the comparison. For the 10x regals, the indicaions I have seen agree with yours, that ER is manageable. I am looking forward to them. Thanks,
--Tad

--------------------
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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Tad S.]
      #2150311 - 01/27/08 11:00 PM

Good thing you picked up the 10x42's as it appears that no more are available for the blowout price. I tried my 8x42's for the first time tonight on the stars and I'm very pleased. To my eyes, they show a lot of contrast and pinpoint sharpness up to about 80% of the FOV - and beyond that they were still very good. I'll be awaiting what Ed reports after further testing of his Regal LX's.

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: wprince]
      #2150643 - 01/28/08 06:23 AM

I was testing depth of field this weekend. the Regal 10x42 has a very narrow depth of field.

When focused at 50m, 40m appears fair and 30m is poor.

When focused at 30m, 25 to 40m is good, beyond that either nearer or farther is poor.

When focused at 15m, 12m is fair and 25m is poor.

The Nikon SE 10x42 has an even narrower dof than the Regal, so the Regal isn't poor in this respect, it's just what it is.

The Bushnell Legend 8x42 and Nikon AE 8x40 have a bit more dof.

The Nikon AE 10x50 has about equal dof, but in this case significantly more curvature in the AE 10x50 may allow objects closer than focus to all appear in focus if they are positioned towards the middle or outer edges of the fov. For instance, when the AE 10x50 is focused at 30m, 25m appears clearly focused at 30% out from center and 15m is in clear focus at 80% out.

It seems that binoculars with more field curvature may have greater depth of field in front of the focus point. It would seem therefore that a field flattener lens, which would be desirable for an astro viewer to get as flat a field as possible, might work against a terrestrial viewer looking for the greatest depth of field. As an example, the Fujinon BFL 8x42 which has almost no field curvature (approx 15-20 arcsec curvature at 60% out), when focused at 50m, 40m appears sharper at 30% out, 30m appears shaper at 50% out, but 25m cannot be seen at all. On the other hand, the Nikon AE 8x40 which has a great deal of curvature (approx 2 arcmin of curvature at 60% out), when focused at 50m, 40m appears sharpest at 30% out 30m appears shapest at 50% out, 25m is clear at about 60% out and 15m is clearly sharp at 70% out. The Nikon AE 8x40 appears to have a much greater depth of field, and this may be because it's greater curvature allows more close objects to come into focus as you use more of the off-axis fov.

edz

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2190832 - 02/14/08 09:33 AM

The 8x42 Diopter twist adjustment

As previously stated
Quote:

The Regal right eyeguard is also the right diopter dial, so nothing is in the way to grasp it. The diopter has click stop, but the clicks are quite coarse. Not only was best focus for me between two clicks on the 8x42, but the dial on the 8x42 was quite tight and coarse. The 10x42 is much quieter and has a smoother fluid-like motion. I don't recall noticing the same 'can't find the right spot' problem with the 10x42.

The right dipoter on some other roofs is very tight, and some are thin rings or low profile, and being under the eyecup are very difficult to grasp. The Regal dipoter is easy to grasp and turn. Both the Pentax and the Garrett have a click stop diopter and both move much smoother and finer than the Regal. The Bushnell is smooth and with raised tactile rubber is the easiest to use overall.

Well, the right dipoter on my 8x42 Regal is defective. It is now broken. The sliding eyecup also acts as the twisting dipoter. Twisting it no longer moves the right eyepiece. Somehow, in the mechanism, the eyepiece has become disconneted from the eyecup, so that twisting the eyecup to adjust the dipoter setting no longer produces any affect. I can no longer focus the right eyepiece. Bummer. These need to go back. The 10x42 does not have any indication of the same problem.

edz





OK, so I got a new replacement 8x42 shipped from Astronomics. This new 8x42 Regal has a very stiff metal-like ratchety feel to the right diopter. I'll emphasize once again, it feels nothing like the smooth quiet movement of the 10x42 Regal. In fact, I would say it is more coarse than any other click stop diopter binocular I own. And once again, it is difficult for me to find the right focus spot. Best focus for me seems to be right between two clicks.


Field Sharpness and AFOV

On another note, this 8x42 Regal seems to be sharper towards the edges than the 10x42 Regal. I'm going to pull both of them out and compare side-by-side just to confirm that. But it would seem the most plausible reason for that high level of outer field sharpness in the 8x42 is the fact that the 8x42 Regal has one of the "narrowest" Afov eyepieces of any 8x binocular I've used. But, in fact all the 8x roofs I've used have a narrow Afov. Many of the 8x porros have a 60-64° Afov eyepiece. Of the four 8x roofs, none are wider than 54°. The 8x42 Regal has a 51° Afov, similar to Pentax binoculars.

The 10x42 Regal, on the other hand, is much different in that it uses eyepieces with a 61° Afov, similar to the other 10x42 roofs and most of the 10x porros.

edz

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2192402 - 02/14/08 09:09 PM

Quote: "...it would seem the most plausible reason for that high level of outer field sharpness in the 8x42 is the fact that the 8x42 Regal has one of the "narrowest" Afov eyepieces of any 8x binocular I've used."

After taking it on a couple of short hikes, I too have noticed that the edge performance of the 8x42 Regal is very good, although I'd just assumed it was a function of its relatively narrow fov. On axis, the views are sharp, and it shows good color rendition and contrast, too. I've also found that I see pretty strong pincushioning, as well.

I'm no fan of the clickstop diopter adjustment, either, but it hasn't kept me from finding acceptable focus. I do wish it were a smooth-moving "infinitely" adjustable type, however.

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: ngc6475]
      #2193209 - 02/15/08 08:27 AM

Hi Walter,

I agree with fairly strong pinchusion.

I would say, this Regal 8x42 ranks with the Fujinon 10x50 and Nikon SEs for field sharpness. So while the Afov of 51° on the 8x42 is quite narrow, this binocular has one of the widest usable fields of view of any in its class, probably usable out to 90%, at least 10% wider than the 10x42 Regal. That's unusual, it's often the other way around.

I had a somewhat difficult time measuring field curvature since there seems to be so little of it present.

edz

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2193789 - 02/15/08 01:19 PM

Ed,
How do the exit pupils look on your Regal 8x42's? I noticed the ones on mine aren't perfectly circular, but look a bit like cat's pupils as if the prisms might be slightly tilted? This has not stopped me so far from enjoying them.

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: wprince]
      #2193885 - 02/15/08 02:22 PM

no problems observed with the pupils

edz

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2264121 - 03/17/08 06:57 PM

Hi Edz

I would like to know please how work these 10x42's regarding color fringing / spurious color under the daytime and how they work at the night regarding the edge of field performance.

thanks Pedro


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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: pedro]
      #2264177 - 03/17/08 07:17 PM

If there is something i haven't covered in the minireview here that you need to know, please wait a few days. I have submitted a full length article the CN Reports. I patiently wait for it to be published.

Edge performance in the 10x42 is not as good as in the 8x42. However it is still very good with 90% of the fov usable. I don't recall seeing any color in this binocular.

edz

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: Teal'c]
      #2287351 - 03/28/08 12:46 AM

Those celestron Regal LX 8x42 binos seems great, how they compare vs Bushnell Discoverer 8x42...?

thanks!


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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: cachora]
      #2287499 - 03/28/08 05:47 AM

I've never used a Bushnell Discoverer

edz

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Re: Celestron Regal 8x42 and 10x42 Roof new [Re: EdZ]
      #2289076 - 03/28/08 07:26 PM

Thanks for you reply.

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Re: Celestron Regal LX 8x42 and 10x42 Roof Minireview new [Re: EdZ]
      #2752402 - 11/14/08 09:06 PM

Are these Regals still available at astronomics close out price?

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Re: Celestron Regal LX 8x42 and 10x42 Roof Minirev new [Re: orbitaljump]
      #2752493 - 11/14/08 10:28 PM

NO!

But you can get one here:
http://www.adorama.com/CN1042RLX.html

ERik D


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orbitaljump
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Reged: 01/29/06
Posts: 426
Loc: Charleston, SC
Re: Celestron Regal LX 8x42 and 10x42 Roof Minirev new [Re: Erik D]
      #2752538 - 11/14/08 10:59 PM

Thanks, Im not really a roof prism type.

I might check out some Bushnell Excursion 8x28 and some Nikon Sporter 8x36.

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Erik D
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Reged: 04/28/03
Posts: 3196
Loc: Central New Jersey, USA
Re: Celestron Regal LX 8x42 and 10x42 Roof Minirev new [Re: orbitaljump]
      #2753196 - 11/15/08 01:06 PM

Quote:

Thanks, Im not really a roof prism type.

I might check out some Bushnell Excursion 8x28 and some Nikon Sporter 8x36.




???


Here is a review of the Bushnell 8X28:

Bushnell Cxcursion

Here is one for the Nikon:
http://www.birdforum.net/archive/index.php/t-37804.html

The reviews are favorable but they are both roofs...

ERik D


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orbitaljump
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Reged: 01/29/06
Posts: 426
Loc: Charleston, SC
Re: Celestron Regal LX 8x42 and 10x42 Roof Minirev new [Re: Erik D]
      #2753386 - 11/15/08 03:04 PM

Jenoptems are next on my list to acquire 8x30w and 10x30w, with MCs. Maybe some Nikon E and E2, Mirkons. Celestron Nova's. More Swift's.

There seems to be an explosion is decent roof prisms....Chinese and Eastern European glass is really expanding the market. Its almost overwhelming.

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