jog
member
Reged: 10/26/06
Posts: 90
Loc: nj
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Hi all, I was just getting ready to buy the Celestron skymaster 25-125x80 Zoom Binocular at Walmart for $139, when I decided to look through this forum to see if anyone had a review on this bino, but what I'm finding out is zoom bions are bad. Can someone please explain why. To me zoom seems like a great idea.
Thanks.
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Mark9473
Post Laureate
Reged: 07/21/05
Posts: 3208
Loc: 51°N 4°E
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Great idea indeed, but generally very poor optical quality.
Regular fixed-power binoculars are already an optical compromise: two very fast achromatic 'telescopes', two sets of prisms, two eyepieces, and all this often for a really low price (like your example shows). Think about what you'd spend on a single telescope objective or diagonal or eyepiece.
With zoom binoculars, the additional optical compromises to make it a zoom really take a heavy toll on the performance.
Let's be realistic, $139 is less than you'd espect to spend on a single good zoom eyepiece for a telescope.
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Mark
Leica 8x20; Vixen 8x42; Swift 8.5x44, 10x50 and 20x80; TS 7x50; Orion 15x63; Docter 15x60
WO Megrez II 80 FD + Baader 90° T2 Amici
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DJB
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 02/23/05
Posts: 1589
Loc: Lisle NY
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Just my advice,
Stay away from zoom binoculars by all means. There were only two or so "good" one manufactured a number of years ago!
Best regards,
Dave.
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charen
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 05/28/05
Posts: 1082
Loc: New Zealand
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Yes generally speaking avoid zooms. They have multiple disadvantages including:
• a narrow field of view.
• more moving internal parts that go wrong
• major problems in getting them and keeping them collimated.
• [usually] poor optical and build qualities.
• a dimmer image compared to fixed binos of the same size
• if they go wrong they are not worth fixing and
• the 25x-125x magnification on those Celestrons is totally misleading - you cannot even get close to a 125x magnification with binoculars like these.
Avoid them at all costs.
Buy a 'fixed' bino from a known manufacture like Nikon, Pentax, Oberwerk etc. or if you do want ‘higher powers’ a quality spotting scope on a tripod would be better choice.
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35 binos.
80mm Cat.
WO66ED
SV NH 80mm / EQ3
Meade 8in.LX90
Skywatcher Equinox ED120 / Goto HEQ5.
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edwincjones
Postmaster
Reged: 04/10/04
Posts: 5658
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Check one of our supporters "big binoculars. com" web site where Kevin is having a close out sell on zoom binoculars with a disclaimer on why zooms are not good.
edj
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n w arkansas
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Wes James
Post Laureate
Reged: 04/12/06
Posts: 3453
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In a world of where "If it sounds too good to be true- it probably is", zoom binoculars live near the top of this heap. That money would be much more wisely put towards a pair of Nikon Action EX Extreme's or something similar at your local Wal Mart. (Note: Not the Nikon Actions)
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Wes
Atlantic Beach, FL
Some bino’s from Miyauchi 5x32 Binon's up through Garrett 20x110 Signature's,
Some telescopes from a Stellarvue 80mm NHNG up through a couple of 8” reflectors…
And a wonderful 4.25" Delmarva Shiefspiegler!
Some good friends, made here on C/N.
Oh- several cats and a wonderful wife!
Anyone want a cat???? :-O
"When your work speaks for itself- Don't Interrupt" -Gamble Rogers
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Joe Ogiba
Post Laureate
Reged: 02/14/02
Posts: 4062
Loc: NJ USA
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They are junk $69 80mm binoculars with junk zoom eypieces. BTW my 8-24mm Pentax XL zoom eyepiece sells for $439 so could imagine the quality of the zoom eyepieces in the binocular.
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Pentax PF-80ED,Meade 102ED APO,Orion EON 72,120ST
Apex 127,C6 XLT,CR150,C9.25,XT10
Zeiss 7x42 FL,Canon 10x42L IS WP,15x50 IS
12x36 IS II
Garrett Optical 28x110 HD-WP Signature Series
Oberwerk BT-80 45, Apogee RA-88-SA
Denk II Power x Switch binoviewer w/13mm Ethos, 20mm Pentax XW's, 20mm Widescan III's.
17mm Ethos, 22mm Nagler, 40mm Pentax XW, 14mm Pentax XL, 5.2mm Pentax XL, 8-24mm Pentax XL Zoom
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jog
member
Reged: 10/26/06
Posts: 90
Loc: nj
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Thanks to all for your reply. I'm glad I checked in here first before wasting my money. Would this one be a better buy http://www.celestron.com/c2/product.php?CatID=28&ProdID=187
Thanks again.
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Tad S.
super member
Reged: 08/28/06
Posts: 151
Loc: SW Virginia
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jog--
The binos that you link to, Celestron 15x70 Skymasters, have been discussed many times on this forum. I think the consensus is that these can be a good deal, but the quality control is so loose that you may have to send them back multiple times before getting an acceptable pair. Keep in mind that if you have to ship them back a few times, the savings you have made by purchasing the cheaper model will be consumed by shipping costs. Also, the price on the link that you provided seems especially high. I think $70 is a price more in line with what folks are paying for these. My sister got a pair here. They are currently $67.95 at this site. I don't have any affiliation with Adorama, but have purchased from them a handful of times with complete satisfaction.
The quality control from importers like Oberwerk or Garrett Optical is much better and I think you will find that those vendors are highly recommended on this forum. As Wes suggested, the Nikon Action Extreme line is another that is rated as a good value in binoculars. Lots of choices to be sure, but there are some good ones. I think you are doing well to avoid the zooms.
--Tad
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Orion XT8i, Vixen ED80Sf, Oberwerk BT-80/45
20x80 Oberwerk Std., 12x50 Nikon AE,
42mm Celestron Regal LX (8x & 10x), 8x40 Pentax PCF WP
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jog
member
Reged: 10/26/06
Posts: 90
Loc: nj
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Thanks Tad S for the info. The problem with me is I have only $170 to spend on a binocular,and I'm trying to get as big a lens as possible for the money so looking at these 70mm and 80mm binos at those prices seems like a good deal to me, but I didn't know that there was so much more to buying a bino. I looked at Adorama web site and saw this http://www.adorama.com/BA3080X.html and I looked at Oberwerk site and saw this http://www.bigbinoculars.com/1570.htm both of which are in my price range, which one would you get?
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StarStuff1
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 04/01/07
Posts: 973
Loc: South of the Mason-Dixon Line
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Which one you get should depend on what your observing goals are. The 15X70s can be hand held for a short while. Will work much better mounted. 30X80s will have to be mounted to use. Smaller field of view than the 15X70s but a darker background and some more details on Luna and Jupiter. Saturn's ring, altho small will be visible.
Actually I would recommend starting with a wide field 7X35 or 8X40 or 8X42. These can be easily hand held and can be useful as a sports glass and birding as well. Later, as your experience grows and your observing goals get narrowed, consider getting some large binocs.
As others here have mentioned, stay away from zoom binoculars. Also, fixed focus (unfocused) binoculars are a no-no.
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Tools that make objects very far away appear much closer than they actually are.
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Scanning4Comets
Postmaster
Reged: 12/26/04
Posts: 5637
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Quote:
Great idea indeed, but generally very poor optical quality.
Not always the case. I tried a pair of Celestron Pro Zooms about a year ago and the optical quality was very good. The only drawback to these particular binocs was that the FOV was quite narrow.
The general consensus to zoom binoculars is that the mechanism used to make them ZOOM eventually fails.
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Markus
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jog
member
Reged: 10/26/06
Posts: 90
Loc: nj
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WOW!! I never expected such quick replies. I just realize that in my haste I posted the wrong link in my last reply to one of the binos I was looking at, here is the other one http://www.adorama.com/CN2080N.html I think I might get this one instead of the 15X70. Anyway, hey StarStuff1 thanks man, I have had some experience with 7X50 and 15X50 and also I have a 10X30 which I got for $14 at Walmart I was able to see some of the brighter star clusters with this bino. I like the 15X because I could see more star clusters and some of the brighter nebula and galaxies. I think I might be ready for the 70mm or 80mm. I already have my sturdy tripod ready and waiting. even then I think it would be wise to wait to hear what you guys think before I make a move.
Thanks.
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Tad S.
super member
Reged: 08/28/06
Posts: 151
Loc: SW Virginia
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Quote:
Thanks Tad S for the info. The problem with me is I have only $170 to spend on a binocular,and I'm trying to get as big a lens as possible for the money so looking at these 70mm and 80mm binos at those prices seems like a good deal to me, but I didn't know that there was so much more to buying a bino. I looked at Adorama web site and saw this http://www.adorama.com/BA3080X.html and I looked at Oberwerk site and saw this http://www.bigbinoculars.com/1570.htm both of which are in my price range, which one would you get?
Hi log--
Others on this list will probably chime in with their direct experience with the 30x80s that you list. I have never used them. The Oberwerk 15x70s that you list or these by Garrett would be great all around astro binoculars. In the end, the size that you pick should be determined by the type of viewing that you want to do. Here are a few things to keep in mind comparing these two binoculars that you mention:
Model----------Barskas----Obie/Garrett
Magnifcation---30x--------15x
Eye Relief-----10mm-------18mm (usable)
TrueFoV-------2.1*---------4.5*
ExitPupil-------2.67mm-----4.67mm
Coatings------FC-----------FMC
Weight--------~4lbs--------~3lbs
15x70 is a good middle size for open clusters and cruising the Milky Way. At 15x you will see a fair amount of detail though 30x will allow much more. The 30x models would allow you to see deeper (fainter stars) but the exit pupil will be almost half as the size. The brightness of the image will be determined by a combination of factors including the exit pupil and the coatings. The eye relief is something to consider if you wear glasses, and it can contribute to the overall comfort of using the instrument. Both weight and magnification affect hand-holdability. For the binoculars above, both will likely need to be mounted, though you may be able to use the 15x'ers for short times without. You wont be throwing either of these in your pocket, but the 15x models will probably be easier to handle.
I think that you would do well to look through the "Best of" guides on this forum before making a decision. There are lots of good binos in your price range. You are already getting some varying recommendations. Just think about what fits with your style, budget, and what you want to do. Have fun,
--Tad
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Orion XT8i, Vixen ED80Sf, Oberwerk BT-80/45
20x80 Oberwerk Std., 12x50 Nikon AE,
42mm Celestron Regal LX (8x & 10x), 8x40 Pentax PCF WP
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hallelujah
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 07/14/06
Posts: 2150
Loc: Rocky Mt. High Colorado
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Quote:
what I'm finding out is zoom bions are bad. Can someone please explain why. To me zoom seems like a great idea.
Thanks.
Here's a link:
Zoom Binocular Cautions!
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Celestron Traveler 8x25 & B. & H. 8x40 FC JAPAN & Revue 10x50 CF Porro FC JAPAN &
Pentax 12x50 PCF WP II FMC & Pentax 16x60 PCF WP FMC &
Pentax 20x60 PCF WP II FMC & Orion 12x63 Mini Giant FMC JAPAN &
SPECTRUM I 20x65 FC JAPAN &
Orion 15x70 Little Giant II FMC JAPAN & Orion 20x70 Little Giant II FMC JAPAN
Orion 16x80 Giant FMC JAPAN & Orion 30x80 MEGAView FMC JAPAN
Barska 30x80 X-Trail LW FC & Burgess Optical Series II 20x90 FMC
Hallelujah! For the LORD God Omnipotent Reigneth
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hallelujah
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 07/14/06
Posts: 2150
Loc: Rocky Mt. High Colorado
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Quote:
Check one of our supporters "big binoculars. com" web site where Kevin is having a close out sell on zoom binoculars with a disclaimer on why zooms are not good.
edj
http://www.bigbinoculars.com/123670.htm
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Celestron Traveler 8x25 & B. & H. 8x40 FC JAPAN & Revue 10x50 CF Porro FC JAPAN &
Pentax 12x50 PCF WP II FMC & Pentax 16x60 PCF WP FMC &
Pentax 20x60 PCF WP II FMC & Orion 12x63 Mini Giant FMC JAPAN &
SPECTRUM I 20x65 FC JAPAN &
Orion 15x70 Little Giant II FMC JAPAN & Orion 20x70 Little Giant II FMC JAPAN
Orion 16x80 Giant FMC JAPAN & Orion 30x80 MEGAView FMC JAPAN
Barska 30x80 X-Trail LW FC & Burgess Optical Series II 20x90 FMC
Hallelujah! For the LORD God Omnipotent Reigneth
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Tad S.
super member
Reged: 08/28/06
Posts: 151
Loc: SW Virginia
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Hey jog-- I just sent you a PM. In case you are not familiar with how to see it, just click on the flashing envelope by your log in name near the top of the page. --Tad
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Joe Ogiba
Post Laureate
Reged: 02/14/02
Posts: 4062
Loc: NJ USA
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If Leica built a pair of binoculars with their new spotting scope zoom eyepiece VARIO 25-50x WW ASPH that has 60-80° AFOV it would be great but I bet a pair cost about the same as my pair of 13mm Ethos eyepieces.
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Pentax PF-80ED,Meade 102ED APO,Orion EON 72,120ST
Apex 127,C6 XLT,CR150,C9.25,XT10
Zeiss 7x42 FL,Canon 10x42L IS WP,15x50 IS
12x36 IS II
Garrett Optical 28x110 HD-WP Signature Series
Oberwerk BT-80 45, Apogee RA-88-SA
Denk II Power x Switch binoviewer w/13mm Ethos, 20mm Pentax XW's, 20mm Widescan III's.
17mm Ethos, 22mm Nagler, 40mm Pentax XW, 14mm Pentax XL, 5.2mm Pentax XL, 8-24mm Pentax XL Zoom
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BillC
on a new path
Reged: 06/04/04
Posts: 2237
Loc: Washington, USA
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Don't.
Bill
--------------------
William J. Cook, Chief Opticalman, USNR-Ret.
Founding Editor, Amateur Telescope Making Journal
20-year vet. of Captain's Nautical Supplies, Optics Dept. Mgr.
Optics Machanic, WG11-3306, Ft. Lewis, Tacoma,WA
Yata, Yata, Yata . . .
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Scanning4Comets
Postmaster
Reged: 12/26/04
Posts: 5637
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Post deleted by Markus
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Markus
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