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Equipment Discussions >> Binoviewers

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Mike Harvey
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Reged: 03/01/04

Loc: Orlando, FL.
DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT
      #5674333 - 02/11/13 04:15 PM

I received the new Binotron this past Friday and spent the weekend with it at Chiefland Astronomy Village.
Even though the seeing conditions limited the quality time I was hoping to spend with the new binoviewer, I came away with a number of fully-formed impressions.

In no particular order:

*The Binotron is, essentially, color-free.
I never really paid much attention to the slight red/blue 'fringing' around bright objects (i.e. Jupiter) with my Denk II. If I did notice anything, I attributed it to whatever eyepieces I was using.
In fact, it was so slight that I never even gave it much thought at all until I used the NEW viewer and realized there was NO 'fringing'...NONE.

* This is one gorgeous hunk of astro equipment! Russ has really outdone himself with this design. It just REEKS of class and quality-build. The workmanship is simply first-class. The new case itself is a work of art! The whole package conjures up the comparison of, say, a ROLEX vs. a CITIZEN watch (and I'm not 'knocking' Citizen...I own both).

* The new locking and focusing knobs are terrific. There is no doubt (in the dark) which knurled ring you're adjusting and the Diopter (fine focus) ring is simply a joy to use. It is absolutely solid...no slop or slack at all. And so smooth it's actually a tactile pleasure to use. It's also extremely effective.
This feature makes the Binotron much easier to "share". It just works so much better than the old system that it's no longer annoying to switch back and forth with another observer whose eyes don't match yours.

* The Binotron arrived perfectly collimated. I've owned or used every brand of binoviewer on the market and nearly all of them required some sort of 'tweaking' when using extremely high magnifications. Usually this was very minor...but noticeable.
I should probably note that, for me, "extremely high magnifications" should probably read "LUDICROUS POWER"!
Conditions permitting, I consider 500+ to be the minimum magnification for planetary viewing with my 28". If the seeing won't permit at least that much, I rarely even bother with planetary observing at all. There are times when I use 1,000+. That's going to push ANY binoviewer to the limit of precise collimation!

(Here's where we get really ludicrous ): I aimed the scope at a light on top of a cell phone tower and used a set of
3MM NAGLERS AND THE 'POWER X SWITCH" IN THE HIGHEST POSITION...FOR A MAGNIFICATION OF 2400X...AND THE IMAGE REMAINED PERFECTLY COLLIMATED! There was no overlap or any problem with merging whatsoever. NOTE: this has caused me to not yet test the collimation procedure. It's so perfect, I don't want to mess with it!

* The rubberized coating of the body is a really nice touch (especially on cold nights!).

* The Binotron FEELS noticeably lighter than the Denk II.

I'll post more when I've had more time with it...and with other types of scopes. I'll be using it in an SCT next week and I'm actually looking forward to having the moon back in the sky. I want to critically test the sharpness and contrast on the lunar features (although in moments of steady seeing this past weekend, there was a wealth of fine detail on Jupiter).

Mike Harvey

Edited by Mike Harvey (02/11/13 04:24 PM)


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BrianG
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Mike Harvey]
      #5674779 - 02/11/13 08:49 PM

Thanks for the first light Mike. These sound fantastic! Everything I was hoping. I put my order in last week, Russ expects to ship early March. Please let us know how they perform with the SCT.

Brian G


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faackanders2
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Reged: 03/28/11

Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: BrianG]
      #5674825 - 02/11/13 09:20 PM

Sounds great! Pleasse post pics.

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Mauikj
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Mike Harvey]
      #5675085 - 02/12/13 12:53 AM

I tried my Binotrons on Jupiter this evening (with a celestron8) and it was awesome! Conditions were not great but it looked really nice. As Mike said it was impressively color free. And I'd second what he said about build quality - really first rate! I got an email from Russ today asking how I liked them (and I REALLY do) and he mentioned he is getting quite a few orders and will be discontinuing the introductory special soon. So if you want a pair you may want to act quickly.

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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Mauikj]
      #5675205 - 02/12/13 03:30 AM

Great report thanks! OK, went ahead and pulled the trigger.

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denis0007dl
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5675936 - 02/12/13 02:08 PM

Congrats for new binos, you will like it for sure!
Did anyone knows what is optical path of Binotron?


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GlennLeDrew
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5675947 - 02/12/13 02:17 PM

Mike,
Just to clarify... It's not the magnification itself which imposes a limit to collimation, but rather it's the focal length of the eyepieces used. No matter the scope size, if a pair of eyepieces showed a certain degree of BV mis-collimation, the apparent degree of misalignment (angle on the retina) will be identical on any scope, even though on larger ones the magnification will be higher.

If a BV were to be limited to eyepieces of, say, 15mm before misalignment became an issue, that same limit would apply as much to a 3" as it would a 30", with a concomitant maximum useable magnification differing by a factor of 10.

That you noted good collimation with 3mm eyepieces is impressive!


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Mike Harvey
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Reged: 03/01/04

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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: GlennLeDrew]
      #5675960 - 02/12/13 02:30 PM

Hi Glenn,
Yes, you are (as usual) correct!
I was just trying to "keep it simple". In my experience, most amateur observers just don't think in those terms. The words I always hear are "I can't use more than ( pick a number ) power without overlapping or double images".


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GHarris
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: denis0007dl]
      #5676307 - 02/12/13 05:09 PM

Quote:

Congrats for new binos, you will like it for sure!
Did anyone knows what is optical path of Binotron?




Russ said the following to me in a recent email:
"Its approximately 118mm. depends on what height you use the diopter focusers."

Very close to the Denk II lightpath then, as I understand it.


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Mike Harvey
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Reged: 03/01/04

Loc: Orlando, FL.
Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Mike Harvey]
      #5676366 - 02/12/13 05:59 PM

I didn't think to measure the difference but, I don't recall a noticeable focus difference between the two when I was doing the "A"-"B" comparison. I'm guessing the light path is pretty much the same (or else I was too 'caught up in the moment' to remember).

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Mr. Bill
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Mike Harvey]
      #5677372 - 02/13/13 10:29 AM

Mike...

I own the Denk IIs. Is there enough difference between them and the Binotrons for me to consider selling mine and replacing them with the Binotrons?



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denis0007dl
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Mr. Bill]
      #5677633 - 02/13/13 12:50 PM

Quote:

Mike...

I own the Denk IIs. Is there enough difference between them and the Binotrons for me to consider selling mine and replacing them with the Binotrons?






In my opinion, upgrade from Denk II would be Mark V or Siebert 2" binos!

Mark V have 30 mm prisms, and Binotron have 27 mm, Siebert 40 or 45....


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Mr. Bill
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: denis0007dl]
      #5677729 - 02/13/13 01:48 PM

With my IPD (67mm) I only use 1 1/4 eps....the largest fieldstop for 1 1/4 is 27mm (24mm Pans) so 30mm and more is not needed.

Besides, I like giving my money to Russ....



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Mike Harvey
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Reged: 03/01/04

Loc: Orlando, FL.
Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Mr. Bill]
      #5677813 - 02/13/13 02:50 PM

Quote:

Mike...
I own the Denk IIs. Is there enough difference between them and the Binotrons for me to consider selling mine and replacing them with the Binotrons?





Well...I can't speak for everyone - but that's what I did...and there are no regrets.

Mike


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denis0007dl
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Mr. Bill]
      #5677835 - 02/13/13 03:06 PM

Quote:

With my IPD (67mm) I only use 1 1/4 eps....the largest fieldstop for 1 1/4 is 27mm (24mm Pans) so 30mm and more is not needed.

Besides, I like giving my money to Russ....






In Binotron 27 will be some vignetting with 24 Pans, because Binotron have only 26mm CLEAR APERTURE, and MkV have 28mm!!!


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Bob S.
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: denis0007dl]
      #5677903 - 02/13/13 03:47 PM

Denis, You don't understand. Mr. Harvey is known for getting the latest and hopefully greatest two days before they are announced.

He and I one day will have a shootout with my Mark V's and his new Binotrons. Trust me. I doubt that the 1mm of difference is of much concern. He uses the bins in a 28" scope under beautiful Florida skies.

However, as you pointed out, one day I will pull out my Siebert 45's with 20mm T5 Naglers and he will be gobsmacked

Bob Schilling

Edited by Bob S. (02/13/13 03:53 PM)


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Bob S.]
      #5678664 - 02/14/13 12:41 AM

I'm putting them head to had when I get mine, B27 v. MkV, and may the best man win. There are several areas where I know the new B27 will win on ergonomics - diopters for instance. I owned a Denk II for a few years and I still miss those beautiful diopters, the MkV is just not the same for me. And the new diopters are supposed to be even better. The PowerSwitch is another bonus simply for being able to achieve 1.3X in a fast dob, the best I can get with my MkVs is 1.7X. Another area with improvement over the MkV is the actual connection, I have never been comfortable with that dovetail/single thumbscrew arrangement of the MkV. Yes the Quick Changer gives me flexibility but it could have been done more securely, i.e. the Baader Maxbright.


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Mike Harvey
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Reged: 03/01/04

Loc: Orlando, FL.
Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Bob S.]
      #5678696 - 02/14/13 01:44 AM

Quote:

Denis, You don't understand. Mr. Harvey is known for getting the latest and hopefully greatest two days before they are announced.

He and I one day will have a shootout with my Mark V's and his new Binotrons. Trust me. I doubt that the 1mm of difference is of much concern. He uses the bins in a 28" scope under beautiful Florida skies.

However, as you pointed out, one day I will pull out my Siebert 45's with 20mm T5 Naglers and he will be gobsmacked

Bob Schilling




Pay no attention to Mr. Schilling...compared to him I am a mere pauper and 'pretender' when it comes to obtaining the latest and greatest!

Seriously, Bob, I would be most interested in doing the comparo between the Binotrons and the Mark V. I've often wondered how they would stack up. Please bring them with you next time you're at Chiefland.

I remember the insanity of our comparing pairs of 24 Pans and 21 Denks et.al. at the Winter Star Party years ago. We may have set a new standard for "anal retentive evaluation"!

I would also LOVE to see the Siebert's. As you know, I hang out with a lot of observers but, despite actively looking for a chance to try them out for several YEARS, I've yet to find anyone who has a pair!

Would I be correct in assuming that, with the sheer size of the 45's, the light-path is so long that those 20mm's might actually be performing as
12mm's (or even 10's!)...or do the Siebert's employ some sort of focal reducer?

I was quite satisfied with my Denk II's. As you know, I got mine as soon as they came out and, over the past few years, I haven't seen any other option that I felt was equal or better (and I'm almost as quick as you are to discard old equipment and get the newest whiz-bang). The Binotron is the first alternative I've found that convinced me to make a change. It's a definite upgrade from the Denk II and, as someone else posted; the combination of features (especially the lower amplification factor, the Power-X-Switch, the eyepiece locking system and the new Diopter) make the Binotron an easy choice for me.

Look forward to seeing you (and participating in more comparo-madness) soon!

Mike


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Bob S.
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Mike Harvey]
      #5678709 - 02/14/13 02:11 AM

Mike, The Siebert 45's have a multi-purpose OCA designed specifically for the binoviewers that allow them to work with both reflectors, refractors and SCT's at a minimum of 1.3x mag factor. They actually bring back that 3-D pop we used to get when we were a bit younger on globs.

Mike, Just because we are comfortable spending 5 hours looking at one object (M51) with two pairs of binoviewers and two pair of ep's in a 24" scope for a comparo doesn't totally equate to compulsivity does it Bob


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GlennLeDrew
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Bob S.]
      #5678881 - 02/14/13 07:20 AM

The sheer size of the 45s resulting in a light path so long that the 20s might be performing as 12s...

What on Earth does does this mean?


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: GlennLeDrew]
      #5678954 - 02/14/13 08:35 AM

I think he might be speaking SCT language...? It's all foreign to me.

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Mike Harvey
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: GlennLeDrew]
      #5679752 - 02/14/13 03:31 PM

Quote:

The sheer size of the 45s resulting in a light path so long that the 20s might be performing as 12s...

What on Earth does does this mean?




An assumption that, by virtue of the sheer physical size of this particular binoviewer, it work work like an extension tube...longer light path - higher amplification factor.
Without a reducer, even the TeleVue Binoview acted like a 3X Barlow.
I haven't heard that the Siebert uses a focal reducer (or OCS) to overcome this (TeleVue didn't). What am I missing?


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Bob S.
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Mike Harvey]
      #5679787 - 02/14/13 03:54 PM

Quote:

Quote:

The sheer size of the 45s resulting in a light path so long that the 20s might be performing as 12s...

What on Earth does does this mean?




An assumption that, by virtue of the sheer physical size of this particular binoviewer, it work work like an extension tube...longer light path - higher amplification factor.
Without a reducer, even the TeleVue Binoview acted like a 3X Barlow.
I haven't heard that the Siebert uses a focal reducer (or OCS) to overcome this (TeleVue didn't). What am I missing?




Mike, You would be right if Harry Siebert hadn't designed a special set of OCA modules for this Siebert 45. The range of the OCA is 1.3x-2.7x. Bob

Edited by Bob S. (02/14/13 03:58 PM)


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Jeff B
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Mike Harvey]
      #5679865 - 02/14/13 04:43 PM

Spoke to Russ and I'm on the list. I can't wait.

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junomike
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: GlennLeDrew]
      #5679888 - 02/14/13 04:59 PM

Glenn, I believe this refers to how Binoviewers increase the Focal Length In an SCT and thus the overall magnification.
So in an SCT, because of the extra Optical Path of the 2" Binoviewer, 20mm eyepieces would yield the same magnification as 12mm would in Mono mode.
Not saying this is correct, but that's what I think was Implied.

Mike


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faackanders2
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: junomike]
      #5685556 - 02/17/13 05:13 PM

I believe that is correct. OCSs usually act like barlows multiplying power to be able to focus.

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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: faackanders2]
      #5693159 - 02/21/13 05:13 PM

Russ he has just posted Zygo tests and beam splitter transmission data on his website, these Bino27 prisms are truly outstanding.

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Eddgie
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: junomike]
      #5693452 - 02/21/13 08:06 PM

It can be complicated in refractors.

The Maxbrights with a T2 required a 1.5x GPC to reach focus in my 6" APO.

But when I went to the Mark Vs (same prism), I could no longer reach focus with the 1.5x configuration, and I am not even sure that the 1.7x would work because these seem to be actually only 1.6x, and I only had about 2mm of in-focus left when using the Maxbrights.

If I went to a 2x configuration to be sure of reaching focus, I would increase my magnification 75%.

Some of this would be offset because I could use a bigger eyepiece in the Mark Vs.

If I went to a giant bino with a light path that was another 20mm or so, I might need even more magnification to reach focus.

In the SCT, it is not as bad, but past 200mm, and the C14 looses aperture.

So, If I went to a 2" diagonal to support a giant prism bino, I would have to add so much back focus that the system would loose a lot of aperture.

In fact, even with the standard Denkmeier Supersystem used with a 2" diagonal, the scope was already only working at 13.2" of aperture.

With my current configuration (Baader Clicklock, Baader T2 Standard prism, and Mark Vs, (total back focus of about 198 mm of back focus).

This gives a focal length of about 4000mm, but full aperture (My scope starts to cut off the light cone right at 200mm).

A big bino though, using a 2" diagonal but with a light path of 140mm, would have a total of perhaps 270mm of back focus (maybe more).

In this case, the C14 would be working at about 4300mm focal length, but the aperture would be reduced to about 13 inches or less.

You can overdo it on the prism size for refractors or SCTs. The bigger the prism, the more Barlow or back focus you need, and in the SCTs, you would almost for sure loose aperture (except C11).

I did some quick calculations, and in almost every case for refractors, if the change from a Maxbright size bino to a Mark V required a step up in GPC, the advantage of the bigger prism would be almost completely negated.

In other words, you could get the same size true field from the Maxbrights using a 20mm Explore Scientific as you could get from a Mark V using 24mm Panoptics if the Mark Vs required one step up in GPC strength.

And if you had a 2" with a big enough prism to use a big 2" eyepiece like a 27mm Pan, you might need even more GPC, so that in the end, you might wind up with no bigger true field than the Maxbrights.

Light path is the the great evil of binovierwers. Unless one is willing to modify a telecope that cannot reach focus without a GPC or OCS, it is very difficult to get a wider field by going to a bigger aperture bino for refractors, and many SCTs will experience aperture loss when giant prisms are used, unless they use an OCS of course, but then what would be the point of the bigger prisms?

I went to the Mark Vs for the C14 because the increase in field size in this case was enough to justify it, but I wrote off the notion of using them in the 6" APO.

Think about it this way..... If I had to use 2x in the 6" APO to reach focus, that would give me 2430mm of focal length.

Heck, I can use them on my EdgeHD 8" and get 2350mm with a brighter field that is every bit as sharp? What would be the point?

I simply abandoned the idea of using the binoviewers with the 6" APO when I realized I could get a bigger, brighter true field out of the EdgeHD 8". It did not make any sense at all to pursue getting the Mark Vs to work on the 6" APO.


Edited by Eddgie (02/21/13 08:08 PM)


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mhilscher
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Eddgie]
      #5693481 - 02/21/13 08:18 PM

well explained

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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: mhilscher]
      #5693639 - 02/21/13 10:00 PM

It's very well explained but also completely due to the longer tube on Eddgie's scope. I'm actually considering keeping my MkVs when the B27's arrive just for the spectacular view they render in my 6" APO at 1X with Pan 24s or Brandon 32s.

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Fred1
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5693849 - 02/22/13 12:29 AM

Quote:

It's very well explained but also completely due to the longer tube on Eddgie's scope. I'm actually considering keeping my MkVs when the B27's arrive just for the spectacular view they render in my 6" APO at 1X with Pan 24s or Brandon 32s.




Keep 'em both. There are times when I am sooooo glad I have two sets of binos.


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faackanders2
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: GlennLeDrew]
      #5709883 - 03/03/13 02:37 AM

Quote:

The sheer size of the 45s resulting in a light path so long that the 20s might be performing as 12s...

What on Earth does does this mean?




The Multipurpose OCS may require an extension or more infocus than the Newtonian OCS (it does when I am at lowest LL power mode of dual power switches). If you require an extension it would change the focal length of the system. If it is just infocus (without an extension) I don't know what he is talking about either?

I knew exactly what all the powers were with just one power switch. Adding the second one (reducer/multiplier) increased the length and changed all the powers a little.
I only know the LL and HH for sure provided by Russ, and had to estimate multiplying the powers of both power switches in series.

I guess we could do the drift time measurement to know for sure.


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Jeff B
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Fred1]
      #5710227 - 03/03/13 09:47 AM






Keep 'em both. There are times when I am sooooo glad I have two sets of binos.




Amen!


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Eddgie
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Mr. Bill]
      #5710337 - 03/03/13 10:44 AM

Quote:

With my IPD (67mm) I only use 1 1/4 eps....the largest fieldstop for 1 1/4 is 27mm (24mm Pans) so 30mm and more is not needed


.

The Baader Hyperions have a 28mm field stop.

When measured with a caliper, I got 28mm.

The Televue 40mm Plossls were 27mm.

Is 1 millimeter a big deal?

Well, yes and no I suppose. On one hand, I very much like to see a very sharp field stop in my eyepieces with zero softness. For many this is not important at all and while it is cosmetic, it is what I personally like. The 24mm Hyperions have a very sharp field stop.

And as for the difference, well a 3% wider field in a binoviewer is a 3% wider field in a binoviewer.

And if you are using a C14, it all adds up.

I have no investment in what other people buy. Only trying to say that there are bigger field stops in 1.25" eyepeices.

Does it matter to you or to anyone else? Maybe not.

Juat a fact so I though I would introduce it.


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swampdog
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Eddgie]
      #5752715 - 03/23/13 09:04 PM

I'm looking for more 1st. light reports! Subsequent "nights out" from actual owners also! I appreciate everyones contribution, sure looks like a nice product. Thanks for sharing your experience.

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Mauikj
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: swampdog]
      #5754812 - 03/24/13 07:34 PM

Hey Swampdog,

Had my Binotrons with Denk 21's out a fews days back hooked up to my Tak TOA 130. The conditions were much better than my first night out and WOW did they perform. The moon was amazing. The Tak by itself is great on the moon but with the binoviewers the view was breathtaking. Razor sharp and beautiful subtle coloring of the lunar surface. Jupiter was also a wealth of detail and the moons perfect tiny disks. What is really amazing to me (and I know most binoviewer users already know this but it is new to me) is how relaxing it is to view with two eyes instead of one. I can't wait to bring them to a really dark site and put them in my Dob. This night was in my yard which is kind of dark -(I don't know the darkness scales but I can see the milky way from my yard but not distinct light and dark areas within it - it is just a hazy band of light.). The binos really performed beyond my expectations.


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George N
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Mauikj]
      #5754981 - 03/24/13 09:11 PM

When upgrading from the Denk II, can't one keep the old PowerX switch? I also have the Newt reducer lens..... Would I keep that?

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swampdog
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Mauikj]
      #5755109 - 03/24/13 10:21 PM

Right on..and Aloha! Nice report, nothing like a good, comfortable pair of binocs for viewing. My experience is daytime scenic/hunting scenarios, like most people I suppose, and the higher end glass, if you're fortunate enough to own, really is a pleasure to use. And that's what I was hoping, in considering these binotrons. You know, I'm 50 yrs. old & started this astronomy hobby 2 yrs. past, I like the fact when using a scope, you bow your head when you look to the sky, and sometimes just look up, take it all in. I didn't know much of these astronomy things were even availiable to most people...so thanks again.

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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: swampdog]
      #5760921 - 03/27/13 05:50 PM

Mine shipped today!

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Aquarist
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5761087 - 03/27/13 07:16 PM

Well Johnny, we will be waiting for a report!

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Mauikj
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5761727 - 03/28/13 04:19 AM

Can't wait to see what you think, Johnny....I think you will be impressed!

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Jeff B
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Jeff B]
      #5762727 - 03/28/13 05:03 PM

Quote:

Spoke to Russ and I'm on the list. I can't wait.




E-mail from Brown says Monday.


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mich_al
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5764243 - 03/29/13 11:05 AM

Quote:

Mine shipped today!




Do you know what your order number is? I'm on the list and still waiting (2094).


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: mich_al]
      #5765580 - 03/29/13 07:27 PM

I don't know the order number Al. but Russ said he is starting to ship out orders from January/Feb. Some are a little out of order depending on whether a filter switch was ordered or a OC45, etc. All I know is, it should be worth the wait! Although I posted here that I "pulled the trigger" in Februaryy mine was actually ordered a few weeks before that, sometime in the beginning of January...

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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5774283 - 04/02/13 10:07 PM

Just got my B27 today but I am packing to go to TX for a week so I don't think I'll have a chance to check it out until I get back.

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Jeff B
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Jeff B]
      #5775375 - 04/03/13 11:45 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Spoke to Russ and I'm on the list. I can't wait.




E-mail from Brown says Monday.




Got mine and a preliminary report using my APM 6" F8 triplet.

The Good:

1. Wonderfully made, love the rubber coating.
2. Light weight, much appreciated
3. Wonderful coatings
4. Cool collimation feature
5. Deeper collet allows eyepieces with longer barrels to sit flush with top.
6. Best for last, very sharp, no tint differences between R/L.

Not so good:
1. Requires ~ 10mm more backfocus due to collimation feature. Bad for my APM 152 F8, can't get to focus sans OCS with power switch attached.
2. Speaking of the power switch, arms are very stiff and when using sans OCS with refractors, barlow side has annoying "glow" at focus. Older version switches do not. Glow eliminated with OCS so new switch can only be used with OCS, a limitation.
3. Two inch nose piece on new switch is longer than old one and with OCS attached, entire viewer sticks up out of diagonal ~10mm. Not good.

So, a mixed impression so far. More later.

Jeff


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Jeff B]
      #5776959 - 04/04/13 02:26 AM

Jeff - I believe the PowerSwitch is not designed to be used without the OCS - it requires the OCS to work. The OCS narrows the light cone so it can feed properly through the PowerSwitch lenses.

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Jeff B
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5777191 - 04/04/13 09:01 AM

Well, the older version works just fine in the barlow mode on either binoviewer (can't, of course, use the reduction mode), which is expected and the newer switch behaves the same (the surrounding glow)in the Denk II as well. Also, I used it the way anyone with a SCT would use it, sans OCS. I've not tried it yet in my SCTs or Maks. However, there is a physical difference between the older and new version in the barlow element of the switch with that of the newer version having a much larger diameter.

My refractors are all "bino-friendly" and all, save the APM 6" F8, can swallow the extra 10mm of backfocus but that does limit my eyepiece selection considerable and, to me, represents a loss in capability and flexibility of the product with those scopes.

When I get the time, I'll contact Russ about this.

Jeff


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Jeff B]
      #5778953 - 04/05/13 03:27 AM

Ah sorry thanks, I forgot once again the SCT does not need the OCS - but I was told that the OCS was required in my scopes. Good luck with it, I can't wait to try mine out. It's amazingly light weight for one thing.

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axle01
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5789696 - 04/10/13 07:33 AM

Just ordered mine for my UO 130 refractor, now I need to know what EP's to get,,,,any thoughts,,,,,I have to wear glasses.

Alan


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Kent10
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: axle01]
      #5805200 - 04/17/13 06:39 PM

Hi Johnny:

I am wondering if you have had a chance to try out your new Binotron. I am anxious to hear how you think they compare to your Mark V.

Thanks!


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Kent10]
      #5805359 - 04/17/13 07:58 PM

No I haven't Kent, the weather just cleared up today though. Hopefully I'll get a chance here by the weekend anyway.

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Mike Harvey
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5805964 - 04/18/13 12:46 AM

While it's difficult to quantify the amount of (or the reason for) the increase, I've noted that DSO's do appear brighter through the Binotron than with the Denk II.
Last weekend, this was especially noticeable while observing the "Ghost of Jupiter" nebula with the 28" Starstructure. There doesn't seem to be as much "light loss".
I'm guessing that the difference has to do with the combination of the Binotron's larger clear aperture, better coatings and the new Denk 45mm OCS.
WhatEVER it is...the bar has, once again,been raised a bit!


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Kent10]
      #5814098 - 04/21/13 09:27 PM

OK I had a chance to try out the B27's last night in my 14.5" dob here in LA. Seeing conditions were pretty good, the Moon was nice and sharp up to a little over 200X. Saturn was average, I could only squeeze out a little over 150X before the image started breaking down, but there were occasional nice moments where I got a sharp view at around 200X.

My initial impression is these binoviewers are a big WOW, awesome, I think I LOVE them. Nice big bright clear sharp images with excellent contrast - I was also using the new ultimate aperture OCS-A45. Very light weight and very easy to use, the ergonomics are a cut above anything I have used before. I achieved focus at all three power settings with no adjustments to my focuser or truss tubes (but this does require a 3" drawtube). The individual diopters especially are simply fantastic. I would liken them in use to a zoom eyepiece, where the ability to dial in the image to the nth degree is a true game changer. The "set it and forget it" diopters of the Mark Vs are fine up to a point, but that does not account for tiny incremental differences between eyepiece pairs - and even the focus of my eyes themselves seem to change a tiny bit over the course of a session. The B27 diopters are perfect, just the right amount of fine focus where even 1/8 of a turn makes a slight noticeable difference. They are very fluid and the whole setup is pretty intuitive. Another great feature is the eypieces do not rotate when fine focusing which would allow for the use of batwing-style eyecups.

With my Leica Zoom I am able to dial in the perfect magnification for seeing conditions and it makes a major difference especially when viewing planets. The B27s are similar in that the simplicity of the fine focus diopters allow me to capture the absolute best focus to the nth degree, on the fly - even while looking with both eyes, I can easily adjust one side or the other and see the sharp snap into perfect focus. I had a pair of Denk IIs before and I realized how much I missed this feature, and how important it is. As I found my eyes themselves change focus very slightly throughout the evening whether from temperature changes or blood pressure or who knows what. The B27s are still for the most part "set it and forget it" but I change out eyepieces a lot and I found the individual diopters made a big difference. No matter how perfect a pair of eyepieces is made, there are still tiny differences in length between individual eyepieces that can effect the focus of the pair together. And while the eyes can accomodate to a certain extent to fine differences in focus, there is much less strain when the focus is perfect. My initial session with these binoviewers lasted well over three hours before I took a break, and seemed like only minutes because of the extreme level of comfort I experienced.

I did have an issue with my KK orthos, the barrels are about 1/3" longer then all my other eyepieces except the Nagler 13T6s, and the longer barrel knocked the eyepieces out of collimation. The instructions do make this clear that if a barrel is too long or adjusted too deeply the collimation mechanism can be nudged slightly out of alignment. So I got to learn how to collimate the B27s right away and it was easy and worked well, I was able to do it while viewing Saturn in the dark. There is a slight learning curve but again, everything is very intuitive. You simply loosen the silver collimation ring a bit and you can nudge the eyepieces up and down and back and forth in a flat plane, and you line up the target at the top and side edges. The top edge alignment is critical and the side edge you actually want a little difference for a 3D effect. It was not hard and will get super easy after a few times. The only other issue I had was the B27s were delivered with the IP adjustment too loose. This was a very simple fix, just remove the little cover and adjust with a spanner, no setscrews or anything else to worry about. I didn't have a spanner but with two small screwdrivers the adjustment was very easy and made in seconds. As for the longer barrels of the KKs I added some o-rings to parfocalize them and now they work fine. All my other eyepieces worked fine even the new 18mm Hutech HCs.

Overall I give this an A+, everything seems to be absolutely first rate quality and after a slight learning curve they are very simple to use. I did not have a chance to compare them to my MkVs yet but optically they were fantastic, contrast was breathtaking and I felt like I saw more detail on the Moon than I have ever seen before, the detail in the craters in particular was simply astonishing and I attribute a lot of this to the individual diopter fine focus and of course the 1/8 wave+ prisms with beautiful coatings. Overall an excellent job by Russ and co. at Denkmeier, kudos for a beautiful all-American made binoviewer!


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mich_al
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5814387 - 04/21/13 11:14 PM

Quote:


The only other issue I had was the B27s were delivered with the IP adjustment too loose. This was a very simple fix, just remove the little cover and adjust with a spanner, no setscrews or anything else to worry about. I didn't have a spanner but with two small screwdrivers the adjustment was very easy and made in seconds.




Mine have the same problem, they steadily close while I'm viewing. How does the little cap come off? Is it the cap that says 'Denkmeier' in the middle on top?


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: mich_al]
      #5814392 - 04/21/13 11:19 PM

Yes, the little cap on the back (eyepiece) side. I just unscrewed mine with my fingers Al. The adjustment only required about 1/8 turn. You could probably do it with a dime.

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Daud
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5814486 - 04/22/13 12:43 AM

Quote:

...
With my Leica Zoom I am able to dial in the perfect magnification for seeing conditions ...




So are you getting a second one ?


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Daud]
      #5814528 - 04/22/13 01:30 AM

No I won't be using the Leica ASPH for the binos, I don't like too much weight or length added to my binoviewers, I prefer orthos. Last night I used the 24 Pans, 32 and 24 Brandons, 25 KKs, 16 ZAO-IIs and 18 KKs and HCs. Best view was provided with the 24 Brandons.

I cannot tell you how lucky and pleased I am to have the B27s with excellent orthos, and then the Leica Zoom for mono viewing which I also use with and without a Zeiss Abbe 2X barlow. Other than my 31T5 and occasionally my 13E this is all that I feel I need.


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Daud
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5814538 - 04/22/13 01:42 AM

Hmm, 24 Pans, 24 Brandons, 16 ZAO-IIs..
Binotron here in couple days, how the Brandons bested Pans or ZAOs ?


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Daud]
      #5814542 - 04/22/13 01:44 AM

The ZAOs were not necessarily bested but they were too much power for conditions last night. I also found once again that the Brandons displayed less scatter on Saturn. The Pans are nice but the Brandons are clearly better on axis and show a darker background and much flatter field. I like the Pans though for DSOs and for giving me the widest possible field. All eyepieces were sharp to the edge in the B27s/OCS-A45.

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denis0007dl
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5814568 - 04/22/13 02:26 AM

It will be interesting how Binotron 27 will performs vs Mark V, that is what many peoples waiting for, but in my opinion, because Mark V have 2mm larger clear aperture, and ZEISS optics, will be slightly better, so we waiting for results

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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: denis0007dl]
      #5814576 - 04/22/13 02:36 AM

I wouldn't be so sure Denis. The Mk V is 28mm clear aperture (+1mm) but only 24mm when using a glasspath compensator, which is recommended for best correction. The Zeiss optics are fantastic but I also think the new B27 prisms are fantastic, 1/8 wave+ with beautiful coatings. I could not believe the level of detail I was seeing on the Moon last night, just stunning. Particularly inside the craters, there were levels of contrast that even the MkVs I do not remember providing, the detail was astonishing. One thing I know for sure is the easy individual diopter adjustment on the fly, while viewing, makes the B27s clearly better both ergonomically and optically. I will be first reaching for the B27s first from now on, no doubt, I realized that within the first half hour of use. I also did not mention but they provide a very nice cool neutral tone similar to the MkVs. I can't believe how much cheaper they are than the MkVs especially when you add on the additional cost of the glasspath compensators and newtonian OCS/Barcon ($2000+), the B27s are almost 1/2 the price. And on top of that the B27s weigh considerably less.

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denis0007dl
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5814589 - 04/22/13 02:50 AM

Actually Mark V have 2mm more clear aperture, Binotron 27 have 26mm CA, that is what wrote on Denk site, prisms are 27mm, but CA is 26, on Mark V prisms are 30mm, and CA 28mm.
Anyway, it will be interesting to put them on high power test with with same eyepieces on same scope, and of course, test on DSO with marginal seeing.
You have opportunity to do that first, so you are lucky, and we expect detailed review
Best!


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: denis0007dl]
      #5814599 - 04/22/13 03:18 AM

Ah thanks for the correction Denis! Yes it should be very interesting and fun... I am also interested in how the B27s come to focus on my FS152 w/ FT3545 focuser. I can reach focus at 1X with the MkVs with 1/2" to spare, using the 1.25" T2 prism diagonal - I expect to reach focus at all three B27 PowerxSwitch settings with my 2" Zeiss prism diagonal (OCS attached to the nosepiece) but I cannot be sure until I try.

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denis0007dl
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5814618 - 04/22/13 03:58 AM

It will be interesting comapre them without correctors, but problem will be to reach focus on some scopes, that is why I cut my tube, put bigger secondary, install low profile focusser, and I am able to reach focus without GPCs.

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beatlejuice
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5814620 - 04/22/13 04:00 AM

Johnny you're killing me, I have been waiting forever it seems. I got to stay away from here until they finally get shipped.

Eric


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: beatlejuice]
      #5814658 - 04/22/13 05:11 AM

Hang on Eric, it'll be worth the wait!

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Kent10
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5815079 - 04/22/13 11:52 AM

Thanks Johnny for the great 1st light report.

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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: denis0007dl]
      #5816472 - 04/22/13 10:21 PM

Quote:

It will be interesting comapre them without correctors, but problem will be to reach focus on some scopes, that is why I cut my tube, put bigger secondary, install low profile focusser, and I am able to reach focus without GPCs.



To reach focus at 1X with my Binotron 27s in my FS152 would require getting a Powerswitch to T2 adapter from Precise Parts, and attaching the B27s directly to my 1.25" Baader/Zeiss prism diagonal a la the Baader Maxbrights, and I think I might get it with 1 or 2mm to spare. It's do-able but I think I'll be pretty happy if I can get the 1.3X using the conventional Denk setup with the OCS screwed into the nose of my 2" prism diagonal.

Hmm, I just "built" the part at precise Parts and it only cost $89. OK I ordered it, should be interesting. I may need to use the little thin Baader rings to make sure I get the correct orientation of the B27s but it's pretty straightforward. There might be clearance issues with the PowerSwitch, I hope I'll be able to get the diagonal seated all the way in... I'll eyeball it later though and see, probly should have done that before ordering...


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denis0007dl
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5816743 - 04/23/13 01:57 AM

The only regluar testing will be without any GPCs, and with same scope and eyepieces.
Hope that you will be able to do that


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Jeff B
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5817175 - 04/23/13 10:50 AM

Johhny:

When you get the chance, can you try the binotron out, no OCS, but with the newer power switch attached using the barlow portion of the switch. You should be able to reach focus. It's about a 2.5X barlow effect.

Jeff


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Jeff B]
      #5817328 - 04/23/13 12:10 PM

I'll try it Jeff but as far as I understand, with my dob or refractor, the OCS is required for the PowerSwitch to function properly.

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junomike
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5817877 - 04/23/13 04:05 PM

Johnny, Jeff is correct! The Barlow "Slider" essentially acts as an OCS would in creating the needed out focus that's being eaten up by the added optical path of the Binoviewers.
I used this trick on a C6R once when I forgot the OCS at home.

Mike


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: junomike]
      #5818992 - 04/24/13 12:16 AM

Well it doesn't hurt to try... I mean, I believe you Jeff, it certainly should work with the barlow switch, just never tried it before... If we can just get some decent weather here, it's been cold and damp for days.

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Jeff B
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: junomike]
      #5819425 - 04/24/13 10:12 AM

Quote:

Johnny, Jeff is correct! The Barlow "Slider" essentially acts as an OCS would in creating the needed out focus that's being eaten up by the added optical path of the Binoviewers.
I used this trick on a C6R once when I forgot the OCS at home.

Mike




Exactly. All of my refractors are "bino-friendly" in that the OTA is short enough to allow me to reach focus using a 2" diagonal but no OCS. The barlow feature of the switch gives about 2.5X and requires about 2.5" or so of focuser travel from the non OCS position. This is very much like the older style single arm power switch, something I wish Russ would bring back (with perhaps a 1.75X) for us with "bino-viewer friendly" refractors. This is also exactly how it's used with SCTs BTW.


The new power switch provided with the binotron has a redesigned barlow element. At least on my sample, it did not work well with my refractors as described above, providing a pronounced glare off axis. I've not tried it yet with my Maks or SCTs. It works just fine with the refractors when I use it with the OCS either in the inlet to the diagonal or, my preference, in the nose of the 2" adapter for the switch (which gives slightly less magnification).

I've been in communication with Russ about this and have sent the switch back to him for evaluation but he's busy with NEAF so it may be sometime before he gets to it. It may be my particular switch or generic but I'm curious and several others have the new binotron assembly so I would appreciate any results others may have using the switch this way with refractors.

Jeff

BTW, I just got the new 2" diagonal with the dovetail feature. This reduces the light path of the diagonal a solid 1.25" or so by removing the 2" eyepiece holder and plugging the binotron and switch directly to the top of the diagonal body. Awesome. But weather is going to be socked in for the next week.


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DixonAgee
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: beatlejuice]
      #5824812 - 04/26/13 04:32 PM

Eric -

You are not alone. I've been patiently waiting since January 18th. Just ordered the wrong extra bits, I guess.

- Bruce


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beatlejuice
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: DixonAgee]
      #5824938 - 04/26/13 05:23 PM

Jan 15 for me Bruce, with no extra bits, just 'bare bones'.
Thats all I could afford.
Eric


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DixonAgee
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: beatlejuice]
      #5824963 - 04/26/13 05:39 PM

Ouch! You ought to check the status with an email or call.

Clear Skies

- Bruce


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beatlejuice
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: DixonAgee]
      #5824971 - 04/26/13 05:46 PM

I'm going to give him a couple of weeks to recover from NEAF and then make a polite call.

Eric


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Jeff B]
      #5825640 - 04/27/13 02:55 AM

Jeff - I was able to reach focus with the barlow switch only and no OCS in my FS152, using my 2" Zeiss prism diagonal. The 4.5" drawtube of my FT3545 focuser was almost all the way out. The image looked nice on Saturn in average/below average seeing, and I tried it on the almost full moon and there were absolutely no internal reflections, the image was fantastic - but this was using 40* eyepieces, the 18mm Hutech HC orthos. I did not get a chance to try it with a larger AFOV. I would say the image was actually less than 2X though.

Using the OCS at the recommended position on the front of the diagonal I was only able to get the low and medium power settings, there was actually not enough out-focus to reach the highest power setting - but it was very close. I think if I use a 2" mirror diagonal instead of the 2" prism I may get all three powers to focus w/o an extension. I didn't get a chance to try my 2" AP Maxbright though.

Attaching the OCS to the nosepiece of the binos there was not enough in-focus, I was only able to get the high and medium settings.

The interesting thing was that the OCS in front of the diagonal gave me too much backfocus (or in-focus) - I would require an extension to get the high power, at least with the prism diagonal. It was awful close though.

As I said the seeing was average but I was again impressed with how bright and contrasty the images were with a nice neutral tone. And again these Bino27's are amazingly light and simple to use. I am so glad too they have the easy collimation feature, when properly collimated they are so utterly comfortable to use with absolutely no eye strain. If they ever do get knocked out of collimation again by a long eyepiece barrel or whatever, it's nice to know I can reset them in minutes.


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junomike
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5825928 - 04/27/13 09:27 AM

Quote:

The interesting thing was that the OCS in front of the diagonal gave me too much backfocus (or in-focus) - I would require an extension to get the high power, at least with the prism diagonal. It was awful close though.




I went through this as well, but with the EarthWin system on my AT111EDT. Same Issue though, not enough out travel in the "Barlow" position. If I used an extension (on the eyepiece side), the the Reducer mode didn't have enough in travel to reach focus.

What eventually worked for me was the use the OCS in the Diagonal, but placed into a 2" extension and then into the scope. With that configuration all three magnifications worked.


Mike


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Jeff B
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5826330 - 04/27/13 01:31 PM

Excellent Johnny.

At his request, I sent my new powerswitch back to Russ for evaluation. He just dropped me a note saying sure enough there was a problem with the barlow lens being cocked a tiny bit in its holder. He fixed it, tested it and sent it back already. Should have it on Monday. That's real customer service!

I'm really happy with the binotron. Can't wait to try out my new dovetail diagonal.

I bet you can get to all three positions using the AP diagonal.

Jeff


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Jeff B]
      #5827803 - 04/28/13 06:56 AM

Russ is amazingly quick with the repairs! Glad you got that sorted out Jeff. Yep I'm real happy with my B27 so far, what a gorgeous piece of kit all around.

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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5834825 - 05/01/13 05:13 PM Attachment (56 downloads)

Here's a photo of the B27's by the way...

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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5834829 - 05/01/13 05:14 PM Attachment (46 downloads)

And what the heck one more...

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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5837516 - 05/03/13 12:15 AM

Well I got a chance to try out the B27s with the Maxbright diagonal and as any mathlete could have guessed, I was unable to achieve focus at highest power and in fact barely got it at middle power. I got it wrong - I need more backfocus. [EDIT: I actually meant LESS backfocus, or more out-travel]. So I'll order part SR from Russ which is the OCS he makes for the Maxbright diagonal to use with refractors, to achieve focus at all three powers of the Powerswitch.

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HowardK
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5837669 - 05/03/13 05:28 AM

I would think that those collimating collars are eating up back focus

Nice though to be able to focus each ep on the fly though those collars look really high needing more back focus again

Thoughts Johnny?


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Jeff B
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: HowardK]
      #5837928 - 05/03/13 09:46 AM

Yes, the collimating collars do add about 12mm to the light path and gave me a problem using the Binotron sans OCS with one of my bino-friendly refractors.

My solution was Russ's new diagonal with the circular dovetail that lets you attach the viewer directly to the top of the diagonal body. It "gives back" or shortens the diagonal light path about 30-35MM.

I'll post pictures shortly.

Johnny, PM me as I've a spare SR.

Jeff


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: HowardK]
      #5838270 - 05/03/13 12:26 PM

Quote:

I would think that those collimating collars are eating up back focus

Nice though to be able to focus each ep on the fly though those collars look really high needing more back focus again

Thoughts Johnny?



When using the OCS/Powerswitch combination with my refractor I actually have a little too much out-focus, so I don't see the collimating collars as an issue. Plus you need a certain amount of length to the eyepiece holders anyway so the barrels can clear the prisms, I think the actual collimating mechanism isn't adding much if anything to the overall length.

As I noted earlier though, if the barrels are really long like my KK orthos and 13T6s then they will need to be parfocalized a bit shorter so as not to interfere with the collimating mechanism.


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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Jeff B]
      #5838276 - 05/03/13 12:29 PM

Yes ...the dovetail connector is a lifesaver...but too difficult with mine to loosen and rotate the position of the binos...so i had PRECISE PARTS make a T2 male connector on a dovetail connector ....... with a BAADER T2 bayonet attached...means the dovetail stays put in my DENK POWERSWITCH and i just loosen the bayonet thumbscrew to rotate the binos

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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: HowardK]
      #5846470 - 05/07/13 07:48 PM

Received my "Part SR" from Jeff B today in excellent condition, AND got my T2 connecter from Precise Parts which would allow me to connect my 1.25" Baader/Zeiss T2 Prism directly to the B27s a la the MkV for 1X viewing with my FS152.

And of course we have rain in the forecast!


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denis0007dl
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5846729 - 05/07/13 10:02 PM

Quote:

Received my "Part SR" from Jeff B today in excellent condition, AND got my T2 connecter from Precise Parts which would allow me to connect my 1.25" Baader/Zeiss T2 Prism directly to the B27s a la the MkV for 1X viewing with my FS152.

And of course we have rain in the forecast!




We hope clear night soon


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Jeff B
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: HowardK]
      #5846772 - 05/07/13 10:26 PM

Quote:

Yes ...the dovetail connector is a lifesaver...but too difficult with mine to loosen and rotate the position of the binos...so i had PRECISE PARTS make a T2 male connector on a dovetail connector ....... with a BAADER T2 bayonet attached...means the dovetail stays put in my DENK POWERSWITCH and i just loosen the bayonet thumbscrew to rotate the binos




Can you post pictures of this assembly?


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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: Jeff B]
      #5847905 - 05/08/13 02:30 PM Attachment (25 downloads)

Aha! I just realized the T2-07 change ring/dovetail, will attach to my new Precise Parts adapter and allow my Denk27s to not only be attached directly to my Baader/Zeiss T2 prism diagonal, but also to rotate just like the MkVs. Sweet. Here is the Precise Parts Adapter, which is B27/Denk on one side and T2 female on the other...

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johnnyha
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5847932 - 05/08/13 02:49 PM Attachment (26 downloads)

...and here is the adapter with the T2-07 change ring/dovetail. This will screw onto the nose of the B27's with or without the PowerXSwitch and allow me to attach the 1.25" prism diagonal (or 1.7X Newtonian Corrector) directly to the B27s a la the MkV's.

I will probably use this sparingly if at all though as I'm not really excited about removing and attaching the PowerSwitch too often. But it does give me the capability to reach 1X in my refractor and to use the MkV prism diagonal.


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HowardK
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5848200 - 05/08/13 04:53 PM

Gotta love Ashley at precise arts

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HowardK
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Re: DENK "BINOTRON" - FIRST LIGHT new [Re: HowardK]
      #5848201 - 05/08/13 04:54 PM

PRECISE PARTS

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