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Equipment Discussions >> Classic Telescopes

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Reged: 07/20/13

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Swift 831
      #6036849 - 08/20/13 04:12 PM

serial number 643003



















Edited by checksum (08/20/13 05:35 PM)


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mustgobigger
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6037076 - 08/20/13 06:25 PM

thats a pretty scope....looks very well made.
Very nice.


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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6037109 - 08/20/13 06:45 PM

Wow, that's in superb shape! How in the world did you find one in such like-new condition. Makes one wonder how many more of these are hidden away. Could you possibly post some close ups of the mount?

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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6037134 - 08/20/13 06:58 PM

just took a test pic through the 40mm eyepiece using my iPhone.. beware unprocessed!



Edited by checksum (08/20/13 07:24 PM)


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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6037151 - 08/20/13 07:05 PM

Gee, you must be in Europe. The Moon hasn't risen here in NH yet. Nice shot. Was there a 22mm Swift eyepiece in your kit? I don't recall ever seeing one.

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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6037175 - 08/20/13 07:19 PM

Oops my bad, that was using the 40mm!

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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6037180 - 08/20/13 07:23 PM

Quote:

Wow, that's in superb shape! How in the world did you find one in such like-new condition. Makes one wonder how many more of these are hidden away. Could you possibly post some close ups of the mount?










how is that?


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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6037183 - 08/20/13 07:28 PM

That's great. I want to do some comparisons between your 1966 and my 1960 mount. Much is the same, but I see a few differences at first glance. There aren't many of these to get some good comparisons.

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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6037208 - 08/20/13 07:45 PM

From the documentation and manual with the scope this was purchased in 1965 it seems so I guessed it was 1965, how do you know its a 1966?

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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6037408 - 08/20/13 10:33 PM

Oops, my mistake - 1964. The first two digits seem to give the year of mfg. I can't type for beans.

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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6038690 - 08/21/13 04:27 PM

I wonder what the parts of the serial number mean?

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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6038740 - 08/21/13 04:57 PM

It seems, after looking at the small number of Swift scopes in the registry, there was a change in serial numbering. In 1960, it looks as though the first two numbers were 60 regardless of aperture size, and the last three digits were the sequence numbers. Starting sometime in 1961, the first two digits are still the year of manufacture, but from then on, all 77mm (3") scopes had 3 for the third digit, followed by a three digit sequence number. All 50mm scopes had a 5 as the third digit and most 60mm scopes had a 6. Of course, I could be dead wrong.

Edited by CharlieB (08/21/13 05:03 PM)


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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6038749 - 08/21/13 05:06 PM

So if you buy into that reasoning, your scope was the third 3" made in 1964.

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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6038807 - 08/21/13 05:40 PM

fascinating! thanks for the info Charlie

Do you have a link to the registry?


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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6038815 - 08/21/13 05:44 PM

This scope does have some issues though, the paint on the main tube seems to be suffering from chicken pox, small blisters that reveal a black undercoat or possibly anodizing?

Could possibly use a respray but finding a colour match for the peachy colour is going to be difficult!


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Masvingo
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6038844 - 08/21/13 05:57 PM

Quote:

Do you have a link to the registry?




Here it is.

See message #4825052 to download the file.

Edited by Masvingo (08/21/13 05:58 PM)


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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: Masvingo]
      #6038921 - 08/21/13 06:40 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Do you have a link to the registry?




Here it is.

See message #4825052 to download the file.




Hmm.. im getting:

Access Denied.

If the post you are trying to find is an old post... you may be able to access it here: Archive Link

Please use your back button to return to the previous page.

Archive link seems dead as well


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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6038959 - 08/21/13 06:56 PM

Here's a direct link:

http://ccdastro.net/SWIFT%20REGISTRY.htm

Use Internet Explorer or the last column gets scrambled.


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Masvingo
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6038980 - 08/21/13 07:04 PM

Strange, works for me

@$€¥%# computers!


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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: Masvingo]
      #6038990 - 08/21/13 07:14 PM

Well if I login i get permission denied but if I log out I can see it.. but not post to it.. or edit anything...

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Masvingo
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6039005 - 08/21/13 07:23 PM

I think it's closed to posting as it's been archived but I don't need to log out to see it. Will need to try a different computer tomorrow and see how that goes.

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terraclarke
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: Masvingo]
      #6039153 - 08/21/13 08:59 PM

That is an absolutely gorgeous telescope. And it looks brand new. Simply amazing.

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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: terraclarke]
      #6040308 - 08/22/13 03:05 PM

Quote:

That is an absolutely gorgeous telescope. And it looks brand new. Simply amazing.




Thank you, yes I was quite chuffed with this one


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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6043288 - 08/24/13 10:20 AM

Added to the swift register, also replicated it here:

http://swift-telescopes.blogspot.com

Removed some of the tables to keep it easy to update if needed.


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tim53
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6043356 - 08/24/13 10:52 AM Attachment (13 downloads)

Very nice moon!

Someday, I'll come across one of these. I did pick up one Swift eyepiece (4mm, I think) at the RTMC swap meet this past may. So now I need a scope to put it in!

I took simple liberties with your image. Hope you don't mind:


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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: tim53]
      #6047101 - 08/26/13 02:25 PM

Quote:

Very nice moon!

Someday, I'll come across one of these. I did pick up one Swift eyepiece (4mm, I think) at the RTMC swap meet this past may. So now I need a scope to put it in!

I took simple liberties with your image. Hope you don't mind:




That looks great

Original


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tim53
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6048805 - 08/27/13 01:08 PM Attachment (9 downloads)

Wow, there's still a lot of potential there!

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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: tim53]
      #6049331 - 08/27/13 05:30 PM

very nice work there Tim, so I guess this ones a keeper

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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6054499 - 08/30/13 02:03 PM

This looks pretty close to the original paint color for the swift 831



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nightfisher
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6055904 - 08/31/13 11:39 AM

That lunar shot is superb, gives me a lot of hope for my little 839, by the way, there is an 831 on ebay uk

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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: nightfisher]
      #6056382 - 08/31/13 04:38 PM

Yes spotted that earlier this week, looks like a very early model as the focus knobs are not painted.

Not sure about the mount though any idea who made it?



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nightfisher
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6057097 - 09/01/13 04:46 AM

Its a Charles franks mount, sturdy but looks a bit tired, i fancy an 831 but wont be bidding on this

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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: nightfisher]
      #6057146 - 09/01/13 05:48 AM

Your right I found another picture of a Charles Frank mount but this one seems to be missing quite a lot of bits, worm wheels, setting circles etc..

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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6062059 - 09/04/13 02:17 AM

Some evidence to support the Swift to Takahashi lineage:


http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=classics&a...,,,,,,All_Forums,,,,,,&Words=&Searchpage=5&Limit=25&Main=5018951&Search=true&where=&Name=160349&daterange=&newerval=&newertype=&olderval=&oldertype=&bodyprev=#Post5018951

Picture of the first Takahashi telescope the TS65:


http://www.astrosurf.com/re/taka_telescopes.html


http://www.astrosurf.com/sogorb/takahashi/TS65_P02s.jpg



A later 1975 TS65 and quite a lot has changed since the original but the evidence is still there:

http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/5359187/Main...

Now if I were a betting man...


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6408315 - 03/03/14 09:20 PM

I guess it's time to resurrect this thread.
Last night I purchased a 1964 Swift Model 831 from David, Lee, and the exceptionally nice people at the San Jose Astronomical Association. What a pleasure to be with fellow astronomy enthusiasts, and such outstanding people. Thank you, David!

The Swift that I purchased is SN 643028, so we have another Swift to add to the Registry.

I got it home and set it on top of the Unitron and Mayflower boxes (protected).



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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408322 - 03/03/14 09:24 PM

I have to admit, I was definitely pleasantly surprised to see the original tag still attached to the handle - the one that says: "Dealers Note: Do not remove this tag. It should be attached when you make delivery to the customer." This was taken very seriously!!



A view of the SN and the Note:



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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408328 - 03/03/14 09:26 PM

The OTA was wrapped in it's original plastic, as were the finder and other parts...a very good sign!



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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408339 - 03/03/14 09:29 PM

Beneath the tripod was a plastic bag with the original manual (in like new condition), and map of the heavens, and the moon map that was drawn by Dr. Shusuke Kojima, the brains and driving force behind the Swift scopes.



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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408342 - 03/03/14 09:32 PM

Another view of the inside of the case showing the mount, the finder in the upper left, and clam shell for the finder below it. If you look to the right, you see a place where something is missing - the Tripod Head!



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Bomber Bob
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408345 - 03/03/14 09:34 PM

Bob, she is showroom beautiful!

Congratulations!!


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408350 - 03/03/14 09:36 PM

From left to right there's the erecting prism, the eyepiece diagonal, Telescope tube adapter, 6mm, 9mm and 40mm eyepieces, and the 2X Barlow.



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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408356 - 03/03/14 09:39 PM

The lens is in very good condition - no scratches. However it needs some careful cleaning and there is a small spot of mold that needs to be removed. I'm going to wait a while before cleaning. I want to get some views in first!



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gelkin
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408360 - 03/03/14 09:42 PM Attachment (3 downloads)

Congrats I love an 831. Everything looks great. Mine was in dreadful condition. WAS

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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408361 - 03/03/14 09:42 PM

Since I don't have the Tripod Head, I put the OTA on my 80mm Mayflower mount. The Mayflower didn't seem to mind, and the Swift does look mighty fine on it! I've noticed that the Mayflower has a much more substantial mount than does the Swift. However, the Swift has a far superior finder than does the Mayflower.



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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408367 - 03/03/14 09:44 PM

A view of the way the Finder mounts onto the Swift OTA - very nice design! In fact, I can also mount the Swift finder on the Mayflower OTA. It's only fair since they are sharing mounts.



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roscoe
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408371 - 03/03/14 09:47 PM

Those are interesting legs! I've never seen an 831 with any other than the rounded reddish-brown ones. It's a real shame that the tripod hub is not included! Hopefully, someone has a 'basket-case' mount that they would part out.....
and also, if anyone has a box of 831 parts, I'm looking for a focuser knob set....mine came with one side broken off.....


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408374 - 03/03/14 09:48 PM

I really like the mechanics of the eyepiece adapter tube with the 14 etched marks for correct positioning. Another fine feature is the way the Swift has the knurled knobs for securing the draw tube and diagonal, and eyepiece in position. What an excellent design!! I'm very impressed. And does this scope look new, or what?!?



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gelkin
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408379 - 03/03/14 09:49 PM

Looks excellent.

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roscoe
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: roscoe]
      #6408383 - 03/03/14 09:51 PM

It certainly looks right at home on that Mayflower mount!

And, if you haven't had it apart, the finder has an actual achromat objective, not the single DCX lens used in most finders!


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408388 - 03/03/14 09:53 PM

That's all the pictures for now. Once again I'd like to thank Dave for contacting me regarding this really fine telescope. Dave is also checking to see if the prior owner still has the Tripod Head sitting around. Hopefully they can find it. If not, I would appreciate any help in locating one. As a last resort, I could build one...but not anxious to do that.

And one last thing, this Swift 831 is an anniversary present to me from my darling wife!! Am I a lucky man, or what!?!? When I get it outside, I want to take her picture next to the telescope. I'm calling it my "Susy" scope.


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408394 - 03/03/14 09:56 PM

Thanks Bob, Russ and Gerald! It is definitely a fine scope and I can't wait for some nice CA night skies. Unfortunately it has to pick now to reduce the drought!
Russ, I did notice that the find actually has achromat objective. It has the same little silver spaces as the objective of the main scope. They spared no expense with the finder.


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roscoe
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408415 - 03/03/14 10:07 PM Attachment (5 downloads)

And....I'm VERY jealous of your focuser! Mine has considerably more mileage.....

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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408418 - 03/03/14 10:10 PM

That is an outstanding example of an 831. It's a shame the hub is missing, but you are right - the Mayflower mount is somewhat better. In the end, it's the view that counts, and I guarantee you'll like the views. I rarely use the Swift mount that came with my 831. I also agree with roscoe in that those legs don't appear to be the originals. Mine was missing the legs also, and I have tried many different legs onthe hub. Most work fine, but I've never found a way to make them fit into the box.
My 831 is from 1960 and seems to lack some of the refinements of later ones. It also had a few condition issues, but the optics are wonderful.
Welcome to the land of Swift!


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: roscoe]
      #6408425 - 03/03/14 10:12 PM

I'm very fortunate to have the scope in such fine condition. I'm excited to see how the 79mm f/13 Swift compares with the 80mm f/15 Mayflower. It should be quite a contest!

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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408439 - 03/03/14 10:17 PM

I had that same contest a few days ago viewing the Sun. It was too close to call. The Moon awaits for a rematch.

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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408444 - 03/03/14 10:19 PM

Charlie, you are right, these aren't Swift tripod legs. I just put the Swift OTA on my beefed up Mayflower mount. I would like to have the Swift tripod hub to have a complete Swift 831, but even with the hub I would build a much more substantial tripod. The original Swift tripod legs are a little short and much too thin.

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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: gelkin]
      #6408451 - 03/03/14 10:23 PM

Quote:

Congrats I love an 831. Everything looks great. Mine was in dreadful condition. WAS




Well, Gerald, you sure do have it looking great now!! Excellent renovation!


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strdst
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408484 - 03/03/14 10:36 PM Attachment (2 downloads)

Didn't know if you knew about the retractable dew shield. Nice feature.

The more I collect and get to actually use these fine instruments the more I am impressed with some of these not real long FL refractors. The Swift 831 at 77mmX1000mm fl and the Lafayette at 76X910 are outstanding! IIRC the Swift gives a warm tone to Jupiter and even Saturn. Just like Nippon Kogaku glass does. I like that.

I think when/if you get to use the Swift mount you will be pleasantly surprised how stable and vibration limiting it actually is. I see others don't agree, maybe I'm just too patient. I hope the seller can find the hub for you!


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: strdst]
      #6408534 - 03/03/14 11:18 PM

Quote:

Didn't know if you knew about the retractable dew shield. Nice feature.

The more I collect and get to actually use these fine instruments the more I am impressed with some of these not real long FL refractors. The Swift 831 at 77mmX1000mm fl and the Lafayette at 76X910 are outstanding! IIRC the Swift gives a warm tone to Jupiter and even Saturn. Just like Nippon Kogaku glass does. I like that.

I think when/if you get to use the Swift mount you will be pleasantly surprised how stable and vibration limiting it actually is. I see others don't agree, maybe I'm just too patient. I hope the seller can find the hub for you!




Thanks, Keith. I hope so too. I haven't had the heart to mention to my wife that the tripod hub was missing since she gave it to me as a gift. She's been really patient with my telescope passion.

I love the retractable dew shield. There's nothing about the OTA that I haven't found to be extremely well designed. I've been blown away by the views with the Mayflower, so if the Swift even approaches that, I'll be really pleased.


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AstroPhys
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408546 - 03/03/14 11:26 PM

That is a beautiful piece of equipment. I am so impressed with the quality of every aspect of the Swift telescopes.
I hope to be a proud owner myself some day.
Congratulations!!


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Masvingo
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: AstroPhys]
      #6408735 - 03/04/14 03:36 AM

Wow, lovely scope, and in great condition. Fingers crossed that the previous owner can locate the hub. Congratulations on your new scope (and anniversary!)

Incidentally, I see the Swift on a Charles Frank mount mentioned by Nightfisher and Checksum is back on Ebay.


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: Masvingo]
      #6408925 - 03/04/14 08:36 AM

Thanks, Dan and James! So far, no hub, but I haven't given up hope. I think that even a Mayflower or Monolux hub would work with the Swift mount. They might be easier to find.

- Bob


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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6408965 - 03/04/14 09:06 AM Attachment (4 downloads)

Quote:

Thanks, Dan and James! So far, no hub, but I haven't given up hope. I think that even a Mayflower or Monolux hub would work with the Swift mount. They might be easier to find.

- Bob




I had the same idea, so I checked a spare Monolux 76mm mount I have and it looks almost exactly that same, but black. However, the diameter of the hole is a bit smaller than the 831 - at least my 831. You could bore it out just a bit, but it might make the walls a bit too thin.


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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6408967 - 03/04/14 09:06 AM Attachment (5 downloads)

hub...

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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6408979 - 03/04/14 09:18 AM Attachment (5 downloads)

If you do find a suitable hub, you can paint it with Rustoleum Multicolor Textured Autumn Brown spray can. It's as close as you could ever get to the original mount paint. I repainted my entire mount and it's difficult to tell it from the original color. Here is a before and after on the knobs.

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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6408992 - 03/04/14 09:24 AM

Thanks, Charlie! I checked the plug that would insert into the hole in the hub. It would be possible to machine in down a slight amount. If it stays cloudy, tonight I'll do the same check with the Mayflower hub. I suspect that the Mayflower and Monolux hubs are identical.

- Bob


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6408999 - 03/04/14 09:26 AM

Quote:

If you do find a suitable hub, you can paint it with Rustoleum Multicolor Textured Autumn Brown spray can. It's as close as you could ever get to the original mount paint. I repainted my entire mount and it's difficult to tell it from the original color. Here is a before and after on the knobs.




Perfect! Thanks! I had been wondering what color would be the closest match. You solved my question before I even asked!


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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6409004 - 03/04/14 09:28 AM Attachment (4 downloads)

Here's the whole mount, painted.

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roscoe
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6409013 - 03/04/14 09:34 AM

Quote:

However, the diameter of the hole is a bit smaller than the 831 - at least my 831. You could bore it out just a bit, but it might make the walls a bit too thin.




If you found a hub, you could perhaps JB-epoxy some sort of ring into the bottom of the hub to thicken the walls back up.


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roscoe
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: roscoe]
      #6409017 - 03/04/14 09:38 AM

Charlie,

Thanks for the paint tip! I was about to go to the auto parts place downtown that specializes in paint matching, (it's where all the vintage car guys go), and get a pint custom made for my tripod hardware, which is in poor condition. My mount seems good enough that a thorough cleaning will hopefully do the trick.....


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6409035 - 03/04/14 09:52 AM

Quote:

Here's the whole mount, painted.




Beautiful paint job, Charlie. You have it looking brand new!

- Bob


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: roscoe]
      #6409038 - 03/04/14 09:53 AM

Quote:

Quote:

However, the diameter of the hole is a bit smaller than the 831 - at least my 831. You could bore it out just a bit, but it might make the walls a bit too thin.




If you found a hub, you could perhaps JB-epoxy some sort of ring into the bottom of the hub to thicken the walls back up.




Good point! And with Charlie's paint recommendation, it might not even be noticed!

- Bob


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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6409204 - 03/04/14 11:16 AM

Great find Bob. Its beautiful! Will this hub work?

http://www.cloudynights.com/classifieds/showproduct.php?product=97264&sor...

You could always have a bushing/adapter machined out of aluminum to mate the original mount to this hub. Then just find a wrinkle finish tan and spray paint it to match.


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: terraclarke]
      #6409284 - 03/04/14 12:10 PM

Quote:

Great find Bob. Its beautiful! Will this hub work?

http://www.cloudynights.com/classifieds/showproduct.php?product=97264&sor...

You could always have a bushing/adapter machined out of aluminum to mate the original mount to this hub. Then just find a wrinkle finish tan and spray paint it to match.




Thanks, Terra! I will check out the dimensions when I get home tonight. It's definitely a possibility!

- Bob


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Stargoat
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6409448 - 03/04/14 01:35 PM Attachment (1 downloads)

Quote:

Quote:

Thanks, Dan and James! So far, no hub, but I haven't given up hope. I think that even a Mayflower or Monolux hub would work with the Swift mount. They might be easier to find.

- Bob




I had the same idea, so I checked a spare Monolux 76mm mount I have and it looks almost exactly that same, but black. However, the diameter of the hole is a bit smaller than the 831 - at least my 831. You could bore it out just a bit, but it might make the walls a bit too thin.




Hello Bob and Charlie, with respect to a replacement hub for your Swift Bob, I see the base lock bolt and possibly the think washer in your photo of the wooden box.

I've seen this of course on Swift and Eikow branded scopes among others.

Charlie, will any brand of base work for Bob that will accept the hand lock bolt to secure the bottom of the base to the mount head?

Here is a photo of a Eikow mount with the thick washer and hand lock nut that GravaT posted.

Stephen


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: Stargoat]
      #6409466 - 03/04/14 01:42 PM

Hi Stephen,
Tonight I will see exactly what I have. I know I have the bolt lock and washer. I know the hub is missing. Beyond that I didn't check it carefully and instead turned my attention to the OTA that I was really happy about rather than concentrate on the mount, which I was not too happy about. I find that it's better to look at the "unhappy things" after a day or two has passed and you can view the situation more objectively.

- Bob


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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: Stargoat]
      #6409490 - 03/04/14 01:55 PM Attachment (2 downloads)

Quote:


Charlie, will any brand of base work for Bob that will accept the hand lock bolt to secure the bottom of the base to the mount head?
Quote:




That's a good question. The width of the opening of the base that secures the RA/DEC assemblies on this Monolux mount is about 38mm. One could use the entire base, not just the hub if the Swift assembly would fit well. I don't have my Swift mount here at work, so I'll check on the width when I get home tonight.

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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6409501 - 03/04/14 02:00 PM Attachment (3 downloads)

Here's a pre-restoration shot of the same part from my 831. Looks identical.

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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6409529 - 03/04/14 02:17 PM

Hmmm...I might be missing the base that secures the RA/DEC assemblies as well as the hub. I'll find out as soon as I get home. Work always gets in the way fun telescope projects!!

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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6409618 - 03/04/14 02:57 PM

It looked like all of the rest of the mount was there in the photos of the box.

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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6409653 - 03/04/14 03:19 PM

Ahh, you're right, Charlie...it is!! I should look at my own photos more often! So all I need is the hub.

- Bob


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roscoe
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6409696 - 03/04/14 03:42 PM

Good to hear! Now, if the hub option Terra suggested will fit your legs, that and a can of Charlie's matching paint, and you're in business, at least till a 'real' hub appears....

Only thing I noticed is that hub has slotted holes, so be careful that the whole thing doesn't pop off the legs at entirely the wrong moment, or perhaps epoxy some sort of bushings or brackets in underneath to prevent that.
R


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: roscoe]
      #6409732 - 03/04/14 03:57 PM

Quote:

Good to hear! Now, if the hub option Terra suggested will fit your legs, that and a can of Charlie's matching paint, and you're in business, at least till a 'real' hub appears....

Only thing I noticed is that hub has slotted holes, so be careful that the whole thing doesn't pop off the legs at entirely the wrong moment, or perhaps epoxy some sort of bushings or brackets in underneath to prevent that.
R




Good point about the slotted holes. I'm still getting used to that with the Mayflower mount. I've wondered about what was the rationale behind that design. Must have been so that you don't have to turn the wing nut so many times to disassemble - couple of turns and we can just let the leg fall to the ground, dangling from the chain. Not the brightest idea!!


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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: roscoe]
      #6409757 - 03/04/14 04:05 PM

The dimensions of Sheldon's hubs is just about the same as the Monolux. The only problem might be the hole diameter. I don't care much for the drop-out slots, but that can be addressed.

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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6409769 - 03/04/14 04:09 PM

Thanks, Charlie. I sure do appreciate all the help you are giving me. I'll check the plug dimension this evening, and if it is good, I'll get the hub. Heck, I might as well get it now. If nothing else, it would be a good spare to help someone else out in the future.

- Bob


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6409783 - 03/04/14 04:19 PM

Let me add that I sure do appreciate the help that EVERYONE has been. I've said it before, but I'll say it again, what a great bunch of people we have here in the Classics forum!!


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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6409789 - 03/04/14 04:22 PM

PM sent.

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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6410692 - 03/05/14 12:12 AM

I've purchased the hub that a Terra pointed me too. It has a 1.1" diameter hole and the post is 7/8" in diameter. I have metal foil to build up the post for a snug fit, so this might work, at least until the actual one is found. I'm still hopeful that the original will turn up.

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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6410704 - 03/05/14 12:21 AM

Tonight had high cirrus clouds cover all but the brightest objects, but I still had to bright out the Swift 831. The Moon, Jupiter, and M42 were the targets for the 40mm, 9mm, and 6mm Swift eyepieces and the 2x Swift Barlow. The 831 could handle all the power and provided sharp views of the Moon features and Jupiter. It will be interesting to see what it can do on a good night. So far I'm really satisfied and expect the Swift to give the Mayflower some serious competition.

- Bob


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checksum
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6454797 - 04/08/14 02:24 PM

Congratulations on your 831 it looks amazing condition!

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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: checksum]
      #6454802 - 04/08/14 03:27 PM

Thank you, James!

- Bob


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6463024 - 04/12/14 10:50 PM

Like chocolates, no matter how good it looks on the outside, what's on the inside can ruin it. The last time I had the Swift 831 out for observing, I noticed how badly the mount functioned. I would lock up in certain positions, and often the slow motion controls seems to have little or no effect on the positioning.
Since I wasn't at NEAF and had nothing else going on today, I decided to take the 831 mount apart, clean it, put new grease where it needs to go, and make sure that it is put together correctly. After what I've seen today, I believe that at some point, someone took it apart and didn't put it back together quite as it should have been.

The beginning of dis-assembly immediately revealed old, congealed grease that was more like tar.



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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6463028 - 04/12/14 10:51 PM

The more I dismantled the mount, the worse it got.



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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6463029 - 04/12/14 10:52 PM

The entire tangent arm assembly was so gooey, that it you touched it, the goo would stick to your fingers.



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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6463030 - 04/12/14 10:54 PM

Another view of the gooey, tar-like grease that was supposed to lubricate. It was more like a mixture of honey and butterscotch.



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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6463034 - 04/12/14 10:55 PM

The RA assembly was beginning to come apart and show the same gooey consistency.



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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6463035 - 04/12/14 10:56 PM

It was amazing that the RA worm and gear could turn at all.



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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6463037 - 04/12/14 10:57 PM

The same gooey mess was on the worm.



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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6463045 - 04/12/14 11:07 PM

I should have taken pictures of the process of cleaning each part. I used two different heavy duty degreasers, toothbrush, brass brush, rags, etc, to remove every bit of old grease. It's interesting how you often find gooey grease on areas that should never have been greased in the first place. Often people put grease on everything, and that can be just as much of a problem as too little grease where it should be.

The dec axis is tricky with the Swift 831. The Declination indicator wheel is attached to a female threaded part which then screws onto the dec axis. But first you have to add the set screw, threading it in just enough so that the part can be inserted and turned, but now so tight that it binds on the threads. Then it's a matter of proper tightening before tightening the set screw though a small hole on dec axis. It was also apparent that a washer had been omitted the last time this was put together. This is what had caused the binding. When the dec axis had been turned, it tightened against the declination indicator piece. I added a washer, properly adjusted the threaded piece, and it works beautifully.
Here is the Swift 831 set up to observe with the C-11 in the background.



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CharlieB
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6463062 - 04/12/14 11:29 PM

Boy, does all of that have a familiar ring to it! The grease on mine was more or less solidified. On your dec worm, was there what looked to be a lock washer acting as a type of preload? There was one on mine and I couldn't tell if it was original or not.

Great job on the rebuild.

Charlie


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6463202 - 04/13/14 01:46 AM

Charlie,
I did have a lock washer on my worm for the RA. You can see it 3 posts above, on the right side of the worm. There was also one on the opposite side, but I've already removed it before taking the picture. I guess it does act as a type of preload, but I'm really not sure that it was a great idea.

I also didn't mention that my tripod legs were in terrible shape with many dings and scratches. I picked up the Gunstock Minwax stain and it matched perfectly and made the tripod look new with little effort. I was dreading the prospect of having to sand the entire tripod down and starting over. Now I don't have too.

- Bob


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roscoe
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6463585 - 04/13/14 09:56 AM

Thanks for the mount dis-assembly photos and tips! The mount is the only un-touched part of my restoration, and I'll be printing out this info to have on the bench as I work!
There was a very nicely restored 831 at NEAF, definitely holding its own in the flock of Unitrons!


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: roscoe]
      #6463626 - 04/13/14 10:14 AM

Thanks, Russ. I would have taken more pics, but I was hesitant to touch my camera so often. The grease had become the consistency of a roll of fly paper (if you have ever seen that), so between that and the degreaser on my fingers, it was nasty.
I recommend recording with pencil and paper the order of the washers everywhere there is a washer. You have brass, rubber and lock washers, and it's easy to forget the correct order after cleaning everything.

Glad to hear about the Swift 831 at NEAF!! They sure are beautiful and well-made scopes.

- Bob


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Bomber Bob
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: CharlieB]
      #6463673 - 04/13/14 10:39 AM

"It's interesting how you often find gooey grease on areas that should never have been greased in the first place."

It does make for some head-scratching moments!

Bob, thanks for the restoration photos & narratives. These threads are helpful for many owners of vintage Japanese scopes.


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Bomber Bob
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: Bomber Bob]
      #6463680 - 04/13/14 10:42 AM

(And the Swift refractors are so pretty!!)

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Geo31
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: Bomber Bob]
      #6464019 - 04/13/14 01:56 PM

Quote:

"It's interesting how you often find gooey grease on areas that should never have been greased in the first place."

It does make for some head-scratching moments!




It's simple ignorance.

When I tore down my C5 to clean and lube, it was covered with sticky red automotive grease. And it was everywhere, even places would normally NOT be lubed, such as the declination lock on the shaft!

The really funny thing is the C5 and C8 use Oilite bearings, sintered bronze bushings impregnated with oil. No way in hell there should be grease on that.

People just thing grease is good and more grease is more gooder. A lot of folks with little mechanical aptitude or sympathy.


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Bomber Bob
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: Geo31]
      #6464179 - 04/13/14 03:49 PM

"grease is good and more grease is more gooder"

IME, only when frying chicken!

Has anyone ever posted what type of lube the Japanese makers used back then - it always seems to turn to sticky pitch.


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rcwolpert
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Re: Swift 831 new [Re: Bomber Bob]
      #6464296 - 04/13/14 04:59 PM

Quote:

"grease is good and more grease is more gooder"

IME, only when frying chicken!

Has anyone ever posted what type of lube the Japanese makers used back then - it always seems to turn to sticky pitch.




I did a while back. Many, if not most, old telescopes from Japan were lubed with cosmoline, which dries as hard as a rock after time. It was used a lot during WWII for greasing up and protecting weapons, but after a number of years of exposure to air, it becomes gummy and hard.

- Bob


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rcwolpert
professor emeritus


Reged: 08/13/12

Loc: San Jose, CA
Re: Swift 831 new [Re: Bomber Bob]
      #6464300 - 04/13/14 05:02 PM

Quote:

(And the Swift refractors are so pretty!!)




They really are! I think they can hold their own against most telescope similarly equipped.

- Bob


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Bomber Bob
scholastic sledgehammer
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Reged: 07/09/13

Loc: The Deep South, USA
Re: Swift 831 new [Re: rcwolpert]
      #6464480 - 04/13/14 07:07 PM

"Many, if not most, old telescopes from Japan were lubed with cosmoline, which dries as hard as a rock after time."

That's the truth! Add decades of smoke & dust, and a mount is practically immobile.


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DocFinance
sage
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Reged: 01/14/14

Loc: Clear Lake, Texas
Re: Swift 831 new [Re: Bomber Bob]
      #6464483 - 04/13/14 07:11 PM

That explains it! That stuff is awful when it hardens.

Cosmoline is best taken off with gasoline or something similarly nasty.

I think the Celestron 80 I got at Christmas has that junk on the focuser.


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Geo31
Pooh-Bah
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Reged: 01/28/13

Loc: Kingwood, TX
Re: Swift 831 new [Re: DocFinance]
      #6464620 - 04/13/14 08:39 PM

Carb cleaner is great for getting off gummed up lube. Just don't get it on any paint.

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rcwolpert
professor emeritus


Reged: 08/13/12

Loc: San Jose, CA
Re: Swift 831 new [Re: Geo31]
      #6464694 - 04/13/14 09:29 PM

Quote:

Carb cleaner is great for getting off gummed up lube. Just don't get it on any paint.




That's basically one of the things I used - engine cleaner.

- Bob


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