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FlashGordan
member
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Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Another RV-6 restoration
      #6310510 - 01/13/14 03:33 PM

I'm now the proud owner of a RV-6. It is my first "classic" scope. And I'm really stoked to be getting it. Now for the downside, it is in sorry shape. Hopefully some of the restoration experts can point me in the right direction for parts and information. I'll post some pictures later on tonight.

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youngamateur42
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 11/21/12

Loc: La Verne, CA
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6310517 - 01/13/14 03:34 PM

My first classic to, heck of a scope, have fun!!

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FlashGordan
member
*****

Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: youngamateur42]
      #6310540 - 01/13/14 03:44 PM

Thanks Justin. I read your entire threads on your RV-6 and the 12.5". Awesome stories!

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FlashGordan
member
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Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6310945 - 01/13/14 07:37 PM

Got the pictures uploaded. So on with the show...


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FlashGordan
member
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Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6310949 - 01/13/14 07:39 PM

It's not bad looking from 20ft off.


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FlashGordan
member
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Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6310954 - 01/13/14 07:40 PM

But there are some really bad spots.


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FlashGordan
member
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Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6310962 - 01/13/14 07:43 PM

And the one thing that worries me the most.


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youngamateur42
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 11/21/12

Loc: La Verne, CA
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6311004 - 01/13/14 08:03 PM

Nice! Nothing that can't be fixed up though. That tube cradle I'd ask someone what they think. Someone on here has a '59 Cave and their pier leg was snapped off and it was fixed like new. There are several different models/versions of the RV-6, and by seeing you have the nameplate it's older than 1971. Pop open the motor cover and on the motor you'll see the serial number with the date. That looks like a really fun project, I really enjoyed restoring mine. There's several people on here that know how to fix just about every part on this scope so I'm excited to see how you'll restore it!

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FlashGordan
member
*****

Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: youngamateur42]
      #6311037 - 01/13/14 08:17 PM

I have a closeup picture of the serial number plate.


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Datapanic
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Reged: 10/17/09

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6311457 - 01/13/14 11:57 PM

Looks restorable to me! Try to get that cradle repair first so it doesn't hold up the rest of the project. A machine shop should be able to weld it back together.

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Brent Campbell
sage


Reged: 02/09/10

Loc: Olympia, WA
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6311628 - 01/14/14 04:51 AM

I was also bidding on that scope. You got it for a heck of a good price. Well done! That looks like a scope to be proud of!

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Qwickdraw
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 03/03/12

Loc: Ann Arbor, MI
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6311681 - 01/14/14 06:20 AM

Quote:

And the one thing that worries me the most.





JB Weld


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sgorton99
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Reged: 04/30/08

Loc: Wisconsin, Madison
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: youngamateur42]
      #6311697 - 01/14/14 06:44 AM

Quote:

Nice! Nothing that can't be fixed up though. That tube cradle I'd ask someone what they think. Someone on here has a '59 Cave and their pier leg was snapped off and it was fixed like new. There are several different models/versions of the RV-6, and by seeing you have the nameplate it's older than 1971. Pop open the motor cover and on the motor you'll see the serial number with the date. That looks like a really fun project, I really enjoyed restoring mine. There's several people on here that know how to fix just about every part on this scope so I'm excited to see how you'll restore it!




Nice, looks like an enjoyable and worthy project! I am the someone who has the '59 Cave with the repaired leg. Click on my thread in my signature line below to see the repair and pics.

Steve


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Geo31
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 01/28/13

Loc: Kingwood, TX
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: sgorton99]
      #6311725 - 01/14/14 07:40 AM

Looks like a fun project. Looking forward to the resto pics.

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Chuck HardsModerator
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Reged: 05/03/10

Loc: The Great Basin
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: Geo31]
      #6311768 - 01/14/14 08:24 AM

I've welded cast aluminum before. I'd first make a jig to clamp both pieces in the proper position relative to one another. Then I'd pack ice on both pieces leaving only the cleaned area to be welded exposed. The ice helps prevent distortion from the heat of the arc.

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FlashGordan
member
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Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: Brent Campbell]
      #6311771 - 01/14/14 08:27 AM

Quote:

I was also bidding on that scope. You got it for a heck of a good price. Well done! That looks like a scope to be proud of!




Then you know exactly how much I paid for it. Just about the price when it was brand new.


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FlashGordan
member
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Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: I finally made the big time... new [Re: Chuck Hards]
      #6311772 - 01/14/14 08:29 AM

Quote:

I've welded cast aluminum before. I'd first make a jig to clamp both pieces in the proper position relative to one another. Then I'd pack ice on both pieces leaving only the cleaned area to be welded exposed. The ice helps prevent distortion from the heat of the arc.




I've seen it done. But the welder used cold, wet rags to keep the warpage to a minimum.


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FlashGordan
member
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Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6312846 - 01/14/14 05:34 PM

Haven't heard from the seller yet as to when the scope will be shipped. But I know it will get here soon enough. Just a couple questions, does anyone know where I can get the mirrors recoated if the mirrors need it? Preferably somewhere here in the northeast. And second, does anyone have a recommendation on collimation tools? Something good but cheap. My wife is bugging me that I'm spending too much money even though everything I have bought so far has been used and secondhand. Except for the Zhumell zoom lens. And that was supposedly the cheapest zoom lens on the market.

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TOM KIEHL
Pooh-Bah
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Reged: 11/17/12

Loc: N.E. Ohio
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6312853 - 01/14/14 05:41 PM

http://www.majestic-coatings.com/

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Mr Magoo
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 11/05/05

Loc: Indiana
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6312854 - 01/14/14 05:41 PM

Majestic Optical Coatings
Majestic Optical Coatings
152 Willow Way | Clark, NJ 07066
Ph: (888) 278-8308

Jeff Decker- Sales@majestic-coatings.com


I won't use anyone else. Very quick turn around and my coatings have been flawless. You may even be able to hand deliver it which would be a big savings over shipping it.


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Compressorguy
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 03/14/09

Loc: Clayton, NC
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Mr Magoo]
      #6312904 - 01/14/14 06:06 PM

Great find there "Flash". These are really great scopes with typicaly very good optics. This should prove to be a very rewarding project. The best collimation tool you have is absolutely free and that's your eyes and a star. Wife can't complain too much about that. Not sure of your level of proficiency collimating scopes but here are several good references to view.

http://www.andysshotglass.com/Collimating.html

http://www.garyseronik.com/?q=node/165

Here's a link to my RV-6 and it's resto.

http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/4488240/page...

Hope you enjoy your new project. It should provide you with some fantastic views!! Can't wait to see more photos!!


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FlashGordan
member
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Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Mr Magoo]
      #6313734 - 01/15/14 06:16 AM

Quote:

Majestic Optical Coatings
Majestic Optical Coatings
152 Willow Way | Clark, NJ 07066
Ph: (888) 278-8308

Jeff Decker- Sales@majestic-coatings.com


I won't use anyone else. Very quick turn around and my coatings have been flawless. You may even be able to hand deliver it which would be a big savings over shipping it.




Clark, NJ is about two hours north of me. I might have to stop there on my next trip into NYC.


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FlashGordan
member
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Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Compressorguy]
      #6313737 - 01/15/14 06:29 AM

Quote:

Great find there "Flash". These are really great scopes with typicaly very good optics. This should prove to be a very rewarding project. The best collimation tool you have is absolutely free and that's your eyes and a star. Wife can't complain too much about that. Not sure of your level of proficiency collimating scopes but here are several good references to view.

http://www.andysshotglass.com/Collimating.html

http://www.garyseronik.com/?q=node/165

Here's a link to my RV-6 and it's resto.

http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/4488240/page...

Hope you enjoy your new project. It should provide you with some fantastic views!! Can't wait to see more photos!!




Thank you for the links. I don't know if I'll be able to do the collimation with my eyes on the RV-6 without a little help. It was a lot easier with 4504 because it is definitely a lot shorter. And I also got a chance to read through your RV-6 thread. Very nice scope!! Just seems that your scope didn't look nearly as bad as mine is now. I've done restorations and repairs on classic cars. This won't be much different in my opinion.


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snork
sage
*****

Reged: 01/27/12

Loc: NE Ohio
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6313810 - 01/15/14 07:52 AM

Yes your scope is a little rough but it definetly is not beyond repair. You will have a very nice vintage telescope when you are done. I was following this on eBay also
Here's an image of my Dynascope 10, which is my profile picture, before it was restored. It was pretty rough. Good luck and have fun!



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FlashGordan
member
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Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: snork]
      #6314349 - 01/15/14 12:58 PM

Thanks Dan. Your Dynascope 10 looked like it needed some serious cleaning in the before picture. How much restoration did you actually have to go through to get it looking like it is now?

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snork
sage
*****

Reged: 01/27/12

Loc: NE Ohio
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6315256 - 01/15/14 07:50 PM

Rob, the tube had 2 layers of paint and was cracking badly, so I stripped the tube completely to the Bakelite and repainted. The previous owner also hacked a hole for a 2" focuser and moved the spider towards the primary...had to fill those holes. Stripped and repainted all the painted aluminum and steel parts. I was able to knock off the surface rust and loose paint on the pier and repainted it. Polished and buffed all the non painted aluminum parts. Luckily, even though the mirror was filthy, it was in remarkably good condition. It took a couple of months in my spare time.

It was a very rewarding experience and hope you experience the same bringing a neglected beauty back to life. Also, this forum is a great resource with a lot of knowledgeable people and most are more than willing to help.


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apfever
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 05/13/08

Loc: Colorado
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: snork]
      #6318607 - 01/17/14 01:01 PM

DAN,

Did you remove the RA and DEC shafts from the housings? This has been my stopping point on mine. It seems that Criterion did not recess a spot on the shaft where the lock knobs contact it. This resulted in building up a ridge on the shaft that keeps it from coming out of the housing.
I can press the shafts out but any ridge will likely damage the housing seat and I'd have to have the housing line bored for a bushing, then have the bushing reamed to size for the shaft.

I'm all ears on this one.


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Rand Barthel
super member


Reged: 12/16/12

Loc: Central Massachusetts
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Mr Magoo]
      #6321075 - 01/18/14 06:43 PM

Quote:

Majestic Optical Coatings
Majestic Optical Coatings
152 Willow Way | Clark, NJ 07066
Ph: (888) 278-8308

Jeff Decker- Sales@majestic-coatings.com


I won't use anyone else. Very quick turn around and my coatings have been flawless. You may even be able to hand deliver it which would be a big savings over shipping it.




I second the motion. I had my RV6's mirrors resurfaced by Majestic and they did a nice job.


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FlashGordan
member
*****

Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Rand Barthel]
      #6322663 - 01/19/14 05:13 PM

When the boxes show up tomorrow, I'll see how bad the mirror assemblies are. I might get lucky and not need them recoated. At least not in the near future.

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Datapanic
Post Laureate
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Reged: 10/17/09

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: apfever]
      #6322705 - 01/19/14 05:34 PM

Quote:

DAN,

Did you remove the RA and DEC shafts from the housings? This has been my stopping point on mine. It seems that Criterion did not recess a spot on the shaft where the lock knobs contact it. This resulted in building up a ridge on the shaft that keeps it from coming out of the housing.
I can press the shafts out but any ridge will likely damage the housing seat and I'd have to have the housing line bored for a bushing, then have the bushing reamed to size for the shaft.

I'm all ears on this one.




I could not separate the Dec Shaft from the Saddle nor the RA Shaft from the Dec Shaft Housing - they are in there tight, and even though there is a set screw on the Saddle to the Dec Shaft, removing it and applying Liquid Wrench didn't loosen it up at all. So, I decided not to try and force them apart or applying heat and ended up just taping and painting them as an assembly instead.


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snork
sage
*****

Reged: 01/27/12

Loc: NE Ohio
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: apfever]
      #6322916 - 01/19/14 07:56 PM

Quote:

DAN,

Did you remove the RA and DEC shafts from the housings? This has been my stopping point on mine. It seems that Criterion did not recess a spot on the shaft where the lock knobs contact it. This resulted in building up a ridge on the shaft that keeps it from coming out of the housing.
I can press the shafts out but any ridge will likely damage the housing seat and I'd have to have the housing line bored for a bushing, then have the bushing reamed to size for the shaft.

I'm all ears on this one.




The only thing I was not able to disassemble was the dec shaft from the saddle. I don't know if you remember Neil, but I called you for advice on removing the ra shaft(almost 2 yrs ago) . You told me about the lock collar in the motor housing.

The threaded hole for the dec lock had a ball bearing inserted in it and the ra had a brass slugs to keep the threads of the lock knobs from gouging the shaft. The only problem I had were burrs caused by the counterweight screw threads on the dec shaft and I had to sand them down.

Dan, I had to paint the saddle the same way you did. Seems like the saddle was press fit on the shaft.

Edited by snork (01/19/14 07:59 PM)


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Datapanic
Post Laureate
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Reged: 10/17/09

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: snork]
      #6322973 - 01/19/14 08:33 PM Attachment (14 downloads)

We've had warmer weather here during the day with temps in the mid to upper 70's so I was able to paint the tube! The tube was kind of beat up, so I used bondo and rouge patching putty to fill in the gouges. Then, sanded it and coated it with 2 coats of primer. I used 4 coats of Ace Appliance White Epoxy paint to finish it off.

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Datapanic
Post Laureate
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Reged: 10/17/09

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Datapanic]
      #6322992 - 01/19/14 08:47 PM Attachment (13 downloads)

Here's another part that isn't coming apart easily. When I first got the scope, it had a Meade finder and ring mount, but I was able to find an original "Criterion" finder and ring mount to replace it. This one is really scratched up, but no dents. The objective end is not coming off the tube easily, so I am going to try soaking it in warm water for a while to soften up whatever is keeping it from turning.

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youngamateur42
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 11/21/12

Loc: La Verne, CA
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Datapanic]
      #6323064 - 01/19/14 09:38 PM Attachment (11 downloads)

Dan, looking good! Here's a suggestion for that finderscope. The thumbscrews on there will scratch your finish when you repaint it fairly soon, no matter how hard you try. Get some Nylon ones, they work great and fit better than those metal ones. Here is the finder on my RV-6:

Edited by youngamateur42 (01/19/14 09:39 PM)


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Datapanic
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Reged: 10/17/09

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: youngamateur42]
      #6323283 - 01/19/14 11:29 PM

I usually use electrical tape but that will take the paint off if it's been on for a while, but plastic thumbscrews work great as well. I do need to do something about the thumbscrews because one of the original ones are missing.

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Datapanic
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Reged: 10/17/09

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Datapanic]
      #6323291 - 01/19/14 11:30 PM Attachment (14 downloads)

After a little soaking in warm water and borrowing my wife's jar opener thing, I got it the objective cell off the tube. Next, I used my optical spanner wrench to remove the retaining ring. That wrench should be in every classic scope restorer's toolbox, btw!

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FlashGordan
member
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Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Datapanic]
      #6323693 - 01/20/14 09:15 AM

I'm sitting here at work waiting for the FedEx guy to show up and you guys start posting stuff like this. I'm almost to the point of going to hunt the driver down and get my boxes from him. ARRRRRGGGHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!

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youngamateur42
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 11/21/12

Loc: La Verne, CA
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6323786 - 01/20/14 10:18 AM

We can't wait!

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Gil V
professor emeritus


Reged: 09/09/12

Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: youngamateur42]
      #6323802 - 01/20/14 10:26 AM

The RV shafts are press-fit into their respective cast aluminum parts (saddle and tee). If you manage to remove them, it's not likely you'll get them reattached properly without drilling through the castings (easy) or the shafts (much harder).

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snork
sage
*****

Reged: 01/27/12

Loc: NE Ohio
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Gil V]
      #6323931 - 01/20/14 11:33 AM

Thank you for verifying that Gil.

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FlashGordan
member
*****

Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Datapanic]
      #6324068 - 01/20/14 12:36 PM

Quote:

After a little soaking in warm water and borrowing my wife's jar opener thing, I got it the objective cell off the tube. Next, I used my optical spanner wrench to remove the retaining ring. That wrench should be in every classic scope restorer's toolbox, btw!




Where did you get the spanner tool?


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Datapanic
Post Laureate
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Reged: 10/17/09

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6324114 - 01/20/14 12:59 PM

Quote:

Quote:

After a little soaking in warm water and borrowing my wife's jar opener thing, I got it the objective cell off the tube. Next, I used my optical spanner wrench to remove the retaining ring. That wrench should be in every classic scope restorer's toolbox, btw!




Where did you get the spanner tool?




Look for "Lens Spanner Wrench" on eBay - there are a lot of different kinds. One thing to watch out for is the length of the tips - some of them are pretty short which will prevent them from seating in the ring notches if the ring is to far down inside its housing to reach. You also have to be very careful to not slip and scratch the glass!


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Datapanic
Post Laureate
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Reged: 10/17/09

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6324137 - 01/20/14 01:06 PM

Quote:

I'm sitting here at work waiting for the FedEx guy to show up and you guys start posting stuff like this. I'm almost to the point of going to hunt the driver down and get my boxes from him. ARRRRRGGGHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!




Sorry I meant to post the pics in the other, Another RV-6 find - got confused.

Hope yours arrives safely!


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FlashGordan
member
*****

Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Datapanic]
      #6324584 - 01/20/14 04:54 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I'm sitting here at work waiting for the FedEx guy to show up and you guys start posting stuff like this. I'm almost to the point of going to hunt the driver down and get my boxes from him. ARRRRRGGGHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!




Sorry I meant to post the pics in the other, Another RV-6 find - got confused.

Hope yours arrives safely!




That's okay Dan. Seeing your pictures just makes me want to get to restoring my scope just that much quicker. Thanks!


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FlashGordan
member
*****

Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6327111 - 01/21/14 09:31 PM

Look at what arrived today!!!


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FlashGordan
member
*****

Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6327123 - 01/21/14 09:33 PM

Besides the cracked/broken saddle, I found this when I unpacked the OTA.


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FlashGordan
member
*****

Reged: 12/29/13

Loc: Southern New Jersey
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6327143 - 01/21/14 09:40 PM

I also noticed that the saddle was broken and welded on the opposite side as well. The felt on the rings is extremely faded. And the motor looks brand new. I'm slightly worried that it's been replaced lately. This is going to be an interesting restoration.

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Geo31
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 01/28/13

Loc: Kingwood, TX
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6327156 - 01/21/14 09:44 PM

Quote:

Besides the cracked/broken saddle, I found this when I unpacked the OTA.





That won't buff out, but should be easily fixed.


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snork
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Geo31]
      #6327165 - 01/21/14 09:48 PM

The uglier it looks now the more satisfaction you will get when it's done . Definitely fixable.

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FlashGordan
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: snork]
      #6327179 - 01/21/14 09:54 PM

So how would you suggest I fix it? Fiberglass or is Bondo out of the question?

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Geo31
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6327326 - 01/21/14 11:10 PM

Fiberglass.

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Datapanic
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Geo31]
      #6327349 - 01/21/14 11:24 PM

Yep - fiberglass repair and smooth it out with spotting putty.

Did it come with the original Criterion Finder and ring mount?


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FlashGordan
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Datapanic]
      #6327694 - 01/22/14 06:52 AM

The finder does say Criterion on it. But how do I tell if it's the original mount?

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Chuck HardsModerator
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6327781 - 01/22/14 08:19 AM

I restored an RV-8 tube last year, filled a gaping hole with a fiberglass patch. Worked very well on the phenolic paper tube.

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snork
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Chuck Hards]
      #6327803 - 01/22/14 08:25 AM

The first thing I did with my Criterion tube was to sand it down to the bakelite to where it was a completely smooth surface. There were a number of useless holes in the tube including a large hole for a 2” focuser. I used a steel reinforced epoxy putty called Quiksteel(I think J-B weld makes a similar putty) to fill all of the holes. Even though the word “steel” is in the name(it does work great on steel) it bonds strongly to almost any material and adhered nicely to the bakelite. I prefer the putty because I feel like I have more control using my hands to mold it into place and it’s not very messy. Once it cures it is very easy to sand and is very strong.

For the large hole, I rolled a piece of aluminum to have an inside radius that was the same as the outside radius of the tube. Put a piece of plastic wrap over the hole, put the aluminum piece over that then clamped it and filled the hole from the inside with the putty. When the aluminum piece was removed, I just had to sand it smooth as it had the same contour as the tube.

The key is whatever method you choose to use, make sure the tube is as smooth as possible before painting.


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FlashGordan
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: snork]
      #6327930 - 01/22/14 09:40 AM

I have to say that I think I got really lucky that there isn't more damage to the tube than what's in the pictures. A couple small dings at both ends, and the holes under the finder mount are about it. I'll post more pictures later today.

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FlashGordan
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6329201 - 01/22/14 07:19 PM

Got a picture of the saddle today.


Thinking about grinding the first weld away and build a jig to reweld both perches perfectly straight. I think that the first weld is crooked and that's the reason why the second perch broke loose. Or am I a little delusional?


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snork
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6329235 - 01/22/14 07:36 PM

Where's the weld, I can't make it out in the picture?

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Datapanic
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6329616 - 01/22/14 11:40 PM

Quote:

The finder does say Criterion on it. But how do I tell if it's the original mount?




There are a couple pictures of the finder mount on page 2 of this thread.


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dgreyson
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Datapanic]
      #6329984 - 01/23/14 07:33 AM

I wonder if the easiest way to line up the saddle wouldnt be to strap the empty tube back on to get things straight for a few spot welds and then take it back off and finish the welding?

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Chuck HardsModerator
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: dgreyson]
      #6330027 - 01/23/14 08:05 AM

^^ That's an excellent idea. It would make the ideal jig, as long as it was protected from heat damage.

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snork
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: dgreyson]
      #6330100 - 01/23/14 08:39 AM

Quote:

I wonder if the easiest way to line up the saddle wouldnt be to strap the empty tube back on to get things straight for a few spot welds and then take it back off and finish the welding?




That is a good idea...I was confused at first because you said "spot welds" then realized you must mean "tack welds".


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FlashGordan
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: snork]
      #6330422 - 01/23/14 11:45 AM

Last time I was in welding class, spot welds = tack welds.

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snork
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6330549 - 01/23/14 12:22 PM

Spot welding or RSW is a form of welding that joins (2) pieces of metal together using the heat generated by the resistance of an electric current passing through them. Tack welds are produced by arc welding.

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dgreyson
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: snork]
      #6331424 - 01/23/14 08:32 PM

Quote:

Spot welding or RSW is a form of welding that joins (2) pieces of metal together using the heat generated by the resistance of an electric current passing through them. Tack welds are produced by arc welding.




Youre right, a spot welder is usually for sheet metal. I meant Tack welds indeed. just enough to hold it in place till you get the tube back off.


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snork
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: dgreyson]
      #6331470 - 01/23/14 09:03 PM

I know what you were saying . I just thought for a minute, "what' does he want to spot".

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greedyshark
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Chuck Hards]
      #6332548 - 01/24/14 12:48 PM

I'll 2nd that... Restored a RV-8 years ago using a fiberglass patch kit from a local auto supply shop.

Charles


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FlashGordan
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: greedyshark]
      #6333104 - 01/24/14 04:19 PM

Hopefully I can get some heat in my garage this weekend. I'll finally get to start some sanding on the individual pieces.

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FlashGordan
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6334971 - 01/25/14 02:07 PM

Can someone tell me, what is the easiest way to get secondary mirror mount out without damaging it?

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Gil V
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6335198 - 01/25/14 04:22 PM

You'll have to twist the secondary holder to remove it. Take the secondary mirror out first. once you loosen the set screw in the central hub, you can just unthread the secondary mirror in it's holder.

Loosen and remove the external nuts on the spider. Grab the center hub. and a mild twist should bring it right out.


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actionhac
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Gil V]
      #6336612 - 01/26/14 12:42 PM Attachment (9 downloads)

The previous owner of my RV-6 (he bought it new) decided to fix the tube edge chips by wrapping several layers of masking tape around the ends and drizzling epoxy or super glue in all the chip voids at the edge, the tape acting as a form like when a concrete foundation is poured. A pretty good idea. He forgot to remove the tape before he painted it though.
I was using my RV-6 last night and what a fine scope.
I was concentrating on Jupiter and the GRS. I was increasing magnification waiting to see when more power was useless I ran out of eyepieces at 3.8mm, 335X! and still maintaining a super detailed view that kept me out all night at 32degF.


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youngamateur42
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: actionhac]
      #6336679 - 01/26/14 01:16 PM

I have similar experiences with my RV-6. On excellent nights I always am running out of power on Jupiter (357x). The image always holds steady and they sure are fine telescopes.

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Bomber Bob
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: youngamateur42]
      #6336792 - 01/26/14 02:21 PM

"I was increasing magnification waiting to see when more power was useless I ran out of eyepieces at 3.8mm, 335X!"

Wow! Excellent performer! What a great way to start! As I mentioned before, I couldn't tell the difference between a Cave 6" and an RV-6 in side-by-side viewing.


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actionhac
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Bomber Bob]
      #6337334 - 01/26/14 06:32 PM

Astromart has in their files a interview with John Krewalk Jr. son of John Krewalk Sr. founder of Criterion Mfg.

Krewalk Jr. said Criterion always made mirrors that were better than a 1/10th wave, even though it promised mirrors accurate to better than 1/8 wave.
"We always believed in giving people more than they paid for," he said. "And we kept our standards up at a 1/10th wave. They would be coming off really perfect because of the technique that was used, the technique that was developed by my dad. All the way back to some of those great telescope makers at the Hayden Planetarium. They helped him develop some production techniques for making parabolas and spheres. We had really good machines, too. We had Elgin machines and a couple of really good German machines."

Robert


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snork
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: actionhac]
      #6337365 - 01/26/14 06:44 PM

The mirror in my Criterion is very good...but I did notice that they did not put a lot of time in the finish work on the aluminum cast parts. There was a fair amount of slag on the parts.

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FlashGordan
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Bomber Bob]
      #6337831 - 01/26/14 11:16 PM

I swear I am chomping at the bit just waiting for it to get slightly warmer in my garage. I really want to do get started on this restoration. But it's still extremely cold that my kerosene heater just can't keep up. In the meantime, I'll keep asking questions as to which way to go.

I do have a couple questions. Does anyone know what the original paint was? Gloss white is close, but did Criterion have one specific paint supplier that had a certain paint code?


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youngamateur42
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6337836 - 01/26/14 11:20 PM

I think it is a bone white color. When I did my RV-6, I painted the tube with Rustoleum Vintage White, it gave a more cream color, very similar to the color of the Cave Telescopes.

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Mr Magoo
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6339366 - 01/27/14 06:26 PM

I used Rustoleum Appliance Epoxy Biscuit color. I really like it. The paint dries rock hard. I painted mine a rotating rig I made and didn't touch it for at least 2 weeks or more. If you belong to the Yahoo Dynascope Group, I have quite a few picture there of both my RV-6 and RV-8 restorations. Link to the RV-8 file that shows my paint set-up. Mr Magoo's RV-8 Dynascope album

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Mr Magoo
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Mr Magoo]
      #6339571 - 01/27/14 08:25 PM Attachment (5 downloads)

One shot of my OTA in the paint booth on the rotating rig. Not sure if you can tell anything about the color. It almost matches the original aged color on my RV-6 tube. Rotating it while painting and drying makes the paint come out like glass.

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actionhac
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Mr Magoo]
      #6340054 - 01/28/14 01:07 AM Attachment (7 downloads)

I took a bath with big red this evening. This is the scope in the Christmas tree stand I posted at Christmas. Its legs vanished when the previous owner moved which is why I was using a tree stand.
I'm cleaning it up to use but its too cold to wash outside, the tub seemed like a good idea.
The red is going to stay for a while I like it. I will strip the red from all the parts except the tube. The red is on everything. When I was in high school there was a shop that would paint your car any color and guaranteed not to fade for $99. They would mask the glass and the tires and shoot the whole car including you if you were standing too close!


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FlashGordan
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: actionhac]
      #6341843 - 01/28/14 08:40 PM

Nice shade of red there. Just curious, how much would I be ridiculed if I decide to change the color of the tube? I'm thinking gloss black with white lettering.

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terraclarke
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: actionhac]
      #6341881 - 01/28/14 09:01 PM

Robert, were you thinking of Earle Scheib? They painted my dad's 53 Chevy when I was a kid. It had been black (original paint) and he was tired of the color. He took it in, the car was probably 10 years old, he picked out a blue and when he got it back it was this god-awful turquoise color. He took it home and he was so p.o.'d. Me and my mom had to clean the paint off the tires, chrome, etc. from the overspray with rags and paint thinner while he raved and drank beer! It was kind of comical in retrospect.

I hated that car. I learned to drive in it. It had a 3 speed, column shift transmission, no power steering, and no power brakes. My dad had zero patience in teaching, had been in the Navy and swore like a sailor. It was an experience to say the least. The thing drove like a Mack truck!

Earle Scheib, used to advertise on TV, "I'll paint any car for $29.95.


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actionhac
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: terraclarke]
      #6341906 - 01/28/14 09:17 PM

Yes thats it Terra. A friend of mine had his VW bug painted yellow and like you said all the trim, hubcaps rubber moldings everything was painted. I think even the lights were painted if I remember correctly. Fortunately though the VW Beetle is probably the only car in the world a paint job like that is acceptable, my friend didn't care he thought it was groovy.
I miss my bug and I miss burning converse all-stars in the morning. Your feet would burn while your face was frozen and the windshield was totally fogged up, but I loved that car.

Rob black would be awesome. I don't see why not since you need to paint it anyway. White letters?

Robert


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terraclarke
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: actionhac]
      #6341932 - 01/28/14 09:33 PM

Gosh Robert, you are right, there was even paint on the headlights! It was everywhere. My dad was fit to be tied! And those old VW bugs were cool. I never had one but I had several friends that had them back in the day, so I rode in them and periodically drove them too. My dad used to say they were powered by a rubberband.

Rob, I like the black idea too. I'm building a 6 inch F10 this summer and I plan on having a rolled and riveted seamed sheet metal tube made for it at a local HVAC place and then painting the tube gloss black (flat black inside of course).

Terra


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youngamateur42
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6341965 - 01/28/14 09:55 PM

Rob, you might consider the Rustoleum Vintage White like I did on my RV-6. Looks really great.

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dgreyson
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: youngamateur42]
      #6342121 - 01/28/14 11:38 PM

When it comes time to strip the paint, buy a bag of wood shavings. They sell them for hamster bedding. Not sawdust.
Let the stripper soak in, then grab some shavings with a rubber glove, wet them with solvent and scrub off the paint. Just discard it when it gets sodden and grab another handful.
a Rag wet with solvent wipes off the remaining softened paint and any stuck on bits of wood shavings leaving it nice and clean. less damage than scraping. maybe overkill for fiberglass.


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FlashGordan
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: actionhac]
      #6343891 - 01/29/14 06:35 PM

Quote:

Rob black would be awesome. I don't see why not since you need to paint it anyway. White letters?

Robert




I need to paint it eventually. There are chips and small cracks in the tube. Every RV-6 that I've seen pretty much has been painted white except for your red. I'm just wondering what black would look like, and if I would be maimed and/or killed for my sacrilege.


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FlashGordan
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: terraclarke]
      #6343899 - 01/29/14 06:38 PM

Quote:

Rob, I like the black idea too. I'm building a 6 inch F10 this summer and I plan on having a rolled and riveted seamed sheet metal tube made for it at a local HVAC place and then painting the tube gloss black (flat black inside of course).

Terra




I can't wait to see the build thread on this one Terra. What are the other specs on this scope?


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numchuck
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Reged: 11/10/13

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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6345238 - 01/30/14 01:58 PM

I've got one of these fine scopes, too. My mirrors are visiting Majestic, right now, but should be back soon. I'm wanting to spruce up the paint; but I thought some trim rings might dress it up even more. Do any of you know where I might find some to fit? My scope will be 36 years old this summer ! P.S. I'm trying a gray color paint from PlastiDip - hoping it won't show my finger prints so much

Edited by numchuck (01/30/14 02:05 PM)


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youngamateur42
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: numchuck]
      #6345302 - 01/30/14 02:28 PM

Quote:

I've got one of these fine scopes, too. My mirrors are visiting Majestic, right now, but should be back soon. I'm wanting to spruce up the paint; but I thought some trim rings might dress it up even more. Do any of you know where I might find some to fit? My scope will be 36 years old this summer ! P.S. I'm trying a gray color paint from PlastiDip - hoping it won't show my finger prints so much




The tube ending trim I got was called Car Door Trim from Autozone. It's a black vinyl. It works very well and looks nice.


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numchuck
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: youngamateur42]
      #6345332 - 01/30/14 02:45 PM

that's a great idea - thank you Justin

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actionhac
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: numchuck]
      #6347931 - 01/31/14 07:37 PM

Anyone have any idea what the markings on the mirror mean?
Here are a few examples:

Mirror #1 motor date 2-74
50.2 (on back)
Null figure (on back) (Null is a circle with a line through it)
1.MM (on back)
CMCO (on back) (Criterion Manufacturing Co.)

Mirror #2 motor date 1-75
50.250 (on edge)
+.5 (back)
CM (back)

Mirror #3 motor date 7-79
1065 (scribed on back)
Null figure (on back felt pen)

Mirror #4 motor date unknown
50.025 (on edge)
+.050 (back)
CM (scribed back)

50.xxx is focal length. CM and CMCO is Criterion.
What is Null, +.xx, 1065, 1.MM, anyone know?

Robert


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Datapanic
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: actionhac]
      #6348092 - 01/31/14 09:20 PM

I checked the back of mine and it only has the focal length - '50"' and nothing else. I think DavidG knows what the +.xx marks are - something to do with the deviation from f/8 or maybe? I remember someone posting about those RV-6 mirror markings a while ago, but can't find the thread...

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youngamateur42
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Datapanic]
      #6348121 - 01/31/14 09:42 PM

Mine has 50" as well scribed into the mirror, no other markings I could find.

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Compressorguy
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: numchuck]
      #6348191 - 01/31/14 10:27 PM

Quote:

I'm wanting to spruce up the paint; but I thought some trim rings might dress it up even more. Do any of you know where I might find some to fit?




Why not make them???

Here's an idea for some inexpensive tube rings I made for mine. They were extremely easy to make and are completely reversible to go back to original. Check out the 4th page. Great scopes by the way.

http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/4488240/page...


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FlashGordan
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Compressorguy]
      #6349035 - 02/01/14 12:16 PM

I now understand why the legs came with black wrinkle paint. It's to cover up all the casting flash and machining imperfections! I started stripping the paint and these legs are a complete mess. I'm going to try to smooth everything for paint but how much material can I sand away and still retain the strength?

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numchuck
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: FlashGordan]
      #6349389 - 02/01/14 03:16 PM

Scott, your scope looks better than new. My mirrors came back 2 days ago; and I'm anxious to just put everything together so that I can observe again; but seeing your work makes me feel that I should spend some extra effort.

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actionhac
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: numchuck]
      #6349428 - 02/01/14 03:38 PM Attachment (5 downloads)

Scott does beautiful work. I especially like his tube repair technique in that thread.
Rob the wrinkle black can sure hide manufacturing marks and etc. I think most are unpainted. I would be tempted to fill the imperfections rather than remove a lot of metal.
I overhauled my focuser today. Very nice unit, cast iron and brass, precision and square to the tube.
I was lucky I could remove the red paint from the focuser without attacking the wrinkle black. I even have red on my diagonal mirror! Earle!


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Datapanic
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: actionhac]
      #6354382 - 02/03/14 09:29 PM

Quote:

Scott does beautiful work. I especially like his tube repair technique in that thread.
Rob the wrinkle black can sure hide manufacturing marks and etc. I think most are unpainted. I would be tempted to fill the imperfections rather than remove a lot of metal.
I overhauled my focuser today. Very nice unit, cast iron and brass, precision and square to the tube.
I was lucky I could remove the red paint from the focuser without attacking the wrinkle black. I even have red on my diagonal mirror! Earle!




The RV-6 focusers are nice, but I wonder why they used cast iron? They're kind of heavy!


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actionhac
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Datapanic]
      #6354471 - 02/03/14 10:11 PM

Its heavy but it does tend to counterbalance the tube with the mounting rings close to the middle which is nice.
The focuser is great I like it. It reminds me of the 40's technology rather than 1959 when the RV-6 was introduced.
The Dynascopes used something very close looking, not sure if it was cast iron.
I don't see how the RV-6 focuser could ever wear out I don't think it would be possible.

Robert


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FlashGordan
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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: actionhac]
      #6359127 - 02/06/14 06:48 AM

So I've got a small update, been trying to strip the flaking paint off the legs on my break at work. I'm surprised at how hard some of this paint is. I'll try to post a before and after picture.

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RussL
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Reged: 03/18/08

Loc: Cayce and Lancaster, SC
Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: Mr Magoo]
      #6359217 - 02/06/14 08:21 AM

When I re-did mine, in order to paint the aluminum parts I first painted with an acid-etch automotive primer. Then used automotive satin black over that. The acid-etch primer made it all stick to the aluminum. Thought I'd just pass that along. I also painted the legs silvery like the pedestal tube in order to be able to see them better in the dark. They were originally wrinkle black. Mine is pre-1963. (I got it very used in '63).

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RussL
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Reged: 03/18/08

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Re: Another RV-6 restoration new [Re: actionhac]
      #6359227 - 02/06/14 08:25 AM

Quote:

Its heavy but it does tend to counterbalance the tube with the mounting rings close to the middle which is nice.
The focuser is great I like it. It reminds me of the 40's technology rather than 1959 when the RV-6 was introduced.
The Dynascopes used something very close looking, not sure if it was cast iron.
I don't see how the RV-6 focuser could ever wear out I don't think it would be possible.

Robert




Mine wore out. had to replace the rack and pinion, or was it just the pinion, I forget. My dad found the parts somewhere. (Restored in 1987).


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