kestrel0222
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 05/21/06
Posts: 2335
Loc: Milford, Michigan
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Last night while I was out observing the Andromeda Galaxy, I noticed an object to the left that I was not sure what it was, so I got out my S&T's pocket Sky Atlas and looked it up. I appears that what I saw was a small galaxy called RV278? Where can I find information on this object. It does not appear in any of my Messier's books (I know, if it was there it would have an "M" designation  )? I don't have a book on Caldwell objects, might it be listed there? 
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blackhaz
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 05/20/06
Posts: 1189
Loc: Prague, Czech Republic
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Could it be M32?
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Max,
10" Aries MCT, C11-SGT XLT, WO ZenithStar 66ED, SW909
1A H-a etalon, CaK, P. Hawksley 100 l/mm grating, Astrovid Voyager, Denkmeier Std, APM Solarprism
Photos and Projects: http://www.bcsatellite.net/bao/
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kestrel0222
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 05/21/06
Posts: 2335
Loc: Milford, Michigan
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No, it wasn't M32, I found that last night also.
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Tom
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Paul_R
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 04/05/05
Posts: 1408
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Never heard of it before. near to M31 is M32 which you saw and then also M110.
What size scope were you using?
Have you tried Google (nothing showed up for me)? Or gone to the SEDs site and seen what's near to M31?
I've been around the block, well the sky, enough time and years, so I'm pretty sure I'd have heard of another galaxy near M31, especially if it made it into the pocket atlas it would have to be bright.
How close to M31 is it in the atlas? That is, how many degrees (or fraction thereof) is it from M31? Where does it fall relative to M110 and M32?
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Paul_R
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 04/05/05
Posts: 1408
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Just did a check in my sky atlas... what you saw was NGC 278! It's six degrees away from M31, across the border in Cassiopeia. The confusion is that right next to it is a variable star, RV Cass. The pocket atlas, like my sky atlas, labels them right next to each other making it look like RV 278, which doesn't exist.
By the way, ngc 278 seems to be a small faint sucker (mag data vary), so congrats on spotting it.
http://www.seds.org/~spider/ngc/ngc.cgi?NGC278
Although an observer's report describges it as "fairly bright smudge" peanut shaped! Hmm... worth tracking down!
http://clifty.com/scott/DSO/278.html
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Achernar
Post Laureate
Reged: 02/25/06
Posts: 3005
Loc: Alabama, USA
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It was most likely M-110 or NGC-205, a larger and more diffuse dwarf elliptical than M-32. It lies on the opposite side of M-31 from M-32, and is definitely dimmer than M-32 but still easy to see even in small telescopes. If you were looking about 7 degrees to the north of M-31, it's either NGC-185, another satellite of M-31, or NGG-278, a dwarf spiral in Cassiopeia. NGC-185 also has a companion, NGC-147 that is very faint and hard to see. This is a sketch I made of M-110 below.
Taras
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kestrel0222
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 05/21/06
Posts: 2335
Loc: Milford, Michigan
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Thanks Paul,
I am fairly new to this hobby, I knew someone a CN could help, and you did, Thank you!!  The reason that I knew it was a galaxy, that's because in my pocket sky atlas, it is "red" in color. Approx. Dec is +47, RA less then 1h. Sorry for the "poor" location description, again, I am fairly new to all of this. Oh, I was using my 8" Dob with 25mm Plössl eyepiece.
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Tom
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Jaycin
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 07/09/06
Posts: 2139
Loc: SW FLorida, USA
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I see M110 every time I look at M31, but I'll be darned if I can see M32 which is supposed to be brighter. In the EP, M110 appears to the left of M31 and M32 should be closer and to the right, but I have yet to see it. Unless I'm confusing M110 for M32.
Here's the sketch I did of "M110", maybe someone could confirm this for me....
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Jason
Zhumell 8" Dobsonian
60mm Meade Telestar
Sketching the Cosmos
Messier countdown: 102 down, 8 to go! 
Yalta Observatory- North Port, FL
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BillFerris
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 07/17/04
Posts: 2433
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Hi Jason,
I'm leaning toward your sketch being of M32 (NGC 221) for several reasons. The bright star near the right edge in your sketch is a good match for HD 3914, a 7.0 magnitude sparkler stationed 13 arcminutes southwest of M32. There is no comparable star near M110. Also, the galaxy shows a stellar core region, an obvious feature of M32 but not as obvious in M110. Finally, M32 is closer to M31 and really is easier to detect than M110. And keep in mind that your Newtonian reflector produces an inverted image. "Right" and "Left" usually don't translate from the star chart to the eyepiece. Try to think in terms of N-S-E-W, directions that do translate...although more easily so when observing with an equatorial mount than with an altazimuth (e.g. Dobsonian) mount.
Regards,
Bill in Flagstaff
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Grand Canyon Adventure
Lowering the Threshold
18" Obsession
4.5" Meade 4500
10x50 Swift Audubon
Cosmic Voyage
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snorkler
Aperture Aficionado
Reged: 10/11/04
Posts: 7831
Loc: Bay Area, California
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Bill,
The obvious problem with Jason's sketch being M32 is that M32 is round. NGC 205 (aka M110) is elongated like Jason's sketch shows. Does anyone notice the amazing resemblence between Arowana's NGC 205 sketch and Jason's?
It's easier for an inexperienced person to think M32 is a star (albeit a huge fuzzy one) and miss it, than for him to completely miss NGC 205 with an 8" scope under reasonably dark skies.
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In politics stupidity is not a handicap.
Napoleon
The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits.
Einstein
Against stupidity the very gods themselves contend in vain.
Schiller
If Stupidity got us into this mess, then why can't it get us out?
Rogers
One man alone can be pretty dumb sometimes, but for real bona fide stupidity, there ain't nothin' can beat teamwork.
Abbey
Edited by snorkler (07/31/06 03:47 AM)
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Paul_R
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 04/05/05
Posts: 1408
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I'm with you on this one Darrell... Jason, were you observing under relatively dark or transparent skies? M110 is usually pretty ghostly, but it does look like your sketch (nice drawing by the way!). It suggests to me that your scope has a good smoothly figured mirror! Congrats!
I'll bet you've simply overlooked M32... it's a bright star (well round with a tad of fuzz) tucked right near M31.
Tom, if you are new to the hobby and were *close* to M31... that is, right by it, say only an eyepiece fov away, if that, then it was likely M110 (if faint and elongated), but more likely it was M32, star like with some fuzzy.
NGC 287 is 6 degrees away... not next to M31! 6 degrees is many, many eyepiece fovs, and you'd most likely need to be an experienced observer to catch it easily. So, I've probably cleared up the RV and 287 confusion, but the object you saw is likely one of M31's closest companions.
Look again another night and report back to us if it's right beside M31 or not.
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BillFerris
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 07/17/04
Posts: 2433
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Quote:
Bill,
The obvious problem with Jason's sketch being M32 is that M32 is round. ... [snip]
It's not unusual for M32 to appear oval and elongated at the eyepiece. Here, are a couple of sketches showing this: Link #1 and Link #2.
The first, in particular, is an excellent match with Jason's sketch. It shows the galaxy's oval shape and obviously stellar nucleus. Given the available information, I find M32 to be the better match.
Regards,
Bill in Flagstaff
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Grand Canyon Adventure
Lowering the Threshold
18" Obsession
4.5" Meade 4500
10x50 Swift Audubon
Cosmic Voyage
Edited by BillFerris (07/31/06 03:12 PM)
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Jaycin
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 07/09/06
Posts: 2139
Loc: SW FLorida, USA
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Thank you all,
I was observing this object while it was close to zenith and the Milky Way was plainly visible, just to give you an idea of my conditions.
Bill, while I'll agree the first sketch is very close, the second shows it in the wrong position and too close to M31 from my perspective.
I appreciate everyones help. I'm going to continue to observe M31 and Co. until I get this thing figured out.
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Jason
Zhumell 8" Dobsonian
60mm Meade Telestar
Sketching the Cosmos
Messier countdown: 102 down, 8 to go!
Yalta Observatory- North Port, FL
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Dain
professor emeritus
Reged: 03/24/05
Posts: 570
Loc: Upstate New York
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Jason,
At about what time were you viewing this object? NGC 147 kind of fits the picture, but it would be really late before this hit around zenith. Hmm.. let me see, other galaxies that are kind of within that vicinity that fit the sketch....NGC 7640, NGC 7331 ( this was my first guess..I had viewed this late last night myself and it was pretty close to zenith..it matches you sketch at high power )..and that looks like all I can find that matches the sketch in my software. There is heavy galaxy population within Andromeda, Cassiopeia, and Pegasus but most of them have extremely low surface brightness and are very faint, especially in an 8" dob.
Let us know when you find out. You have me all curious now! :]
regards,
Dain
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Regards,
Your CN Friend-
Dain
You can't reach for the stars.....if you can't see them. Fight Light Pollution.
Adirondack Public Observatory
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snorkler
Aperture Aficionado
Reged: 10/11/04
Posts: 7831
Loc: Bay Area, California
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Jason,
Look at the middle sketch of the top row at this link. NGC 205 is in the upper left, just outside the circle. The little fuzzball to the right of M31 is M32. Do you think you could have skipped right past that and thought it was a star?
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In politics stupidity is not a handicap.
Napoleon
The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits.
Einstein
Against stupidity the very gods themselves contend in vain.
Schiller
If Stupidity got us into this mess, then why can't it get us out?
Rogers
One man alone can be pretty dumb sometimes, but for real bona fide stupidity, there ain't nothin' can beat teamwork.
Abbey
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Jaycin
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 07/09/06
Posts: 2139
Loc: SW FLorida, USA
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Quote:
At about what time were you viewing this object? NGC 147 kind of fits the picture, but it would be really late before this hit around zenith.
Dain,
Thanks for your help. 
I began observing this object at 3:48 AM EST 7/29/06. I'm at 27.044, -82.236 if that helps.
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Jason
Zhumell 8" Dobsonian
60mm Meade Telestar
Sketching the Cosmos
Messier countdown: 102 down, 8 to go!
Yalta Observatory- North Port, FL
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Jaycin
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 07/09/06
Posts: 2139
Loc: SW FLorida, USA
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Quote:
NGC 205 is in the upper left, just outside the circle. The little fuzzball to the right of M31 is M32. Do you think you could have skipped right past that and thought it was a star?
Darrell,
I think you've nailed it! Thanks a million! I just spent several minutes trying to find M32 in the sketch, so it's no wonder I've been missing it. The position of M110/NGC 205 in relation to M31 is identicle to what I've been seeing. Now that I know where to look for M32, I should be able to find it (hopefully tonight). If I do, I'll post a sketch of it here.
Thanks to you all for your efforts!
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Jason
Zhumell 8" Dobsonian
60mm Meade Telestar
Sketching the Cosmos
Messier countdown: 102 down, 8 to go!
Yalta Observatory- North Port, FL
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Dain
professor emeritus
Reged: 03/24/05
Posts: 570
Loc: Upstate New York
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Jason,
I'm agreeing with David also. I was going to say M110 but I was thinking that that was too close in reference to what you were explaining.
OK, so definitely...your time matches up quite perfect in relation to where M110 would be at that time which you quoted being " 3:48 AM EST 7/29/06. I'm at 27.044, -82.236 if that helps".
Good to see you've finally nailed the object.
Clear skies my friend,
Dain
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Regards,
Your CN Friend-
Dain
You can't reach for the stars.....if you can't see them. Fight Light Pollution.
Adirondack Public Observatory
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Jaycin
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 07/09/06
Posts: 2139
Loc: SW FLorida, USA
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Thanks Dain,
Now that I'm sure of what I've been viewing, I should have a much easier time finding M32. I'm going to give it a shot tonight. Thanks again!
Clear skies to you,
Jason
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Jason
Zhumell 8" Dobsonian
60mm Meade Telestar
Sketching the Cosmos
Messier countdown: 102 down, 8 to go!
Yalta Observatory- North Port, FL
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Paul_R
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 04/05/05
Posts: 1408
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I'll still reiterate my point that your scope and your eyes are good ones! As is your drawing/sketching ability!
Catching M110 that well in the early stages of an observing career is a great sign.
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