iceman
Post Laureate
Reged: 03/07/04
Posts: 4353
Loc: Gosford, Australia
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Hi guys.
My daughter woke me up at 5am this morning, and after putting her back to bed I decided to walk outside and look up, and found a beatifully clear morning so I decided to set the 10" scope up (and camera on a tripod) and do my first early morning observations..
Was nice to see Venus and Saturn for the first time through my new scope (although seeing was terrible, and M42 as well, and I took some widefield shots through my new camera.. I've gotta do some align+stack+post-process on them, and once that's done I'll do my full observing report in a few days.
But anyway, my main question was about the Pleiades.. It was my first view of that lovely looking open cluster as well, but I'm wondering if they're more of a binocular target rather than telescope..
I found that even with my widest FOV eyepiece (32mm @ 39x), I couldn't fit the whole cluster in the view. I couldn't really see any nebulosity either, although I know it's there from the astrophotography i've seen.
So what's your favourite method of viewing the pleiades? What eyepiece combination do you use to get the best effect?
Thanks
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Mike
. mikesalway.com.au - Astronomy and Photography by Mike Salway
. IceInSpace - The Australian Amateur Astronomy Community
. My Bio | My Jupiter 2007 Gallery | My Image Gallery
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Carol L
Reged: 07/05/04
Posts: 5880
Loc: Tomahawk, WI 45N//89W
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Funny you should ask. Just got in from doing some deep sky with the 8" SCT, 11x70's and 22x100s... the preferred view of the Pleiades was definitely through the 11x70's. Absolutely stunning. 
The cluster also benefits from higher power but for aesthetics alone I'll take a widefield bino view any day.
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 *Step-by-Step Lunar Sketching*
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Photo Gallery
8"SCT ~ 120achro ~ 90Mak ~ 80ST ~ 11x70s ~ 22x100s
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ggleyzer
super member
Reged: 07/28/04
Posts: 195
Loc: Maryland
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I use 20X80 binos to observe Pleiades and the view is stunning.
Gennady
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Gennady
AstroSky 14.5" F/4.3 Truss Dob
LX90 8" SCT
Orion 120ST
Burgess 20X80LW Binos
Western Fields 7X50 Binos
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jmoore
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 10/01/03
Posts: 1959
Loc: Beaufort, NC
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Definitely a better binocular object. My 15x70s provide my best view...about 4.5 degs FOV. Also looks awesome in my 80mm f/6 refractor...about 3.2 degs FOV.
Pleiades are about 2 degs in diameter I think, so obviously, you need at least this much FOV to see the whole thing, and then you need a nice wide extra margin to frame the target for best effect.
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Hardin 12"
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Will try a 50mm 2 inch plossl in my 114mm f/5.3 refractor which should give at least three degrees focused FOV when they are up during the evening. The stated size of the Pleiades is 2 degrees which seems about correct to me. So far my best view of them has been in my 9X63mm binocs. 
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BillFerris
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 07/17/04
Posts: 2582
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Quote:
[snip] I found that even with my widest FOV eyepiece (32mm @ 39x), I couldn't fit the whole cluster in the view. I couldn't really see any nebulosity either, although I know it's there from the astrophotography i've seen.
So what's your favourite method of viewing the pleiades? What eyepiece combination do you use to get the best effect?
I enjoy the views presented by my 10-inch, f/4.5 and 10x50 binoculars. Scattered across a 1.7 degree wide area, the stars of M45 are best framed by a wide field instrument. A quality small refractor or binoculars are perfect for the task. Under a dark sky, the delicate glow of the Merope nebula (NGC 1435) teases the eye through my 50-mm binoculars. The nebulosity is unmistakeable in the 10-inch. Here are my notes and sketch for M45.
Regards,
Bill in Flagstaff
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Grand Canyon Adventure
Lowering the Threshold
18" Obsession
4.5" Meade 4500
10x50 Swift Audubon
Cosmic Voyage
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Scott Beith
SRF
Reged: 11/26/03
Posts: 33042
Loc: Gulfport, MS
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Mike,
Either of my 80mm scopes frame it nicely in a variety of EP's.
In my CR150, I use an Orion 40mm 2" Optiluxe or an Antares 52mm 2" Erfle to hit M-45.
Absolutely incredible views with more stars than you would ever imagine. Perfectly framed picture of the night sky's prettiest open cluster.
Trust me - it isn't just a binocular object !!!
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  Scott
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -- Edmund Burke.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell
"The measure of a man’s greatness is not determined by what he accomplishes for himself, but by what he accomplishes for others.” -- Some Bald Guy
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iceman
Post Laureate
Reged: 03/07/04
Posts: 4353
Loc: Gosford, Australia
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40mm and 52mm! Ouch, looks like I need to add some more EP's to my wish list
Thanks for your replies.
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Mike
. mikesalway.com.au - Astronomy and Photography by Mike Salway
. IceInSpace - The Australian Amateur Astronomy Community
. My Bio | My Jupiter 2007 Gallery | My Image Gallery
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Greg K.
Reged: 12/11/03
Posts: 9971
Loc: Clifton Park, NY
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I can't wait to give it a look with my GSO 2" 30mm. I'm hoping it does M45 proud.
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NexStar 11 GPS
Orion SkyView Pro 8EQ w/ Autostar
15x70 Celestron SkyMasters
Orion 90mm Mak
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EdZ
Professor EdZ
Reged: 02/15/02
Posts: 12565
Loc: Cumberland, R I , USA42N71.4W
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Here's a chart of M45 with 250 stars identified down to mag 12.0. A link from the chart will take you to a post in the binocular forum that has a cross reference table of all the stars and their magnitudes.
Chart of M45
In mag 5.8 skies, 10x50s can see to mag 10.0 stars
In mag 5.8 skies, 16x70s can see to near mag 11.0 stars
In mag 5.5 skies, 25x100s can see to mag 11.5
A BT100 binocular telescope at 50 power in mag 5.5 skies missed only a small handfull of all the stars identified on this chart.
edz
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Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21
Edited by EdZ (08/23/04 05:05 PM)
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Scott Beith
SRF
Reged: 11/26/03
Posts: 33042
Loc: Gulfport, MS
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Ed,
Outstanding !!!
Thank you Sir. 
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Scott
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -- Edmund Burke.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell
"The measure of a man’s greatness is not determined by what he accomplishes for himself, but by what he accomplishes for others.” -- Some Bald Guy
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Quote:
Definitely a better binocular object.
I totally agree although I get a nice view with my Nexstar114 and a 25mm EP. But with my binoculars it just seems more impressive.
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half meter
Postmaster
Reged: 05/05/04
Posts: 12517
Loc: Great Lakes
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Quote:
Perfectly framed picture of the night sky's prettiest open cluster.
I agree, although I may have to rethink that. Found out recently the Big Dipper is an open cluster  (Really!)
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Gary
Collins I3 (Thin Film) Image Intensifying Eyepiece
Coronado Maxscope DS 90 <0.5A w/BF30
152 mm f/8 TMB/A&M Carbon Fiber APO; f/5 with 4" Borg ED Field Flattener/Reducer
20" Obsession/OMI Mirror/Servocat/Argo Navis
First Light for the 30" Obsession at BEOTS!
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BluewaterObserva
Post Laureate
Reged: 05/18/04
Posts: 4763
Loc: Zuni Mtns, NM
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You need a better / lower mag eye piece for your 10" is all....
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Scott Beith
SRF
Reged: 11/26/03
Posts: 33042
Loc: Gulfport, MS
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M/2,
I found out that the BD is an open cluster just about 6 months ago. I was suitably impressed.
M-45 is still WAY prettier !!!
I will stand by my previous statement. (if I could fit the BD in one FOV I might change my mind)...
M-45 is by far my favorite.
Double Cluster runs a close second.
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Scott
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -- Edmund Burke.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell
"The measure of a man’s greatness is not determined by what he accomplishes for himself, but by what he accomplishes for others.” -- Some Bald Guy
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BluewaterObserva
Post Laureate
Reged: 05/18/04
Posts: 4763
Loc: Zuni Mtns, NM
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I can get it into the entire field of view on my 17.5", with a 36mm 80degree fov 2" eye piece. The view in my 25x100 binos rivals it though. But with the scope, I think I at least was able to glimpse Merope a few times.
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Scott Beith
SRF
Reged: 11/26/03
Posts: 33042
Loc: Gulfport, MS
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Are you refering to the Double Cluster, or M-45???
If you can fit M-45 in the FOV of the 17.5" - WOW !!!
Is Merope a named star?
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Scott
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -- Edmund Burke.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell
"The measure of a man’s greatness is not determined by what he accomplishes for himself, but by what he accomplishes for others.” -- Some Bald Guy
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BluewaterObserva
Post Laureate
Reged: 05/18/04
Posts: 4763
Loc: Zuni Mtns, NM
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Merope is a tough nebula off of the star Merope, sorry about the confusion, I should have been more specific.
Yes, I can get the entire cluster in the field of view of my 17.5", just barely but yes.
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BluewaterObserva
Post Laureate
Reged: 05/18/04
Posts: 4763
Loc: Zuni Mtns, NM
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PS: Now you start to see why I like ultra fast F/ratios.. lol 17.5" f/4.1 by the way....
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half meter
Postmaster
Reged: 05/05/04
Posts: 12517
Loc: Great Lakes
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Scott, I agree that M45 is a great beacon in the sky, naked eye or with a telescope
Once I get my refractor back from Televue, I'll put on the Denk binoviewer with Nagler 13mm T6 eyepieces, and I should get all of M45 in the FOV at 100x. 
I'm a recent SRF so I'm not used to these incredible wide field views.
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Gary
Collins I3 (Thin Film) Image Intensifying Eyepiece
Coronado Maxscope DS 90 <0.5A w/BF30
152 mm f/8 TMB/A&M Carbon Fiber APO; f/5 with 4" Borg ED Field Flattener/Reducer
20" Obsession/OMI Mirror/Servocat/Argo Navis
First Light for the 30" Obsession at BEOTS!
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EdZ
Professor EdZ
Reged: 02/15/02
Posts: 12565
Loc: Cumberland, R I , USA42N71.4W
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The only instrument I've ever own/used that was able to see a portion of the Merope nebula is the Oberwerk BT100 binocular telescope. f6.2 with a pair of 26mm TV plossls = 24x, 4.2mm exit pupils and a 2.2° fov.
edz
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Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21
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BluewaterObserva
Post Laureate
Reged: 05/18/04
Posts: 4763
Loc: Zuni Mtns, NM
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Impressive, I will have to try harder with my binos next time out!!!!!
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Scott Beith
SRF
Reged: 11/26/03
Posts: 33042
Loc: Gulfport, MS
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Thanks for the help with Merope.
M/2,
When are you selling the rest of the "stuff" you have listed with your beautiful new refractor???
Ed always finds the good stuff !!!
How large is the nebula and what is the surface brightness?
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Scott
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -- Edmund Burke.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell
"The measure of a man’s greatness is not determined by what he accomplishes for himself, but by what he accomplishes for others.” -- Some Bald Guy
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half meter
Postmaster
Reged: 05/05/04
Posts: 12517
Loc: Great Lakes
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Scott, I'm going to load everything onto the dob and scare people when it slews around 
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Gary
Collins I3 (Thin Film) Image Intensifying Eyepiece
Coronado Maxscope DS 90 <0.5A w/BF30
152 mm f/8 TMB/A&M Carbon Fiber APO; f/5 with 4" Borg ED Field Flattener/Reducer
20" Obsession/OMI Mirror/Servocat/Argo Navis
First Light for the 30" Obsession at BEOTS!
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Scott Beith
SRF
Reged: 11/26/03
Posts: 33042
Loc: Gulfport, MS
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As long as you are only using the Dob to aim the Refractor - I guess that is o.k.
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Scott
"The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." -- Edmund Burke.
"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." -- George Orwell
"The measure of a man’s greatness is not determined by what he accomplishes for himself, but by what he accomplishes for others.” -- Some Bald Guy
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half meter
Postmaster
Reged: 05/05/04
Posts: 12517
Loc: Great Lakes
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--------------------
Gary
Collins I3 (Thin Film) Image Intensifying Eyepiece
Coronado Maxscope DS 90 <0.5A w/BF30
152 mm f/8 TMB/A&M Carbon Fiber APO; f/5 with 4" Borg ED Field Flattener/Reducer
20" Obsession/OMI Mirror/Servocat/Argo Navis
First Light for the 30" Obsession at BEOTS!
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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My references say M45 is 2 degrees in size? No eyepiece I know of can show 2 degrees FOV at 100X? 
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half meter
Postmaster
Reged: 05/05/04
Posts: 12517
Loc: Great Lakes
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Hey, you're right, V-guy  I was rushing... with the TV NP-101 (f/5.4, 101mm aperture) and a Nagler 13mm T6 I get a 1.8 degree FOV at 42 power. If M-45 is really 2 degrees, I could use a Nagler 16mm T5 at 34x, yielding a 2.3 degreee FOV.
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Gary
Collins I3 (Thin Film) Image Intensifying Eyepiece
Coronado Maxscope DS 90 <0.5A w/BF30
152 mm f/8 TMB/A&M Carbon Fiber APO; f/5 with 4" Borg ED Field Flattener/Reducer
20" Obsession/OMI Mirror/Servocat/Argo Navis
First Light for the 30" Obsession at BEOTS!
Edited by half meter (08/23/04 01:22 PM)
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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At 34X it should be very nice. I can't wait to look at it in my ED114SS. I'm gonna try my 50mm, 2 inch plossl which should give about 3 degree focused FOV. AL Nagler says the exit pupil is not such an issue with refractors for low power viewing so will test that soon.
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half meter
Postmaster
Reged: 05/05/04
Posts: 12517
Loc: Great Lakes
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Put you head under a black shroud so your eyes open up to their fullest and take in as much light as they can from the 50mm Plossl.
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Gary
Collins I3 (Thin Film) Image Intensifying Eyepiece
Coronado Maxscope DS 90 <0.5A w/BF30
152 mm f/8 TMB/A&M Carbon Fiber APO; f/5 with 4" Borg ED Field Flattener/Reducer
20" Obsession/OMI Mirror/Servocat/Argo Navis
First Light for the 30" Obsession at BEOTS!
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Anonymous
Unregistered
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Good suggestion ... will do ... thanks. 
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EdZ
Professor EdZ
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