gustave
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Does anyone know of field books with detailed information including charts of various degree field sizes for star clusters. I know there is quite a lot of NGC/Messier material online(Messier45.com for one)that one can extract,compile and and aggregate.I am currently doing this and enjoying it but I would think someone must have published a reference book on open/globular clusters that does pretty much the same.
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bicparker
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Best overall book that is cluster specific is:
Star Clusters by Brent A. Archinal and Steven J. Hynes
This is a very in-depth and well written book that includes a lot of corrections and updates to earlier catalogues and references (Brent and Steven did a terrific amount of research to get the information in there as correct and up-to-date as possible). It is an easy reference to recommend.
And yes, it covers all types of clusters (open and globs).
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Bic Parker
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GlennLeDrew
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Another possibility that might begin to address your needs is the volume devoted to star clusters in the Webb Society series.
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gustave
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Thank you for the info Glenn.I'm looking forward to having a look at your suggestions. Star Clusters sounds just like what I'm after.
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Tony Flanders
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Quote:
Star Clusters sounds just like what I'm after.
Anybody who really cares about clusters needs to own it; it's the essential reference work. That doesn't preclude other books, of course.
Do you know about the online resources, by the way? Harris for globular clusters, WebDA for open clusters? Those are necessarily more complete and up to date than any hardcopy work.
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Tony Flanders
First and foremost observing love: naked eye.
Second, binoculars.
Last but not least, telescopes.
And I sometimes dabble with cameras.
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JayKSC
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Loc: Florida
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As others have mentioned, Archinal's and Hynes' Star Clusters is the essential reference for star clusters. It's also a good read on Cloudy Nights for its detailed chapters on the science behind these interesting objects.
- Jay
South Florida
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stevecoe
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Tony;
Is it possible for you to post the complete URL for those websites?
Thanks;
Steve Coe
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Tony Flanders
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Quote:
Is it possible for you to post the complete URL for those websites?
Your favorite internet search engine will do the job fine. But sure.
The Harris globular-cluster database and WEBDA. Harris is pretty much self-explanatory, same cannot be said of WEBDA.
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Tony Flanders
First and foremost observing love: naked eye.
Second, binoculars.
Last but not least, telescopes.
And I sometimes dabble with cameras.
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EdZ
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Quote:
Star Clusters by Brent A. Archinal and Steven J. Hynes
Star Clusters is an excellent resource, however it is a desk reference, not a field book. I own it an would recommend it, but look for another choice as a field guide.
edz
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CaptainTruss
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Webb Society Handbooks are great and cover everything! There's a book for each object type. They're great books and pretty darn cheap too.
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gustave
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Thanks Prof...that's a good tip.
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gustave
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Thanks Prof...that's a worthy tip.
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bicparker
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Quote:
Quote:
Star Clusters by Brent A. Archinal and Steven J. Hynes
Star Clusters is an excellent resource, however it is a desk reference, not a field book. I own it an would recommend it, but look for another choice as a field guide.
edz
Ahh Ed! I still take mine into the field. It gets a little more wear, but I hate my books to look too unused  .
Just for those who don't know, the Star Clusters Book we are talking about is hardback bound in an identical manner to the Night Sky Observer's Guide, Uranometria 2000, and Arp Atlas of Galaxies volumes, all of which come from Willmann-Bell, Inc. This binding obviously makes for nice looking library references, but it is fairly robust, too, which is good if you want to use them in the field. Your choice. A lot of folks do use these in the field. They will wear well, but they will wear, just like any books will when exposed to the elements.
The Star Clusters book, in addition to its narratives, has several tables, catalog listings, and cross references that are terrific for field use (and I have used them many times). And there are, of course, many reference photographs and diagrams of many of the clusters that are helpful for identification.
Soooo.... keep it in the library to take it to the field.
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Bic Parker
17.5" f/5 dob
10" f/10 SCT
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bicparker
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Quote:
Another possibility that might begin to address your needs is the volume devoted to star clusters in the Webb Society series.
Glenn, that was a good recommendation.... I have the whole Webb series and your post made me go back and look at the star clusters volume (Volume 3). I think one thing that especially stands out about the Webb Society volume is that it is chock full of sketches and observed descriptions of clusters, in addition to other catalog information. This is a dedicated visual reference and it is a good one. Thanks for reminding me about it and making me get re-acquainted with that volume.
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Bic Parker
17.5" f/5 dob
10" f/10 SCT
5" f/8 refractor
80mm f/6 refractor
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starbux
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Reged: 02/08/06
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Loc: Silicon Valley, CA
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You might consider "Star Clusters and How to Observe Them" by Mark Allison. Not without its faults, the book could use some serious editing. Still with the limited number of books of this type it is worth adding to one's collection after Archinal & Hynes book and the Webb Society Deep-Sky Observers Handbook volume (#3). There are plenty of cheap used copies on Amazon so it wouldn't be too major a purchase.
What might be nice to see someday would be an atlas dedicated to open and globular cluster (much in the same vein as the Cambridge Double Star Atlas featuring many of the more obscure clusters not included in other atlases.
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scopethis
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Loc: Kingman, Ks
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Mr. Steven Hynes also wrote a book about Planetary Nebulas.
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CaptainTruss
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Quote:
Mr. Steven Hynes also wrote a book about Planetary Nebulas.
That you'll have to sell your car and get a mortgage to buy! Ok, maybe it's not that bad but they go for $100 used. I bet it's amazing, I want it badly but I would like to talk to someone how personally has the book to tell me about it and see if it's really worth it as I'm a serious PN observer.
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Are you a serious deep sky observer?
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TomN
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Reged: 01/14/09
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The original question was;
Quote:
Does anyone know of field books with detailed information including charts of various degree field sizes for star clusters.
..then the book Star Clusters may dissapoint. It is full of information but most of it not terrifically useful to the backyard astronomer in my opinion. I get most of the information about relative sizes from my Uranometria. It's the main reference I use to plan an observing session.
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bicparker
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Tom,
Have you tried using Table 4.1 - Catalog of Clusters and Asterisms in the Milky Way, and Objects Misidentified as Such that is in Star Clusters? While I also use Uranometria as my primary reference, I have found this to be one of the better cluster references in the field since it includes size (going to the OP's original question), brightest star mag, surface brightness, Trumpler type (great for OC's), cross ref's to SA2K and U2K charts, and of course, the comments. There are other good table references in the book, but that is the one I go to most often. Probably this table's biggest value is that it contains a lot of corrected information (especially for visual observers) that has permeated several of the many clusters catalogs.
I would agree that for casual observations of objects in general, this reference might be TMI. And I wouldn't recommend it in such cases, either. But I think for dedicated cluster observations, this book really does fit the bill (at least it has for me). The widely varied nature of clusters makes it necessary to have additional information beyond just the size, plus it is really useful to know where the errata is on a lot of these objects (and there is a lot out there).
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Bic Parker
17.5" f/5 dob
10" f/10 SCT
5" f/8 refractor
80mm f/6 refractor
66mm f/6 refractor
Plus a few others out of the rotation
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JakeSaloranta
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Reged: 09/18/08
Posts: 237
Loc: Sisu, Sauna, Sibelius...
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I'll be honest - "Star Clusters and How to Observe Them" by Mark Allison is by far the worst astronomy book in my bookshelf and I constantly wish I had not spent $20 to get it.
Also Webb Society's books are pretty old (some from the 70s!) and the quality of sketches in the book leaves a lot to desire. I cannot recommend these either although I have the galaxies volume (I got for free).
There currently is no good observing books out there of globular and open clusters.
In my opinion Best resource is the internet where you get most of the stuff for free and easily. WEBDA has 1200 listed clusters, DSH's asterism database is pretty huge...
/Jake
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Tony Flanders
Post Laureate
Reged: 05/18/06
Posts: 3469
Loc: Cambridge, MA, USA
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Quote:
Quote:
Mr. Steven Hynes also wrote a book about Planetary Nebulas.
That you'll have to sell your car and get a mortgage to buy! Ok, maybe it's not that bad but they go for $100 used. I bet it's amazing, I want it badly but I would like to talk to someone how personally has the book to tell me about it and see if it's really worth it as I'm a serious PN observer.
It's a superb book, but I wouldn't pay $100 for it. A lot of the book consists of the science behind the planetaries, with reference to recent studies. But the science of planetary nebulae has advanced quite a bit in the 18 years since the book was published.
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Tony Flanders
First and foremost observing love: naked eye.
Second, binoculars.
Last but not least, telescopes.
And I sometimes dabble with cameras.
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Cygnus_x1
Sketcher Extraordinaire
Reged: 11/17/04
Posts: 2396
Loc: 50N - too far north!
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Quote:
I'll be honest - "Star Clusters and How to Observe Them" by Mark Allison is by far the worst astronomy book in my bookshelf and I constantly wish I had not spent $20 to get it.
Also Webb Society's books are pretty old (some from the 70s!) and the quality of sketches in the book leaves a lot to desire. I cannot recommend these either although I have the galaxies volume (I got for free).
There currently is no good observing books out there of globular and open clusters.
In my opinion Best resource is the internet where you get most of the stuff for free and easily. WEBDA has 1200 listed clusters, DSH's asterism database is pretty huge...
/Jake
I agree about Mark Allison's book. I picked up a copy in a bookshop a while back and after a look through I put it back, it was badly produced and the pictures were not well reproduced at all.
The Webb Soc's books are very long in the tooth now, and the sketches didn't reproduce well in them at all, but I have all of them and do refer now and again to them (mostly for old time's sake - I was just getting into deep sky observing when I picked them up in the early 1990s and I love the feeling I get when I open them; the excitement of a new hobby as it was then!), but I tend to use the Night Sky Observer's Guide Vols 1 and 2 and the internet these days, more than anything else.
The best cluster book on the market is the aformentioned Star Clusters by Archinal and Hynes.
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Tony Flanders
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Quote:
There currently is no good observing books out there of globular and open clusters.
I'd never really thought about it, but I suppose that's true. For open clusters in particular, Sue French's Celestial Sampler might come closest. Obviously, she covers lots of other stuff, but as a small-scope observer, she really has a passion for asterisms and open clusters.
But wouldn't it be cool to have a book that really delves into the science of each open cluster, and then says: "now let's look through the eyepiece and see what evidence we can find of this cluster's age, distance from Earth, and distance from the plane of the Milky Way." I certainly would buy such a book. In fact, I might even write it!
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Tony Flanders
First and foremost observing love: naked eye.
Second, binoculars.
Last but not least, telescopes.
And I sometimes dabble with cameras.
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Rick Woods
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Quote:
Quote:
Mr. Steven Hynes also wrote a book about Planetary Nebulas.
That you'll have to sell your car and get a mortgage to buy! Ok, maybe it's not that bad but they go for $100 used. I bet it's amazing, I want it badly but I would like to talk to someone how personally has the book to tell me about it and see if it's really worth it as I'm a serious PN observer.
$56 just now on Bookfinder.com.
If you're really into PNs, it's a great book to have, and a good read. I got mine when they were in print. While I don't use it often, when I do need it, there's nothing else that will do. Good catalog of PNs in it too.
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- Rick
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davidpitre
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A great reference that Cloudy Nights contributor Alvin Huey has graciously made available for free online is his guide to observing globular clusters :
www.faintfuzzies.com/Files/GlobularClusters.pdf
It contains excellent finder charts, images, and basic info including coordinates, visual magnitudes, size , star magnitudes...
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David
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scopethis
professor emeritus
Reged: 05/30/08
Posts: 638
Loc: Kingman, Ks
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Well, I believe it's time for Steve O'Meara to start on a new book!
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starbux
sage
Reged: 02/08/06
Posts: 290
Loc: Silicon Valley, CA
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Quote:
I'll be honest - "Star Clusters and How to Observe Them" by Mark Allison is by far the worst astronomy book in my bookshelf and I constantly wish I had not spent $20 to get it.
That's why I suggested buying it used. At the used price it might be worth it.
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blb
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Reged: 11/25/05
Posts: 215
Loc: Piedmont NC
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Quote:
I'll be honest - "Star Clusters and How to Observe Them" by Mark Allison is by far the worst astronomy book in my bookshelf and I constantly wish I had not spent $20 to get it.
I have a copy of this book and have been looking it over again. So I was wondering what is wrong with it other than some poor quality photo's of clusters. It seems to me to be a good introduction to observing them. Isn't that what the series by Springer is supposed to be? Anyway, I was just curious. 
Buddy
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blb
sage
Reged: 11/25/05
Posts: 215
Loc: Piedmont NC
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Quote:
Well, I believe it's time for Steve O'Meara to start on a new book!
YES! I would realy love it if Steve O'Meara could do one like he did on the Herschel 400, for globular and open clusters. Now that would be realy great. Maybe even use the Astronomical League's observing clubs manual for a basis.
Lets hope, Buddy
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blb
sage
Reged: 11/25/05
Posts: 215
Loc: Piedmont NC
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Quote:
Quote:
I'll be honest - "Star Clusters and How to Observe Them" by Mark Allison is by far the worst astronomy book in my bookshelf and I constantly wish I had not spent $20 to get it.
I have a copy of this book and have been looking it over again. So I was wondering what is wrong with it other than some poor quality photo's of clusters. It seems to me to be a good introduction to observing them. Isn't that what the series by Springer is supposed to be? Anyway, I was just curious.
Buddy
So I guess no one can tell me what is wrong with this book!
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JakeSaloranta
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Reged: 09/18/08
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Quote:
So I guess no one can tell me what is wrong with this book!
Well I think it all depends on the reader. Some of the things I found lacking in my review were:
Photographs
95% of the images in the book look like they were taken before the camera was invented. Photographs are
a) not centered on the object
b) taken with too much "magnification" (for example M48 picture shows only a handful of stars with a field of view approximately 15' when the cluster is over 30' in size)
c) are typically poorly focused, show a lot of grain and are very poorly tracked.
Minimum apertures
Same problem with every deep sky book out there. For example calming G1 to be extremely faint and visible in 12" to 16" telescopes is a joke.
Layout
Many of the pictures are 3-4 pages behind or before the actual object description. As a reader I find it highly annoying. The grainy, barely in focus picture of globular cluster Messier 12 is on page 152 and the description of the object is on page 157.
For the newbies
The book offers very little (if anything) to an advanced amateur observer.
Comprehensive observing list
This basically lists "the best" and some interesting open and globular clusters in the sky. Fairly good choice in objects (you can't really argue about what other people like) but the descriptions of the objects are... well not ¤%&/ but seems to be made in haste and in very basic way. 5 lines on M44 is hardly very detailed and the description doesn't make the object sound interesting or worth looking at in any way. Putting in some different observations made with different size telescope would have spiced up things a bit. It feels like the author has only copied observations from other observers and not cared to looked at the objects on his own.
All and all very amateur-like attempt to make a book, probably with a small budget, leaving the reader wanting more value for money and the brain.
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/Jake
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blb
sage
Reged: 11/25/05
Posts: 215
Loc: Piedmont NC
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I agree that the photo's are not up to par and I would have preferred them to be together with the descriptions, but all in all I think the book is a good introduction to observing clusters. As such it is well worth the money and not worth bashing. At least that's my opinion.
Clear skies, Buddy
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C-11, C-6, XT10i Dob, ETX125PE, TV102, & AT66
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Lane
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Reged: 11/19/07
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If anyone is interested in the book "Star Clusters" by Brent A. Archinal and Steven J. Hynes it is available for $34.95 from www.willbell.com. I just ordered a copy after reading this thread.
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obrazell
member
Reged: 04/03/05
Posts: 56
Loc: United Kingdom
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I think then perhaps you should read the book more carefully. It is full of factual errors and poor editing. Although you might claim that beginners do not need to know the facts just a good read I would question that.
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