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Equipment Discussions >> Mounts

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Jim7728
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New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity!
      #4297927 - 01/07/11 08:57 AM

For $1999.

http://www.celestron.com/c3/product.php?CatID=78&ProdID=761

Got a better link. So it's a CGEM with a beefier tripod?

Edited by Jim7728 (01/07/11 09:12 AM)


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Chris.Baron
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Jim7728]
      #4297958 - 01/07/11 09:13 AM

Looks very much like a current cgem but with a longer counterweight bar and a better tripod and spreader. I could be wrong, but Celestron's site lists the weight of the mount as being 18.6KG for both mounts.

So no magic here, but slight tweaks to the existing product ala an NEQ6 vs EQ6.

Celestron's product page

Cheers,
Chris


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t.r.
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Chris.Baron]
      #4297963 - 01/07/11 09:18 AM

Now it's getting too close to the price of a Losmandy G11 Gemini II though...

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Jb32828
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: t.r.]
      #4298019 - 01/07/11 09:59 AM

A Losmandy with Gemini Goto is like 3200 bucks isnt it and is rated for 60 pounds.

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RTLR 12
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: t.r.]
      #4298029 - 01/07/11 10:03 AM

If you only want an SLT...A GLT Go/To will cost an additional $1000+.

Stan


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t.r.
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: t.r.]
      #4298031 - 01/07/11 10:03 AM

Where did you see the $1999 price quoted...its not on the C site?

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LLEEGE
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Jb32828]
      #4298037 - 01/07/11 10:06 AM

Looks like a $600 tripod "upgrade".
For 600 beans, I'd just buy a used Meade GFT.
I don't think a bigger tripod will increase the CGEM capacity 10 lbs.


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fetoma
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Jim7728]
      #4298044 - 01/07/11 10:09 AM

Quote:

So it's a CGEM with a beefier tripod?




That looks right on the button to me, a $600 tripod upgrade.


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Chris.Baron
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: fetoma]
      #4298074 - 01/07/11 10:25 AM

And a longer looking counterweight bar, we mustn't overlook that.

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LLEEGE
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Chris.Baron]
      #4298096 - 01/07/11 10:35 AM

Looks like they added a hub to the base to mount on the larger tripod.

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Jim7728
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: t.r.]
      #4298111 - 01/07/11 10:41 AM

Quote:

Where did you see the $1999 price quoted...its not on the C site?




http://www.highpointscientific.com/product/CEL-91528/Celestron-CGEM-DX-Mount-Tripod-91528.html

If anything, the larger tripod looks like a better match for the CGEM head than the CG-5 legs. I imagine Celestron will offer that tripod separately for those who want to upgrade their CGEM tripod.


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Chris.Baron
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: LLEEGE]
      #4298121 - 01/07/11 10:45 AM

Well then, there you have it. There's roughly $50 in raw costs added to the mount so there's your $600 delta between the CGEM and CGEM DX.

Perfectly justifiable right?

I guess they found they've created a hole where the the CGE used to sit and need to add a middle tier. There's no way to downgrade the capacity of the CGE PRO I guess. It's too bad the CGE is no more. I was finally going to be able to convince the CFO I could afford to buy one. Now I either have to sit tight, try the used market or continue to save for a much larger jump up.

Alas.


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Jb32828
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Chris.Baron]
      #4298146 - 01/07/11 10:56 AM

Well I for one am lost on the new Celestron offerings.

First we have that SkyProdigy series with a 70mm refractor for 699, a 90mm mak for 749 and a 130mm newt for 799. What scares me with these offerings is that these are the same scopes they offer on the SLT mount, so do we have an SLT mount with a better computer?

Now we have what looks to be a GCEM with a better tripod and longer counterweight bar with a claim of 50 lbs capacity? Does that mean I can toss 25-30 lbs of equipment on this for imaging? It looks like the same mount? Does that mean I could replace the CW bar and tripod on my CG-5 and get a 45 lbs capacity? I have to think that would be ridiculous thinking right?

Am I the only one scratching my head at this?


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Goodchild
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Chris.Baron]
      #4298152 - 01/07/11 10:58 AM

I don't own a CGEM but I've seen several threads addressing its problems. Do you suppose Celestron has worked out the kinks with the deluxe?

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Chris.Baron
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Jb32828]
      #4298154 - 01/07/11 11:01 AM

Quote:


Am I the only one scratching my head at this?




Scratching your head perhaps. I think the rest of us are shaking our heads.

As for working out the kinks in the CGEM, my money is on no. These might ship with the latest firmware, but I doubt there's anything craftsmanship wise that's been improved upon.


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hfjacinto
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Goodchild]
      #4298157 - 01/07/11 11:01 AM

I would have purchased it, I wonder if they are just selling the tripod?

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mclewis1
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: LLEEGE]
      #4298168 - 01/07/11 11:08 AM

Quote:

I don't think a bigger tripod will increase the CGEM capacity 10 lbs.



It is if the current tripod isn't capable of dampening vibrations at the heavier weights. Assuming the existing bearings and motors can handle the increased weight the other components needed to handle a weight increase are the tripod and the counterweights.

A tripod upgrade is the number one method of increasing a mount's carrying capacity. Adding weight to an existing tripod helps dampen vibrations, increasing leg diameters and the overall robustness makes a marked improvement in a mount's capacity.

The CG-5 and CGEM/Atlas/EQ-6 have very similar (35 vs. 40lbs) weight carrying capabilities while they have very different bearings and motors, the common element between them is the tripod. The CG-5 went from 25-30lb carrying capacity to 30-35lbs with primarily a tripod upgrade (the 2" steel leg version).

It's very common for folks with pier mounted configurations (the ultimate "tripod" upgrade) to report that they are very happy with a particular mount's carrying capabilities when loaded at or exceeding the rated capacities.

This new CGEM DX appears to be using a revised CGE tripod (same leg diameters, same leg clamps, same spreader bar) to provide part of the increased capabilities. Seems like an easy and smart move on Celestron's part to offer another mount to help fill the gap left by the CGE.

The question for Celestron is if this revised mount is indeed capable of carrying 50lbs of equipment on a regular basis. If there are any weak points in the existing CGEM mount's capabilities the DX will certainly highlight them.


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t.r.
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: mclewis1]
      #4298188 - 01/07/11 11:18 AM

Personally, I don't think the Big "C" cares...just throw it out there and see what sticks!

Edited by t.r. (01/07/11 11:18 AM)


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hfjacinto
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: t.r.]
      #4298214 - 01/07/11 11:34 AM Attachment (277 downloads)

The CGEM is certainly capable of imaging with more than 25lbs of weight. The below image of M57 won't win any awards but it was taken with a 9.25 (no focal reducer so imaging at 2300MM Focal length) an 80 MM EON Guide scope and cameras attached. The weight was over 30LBS and only 1 image wasn't usable. This was also taken in a white zone with the full moon out.

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fetoma
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: t.r.]
      #4298217 - 01/07/11 11:36 AM

Quote:

Personally, I don't think the Big "C" cares...just throw it out there and see what sticks!




Hmmm, it's easy to feel that way at times!


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Chris.Baron
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: hfjacinto]
      #4298233 - 01/07/11 11:46 AM

I think the CGEM capable is a mount, but I'm not sure how long an exposure one can take at higher focal lengths. When I had my SV90TBV I could go for 30min exposures and had to toss out a few, but not many. I've now moved to a carbon fibre R200SS which funnily enough isn't much heavier than the SV90TBV but balancing it is different.

Of course I developed a problem with my RA gear before I was able to test the R200SS. I was just out of warranty and so sent it down to be hypertuned and had the gear repaired.

I just got it back but the weather has been brutal. I'm hoping I can get a clear night over the next while. I'd be happy with 10 minute subs to begin with, but would like to get back to 30min subs. All told I'm hovering around the 20lb mark so we'll see what a hypertuned CGEM can do.

I have an observatory and plan on getting a pier, but a better tripod could be a stopgap. As long as it isn't ridiculously priced that is. $600 for the DX over the stock CGEM seems a bit steep to me.

Chris


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hfjacinto
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Chris.Baron]
      #4298245 - 01/07/11 11:54 AM

I don't know what the Tripod costs but lets compare to Losmandy.

The LW Tripod costs $450
The HD costs $700
The FHD MA costs $1190

I think that the CGE Pro tripod is almost as capable as an HD Tripod.

Remember this manufacturers recommended, it will $1799 in a couple of months.

I know people are going to say that it isn't a fair comparison, but we would need to see test images. So far while Losmandy makes a great EQ head, the Gemini system has left me wanting.


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nemo129
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: hfjacinto]
      #4298292 - 01/07/11 12:18 PM

It will be interesting to see what comes out of this as the first ones hit the market and we get first light reports. The mount head looks exactly the same, and that is where the issues have been, not the tripod. ...still saving for an AP900 or Mach1.

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LLEEGE
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Jim7728]
      #4298640 - 01/07/11 03:31 PM

Quote:

I imagine Celestron will offer that tripod separately for those who want to upgrade their CGEM tripod.


You would need to replace the polar fork on the mount as well.

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RTLR 12
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: LLEEGE]
      #4298652 - 01/07/11 03:39 PM

What is a polar fork?

Stan


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Asimov
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: RTLR 12]
      #4298663 - 01/07/11 03:43 PM

All I have to say is:

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LLEEGE
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: RTLR 12]
      #4298693 - 01/07/11 03:57 PM

Quote:

What is a polar fork?

Stan


The lower section of the mount. The part that bolts to the tripod.

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RTLR 12
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: LLEEGE]
      #4298720 - 01/07/11 04:18 PM

It looks as if there is an adapter between the polar fork of the CGEM and the DX tripod.

Stan


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LLEEGE
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: RTLR 12]
      #4298751 - 01/07/11 04:31 PM

To me, it looks like an entire new casting. Looks like the only change to the mount itself. It could be an adapter though.

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RTLR 12
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: LLEEGE]
      #4298851 - 01/07/11 05:14 PM

Luke,

I think you are right! It does look like a new casting, but it's not a real picture then is it? Seems the way to go would be to make an adapter to mount the existing CGEM, but then you wouldn't have to buy a new one from them if you wanted to update.

Stan


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drksky
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Jim7728]
      #4298959 - 01/07/11 06:10 PM

Looks like they had a bunch of CGE tripods left over and want to get rid of them.

This certainly doesn't take the place of the CGE, although I guess in their eyes it does. I think the CGE was a well-done mount save for the *BLEEP* cable connectors. It's too bad they didn't want to continue to support US manufacturing.


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mewmartigan
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: drksky]
      #4299007 - 01/07/11 06:28 PM

Spreader on the bottom looks a lot like the TPI Astro one you can get for the CGEM or Atlas.

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mclewis1
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: mewmartigan]
      #4299056 - 01/07/11 06:55 PM

The spreader is visually identical to the CGE model. The legs are the same diameter but are brushed stainless steel rather than painted as on the CGE. The castings at the ends and the clamps are slightly different. The forks at the top also look different.

Similar but certainly not identical to the original CGE tripod. If the walls of the legs are the same thickness then the carrying capacity of this tripod should be the same as the CGE.

It all looks like a nice upgrade to the CGEM ... don't love the price though. Now we get to wait for the some hands on experiences to see what the real scoop is.


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Gord
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: mclewis1]
      #4299111 - 01/07/11 07:20 PM

Haven't seen this mentioned, but looking at Celestron's site under "new products", right after the new CGEM DX, is a listing for a CGEM DX 1400 and CGEM DX 1400 HD. Very interesting.

http://www.celestron.com/c3/product.php?CatID=78&ProdID=758
http://www.celestron.com/c3/product.php?CatID=78&ProdID=760

Based on comments that people have made about the Atlas/CGEM after seeing some modifications (to the saddle and more importantly a heavier tripod), there is belief that the mount could handle up in the G11/CGE-classic weight range. That would be enough to carry the C14, at least for visual & planetary imaging.

Hmmmmm. Going to have to watch that space.

Clear skies,


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Gord
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Gord]
      #4299121 - 01/07/11 07:26 PM

Looks like $6299 for the classic C14:

http://www.highpointscientific.com/product/CEL-11001/Celestron-CGEM-DX-1400-14-F10-SCT-Telescope-11001.html

That's close to in-line with the old CGE 1400 package.

Clear skies,


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Nocturnal
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Gord]
      #4299201 - 01/07/11 07:58 PM

Wow, a C14 on a CGE.

Actually this makes me wonder why the big C doesn't sell their mounts -without- tripods but with a pier plate for those of us who plan to mount these permanently. I realize that would add more SKUs but if it cuts a few hundred of the cost then it would make the product even more attractive. I mean if I buy a CGE-Pro I end up with the big tripod in the basement that'll serve no purpose.


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Gord
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Gord]
      #4299206 - 01/07/11 08:00 PM

I forgot to mention, it's hard to tell from the picture, but is the c/w bar actually bigger in diameter as well? I'm wondering if they increased it to the same as the CGE-Pro (and old CGE, G11, etc.), which is 1.25" I think. It looks heavier.

Clear skies,


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Steven
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Gord]
      #4299217 - 01/07/11 08:05 PM

Maybe Orion/Sky-Watcher will soon put a beefier tripod on their Atlas/EQ6 mounts for a stated 60-70 lbs capacity

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drksky
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Gord]
      #4299223 - 01/07/11 08:07 PM

Actually, the spreader is the same one as the CGE-Pro. Cast steel as opposed to the plastic on on the classic CGE, which was one of the things I never liked about it. Seemed like a really cheap and silly place to cut a corner.

Counterweight shaft definitely doesn't look as thick as a CGE shaft. Looks the same as the CGEM and CG5. Quite spindley. I've never understood why C lists the CW shaft weight, but not the size.


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RTLR 12
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Gord]
      #4299224 - 01/07/11 08:08 PM

And the EDGE 14 HD on the CGEM DX...

Stan

http://www.highpointscientific.com/product/CEL-11004/Celestron-Edge-HD-1400-On-CGEM-DX-Mount-14-F11-Aplantic-SCT-Telescope-11004.html


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drksky
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: RTLR 12]
      #4299230 - 01/07/11 08:10 PM

Boy, I just can't see that mount handling a 50lb OTA very well. It looks like a C11 sitting on top of a CG-5. Scary.

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Garry
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Jim7728]
      #4299278 - 01/07/11 08:34 PM

Saw at CES yesterday.
Talked to Kevin for couple minutes, didn't have much time to
spend. On flight home now.
The counter weight bar is larger dia., 22lb wt., might be same as Pro .
The locking clutch knobs are bigger.
I believe adapter was mentioned to attach to what looks like a
Pro style tripod.
There is also a better "chip" for improved performance .

The mount took me by surprise, wasn't prepared to get all
new details.

Looked pretty solid w/C11HD,guider,and camera mounted.

My appologies to Kevin if my recall is inaccurate.

Garry


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Don Allen
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Garry]
      #4299333 - 01/07/11 09:02 PM

Would be nice if the "chip" solved the performance issues.

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Jim7728
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Don Allen]
      #4299376 - 01/07/11 09:26 PM

Thanks for the quick look, Garry!

CES looks like a lot of fun to attend.


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Gord
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: drksky]
      #4299430 - 01/07/11 10:13 PM

Quote:

Boy, I just can't see that mount handling a 50lb OTA very well. It looks like a C11 sitting on top of a CG-5. Scary.




I think it's all a matter of personal comfort and preference. I don't think it's really a stretch for this setup. I have both the EQ6 and G11, and my first impression of the EQ6 (after having the G11 already) was just how beefy of mount it is. The thing is solid, and the real weakness is the Vixen saddle. Fix that (as here) and a better tripod (certainly a weakness for heavier/taller loads) and it's close to the same league.

Certainly not in quality, refinement, or probably absolute strength or solidness. The machined billet vs. cast has got to swing in favor of the G11. But I don't see this being that much of a stretch, especially for visual. Then again, I actually found my C10N on EQ5 to be actually useable...

Clear skies,


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Gord
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Garry]
      #4299435 - 01/07/11 10:16 PM

Garry, thanks for the live update and confirming some of what people are suspecting/noticing. Definitely was a surprise, but as some have said, I think it makes sense. Minimal effort in terms of development, re-using of existing parts, and they now have something to slot in between the CGEM and CGE-Pro. Nice to see.

Clear skies,


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jason_milani
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Gord]
      #4299455 - 01/07/11 10:27 PM

Pour yourself a concrete pier and stick a standard CGEM on it. You'll have the same thing for a lot less money. And it STILL won't carry a C-14 comfortably. Next they'll be offering the C-11 on a CG4-DX.

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danielcrosse
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: jason_milani]
      #4299499 - 01/07/11 10:57 PM

I think the picture circulating says it all -- not an actual photo. I would be surprised if the mount was not different from the current one shipping. It would seem that bigger bearings would be required to support 50 lbs. It has to be more than just a tripod upgrade.

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Space99
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: danielcrosse]
      #4299860 - 01/08/11 06:03 AM

I think the worm wheel size is more important than the bearings. And that is the major difference between the CGEM/EQ6 and the G11. The Losmandy worm-wheel has nearly twice the diameter. The rotational torque transferred to the worm bearings are much less.

IMHO

Mick.


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Gord
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Space99]
      #4299958 - 01/08/11 08:10 AM

I don't think the worm wheel size has any bearing on the carrying ability. Remember, the mount is supposed to be balanced so that there is very little weight that the motors need to act on. Other than rotational intertia, whether it's 5 lbs, or 50 lbs, it doesn't matter.

The larger wheel will affect the tracking performance though (I believe). But it's not to say you can't have good tracking with a smaller wheel. Just look at the Tak EM200. The Atlas/EQ6/CGEM are all effectively the same. And no one seems to be concerned with the EM200.

Clear skies,


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rmollise
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: drksky]
      #4300009 - 01/08/11 08:43 AM

Quote:

Boy, I just can't see that mount handling a 50lb OTA very well. It looks like a C11 sitting on top of a CG-5. Scary.




Well, a CG5 - C11 is nothing to be afraid of. I've used a buddy's setup for years and it has never sent us screaming...and has acutually worked pretty well.

As for the C14 on an improved CGEM. No reason you need to be afeared. I believe it will be very similar in performance to a C14 on a CGE or G11. That is...you wouldn't want to try to do "20 hour total exposure time" imaging, but for us aging babyboomers like moi who are almost exclusively visual/short video exposure oriented, this could be a godsend.


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t.r.
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Gord]
      #4300011 - 01/08/11 08:44 AM

The bugs weren't even worked out of the first one, now they're on to the next gen?

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dawziecat
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: rmollise]
      #4300149 - 01/08/11 10:03 AM

Quote:

(In another thread entirely). . .Celestron seems to be on the cusp of resolving the CGEM problems
--------------------
Uncle Rod




Think this DX model could be the "resolution" you were referring to in the IEQ45 thread?

If C could just get the CGEM working reliably, I could be a customer. The electronic problems reported on scare the heck outt'a me. No way I can be sending a heavy piece of gear back and forth from Canada and the US for repairs! Shipping charges would be murder and the customs/brokerage procedures even worse!

Edited by dawziecat (01/08/11 10:06 AM)


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mclewis1
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: dawziecat]
      #4300219 - 01/08/11 10:36 AM

Quote:

No way I can be sending a heavy piece of gear back and forth from Canada and the US for repairs! Shipping charges would be murder and the customs/brokerage procedures even worse!



Agreed that the shipping charges would be a bit nasty and prohibitive for many folks. There is no duty on telescopes and telescope parts. You also shouldn't be charged excessive brokerage fees since the cost of what you are transporting across the border is the rework/warranty repair charges and not the value of the whole mount (which you have already paid for and have proof of). Still, I hate the brokerage situation as much as the next guy.

You also wouldn't be shipping the whole mount for an electrical problem, just the head and the hand controller. No counterweights, no cw bar, no tripod, etc. So the actual weight and amount being shipped should not be that bad.


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Gord
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: mclewis1]
      #4300228 - 01/08/11 10:40 AM

Agreed. I've gone through it before with Celestron for a mount issue in the past. It was relatively painless, and duties/brokerage/etc. was not an issue. Just the shipping, which wasn't that bad.

Still, it's hopeful that they will have resolved the electrical issues at some point.

Clear skies,


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rmollise
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: dawziecat]
      #4300375 - 01/08/11 12:15 PM

Quote:


Think this DX model could be the "resolution" you were referring to in the IEQ45 thread?





What I was referring to is the fact that the number of reported problems with the CGEM, the standard CGEM, I've seen has declined rather precipitously in the last six months.


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rmollise
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: t.r.]
      #4300377 - 01/08/11 12:17 PM

Quote:

The bugs weren't even worked out of the first one,




Actually, I think the bugs have been worked out.


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BlueGrass
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Gord]
      #4300398 - 01/08/11 12:29 PM

After all the problems I and others have had with the original CGEMs, I don't have much interest in this 'upgrade'. The various CGEM problems are not something to simply wish away, hoping they've got it right this time.

If you do have to ship it back for service, shipping just the mount and controller in the original box is not insubstantial, it amounts to close to 40lbs.

I don't want to rehash the various problems and what others have experienced. We'll just have to wait and see about the DX. Good Luck to all!



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nemo129
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: BlueGrass]
      #4300457 - 01/08/11 12:57 PM

I have to agree with George here and with t.r. above. The CGEM was a troubled platform from day one. Have they fixed the issues as Rod said? Maybe in the newer shipping ones, and it is true I have seen fewer complaints in the last 6 months than in the previous year...but that could be due to lower sales of CGEMS due to all if the complaining..hence more Atlas mounts or name your mount here being sold?? (...only Celestron knows for sure). No doubt a properley working CGEM is a very nice mount for the money, the issue is that it was and to some extent still is a gamble to get one. That said, I have purchased my last Celestron mount unless something turns aound at the big "C". I really hope for anyone who buys a CGEM DX that the same issues are not still lurking. One thing I did note was when Garry reported that Celestron said a new chip was fixing the errors...on the Yahoo forum there are folks having a DEC guiding issue (in the South direction) that accoding to the forum members dealing with the issue...Celstron has acknowleged and has promised to fix in firmware. I would hope they would spend some time fixing any existing issues along with pushing new models out the door.

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BlueGrass
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: nemo129]
      #4300520 - 01/08/11 01:29 PM

"I would hope they would spend some time fixing any existing issues along with pushing new models out the door."

I too hope this happens, but some problems such as axis binding / stiction may not be finally resolved except with a parts upgrade or replacement. IMHO, if steel ring gears would have been listed in the DX specs, my ears would have perked up... but alas ...

Again, I'd rather this thread stay on track with info and news about the DX, not about the problems of the current CGEM, although the 'picture' of the DX head itself looks identical.


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nemo129
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: BlueGrass]
      #4300533 - 01/08/11 01:36 PM

We may have to wait until March to hear any real news, as they say the proof is in the pudding. I wish C the best with this new mount and will be happy to report any news of its make up if I hear of it.

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Alph
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: rmollise]
      #4300578 - 01/08/11 02:02 PM

Quote:

I believe it will be very similar in performance to a C14 on a CGE or G11.



Not even remotely.


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Tiny
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Gord]
      #4300620 - 01/08/11 02:27 PM

Quote:

Garry, thanks for the live update and confirming some of what people are suspecting/noticing. Definitely was a surprise, but as some have said, I think it makes sense. Minimal effort in terms of development, re-using of existing parts, and they now have something to slot in between the CGEM and CGE-Pro. Nice to see.

Clear skies,




This doesnt count as a mid tier mount in my opinion. Not in price or design.

CGE Pro $5,000 90lb capacity
CGEM DX $2,000 50lb capacity
CGEM $1,300 40lb capacity

Still a huge gap there.


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Gord
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Tiny]
      #4300779 - 01/08/11 03:48 PM

I think there is room in there for another offering, but this is a step up from the CGEM.

I'm also not sure I agree with the capacity ratings. If anything, I think they are somewhat conservative, and perhaps being stated more from an imaging perspective. Although in that case, I would say they are a little high, but I'm sure it's somewhat workable.

Look at it this way. Vixen rates the Sphinx DX at 50lbs. I *know* this setup, especially in CGEM-DX guise, is much more capable than the Sphinx. And if you look at the AS-GT, they rate it at 35lbs. That's a 12 lbs mount. And I can say, that I've used the AS-GT at 35+ lbs for a long time, and as imprefect of a setup as it is, it still works. And that's with a 44" long OTA.

With a (relatively) short tube like the C14, the CGEM-DX will work quite well.

There are no fast and hard rules (except that you can never overmount...), but an old guideline I've heard kicked around before is that "don't put more on it, that it itself weighs". The CGEM head is supposed to be around 41 lbs. 40-50lbs (or even a bit more) will be fine on this mount.

By the same guideline they followed for the AS-GT, it should even be able to swing 120lbs!

Clear skies,


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Tiny
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Gord]
      #4300840 - 01/08/11 04:16 PM

Quote:

I think there is room in there for another offering, but this is a step up from the CGEM.

I'm also not sure I agree with the capacity ratings. If anything, I think they are somewhat conservative, and perhaps being stated more from an imaging perspective. Although in that case, I would say they are a little high, but I'm sure it's somewhat workable.

Look at it this way. Vixen rates the Sphinx DX at 50lbs. I *know* this setup, especially in CGEM-DX guise, is much more capable than the Sphinx. And if you look at the AS-GT, they rate it at 35lbs. That's a 12 lbs mount. And I can say, that I've used the AS-GT at 35+ lbs for a long time, and as imprefect of a setup as it is, it still works. And that's with a 44" long OTA.

With a (relatively) short tube like the C14, the CGEM-DX will work quite well.

There are no fast and hard rules (except that you can never overmount...), but an old guideline I've heard kicked around before is that "don't put more on it, that it itself weighs". The CGEM head is supposed to be around 41 lbs. 40-50lbs (or even a bit more) will be fine on this mount.

By the same guideline they followed for the AS-GT, it should even be able to swing 120lbs!

Clear skies,




not for nothing but the SXD [what you meant?] has a payload capacity rated for 15kg[33lb] not 22kg [50lb]. There appeared to have been something lost in translation when the Vixen US people wrote their version of specs so i'd lean toward Vixen Japan being the correct capacity. Plus like you i've seen the mount and i never once thought it was substantial enough to take a 50lb ota.

http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ja&u=http://www.vixen.co.jp/at/sxd.htm&ei=ddMoTc3cMYiq8AalhpH-AQ&sa=X&oi=translate&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CB4Q7gEwAA&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dhttp://www.vixen.co.jp/at/sxd.htm%26hl%3Den%26safe%3Doff%26prmd%3Divns


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Gord
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Tiny]
      #4300901 - 01/08/11 04:47 PM

Quote:

not for nothing but the SXD [what you meant?] has a payload capacity rated for 15kg[33lb] not 22kg [50lb].




Sorry, you are right, it is the SXD. I have "DX" on the brain!

I've heard that said before as well about the Vixen ratings. That's more in line with how I would see it relative to the CGEM/EQ6/Altas in the 40-50lbs+ range.

Clear skies,


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Jay Wise
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: rmollise]
      #4301017 - 01/08/11 05:47 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Boy, I just can't see that mount handling a 50lb OTA very well. It looks like a C11 sitting on top of a CG-5. Scary.




Well, a CG5 - C11 is nothing to be afraid of. I've used a buddy's setup for years and it has never sent us screaming...and has acutually worked pretty well.

As for the C14 on an improved CGEM. No reason you need to be afeared. I believe it will be very similar in performance to a C14 on a CGE or G11. That is...you wouldn't want to try to do "20 hour total exposure time" imaging, but for us aging babyboomers like moi who are almost exclusively visual/short video exposure oriented, this could be a godsend.




Finally a sane voice among the naysayers! For those of us who are tormented by Gemini (I thought observing was supposed to be fun) a possible mount for my older but optically great C14. I only need it for visual and 1-2 minutes max for videocam. I can quit saving for the PRO. Hooray!

JayW


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rmollise
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Alph]
      #4301314 - 01/08/11 08:44 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I believe it will be very similar in performance to a C14 on a CGE or G11.



Not even remotely.




OK...can't help but ask...why? Have you used a C14 on either of these mounts? It is OK, but it is not exactly the Rock of Gibraltar.


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Learken
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: drksky]
      #4301581 - 01/08/11 10:57 PM

Under the details tab for the mount on the Celestron web site, the marketing blurb reads as follows regarding the improved payload capacity.

"Power Management - Redesigned electronics deliver constant regulated power to the motors making them capable of driving the telescope even when not perfectly balanced. This allows the CGEM DX to have the payload capacity of that of much larger mounts without sacrificing smooth tracking motion and pointing accuracy across the entire sky."

They don't mention that in the marketing blurbs for the standard CGEM mount, so it appears that they have made some changes to the internal electronics package, as well a beefier tripod.


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Alph
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: rmollise]
      #4301632 - 01/08/11 11:27 PM

Quote:

Have you used a C14 on either of these mounts?



Don't you dare to compare the stinking CGEM to my observatory class CGE Suddenly the CGEM is good enough for the C14. I am sure they will manage to dupe a lot of people. So far people were comparing the CGEM to the Atlas and the likes. However to compare it to the G11 is a big stretch. Slow down guys.


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mak7
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: rmollise]
      #4301657 - 01/08/11 11:40 PM

I have a CGEM and had my trials and tribulations with it. Had to send the first one back yada yada yada. I have since had the new replacement CGEM( thanks OPT) Hypertuned since it had already cost a lot for purchase price, shipping for warranty, time without and time down and the new one was better than the first but still hard to balance with axis stiction. I also added a TPI spreader bar and now think that I have a very good and substantial mid sized gem mount.The turning point was the Hypertune from Ed Thomas at DSProducts. Complete turnaround of a new mount. Wasn't real bad, but needed lots of help.
I am very happy at this point, more than I thought I would be, but pleased with my investment in the mount. 1.5 hour tracking and rock solid. The Hypertune made a world of difference in my ability to balance and guide.

My point in all of this is that all though Celestron has had trouble getting the CGEM up and running, I believe the CGEM is a capable mount as designed. Not as executed!!! I can now use the CGEM past the load limit I originally expected, about 50% of stated limit.

Load ratings differ, I expected to use it at one half of stated rating for AP. I am actually using it at 75 % of Celestrons load rating, and could go slightly more, but that has cost a lot of extra.. An AP or Tak mount would handle its rating without skipping a beat, or so I hear.

My point is that the new CGEM DX will probably be better than the standard CGEM. They have had time to fix simple things, put probably not QC. It will be another mass produced, mediocre offering !!!! I will hopefully have the ability to afford better when my current $ 2,100 CGEM needs to be replaced.

Hopefully your experiance will be different,

Brad


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Garry
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Learken]
      #4301722 - 01/09/11 12:38 AM

Keen eye Learken.

In regards to my previous post:
Kevin Kawai tried to describe briefly the improvement of performance and used the word "chip" in relation to the
" Power Management - Redesigned electronics deliver constant regulated power to the motors making them capable of driving the telescope even when not perfectly balanced. This allows the CGEM DX to have the payload capacity of that of much larger mounts without sacrificing smooth tracking motion and pointing accuracy across the entire sky."

The mounts new larger locking clutch lever would allow for
easier and more secure locking of the clutch for larger payloads.

A larger diameter counterweight bar would handle more weight
better for larger payloads.

The larger beefier tripod would be better for larger payloads.

C has upgraded & strengthened the mount/tripod both physically and electronically. That's a plus.
So why shouldn't it have a higher payload rating?

If a C14 were to be mounted on the CGEM DX the net results
should be better than the CGEM I would think.

Now as far as the picture on C's site I'll have to tell ya
I was close enough to read the DX on the side of the mount
and I'm slightly nearsighted but to my recallition the pic
looks like what I saw at CES.


Garry


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alrosm
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Garry]
      #4301798 - 01/09/11 01:55 AM

When you got to move your C14 OTA outside, you just know you are not gonna try to put it on a 50 lbs capacity mount.
CGE capacity was 65 lbs...
G11 is 60 lbs...


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Gord
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: alrosm]
      #4302086 - 01/09/11 09:32 AM

I know the G11 is better than the CGEM (or EQ6/Atlas) as it's machined billet vs. cast. That being said, I'm wondering how much all the quoted numbers are just pulled out of the air.

For example, the G11 is called the G11 because it was originally designed to carry the C11, not the C14. I remember having a conversation with Susanne Kidner on this topic, and her discussions with Scott Losmandy about Celestron putting the C14 on the G11. She was skepitcal, and as it sounds so was Scott. But Celestron seemed to think it was good enough was my understanding of what was said, and so we got the C14 on G11. And now it seems generally accepted that the G11 is up to the task.

Is it really that different to think the CGEM can't be as well, especially with some improvements to address the weaknesses?

As I said before, I know billet is better than cast, but the CGEM is actually a heavier mount than the G11 (by 5 lbs).

Clear skies,


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Gord
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Garry]
      #4302092 - 01/09/11 09:43 AM

Quote:

The larger beefier tripod would be better for larger payloads.





Absolutely. If it's not on a solid base, the mount and telescope as a unit are going to flex at the tripod. I know because I've experienced it myself with the G11 and my C10N.

I had my G11 on a light duty pier for testing. It's the same pier for my EQ5. Interestingly, the G11 was really not much more stable in carrying the C10 than was the EQ5. The flex was all coming from the pier.

I've noticed that the standard 2" SS tripod is also kind of light for heavier loads, especially when extended. The heavier tripod will improve that and let the mount work up to it's potential.

As someone earlier pointed out, if you want to get a true sense of what a mount will do, put it on a heavy concrete pier with a solid coupling. Then what you are really seeing is the capabilities of the mount.

Clear skies,


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rmollise
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Alph]
      #4302132 - 01/09/11 10:03 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Have you used a C14 on either of these mounts?



Don't you dare to compare the stinking CGEM to my observatory class CGE Suddenly the CGEM is good enough for the C14. I am sure they will manage to dupe a lot of people. So far people were comparing the CGEM to the Atlas and the likes. However to compare it to the G11 is a big stretch. Slow down guys.




Nobody said the CGEM. We are talking about a significantly strengthened mount. Only real world use will show whether it is up to the task or not. I am glad you like your mount, I do too in many ways, but I've used one with a C14 out at a breezy dark site. Dern near got me seasick.

Bottom line? If you want stability for a C14, you need to bump it up to the next tier, to at least a Losmandy Titan. But...that said...I believe the new CGEM DX will do about as an _acceptable_ job as the CGE and the G11.

Edited by rmollise (01/09/11 02:00 PM)


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ccreigh
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: fetoma]
      #4302471 - 01/09/11 01:06 PM

Here is an idea. I have the CGEM 11 HD with the "old" tripod and am looking to beef it up as well. The counterweight bar is definitly not long enough but C is sending me another gratis. I think this website may be the answer on the tripod fix....

http://www.tpiastro.com/index.htm


Chuck in Las Vegas
CGEM 11 HD
Meade ETX 90
Not enough Teleview lens!


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Garry
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Jim7728]
      #4305129 - 01/10/11 03:45 PM

Jim.
Here are the "Details" & "Specs" from C's site:
Power Management

CGEM CGEM DX CGE PRO

No Yes Yes

Power Requirement

12VDC 3.2A 12VDC 3.5A 12VDC 3.5A

Counterweight

17 lbs 22lbs 22lbs
(Same Accessories Item # 94187)

Tripod Leg/Wt.

2”SS / 17lbs 2.75”SS / 45lbs* 2.75”SS / 52lbs**
(* “CGE PRO style” ) (**Wt. includes Electronic Pier)
Mount Wt.

41 lbs 41 lbs 75 lbs

Payload Capacity

40 lbs 50 lbs 90 lbs


Check out the Flickr link for photos : CES Celestron Booth

There are about a hundred photos to go through but there
are a few decent ones of the CGEM DX.

Garry


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Jim7728
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Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Garry]
      #4305382 - 01/10/11 05:10 PM

Thanks for the link,Garry.

Good shot here.

DSCO4255/Flickr


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Jay Wise
sage


Reged: 11/21/08

Loc: Near Williamsburg VA
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Garry]
      #4305391 - 01/10/11 05:14 PM

Gary,
Thanks for the tour and all the great photos!
The CGEM DX is clearly beefed up from my CGEM and I am going to have to try it. I only need it to carry my older C14 for visual and videocam. I house it in an Exploradome so wind and setup and breakdown are not an issue. Is there a firm price out on it yet? If it works as well as my CGEM I will not feel the slightest bit "duped".

JayW


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BlueGrass
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 07/25/09

Loc: Wasatch Front, UT
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Jay Wise]
      #4305654 - 01/10/11 07:24 PM

Pictures do show a better image of the mount head itself. It does look bigger?

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nemo129
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Reged: 01/03/10

Loc: WMass
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: BlueGrass]
      #4305746 - 01/10/11 08:00 PM

Looking at the HC compared to the DEC and RA axes in this picture , the mount body looks the same as a classic CGEM. I must admit that beefier tripod and mounting plate does look like it would make a much sturdier platform. It will be intesting to hear from any beta testers or the folks who get the first ones out of the chute when that time comes!

One other thing I just noticed in this picture is the DEC clutch knob not only is longer as previously reported, but the orientation of the locked position has changed. On my CGEM and in the manual, the locked position of the clutch knob points forward (if you will), here, it clearly points toward the rear of the mount. It also looks like they might have done some work on the dovetail which would be nice. It does not look like a dual saddle like the ADM replacement one, but maybe that will be in CGEM-DXL??

Edited by nemo129 (01/10/11 08:13 PM)


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gdd
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 11/23/05

Loc: N Seattle suburb, WA
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Garry]
      #4305841 - 01/10/11 08:53 PM

Quote:

CGEM CGEM DX CGE PRO

No Yes Yes

Power Requirement

12VDC 3.2A 12VDC 3.5A 12VDC 3.5A






CGE Pro motors on the CGEM DX?


Gale


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Garry
member


Reged: 10/01/06

Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: gdd]
      #4306153 - 01/10/11 11:29 PM Attachment (139 downloads)

Quote:

CGE Pro motors on the CGEM DX?




Gale,
Here is more information including the Drive Motors:


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jrbarnett
Eyepiece Hooligan
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Reged: 02/28/06

Loc: Petaluma, CA
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Chris.Baron]
      #4306204 - 01/10/11 11:57 PM

Pity they didn't simply keep the price the same, drop the base CGEM and replace it with the CGEM DX to differentiate it from the Atlas. Is 10# capacity worth another $600 to $700? I dunno. I do like the looks of the tripod though.

Regards,

Jim


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Jay Wise
sage


Reged: 11/21/08

Loc: Near Williamsburg VA
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: jrbarnett]
      #4307632 - 01/11/11 04:28 PM

I just received an email ad from High Point for pre ordering the CGEM DX for $1999 with free shipping. Says it is due out in March.

JayW


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Don Allen
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 07/07/05

Loc: Charleston, SC
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Jay Wise]
      #4308049 - 01/11/11 07:52 PM

Probably the last mount I will have to purchase in my lifetime and $1200 less than the fully loaded G-11. Tempting although the G-11, at least IMHO, looks much cooler.

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kevc
Pooh-Bah
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Reged: 03/22/10

Loc: Long Island NY
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Don Allen]
      #4308145 - 01/11/11 08:41 PM

With all this talk about a beefier tripod giving the DX a higher load capacity, what is the load capacity of a good old CGEM (hypertuned), on a permanent pier?
Kev


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jason_milani
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Reged: 09/03/04

Loc: Northeast Ohio
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: kevc]
      #4308282 - 01/11/11 09:53 PM

Quote:

With all this talk about a beefier tripod giving the DX a higher load capacity, what is the load capacity of a good old CGEM (hypertuned), on a permanent pier?
Kev




Probably about the same.


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kevc
Pooh-Bah
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Reged: 03/22/10

Loc: Long Island NY
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: jason_milani]
      #4308396 - 01/11/11 10:50 PM

Not trying to be a smart a** but, if a new tripod can help boost payload, why can't a concrete pier?
Kev


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rmollise
Postmaster
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Reged: 07/06/07

Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: kevc]
      #4308839 - 01/12/11 06:30 AM

Quote:

Not trying to be a smart a** but, if a new tripod can help boost payload, why can't a concrete pier?
Kev




As the poster said, it can. The CGEM DX head, however, apparantly incorporates some other improvements including a new counterweight bar and new electronics.


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Bill in Va
member


Reged: 05/15/08

Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia, USA
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: rmollise]
      #4310023 - 01/12/11 05:49 PM

Any Chance that Celestro will offer an upgrade kit? I bought my CGEM last June and am very happy with it. I us a C11 CF with it for visual and a C-8 for AP. My biggest complaint has been the mount.

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nemo129
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Reged: 01/03/10

Loc: WMass
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Bill in Va]
      #4310322 - 01/12/11 07:53 PM

Not sure if it was here or in the CGEM Yahoo group, but someone sent Celestron a question regarding that and they replied that there would be no upgrades offered for the current CGEM model. Of course that is now...maybe that will change for at least some of the parts after the new mount has been shipping for a while. It would be nice to have the option to upgrade the tripod if you wanted a beefier base.

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rmollise
Postmaster
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Reged: 07/06/07

Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Bill in Va]
      #4310539 - 01/12/11 09:39 PM

Quote:

Any Chance that Celestro will offer an upgrade kit? I bought my CGEM last June and am very happy with it. I us a C11 CF with it for visual and a C-8 for AP. My biggest complaint has been the mount.




I would be surprised if they did. Of course, it's fairly easy to upgrade the CGEM to a heavier duty tripod, at least, without Celestron's help.


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Bart
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Reged: 05/28/06

Loc: Somewhere near Charlottesville...
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! *DELETED* new [Re: rmollise]
      #4314467 - 01/14/11 03:55 PM

Post deleted by Bart

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Wilki
super member


Reged: 03/15/10

Loc: California (recently moved)
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Bart]
      #4314771 - 01/14/11 06:12 PM

I like my CGEM as little as I've been able to use it. What kind of upsets me is that I waited for 7 months to finaly get my CGEM 11HD, and then find they have a more capable mount. Just received mine this last September, it would have been nice if they had offered this mount when they first rolled out the HD's. I would have offered up the difference for a slightly more weight capable mount.

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Scotty H
super member


Reged: 11/15/10

Loc: Surrey,UK
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Wilki]
      #4314993 - 01/14/11 08:24 PM

Boo!!! they still have'nt put a longer cable on the handset

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Garry
member


Reged: 10/01/06

Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Jim7728]
      #4315307 - 01/14/11 11:44 PM

From Celestron's Kevin Kawai's 2011 CES blog:
"A newly "beefed up" CGEM DX gracefully occupied the adjacent corner of the booth and was equipped with an 11" EdgeHD OTA, larger counterweight bar/weights, CGE Pro style tripod and guidescope package with a DSLR camera attached. The CGEM DX has a load capacity of 50 lbs and comes with an upgraded motor driver chip."

Garry

DSC04234


DSC04249


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Tiny
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 05/02/08

Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Wilki]
      #4318423 - 01/16/11 03:30 PM

Quote:

I like my CGEM as little as I've been able to use it. What kind of upsets me is that I waited for 7 months to finaly get my CGEM 11HD, and then find they have a more capable mount. Just received mine this last September, it would have been nice if they had offered this mount when they first rolled out the HD's. I would have offered up the difference for a slightly more weight capable mount.




Cant say i feel the same way. $900 is $900. With the most substantial difference being the tripod i'd just assume take my savings and buy my own.


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Starman1
Vendor (EyepiecesEtc.com)
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Reged: 06/24/03

Loc: Los Angeles
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Tiny]
      #4318791 - 01/16/11 06:45 PM

Just a couple comments on this thread:
--Celestron is the same company who puts a 10" newtonian on the CG5, a 6" refractor on the CG5 and a C11 on a CG5. They have a history of overloading mounts with combinations few people would choose to assemble.
--the needs of photography are different than visual observing--a visual observer can tolerate a little wiggle or a longer damping time. And don't forget an astrophotographer will often have a piggy-backed guide scope, heavy camera(s), and need much higher stiffness to resist the breeze, even if autoguiding.
--My friend Tom sold his G-11 mount, used with a C14, and replaced it with a Titan mount. His comment: "The G11 wasn't adequate for imaging using the C14. Periodic error went off the charts and guiding was iffy."
--Vixen's SXD rated capacity is 50 lbs with counterweights. They assume at least 15 lbs of counterweights, making the limit on that mount more like 35 lbs, more in line with the Japanese site's quote. And that's the limit--it's happier with less.

--if it isn't beefed up internally, it will still be better for the C11 in imaging than the original CGEM because of the new tripod, but will still take a lot of work to eliminate PE and gear backlash. Still, with those issues addressed, the mount should do fine visually with a C11 or M12 or a 5-6" refractor. But a C14? It might not break the mount, but how would you like a 10 second shimmy period? It's conceivable that would be the case. The C14/CGE combo had a several-second vibration period, and that was a much more robust mount.

Now, back to your regular scheduled program of speculation.

Edited by Starman1 (01/16/11 06:47 PM)


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Garry
member


Reged: 10/01/06

Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Jim7728]
      #4393696 - 02/17/11 09:33 PM


Jim,

Celestron's site has a You Tube video link.
CGEM DX

Shipping April 2011

Garry


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jrbarnett
Eyepiece Hooligan
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Reged: 02/28/06

Loc: Petaluma, CA
Re: New Celestron CGEM DX- 50lb capacity! new [Re: Garry]
      #4393986 - 02/18/11 12:30 AM

The tripod weight (basically a CGE Pro tripod; beefier than the old CGE tripod) is over the top for a 40# to 50# capacity mount. The tripod weighs more than the rest of the mount for Chrissakes! 45# versus 22# for the tripod on the standard CGEM. That really hampers the portability of the mount, with only a scant 10# increase in payload capacity.

- Jim


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