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Equipment Discussions >> Mounts

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neilson
professor emeritus


Reged: 08/22/10

Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: orlyandico]
      #5670452 - 02/09/13 10:25 AM

Hi Mike,
I have rechecked that information many times. In fact the Gem 2's internal battery died within a few weeks of recieving the mount. Scott sent me a replacement battery that started with 3.3volts but in a few weeks it was down to 2.5v and I had to keep reentering the info. I bought 2 more batteries and its been a couple weeks and this one started at 3.4volts and is already down to 2.9v. I haven't had to reset the info yet but I check it every day. I get the voltages from the Gemini web server page then checked the batteries with my multimeter when I replaced them. I find the Web server's volts reading to be accurate. I expected the batteries to last around 5+ years but you never know how long they might have been in the packages. Thank you for your help.

Hi Hilmi,
Yes, several weeks after I got the mount I followed the procedure to update the firmware. Even though it was up to date. Flashing the sram was part of that process if I remember correctly. But I will try flashing the sram today. Thank you for your help.

Hi Orlyandico,
Yes, At least I would buy one, but I would prefer the Gemini 2 to be improved similar to the NexStars level.

Neilson


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Raginar
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 10/19/10

Loc: Rapid CIty, SD
Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: neilson]
      #5670677 - 02/09/13 12:46 PM

OK, let me clarify by 'not accurate' . First star, off as I'd expect from my Nexstar. Second star, off significantly (3 degrees or so?) and not quite as I'd expect from my Nexstar. Third star, put it within a degree (again not as accurate as my Nexstar, would've expected it to be spot on). Fourth star, spot on.

When I flipped to get the other side, I expected the GOTOs to be 'more' accurate. They weren't. It was essentially the same as starting over. This makes sense since each side of the sky has separate models.

Now the interesting part. I'd polar aligned with PEMPRO, so I assumed I was within a arc-minute of the pole on each axis now. When I started the model on the East side, It had a large number in pole azimuth and a smaller number in pole elevation (15000 and around 300). As I refined, that number got smaller (around 1000 in each when I got to my 5th star). What surprised me is that the pole numbers became significantly off when I started the W side of the model! It again went large to 15000 for the azimuth and a smaller number for the elevation. But, as I got to the 4th star on the W side, it became what I expected of around 1000 in each value.

So, maybe PAC is very dependent on our modeling behaviors. If you're not putting in enough data points on the E and W side, perhaps it isn't capable of calculating a precise polar alignment?

Anyways, just thought I'd share.

Hilmi, thanks for the help! I finally figured out how to use the semi-automatic modeling, and it really works well. That definitely made the difference for me. Oh, and I had the scope slew to my only real target last night (M81) and it put it within arc-seconds on my ST-10. No plate solve required. I was definitely happy with it . That was with 6 stars on each side of the meridian in my model.

Finally, I want to see how it does when I wake it up next. My CGEM was never accurate after 'sleeping'. I always had to use plate solving after putting it to sleep (or just knock out a new alignment). If my G2 wakes up and can point, I'll be VERY happy indeed.

Neilson,
I agree, I like the color screen and features of the G2. The ASCOM driver is AWESOME compared to Nexstar. I hate that I needed another program like Nexremote (which wasn't free :/) in order to control it. Also, the fact that the ASCOM driver works with the data in the mount and vice versa... I hated creating two mutually exclusive models with Nexremote/Nexstar HC.

Overall, I'm extremely pleased with G2.

Oh, anyone wanna tell me how to do PEC? I did a 30-minute run in PEMPRO.... Made the curve, and unlike my CGEM, it didn't have a way to 'upload' it directly to the mount? It required me to play it back.... which took the worm time for a full rotation obviosuly. And then the ASCOM driver wouldn't let me turn on PEC? Any ideas?

Oh, and my PE was around +/- 2" I love this MI-250. I've never had guiding so easy! My RMS was .11 and my oscillations were around .48 (where they should be).


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pfile
Post Laureate


Reged: 06/14/09

Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: Raginar]
      #5670807 - 02/09/13 01:50 PM

for pempro, make sure you have selected Gemini L4/L5 as the mount type. when you do that you get a new tab (way at the end, in the bottom pane) that lets you upload and download curves directly to the mount.

IIRC there are 2 gemini mount types in PEMPro and only one of them supports the direct upload.


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Hilmi
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 03/07/10

Loc: Muscat, Sultanate of Oman
Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: Raginar]
      #5670810 - 02/09/13 01:51 PM

Quote:

anyone wanna tell me how to do PEC? I did a 30-minute run in PEMPRO




You need to run the mount setup wizard in PEMpro and select Gemini as mount type


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neilson
professor emeritus


Reged: 08/22/10

Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: Raginar]
      #5670939 - 02/09/13 03:50 PM

Your making me want your mount even more. Especially that low PE.
I havent been able to figure out how those pole numbers work on Gem 2. With NexStar they made sense to me. My pole numbers on my Gem2 were usually around 400-800 for the first and 1300- 6000 for the second. Does it mean its 6,000 arcseconds off?

I'm glad your mounts working out good.
You just have to build a model on the East side for PAC. I believe you need 4 stars but more is better. The quality of that model effects how good PAC will figure the Polar alignment.

My alignment stars on both sides were just as you described yours were.
I found it was best to use one or two stars that overlap the East and West models or after doing the West model the East model stars were off a little. That was just my experience, you might check it out.

Neilson


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Raginar
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 10/19/10

Loc: Rapid CIty, SD
Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: neilson]
      #5671409 - 02/09/13 08:46 PM

Neilson,

I'll keep that in mind about using repetitive stars on each side of the meridian. That's good advice!

pfile, I'll have to go through the mount setup and see if there is an option for a G2/MI250. I'm sure PEMPRO thinks I have a G1/MI250 right now.

This thread has been very fortuitous! I learned a lot over the last few days going through everything with ya'll.

Thank you!


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Raginar
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 10/19/10

Loc: Rapid CIty, SD
Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: EFT]
      #5674952 - 02/11/13 10:52 PM

Ok, I've got a new one. MI-250 and G2: how long do I have to wait after hitting the safety limits (95 in the W and 92 in the E) before I can do a meridian flip? I tried imaging to the safety limit and slewed... and it told me to *BLEEP* off I assumed since both numbers are greater than 90... there is overlap?

Finally, if I do hit a safety limit, it seems to really jack up the driver? Is there any way to keep it from doing that?

Thanks,


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Hilmi
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 03/07/10

Loc: Muscat, Sultanate of Oman
Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: Raginar]
      #5674966 - 02/11/13 11:13 PM

Dont know. That is a rather narrow overlap compared to what I have on the G11. As for hitting the limits it never seemed to be a harsh stop on my mount.

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pfile
Post Laureate


Reged: 06/14/09

Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: Hilmi]
      #5674985 - 02/11/13 11:28 PM

i think those numbers are in degrees from CWD to the east and west, so i don't think there could be overlap unless they are > 180 degrees.

i think by default once you hit a limit, the mount really refuses to move. it will move if you use the handpad to back it out though. the driver has an "automation" setting that will automatically nudge the mount out of the safety limit, i assume so that mount control programs can move the mount or do a meridian flip or what have you. but when you enable this the driver warns you about it, so i was a little afraid to turn it on


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Hilmi
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 03/07/10

Loc: Muscat, Sultanate of Oman
Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: pfile]
      #5675047 - 02/12/13 12:16 AM

Actually the best way to imagine the angle is to think of it as the angle to the left or to the right from the telescope when it is in counter weight down position.

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neilson
professor emeritus


Reged: 08/22/10

Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: Hilmi]
      #5676804 - 02/12/13 11:28 PM

Hi,
Is there a special setting if I want to image unguided. I am in sidereal rate but the mount runs slow in RA.

neilson


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Hilmi
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 03/07/10

Loc: Muscat, Sultanate of Oman
Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: neilson]
      #5676812 - 02/12/13 11:33 PM

If ti is running slow then you need to check you'r mount set up. There is a page where you set the ratios for your particular mount. I'm not at the system now so I can't guide you. It also has a list of pre-defined selections such as the MI250 or G11 etc.. If you have a Titan, the Gemini II unit has 2 different types of that mount in the pre-defined settings.

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neilson
professor emeritus


Reged: 08/22/10

Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: Hilmi]
      #5676830 - 02/12/13 11:48 PM

Hi Hilmi,
My mount is a G11 and that is what I set it too. I haven't messed with anything else except the TVC I set to 25 and I also set the mount limits.
I found the default gearing settings on line I will check them tomorrow. Both worms 360, spur gears 25, motor encoders 256. I have never messed with them but I will check them. Thank you.

neilson

Edited by neilson (02/12/13 11:58 PM)


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Hilmi
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 03/07/10

Loc: Muscat, Sultanate of Oman
Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: neilson]
      #5676865 - 02/13/13 12:21 AM

Then I opine (don't you just love those extravagant words you sometimes find in the English language) that you have a combination clutch slip/balance problem. I'm no expert, it took me almost a year to get my mount tuned in, so check with the true experts.

But to my understanding the speed is set in the hand controllers and the speed is maintained by the motor encoders. So If mechanically the mount is turning at the right speed, but you are still falling behind in RA, that indicates to me you'r clutch isn't doing its job.

The clutch is A) Easy to replace B) A consumable item C) Very cheap.


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neilson
professor emeritus


Reged: 08/22/10

Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: Hilmi]
      #5676974 - 02/13/13 02:52 AM

Hi Hilmi,
My clutches were slipping bad. I thought it was the cause of my problem. Scott sent me some different clutches and now they hold very good. Very stiff, no more slipping at all. But the RA is still slow.

I checked balance over and over, I even tried making it heavy to the West to speed it up but the mount slows it back down.

Neilson


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orlyandico
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 08/10/09

Loc: Singapore
Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: neilson]
      #5677062 - 02/13/13 06:17 AM

there is sidereal rate and king rate. and they're slightly different right?

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neilson
professor emeritus


Reged: 08/22/10

Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: orlyandico]
      #5677607 - 02/13/13 12:35 PM

Hi Orlyandico,
King is for imaging near the horizon. Increased refraction makes things go at a different speed than the normal sidereal rate near the horizon. King rate compensates for that. I think thats right.

neilson


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neilson
professor emeritus


Reged: 08/22/10

Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: neilson]
      #5679315 - 02/14/13 12:08 PM

Hi Everyone,
I posted my complaint on the Gemini 2 Yahoo group.
It wasn't long before someone with a fairly new G11 Gem2 replied that he is having all the crazy problems that I am with his. There appears to be some kind of bug in the Firmware or defective units. I don't know how this is going to be resolved. I sent an email to Scott and Craig the owner of OPT where I bought it. I have been sending both of them complaints about this ever since I bought it in December. Now I have proof that it's the mount, not me.

Neilson


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10gauge
sage


Reged: 10/31/10

Loc: Boston
Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: neilson]
      #5679351 - 02/14/13 12:25 PM

Please keep us informed how this gets resolved. Darn, the mechanics are beautiful as I've been considering getting a G11, now I might go with the Alt-Az EQ-6 Pro if Losmandy doesn't resolve the issue. Good Luck!

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neilson
professor emeritus


Reged: 08/22/10

Re: LOSMANDY GEMINI 2 GOTO SYSTEM new [Re: 10gauge]
      #5679531 - 02/14/13 01:47 PM

Hi 10gauge,
The choice would be easy for me after all the problems the one I got has. But I am biased. You might get a good one. If Scott fixes all my mounts problems to my satisfaction then my opinion might improve.
The Alt/Az Eq-6 Pro is a mount I would like to own.

neilson


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