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Greyhaven
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 05/11/04

Loc: Greater downtown Maine
Re: WEird clutch issue? There's hope new [Re: UncleMossy]
      #6256395 - 12/16/13 02:33 PM

I don't think there was a design problem on celestrons base configuration. The original bolts work fine in the mount that came with the scope. The homemade wedge changed the bolt requirements and the new design required bolt length be modified to accommodate the new base thickness. If the new base were 3 inches thick instead of 1/4 inch thick I doubt if anyone would have called the shorter than needed bolts a design issue. I think one of the issues uncovered here is how quickly we try use a guarantee to cover a self inflicted loss. It is things like this that cause companies to try to protect themselves by not covering all claims. We as responsible equipment owners and modifiers should not expect the equipment manufactures to build in safe guards for all the possible combinations we may choose to use it in.
Be Well
Grey


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Tel
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 03/31/06

Loc: Wallingford England
Re: WEird clutch issue? There's hope new [Re: Greyhaven]
      #6256608 - 12/16/13 04:45 PM

While from what I have personally read over the years of Celestron's approach to customer service, such appears to leave room for significant improvement, I would agree entirely with Greyhaven that it would be unfair to this supplying company to attempt to hold it responsible for any mechanical/electrical/electronic variations made to its original design, by us, the end user, undertaken to further our own particular requirements.

If therefore, we choose to deviate from the original 'scope's specified intended use, of which, as result of our decision, requires known or unknown elements of re-construction, surely we, initially and ultimately, become responsible for any such variant project we alone design and thus all and any consequences associated with it ?

Just one guy's opinion,

Best regards,
Tel


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hamdul
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 06/23/09

Loc: Litchfield NH, USA
Re: WEird clutch issue? There's hope new [Re: Tel]
      #6256994 - 12/16/13 08:27 PM

I believe that greyhaven hit the nail on the head as opposed to the bolt engaging the gears. I don't believe that its Celestron's responsibility to design a product knowing full well that that someone will modify it God knows how. The product worked fine as designed and constructed. They should not have to worry about your longer bolt especially since the bolt length warning has been discussed here on this forum.

Fred


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sonny.barile
professor emeritus


Reged: 10/19/10

Loc: In the middle of the glow.
Re: WEird clutch issue? There's hope new [Re: hamdul]
      #6257045 - 12/16/13 08:54 PM

The logical path would have been to measure the actual engagement of the original fastener and try to reproduce that.

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Tyranthrax
sage


Reged: 04/22/13

Loc: Tampa, FL
Re: WEird clutch issue? There's hope new [Re: sonny.barile]
      #6258293 - 12/17/13 02:51 PM

I was able to take the burs of the gears. . adjusted the drive sprocket for clearance of the drive gear so the set screw would clear. Out of principle that this was self inflicted and I have it working I'm not going to try to get free stuf ebcuase I didn't check the bolt holes. . .not to self On that one. I just figured it wouldn't have been designed that way. . .I made the mistake of assuming. Mayeb I should do an instruction on how to make one so no one messes it up.

You guys rocked on the trouble shooting, and after opening it up if this ever becomes an issue, I can always see if I can buy the gears.


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Greyhaven
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 05/11/04

Loc: Greater downtown Maine
Re: WEird clutch issue? There's hope new [Re: Tyranthrax]
      #6258363 - 12/17/13 03:29 PM

I'm glad you decided to take this speed bump on the road of life as a learning experience. I did not want to discourage you or anyone from attempting modifications on their own equipment, there is nothing that can get the astronomy juices flowing quicker than some hands on tinkering. With your positive attitude and open mind I'm sure there will be many successes in your journey through our hobby.
Be Well
Grey


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Doug Michel
sage


Reged: 09/18/11

Loc: Lincoln, NE
Re: WEird clutch issue? There's hope new [Re: Greyhaven]
      #6261814 - 12/19/13 12:23 PM

Glad you have decided to not try to obtain a free replacement for your own adjustments. I read a post a month or two back on one of the AP forums about a guy that fried a CCD camera because he had not put the solar filter on for a few seconds and it melted the camera. He returned it to Amazon for a free replacement because it didn't work. That is very unmoral seeing as how it was "user error" that destroyed the equipment. He learns nothing from this, and the rest of us pick up the costs in higher prices when people do that. Cloudynights has since deleted that post as he was getting irate at people chastizing him for what he did.

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Tyranthrax
sage


Reged: 04/22/13

Loc: Tampa, FL
Re: WEird clutch issue? There's hope new [Re: Doug Michel]
      #6262958 - 12/20/13 02:03 AM

true, I saw the set screw marks on the large gear, looked like it had backed out, its rather far out instead of a normal gear being recessed. that's why I initially thought it might be their fault. but I couldn't move the gear and had to back it out. me hitting it with the bolt is the only logical concussion. And hat just isn't right to take advantage of them. Now their tracking is something else 3 nights in a row I can't get it to track

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Midnight Dan
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 01/23/08

Loc: Hilton, NY, Yellow Zone (Bortl...
Re: WEird clutch issue? There's hope new [Re: Tyranthrax]
      #6263338 - 12/20/13 10:06 AM

I dunno. I can see this "who's fault" issue from both sides.

On the one hand, Celestron sells the SE line of scopes as a turn key system, and it works as designed. It really isn't sold as a general purpose mount to placed on a variety of bases such as tripods, piers, wedges, etc. So when a user does so, he's on his own to make sure he doesn't damage anything in the process.

On the other hand, this reminds me of something that I learned in user-interface design for software. Often times a user interface provides a message or indication that user has done something wrong so he can correct it. But a far better design is one that makes it difficult or impossible for the user to do the wrong thing in the first place.

In this case, it would have been a fairly simple thing to design the base of the mount to make it impossible for this kind of error to occur in the first place. The fact that this kind of serious damage can occur simply by screwing a bolt into an existing hole is not at all obvious to the user. If you use the mount in any way other than in the original system, it is extraordinarily easy for this kind of error to occur.

Bottom line, Celestron is not technically liable for the damage that occurred. But they do share the responsibility by creating a poor design that allows this kind of damage to occur far too easily.

Just my 2 cents.

-Dan


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rmarolla33
member


Reged: 01/01/14

Loc: Newark, Delaware
Re: WEird clutch issue? new [Re: maugi88]
      #6302605 - 01/09/14 05:36 PM

2 yr warranty on the NexStar mount, but I don't know if that cover damage caused by the consumer.

Good Luck


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