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General Astronomy >> Light Pollution

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Dark Sky Scott
super member


Reged: 01/06/12

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: magic612]
      #5045653 - 01/30/12 10:50 AM

The City of Vista, Calif. wants to turn off streetlights to save money, but the local power company owns them and isn't playing ball.

"San Diego Gas & Electric Co. would charge Vista $180,000 to de-energize and re-energize selected streetlights, then charge the city each month for upkeep of the lights and poles."

http://www.nctimes.com/news/local/vista/vista-officials-nix-streetlight-shutoff-idea/article_f50ba655-9894-5cc4-9369-6e071039592a.html


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magic612
Post Laureate
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Reged: 09/30/08

Loc: S. of Chicago's light dome
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: Dark Sky Scott]
      #5045839 - 01/30/12 12:24 PM

I saw that yesterday, Scott. Unbelieveable. Of course, reading the article, it states that they were looking to save as much as 230,000, and the company was going to charge them 180,000. Isn't $50,000 still a decent savings?

Of course, I'd have just said, "Take the poles down altogether" (but that's just me ). Pretty sad the way that one turned out though. This may be a bad sign for light pollution reduction efforts in the future too, and one of which we should all take note.


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RobbW
sage


Reged: 02/09/10

Loc: Elgin, IL
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: magic612]
      #5046113 - 01/30/12 03:07 PM

Yes, $50K is still a decent savings. However, I think the difference is $180K up-front costs to de-energize the utility-owned lights vs. $230K savings spread over the whole year. The municipal board has to justify cutting a check for $180K right away. Then there's the question of how much the utility is going to charge the city for upkeep of the lights and poles that the utility owns. The article doesn't mention how much that is going to cost.

I think it is quite ridiculous that the utility can get away with charging the city for upkeep on light poles that are owned by the utility and the city would no longer use. That would be the equivalent of me cancelling my DirecTV subscription, and having DirecTV turn around and say they are still going to charge me a monthly fee for upkeep of their satellites! For crying out loud, those aren't my satellites, and I'm not using them anymore. How the heck could they have any reason to charge me anything?

What bothers me almost as much is reading the user comments. It's a classic example of taxpayers crying for governments to reduce spending... until it actually affects them! Then it's all, "How dare you do something as stupid as turn off the street lights in my neighborhood! You're giving the boogieman free reign to roam the streets of my neighborhood bringing rampant destruction!"

Tell you what, turn off all the street lights except those at intersections. If it is so important that the road and sidewalk directly in front of your home is illuminated, then you can personally pay for the installation and ongoing operation of an appropriate street light that does not pollute the skies or trespass onto your neighbors' properties. Why should the government (and all taxpayers) have to pay for you to "feel" safe in your home?!?!


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magic612
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Reged: 09/30/08

Loc: S. of Chicago's light dome
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: RobbW]
      #5046271 - 01/30/12 04:26 PM

Quote:

Why should the government (and all taxpayers) have to pay for you to "feel" safe in your home?!?!




Robb, I think you hit the nail on the head right there. Why are we paying taxes for the illusory "feeling" of safety, vs. the proven "most lights off in most places actually makes you safer" alternative? And the perfect-pitch point of the whole "pay upkeep for something we don't own" thing in this particular article... yeah, wow.

I may just have to make a video on that exact thing. That's the whole point in a neat little package right there. In fact, when it's warmer, if you want to get together and work on that one, we should both work on that - if you want.


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RobbW
sage


Reged: 02/09/10

Loc: Elgin, IL
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: magic612]
      #5046339 - 01/30/12 05:09 PM

I'm all in, Dave. Keep me posted!

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magic612
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Reged: 09/30/08

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Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: RobbW]
      #5049696 - 02/01/12 11:49 AM

Robb's article made the FRONT PAGE!

http://couriernews.suntimes.com/news/10274507-418/astronomer-cutting-light-pollution-key-to-seeing-stars.html

Nice going, Robb!


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TOM O
sage
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Reged: 03/30/06

Loc: Joshua Tree CA.
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: magic612]
      #5052554 - 02/02/12 10:19 PM

I added a note and enjoyed the article!

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RobbW
sage


Reged: 02/09/10

Loc: Elgin, IL
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: TOM O]
      #5052592 - 02/02/12 10:41 PM

Saw your note, Tom. Thanks for that! So far, nothing negative!

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barasits
sage


Reged: 06/12/11

Loc: Chicago
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: RobbW]
      #5052694 - 02/03/12 12:08 AM

Well done, Robb! Just now added a comment.

Geoff


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RobbW
sage


Reged: 02/09/10

Loc: Elgin, IL
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: barasits]
      #5053092 - 02/03/12 09:35 AM

I saw that, Geoff. Thanks!

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RobbW
sage


Reged: 02/09/10

Loc: Elgin, IL
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: RobbW]
      #5053620 - 02/03/12 02:49 PM

If I may be so bold as to make a special request to all who read the LP article in The Courier-news. Even if you do not leave a comment, could I please ask that you at least use the social networking buttons at the top of the article to "Like", "Tweet", "+1", and "Share" this article. The more we can get positive articles about night sky preservation (such as this one) to spread around the cyber world, the more awareness we can bring to the subject.

This article was published in coordination with the vote on the Cook County Lighting Ordinance that day, which passed unanimously. Getting positive articles like this to spread or even possibly go viral would send a huge message to the powers-that-be that starlight preservation is a worthy cause that MANY people support.

Thank you for your help!


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magic612
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Reged: 09/30/08

Loc: S. of Chicago's light dome
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: RobbW]
      #5053669 - 02/03/12 03:25 PM

Robb, as you know I already did this, but I just want to encourage everyone else to do the same.

It's a really simple way to take a small message and spread it far and wide, and it only takes a few seconds.


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Dark Sky Scott
super member


Reged: 01/06/12

Loc: Tucson, Arizona
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: magic612]
      #5058994 - 02/06/12 06:04 PM

Big Bend National Park in Texas is now an International Dark Sky Park.

See:
http://alpinedailyplanet.typepad.com/alpine-daily-planet/2012/02/big-bend-national-park-earns-international-dark-sky-association-gold-tier-desigation.html

or http://docs.darksky.org/PR/BigBendNPPR.pdf


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TOM O
sage
*****

Reged: 03/30/06

Loc: Joshua Tree CA.
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: Dark Sky Scott]
      #5059651 - 02/07/12 01:58 AM

I tried to post a comment, but can't see that it worked? Sure wish Joshua Tree could do the same!
Bravo! Big Bend!!!!


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magic612
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Reged: 09/30/08

Loc: S. of Chicago's light dome
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: TOM O]
      #5060021 - 02/07/12 10:10 AM

I can't seem to get the comments area to work for me either...?

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TOM O
sage
*****

Reged: 03/30/06

Loc: Joshua Tree CA.
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: magic612]
      #5060333 - 02/07/12 01:14 PM

If it is, I left 3 trying.....

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barasits
sage


Reged: 06/12/11

Loc: Chicago
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: TOM O]
      #5060433 - 02/07/12 01:59 PM

Tom, your comment is there. My comment appeared after the second attempt--and there was a delay of a few minutes.

Geoff


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TOM O
sage
*****

Reged: 03/30/06

Loc: Joshua Tree CA.
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: barasits]
      #5061242 - 02/07/12 10:29 PM

Ahhh.. Thanks, Geoff

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magic612
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Reged: 09/30/08

Loc: S. of Chicago's light dome
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread new [Re: TOM O]
      #5120348 - 03/13/12 02:41 PM

Of course, it's important to comment where the skies are still dark too:

http://www.codyenterprise.com/news/opinion/article_05050ab0-6c91-11e1-821f-0019bb2963f4.html


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magic612
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Reged: 09/30/08

Loc: S. of Chicago's light dome
Re: The "Add positive comment to this article" thread [Re: magic612]
      #5220893 - 05/13/12 08:32 PM

I've been rather busy this weekend, so I just saw this one now, but "The World at Night" got a nice article on MSNBC from science editor Alan Boyle, here:

http://photoblog.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/05/11/11662164-the-world-at-night-finds-beauty-in-darkness-and-light?chromedomain=cosmiclog&lite

A couple of the pictures in the slideshow utilize light pollution as part of the artistry of their pictures, but overall, the photos are fantastic, and if nothing else, this effort does a nice job to highlight the problem so more people are aware of it.

All the comments I saw at the end of the article were positive, but it never hurts to add more.


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