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General Astronomy >> Light Pollution

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csrlice12
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 05/22/12

Loc: Denver, CO
Re: court order new [Re: Gil V]
      #6096609 - 09/23/13 10:56 AM

...except nobody lives there, the brother is just watching the house.......

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Gil V
professor emeritus


Reged: 09/09/12

Re: court order *DELETED* new [Re: csrlice12]
      #6096685 - 09/23/13 11:56 AM

Post deleted by Gil V

Edited by Gil V (09/23/13 10:58 PM)


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obin robinson
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 10/25/12

Loc: League City, TX
Re: court order *DELETED* new [Re: Gil V]
      #6097137 - 09/23/13 04:52 PM

Post deleted by obin robinson

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Kfrank
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 12/20/08

Loc: Northern Colorado
Re: court order new [Re: obin robinson]
      #6097192 - 09/23/13 05:31 PM

Guys, you'll get this thread locked or removedmif that keeps up, I'm afraid.

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Gil V
professor emeritus


Reged: 09/09/12

Re: court order *DELETED* new [Re: Kfrank]
      #6097618 - 09/23/13 11:01 PM

Post deleted by Gil V

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csrlice12
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 05/22/12

Loc: Denver, CO
Re: court order new [Re: Gil V]
      #6097993 - 09/24/13 08:49 AM

Bottom line is you have two choices:

1. Accept the situation as is....
2. Do something about it....what to do will be determined by the stregnth of the neighbors actions (or lack thereof).

The thing to remember is that HE is the one with a problem, not YOU.....put the problem where it lies.....


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Gil V
professor emeritus


Reged: 09/09/12

Re: court order new [Re: csrlice12]
      #6098270 - 09/24/13 11:21 AM

Coincidentally, I was set up in the front yard last night. I wanted to get 90 minutes of viewing in before the moonlight started to wash out the sky. Neighbor's front house lights come on - obliterates any viewing from the front.

I go inside for a few minutes, then go back out and sit in a lawn chair. Neighbor pulls in his driveway. When he gets out of the car, I politely ask if he would shut off the outside lights after he is done outside. He says, "Absolutely". I say, "Thank you very much".

I love my neighbors. And people accuse us Northeasters of being cold!

Edited by Gil V (09/24/13 11:22 AM)


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seawolfe
professor emeritus


Reged: 06/26/13

Loc: N 47.11.23 W 122.20.18
Re: court order new [Re: Gil V]
      #6099789 - 09/25/13 05:38 AM

Quote:

Coincidentally, I was set up in the front yard last night. I wanted to get 90 minutes of viewing in before the moonlight started to wash out the sky. Neighbor's front house lights come on - obliterates any viewing from the front.

I go inside for a few minutes, then go back out and sit in a lawn chair. Neighbor pulls in his driveway. When he gets out of the car, I politely ask if he would shut off the outside lights after he is done outside. He says, "Absolutely". I say, "Thank you very much".

I love my neighbors. And people accuse us Northeasters of being cold!




I've done the same with my neighbors' back porch lights. I even invited them to come take a look at what I'm seeing. Sometimes, it has been the Moon or Saturn. Great to see them ooh and awe and heartily agree to turn off their lights the next time (if they remember too) and I make sure to thank them as well.


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Kraus
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 03/10/12

Loc: Georgia.
Re: court order new [Re: Gil V]
      #6100692 - 09/25/13 03:38 PM

Quote:

How old is your daughter?

Here is what to do.

Have her go over one afternoon with tears in her eyes. Have her talk to the woman of the house. In tears, let her explain to the woman how she couldn't complete her astronomy project for school because the neighbor's lights prevented her from using the scope with her dad.

Problem solved.

Oh, you might have to pay your daughter to do this, but it will be the best $100 you ever spent.




That's sneaky and conniving. I love it.


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csrlice12
Postmaster
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Reged: 05/22/12

Loc: Denver, CO
Re: court order new [Re: Kraus]
      #6100705 - 09/25/13 03:44 PM

Except the house next door is empty, remember what the OP said? The brother's only watching it.......and only drops by occasionally. The lights are on 24/7/365.

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csa/montana
Den Mama
*****

Reged: 05/14/05

Loc: montana
Re: court order new [Re: Kraus]
      #6100798 - 09/25/13 04:29 PM

Quote:

Quote:

How old is your daughter?

Here is what to do.

Have her go over one afternoon with tears in her eyes. Have her talk to the woman of the house. In tears, let her explain to the woman how she couldn't complete her astronomy project for school because the neighbor's lights prevented her from using the scope with her dad.

Problem solved.

Oh, you might have to pay your daughter to do this, but it will be the best $100 you ever spent.




That's sneaky and conniving. I love it.




Encouraging a child to lie???


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Kfrank
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 12/20/08

Loc: Northern Colorado
Re: court order new [Re: csa/montana]
      #6101043 - 09/25/13 06:34 PM

Bravo, Carol!!!!

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BluesNebula
journeyman


Reged: 09/16/13

Loc: Western Nevada
Re: court order new [Re: Kfrank]
      #6101239 - 09/25/13 08:34 PM

Random lighting at night inside the house would be just as effective, cheaper and should make everyone happy. The objective of the brother watching the house is crime prevention apparently. Perhaps he would respond to an approach that made it seem the house was occupied w/o the need for obnoxious outside lighting.

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bogg
sage


Reged: 11/17/09

Loc: Bruce County Ontario
Re: court order new [Re: BluesNebula]
      #6102721 - 09/26/13 05:26 PM

Just a thought. He has a very bright light on all of the time. Could anyone here find any articles for the opt that mentions how criminals can case a neighborhood looking for bright outdoor lights on during daylight, or lights bright enough to hide them. If its for security he may take note.

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schinia
member


Reged: 05/17/13

Loc: cape carteret,NC
Re: court order new [Re: bogg]
      #6114832 - 10/03/13 10:08 AM

my next door neighbors house has been on the market for three years. (we live in a gated subdivision) there is a street lamp in front of the neighbors house. very bright, and annoying. but i felt i couldn't do anything about it, but thought about it. it finally sold, and a day or two later the light went out ! it's been a while, but hopefully it won't go back on.

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Littlegreenman
Post Laureate
*****

Reged: 05/09/05

Loc: Southern California
Re: court order new [Re: schinia]
      #6115298 - 10/03/13 02:19 PM

Quote:

my next door neighbors house has been on the market for three years. (we live in a gated subdivision) there is a street lamp in front of the neighbors house. very bright, and annoying. but i felt i couldn't do anything about it, but thought about it. it finally sold, and a day or two later the light went out ! it's been a while, but hopefully it won't go back on.




Quite a few of us amateur astronomers have requested the local governmental agency that deals with street lights to improve the situation for them. One common fix is a partial shield/shade blocking the light and/or glare in your direction. It's free to ask, and may be successful. A burnt out light will most certainly be fixed.

LGM


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Widespread
professor emeritus


Reged: 05/11/11

Loc: Bowling Green, Kentucky
Re: court order new [Re: schinia]
      #6115368 - 10/03/13 02:55 PM

Maybe someone else mentioned this, but I didn't see it.
I think the first thing to do, since talking with the neighbor has failed, is to talk to a lawyer.

He or she can tell you the best approach. A likely scenario is that the lawyer would write a letter to the property owner explaining the problem, offering to pay for the remediation of the problem by installing motion sensor lighting, and stating that if the problem is not resolved, further legal action will be taken.

A complaint from a neighbor is easily ignored, because it has no leverage. A formal letter from a law office, on the other hand, implies a costly waste of time and money.

Now the owner has a choice. He can spend money on a lawyer himself, or he can agree to a free security upgrade to his home (motion sensor lighting).

I'm no lawyer, but as a translator I see this kind of carrot/stick approach used a lot. It combines negative reinforcement (avoiding a lawsuit) with positive reinforcement (free motion sensors).

Best,
David


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Kfrank
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 12/20/08

Loc: Northern Colorado
Re: court order new [Re: Widespread]
      #6115521 - 10/03/13 04:03 PM

Quote:

Maybe someone else mentioned this, but I didn't see it.
I think the first thing to do, since talking with the neighbor has failed, is to talk to a lawyer.

He or she can tell you the best approach. A likely scenario is that the lawyer would write a letter to the property owner explaining the problem, offering to pay for the remediation of the problem by installing motion sensor lighting, and stating that if the problem is not resolved, further legal action will be taken.

A complaint from a neighbor is easily ignored, because it has no leverage. A formal letter from a law office, on the other hand, implies a costly waste of time and money.

Now the owner has a choice. He can spend money on a lawyer himself, or he can agree to a free security upgrade to his home (motion sensor lighting).

I'm no lawyer, but as a translator I see this kind of carrot/stick approach used a lot. It combines negative reinforcement (avoiding a lawsuit) with positive reinforcement (free motion sensors).

Best,
David




The above suggestion will work only under one condition:

That there is a statute or ordinance or other legislation, having to do with lighting or light trespass in place, covering the locality of concern and dealing with the lighting issue at hand.

Absent such legislation, a letter from a lawyer (if you can even get a lawyer to write such a letter), is nothing more than a bluff.

Granted that such a bluff might work, but the other party is just as apt to call your bluff - in which case you have no recourse but to take him to court
and hope that you draw a judge sympathetic to your cause. It may not even get to a judge though as many places routinely refer these sorts of disputes to mandatory mediation/arbitration.

If he calls your bluff and you don't sue, you've lost - big time. He's out nothing and you've paid a lawyer to write a letter. If you do take legal action, you may ( or may not ) win. There are no guarantees here.

One thing is clear. Taking someone to court over an issue such as this opens Pandora's Box. And it can Never be shut again.

I'd think long and hard befor taking this kind of action.


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obin robinson
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 10/25/12

Loc: League City, TX
Re: court order new [Re: Kfrank]
      #6115788 - 10/03/13 06:03 PM

Get the lawyer. When you go to court say that the light shines directly into your daughter's bedroom. Boom. Case closed in your favor.

obin


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csa/montana
Den Mama
*****

Reged: 05/14/05

Loc: montana
Re: court order new [Re: obin robinson]
      #6115814 - 10/03/13 06:23 PM

Quote:

Boom. Case closed in your favor.




Nothing is 100%. Ken explained what might happen very well in his last post here.


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