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Equipment Discussions >> Reflectors

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Pinbout
Postmaster
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Reged: 02/22/10

Loc: nj
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: obsessionstar]
      #4889465 - 10/30/11 10:31 PM

Quote:

Those scopes have been offered for a year and not one CN member has had the guts to order one yet?




If they don't have salesreps at star parties showing them off why would anyone spend that much money without seeing one in action. Not even showing up to NEAF.


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Ira
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 08/22/10

Loc: Mitzpe Ramon, Israel
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: Pinbout]
      #4889700 - 10/31/11 02:29 AM

The mirrors on their web sites have no hole in the middle. Just a green dot. They do make mirrors for maks and cats. Maybe that's where the "hole" idea comes from. So far no great insights on this scope.

/Ira


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sopticals
professor emeritus


Reged: 03/28/10

Loc: New Zealand
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: Ira]
      #4890686 - 10/31/11 05:19 PM

I have over the last 2 years bought 3 mirrors from HO and none have holes or green dots. A center mark would be useful.

I would like to comment on the quality of the current HO mirror I am using. HO claims the following specs: Strehl 0.997, 1/25.4 PV. 1/111 RMS. The mirror is a 14" sandwich.Even if the RMS and wave front specs are even half as good as claimed this would be an excellent mirror.I am very pleased with its performance.Image stays firm at all mags.In my view great value for money spent.


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Wozzel
super member
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Reged: 12/01/10

Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: sopticals]
      #4890840 - 10/31/11 07:33 PM

Someone buy and make report the scope. Too long someone want.

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roverich
member
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Reged: 12/11/10

Loc: East coaster
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: Wozzel]
      #4890924 - 10/31/11 08:22 PM

I was thinking about buying one of the UL16 scopes ..I was reading there web page and found out there located in northern Va. (falls church) area , so i would want to go and check one out before i spent that kind of cash ..3000 is a lot of money for me ...But after further investigation i see there stuff comes out of Hong Kong ..Not that that is a bad thing ...If they are indeed located in No.Va. i will check them out for sure ...

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GeneT
Ely Kid
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Reged: 11/07/08

Loc: South Texas
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: Ira]
      #4891197 - 10/31/11 11:09 PM

I would look at what kind of light baffle is used for the upper tube assembly. I see these type of telescopes as filling a niche for some observers. However, I believe that a traditional Dob is a much better all around telescope. A good 16 inch truss tube Dob will be reasonably portable, but operate more smoothly, have better baffling, and be more stable. If these guys ever make a traditional Dob, I would definitely be interested.

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sixela
Postmaster
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Reged: 12/23/04

Loc: Boechout, Belgium
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: GeneT]
      #4891441 - 11/01/11 05:42 AM

You just have to make your own light shield; it's hardly rocket science.

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lunar
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 07/03/10

Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: cheapersleeper]
      #4891802 - 11/01/11 11:36 AM

They have striking similarities in appearence to the Orion Ultra Compact telescope line...if it's still offered. From what I remember they had a similiar structure.

Clear skies,
Brandon Doyle


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Ira
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 08/22/10

Loc: Mitzpe Ramon, Israel
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: roverich]
      #4891823 - 11/01/11 11:44 AM

Quote:

I was thinking about buying one of the UL16 scopes ..I was reading there web page and found out there located in northern Va. (falls church) area , so i would want to go and check one out before i spent that kind of cash ..3000 is a lot of money for me ...But after further investigation i see there stuff comes out of Hong Kong ..Not that that is a bad thing ...If they are indeed located in No.Va. i will check them out for sure ...




The introductory price is just $1995. Pretty cheap for a scope of this class.

/Ira


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Pinbout
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Reged: 02/22/10

Loc: nj
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: lunar]
      #4891943 - 11/01/11 01:00 PM

Quote:

They have striking similarities in appearence to the Orion Ultra Compact telescope line...if it's still offered. From what I remember they had a similiar structure.

Clear skies,
Brandon Doyle




HO made them for Orion.


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thinairart
professor emeritus


Reged: 11/18/09

Loc: Denver, Co
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: Pinbout]
      #4891953 - 11/01/11 01:06 PM

HO's operations are based out of Hong Kong, but they have an office of some kind in Virginia that they sometimes ship mirrors from through their eBay store. If you are close to that office that would be a great idea to see if you could take a look at a UL16 first hand. Just write Tong @ Hubble Optics and ask, he is a nice guy and actually wrote me directly recently recommending what kind of lateral support to use for my 14" ATM scope that was built around an HO sandwich mirror.

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Ira
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 08/22/10

Loc: Mitzpe Ramon, Israel
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: thinairart]
      #4892501 - 11/01/11 06:14 PM

What was the quality of that sandwich mirror?

/Ira


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Mike Selz
sage
*****

Reged: 04/06/07

Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: Ira]
      #4892943 - 11/01/11 10:42 PM

I wonder if this Ultra light can be EQ mounted...or if there is an adapter that can achieve this. If so you can have a 16" for use visually on a CGE, or for photographic use on a CGE PRO...now that'd sure be something...(given the total weight without the rocker box I believe is just 52lbs)

Edited by Mike Selz (11/01/11 10:53 PM)


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GeneT
Ely Kid
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Reged: 11/07/08

Loc: South Texas
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: sixela]
      #4894327 - 11/02/11 05:53 PM

Quote:

You just have to make your own light shield; it's hardly rocket science.




I once owned an 18 inch Ultra Compact and there's a lot more to it than just a tweak here and a tweak there. By the time I made all my mods, to include the light shield, solid side bearings, a 1/4 inch alumimum ring under the UTA ring that came with the telescope (to stiffen up the ring so the telescope would hold collimation), and so on--I was out about $600 and still did not have the telescope I wanted. The ultra lights do fill a niche, but my main point in this discussion is that the traditional Dob is a far better telescope from the get go, and needs far fewer modifications. None of the mods I made were rocket science--they were easy to do-- and they were expensive.


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sixela
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Reged: 12/23/04

Loc: Boechout, Belgium
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: GeneT]
      #4894373 - 11/02/11 06:14 PM

Well, we know the price of the shroud and we know a light shield is not expensive.

There may be other things wrong with the scope, but that's just idle speculation until someone reports them.


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davidpitre
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Reged: 05/10/05

Loc: Central Texas
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: sixela]
      #4894735 - 11/02/11 09:43 PM

A light shield can be made for nothing. If you are broke, cardboard and flat black paint work as well as anything. For the price of a cheap dinner, a nice one can be mad of ABS.

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GeneT
Ely Kid
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Reged: 11/07/08

Loc: South Texas
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: sixela]
      #4894906 - 11/02/11 11:15 PM

Quote:

Well, we know the price of the shroud and we know a light shield is not expensive.

There may be other things wrong with the scope, but that's just idle speculation until someone reports them.




Quote:

A light shield can be made for nothing. If you are broke, cardboard and flat black paint work as well as anything. For the price of a cheap dinner, a nice one can be mad of ABS.




You both are missing my point. A lot of people are buying these ultra compact or ultra lite telescopes not realizing their short comings. They are great for getting a lot of telescope into a small vehicle, for shipping ahead to a destination, and so on. The modifications a lot of us have had to make to these telescopes have nothing to do with cardboard and flat paint. The issues are not just building and affixing a light shield. My point in raising some issues with these ultra light telescopes is to do a careful side by side, point by point comparison to a traditional Dob before buying one of these telescopes. The issue is not 'problems' with these telescopes, but performance when compared to their traditional Dob cousins. The performance issues do not involve the optics. Obsession puts OMI and Galaxy in both their traditional and ultra compact Dobs. The issue is overall system performance to include balance, holding position, motions in both axis, light leakage, stiction, and other issues. I am not recommending to avoid purchasing these telescopes. I am recommending to think through how you would use one of these telescopes. Portability is the one area in which these telescopes shine. However, you can get good portability with some of the newer traditional Dob designs offered by Teeter, Webster, Starstructure, Starmaster, and Obsession telescopes. Careful research may lead some to conclude that a better viewing experience may be achieved by giving up a little in portability to gain significantly in the overall operational aspects of the telescope. I have owned both an 18 inch Ultra Compact and a 20 inch Classical Obsession. There is no comparison in the operational aspects of both telescopes. It is not that the ultra compact is a bad telescope. It is just that the classical Obsession is so much better designed from top to bottom, and is so much more pleasurable to use. When I bought an ultra compact, I thought I would get most of the beneficial viewing aspects of the traditional Dob, just in a smaller package. It wasn't so. I am not reporting on some speculative aspects in these telescope comparisons. I am giving my opinions (yes, these are just my opinions) based on personal, side by side comparisons.


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Mary B
Vendor - Echo Astronomy and Electronics
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Reged: 05/21/10

Loc: Minnesota
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: GeneT]
      #4895087 - 11/03/11 02:06 AM

Until someone actually uses one you can't make comments about performance. It is an unknown.

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sixela
Postmaster
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Reged: 12/23/04

Loc: Boechout, Belgium
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 new [Re: GeneT]
      #4895185 - 11/03/11 06:25 AM

Quote:


You both are missing my point. A lot of people are buying these ultra compact or ultra lite telescopes not realizing their short comings.



You're missing mine. There are more compact scopes that "classic" Obsessions and some UltraCompacts that have none of these shortcomings.

To say that these scopes all have "the" shortcomings of "UltraCompacts" is to overgeneralise, and to say that all people who buy UltraCompacts "do not realise" what they're doing is simply untrue.

I think that if you were living in Europe you'd have a different view on things. The Obsession Dob design has been a lot less dominant around here, and there are fine example of not-Obession-clones that are really fine scopes.

Quote:

The modifications a lot of us have had to make to these telescopes



Again, if you have to make modifications beyond a light shield (which is a necessary item on these scopes, then you had a less than perfect UltraCompact, not just an UltraCompact.


Quote:

I am giving my opinions (yes, these are just my opinions) based on personal, side by side comparisons.



But you are talking about your personal experience with a scope that id different from the ones in this thread, and certainly different from the really best UltraCompacts (and no, The Obsession UC isn't the best UltraCompact, just if someone would like to bring that up as an example).

You cannot diss a scope because of the ills of another one that simply resembles it without having actually checked that it has the same ills.

It's certainly missing a light shield, that is obvious, but that is also easy to fix.

What other ills do you ascribe to the design are you sure is present on these scopes and why?

If you have a skeptical mind you're wary of your own experiences and the perceptional biases they might cause. Perhaps they're justified, but perhaps they're not. To know if they're not, you need to dig deeper.

Perhaps these scopes aren't that good --certainly, the fact that HO made the structurally weak Orion scopes does not bode well-- but perhaps Hubble Optics are able to learn from their mistakes and these are better. They certainly showed they're able to learn from their mistakes if you look at the quality of their mirrors over the years.

We simply don't know, and I don't think that we need to pretend that we do.


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Pinbout
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Reged: 02/22/10

Loc: nj
Re: Let's talk about the Hubble Optics UL16 [Re: sixela]
      #4895219 - 11/03/11 07:00 AM

Quote:

the fact that HO made the structurally weak Orion scopes does not bode well-- but perhaps Hubble Optics are able to learn from their mistakes and these are better. They certainly showed they're able to learn from their mistakes if you look at the quality of their mirrors over the years.






the older scope's lazy suzy az bearing felt horrible and it looks like they still have it. It seems to me, that the bearing maybe twisting 'cause it's doesn't have enough support. I would want more structure down there.

At least the poles go directly to the cell's frame. The older scope was trying to do to many things. Is it a dob or a frame to mount to a GEM? I think that's one reason it suffered.

Why are they using 6063 t3 instead of 6061 t5 for the poles?

They have a 6 point cell. They use to suggest using an 18 point cell, but I guess they've since changed that in their mirror write-ups on ebay. They also suggest using a sling but it's hard to see the cell on their website pictures. I would like to see the sling strapped across the sandwich mirror.


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