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Equipment Discussions >> Refractors

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James Ling
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
APM 152 ED APO #002
      #5560036 - 12/07/12 10:05 PM Attachment (612 downloads)

Hi All....

I have just received my new 152 APM ED APO, two days ago, and very much like to share in this forum, for those who are interested to know how APM packed and delivered this new scope to anyone who make the purchase...

This new scope is exactly the same scope on display at the recent Tucson Astronomy Show, and as it has been shipped back to Germany, after no one took the opportunities to purchase it, I wrote to Markus, and he agreed to let me have this scope, otherwise I will need to wait until March 2013, for the production delivery.

APM uses DHL for the delivery, to my country, Singapore.
And it took less than 10 days to reach me...

The following photo attachments shows the new scope is delivered to my house, and how APM packed the scope...

1. The delivery box arrived , measuring 122cmX45cmX40cm and weighing 26kg....


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James Ling
sage
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560043 - 12/07/12 10:08 PM Attachment (331 downloads)

2. Delivery box is packed with double carton box....
The case within the double box is bubble wrapped....with few layers...


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James Ling
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560046 - 12/07/12 10:10 PM Attachment (227 downloads)

3. Case with bubble wrapping removed from the double box.....

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James Ling
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560050 - 12/07/12 10:13 PM Attachment (237 downloads)

4. One final bubble wrapping for the case, after removing few layers of bubble wrapping....
Looks like a lot of protection for this case....


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James Ling
sage
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560055 - 12/07/12 10:15 PM Attachment (334 downloads)

5. The beautiful case after removing the bubble wrapping...

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James Ling
sage
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560059 - 12/07/12 10:17 PM Attachment (316 downloads)

6. The case is opened and has double foam compartments for top and bottom side....

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James Ling
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560063 - 12/07/12 10:19 PM Attachment (294 downloads)

7. This delivery comes with Warranty certificate for this serial # 002 OTA and test report showing 95.4% Strehl

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James Ling
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560065 - 12/07/12 10:23 PM Attachment (285 downloads)

8. Included in this shipment are accessories such as , finder with illuminator, extension tube, diagonal and carrying handle..., which are individually packed, and stuffed into the cut foam....

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James Ling
sage
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560067 - 12/07/12 10:25 PM Attachment (288 downloads)

8. Removing the OTA from the foam box, which is bubble wrapped.....

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James Ling
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560072 - 12/07/12 10:28 PM Attachment (246 downloads)

9. OTA with one final plastic bag wrap, after removing the bubble wrapping...
Looks like even the OTA is well protected against scratches from the foam...


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James Ling
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560080 - 12/07/12 10:32 PM Attachment (452 downloads)

10. Finally the OTA with the APM focuser....
For the production shipment, the supplied focuser will not be APM made...


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James Ling
sage
*****

Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560084 - 12/07/12 10:36 PM Attachment (404 downloads)

11. The APM focuser with Markus Ludes's name on it.....

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Bill Barlow
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Reged: 12/03/07

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560096 - 12/07/12 10:43 PM

James,

Congratulations on getting your new APM 152 doublet. Looks fantastic. Hope it gives you some great views of the night sky. Let us know how you like the scope after getting a chance to use it.

Bill


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James Ling
sage
*****

Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560097 - 12/07/12 10:43 PM Attachment (306 downloads)

12. Fixing the accessories onto the APM focuser....
i) Finder , which comprises the brkt, finder and illuminator...
ii)Extension tube lengthens the focusing distance travel to 12cm...., as the focuser only has around 6cm of travel...
iii) 2" 99% dielectric 1/10 lambda diagonal... Pls take note that this diagonal is not part of the usd3990 pkg...


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James Ling
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560106 - 12/07/12 10:49 PM Attachment (244 downloads)

13. Fixing the carrying handle onto the OTA....
As the losmandy dovetail is adjustable with series of holes on one side, and slot hole on the other side, as such you can mount this carrying handle by adjusting the distance between the 2 mounting rings that come along with this scope...


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James Ling
sage
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560112 - 12/07/12 10:52 PM Attachment (513 downloads)

14. This is the look of the new 152 APM ED APO, when mounted onto my G11 losmandy G2 mount.....

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James Ling
sage
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Bill Barlow]
      #5560118 - 12/07/12 10:59 PM

Quote:

James,

Congratulations on getting your new APM 152 doublet. Looks fantastic. Hope it gives you some great views of the night sky. Let us know how you like the scope after getting a chance to use it.

Bill




Hi Bill..

Thanks for your comments.....

Today I hope have a good chance of using it at my Astronomy Friend's astro talk at a local library...
Although the weather don't look promising at this moment, but tonight, after the astro talk, maybe the weather may change......
But tonight's main object will only be Jupiter, M45 and M42, as we are putting this up in a heavily light polluted city....

Regards

James Ling


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astroricardo
sage
*****

Reged: 11/14/11

Loc: Marietta, GA
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560120 - 12/07/12 10:59 PM

Your unboxing is so well documented I feel like I received it too - except my wife isn't yelling at me

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James Ling
sage
*****

Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: astroricardo]
      #5560128 - 12/07/12 11:06 PM

Quote:

Your unboxing is so well documented I feel like I received it too - except my wife isn't yelling at me




Hi Bro...

Thanks for your comment....

I think is good to show how APM packed their scope for the delivery, and if there is a need for further improvement, I think , they will make the necessary changes....

Regards

James Ling


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Hermie
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Reged: 04/20/05

Loc: Cloudy HKG
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560140 - 12/07/12 11:14 PM

James,

Congratulations on a beautiful scope, and Happy Birthday too! Now all you need for Christmas are some clear skies ..... and maybe an Ethos 21!

Well done!

Hermie


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James Ling
sage
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Hermie]
      #5560166 - 12/07/12 11:34 PM

Quote:

James,

Congratulations on a beautiful scope, and Happy Birthday too! Now all you need for Christmas are some clear skies ..... and maybe an Ethos 21!

Well done!

Hermie




Thanks Hermie...

I really did not plan this for my this year birthday, and it so happen it all happened at the same time....

As for the Ethos 21, I know is great to have..., although currently I have the 22mm TV panoptic....

Yes, with this scope arriving perfectly during Jupiter opposition time, I have the whole of this month of December to put it out for more side walks....

Regards

James Ling


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zjc26138
Loved By All
*****

Reged: 02/24/05

Loc: Mingo Junction, Ohio
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560244 - 12/08/12 12:39 AM

Beautiful scope James!

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James Ling
sage
*****

Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: zjc26138]
      #5560294 - 12/08/12 01:29 AM

Quote:

Beautiful scope James!




Hi Bro..

Thanks for your comment...

The physical appearance of this scope really meet my expectation, as previously not much photos being taken from this new scope...

And it come in a nice case, which give me peace of mind, when I travel with it for star gazing activities...

REgards

James Ling



And


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Mark9473
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Reged: 07/21/05

Loc: 51N 4E
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560458 - 12/08/12 07:13 AM

I'm surprised that with a doublet objective, the scope is still so front heavy. Or is perhaps the dewshield not extended in those last two images?

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Mr Onions
Two Time International Photographical Competition Winner
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Reged: 04/14/07

Loc: Newcastle upon Tyne.
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #5560469 - 12/08/12 07:30 AM

Wonderful set of photos.
Goodluck with your new scope.


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Ambiorix
member


Reged: 05/01/11

Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mr Onions]
      #5560501 - 12/08/12 08:12 AM

Good looking scope James, good luck with it!

I can't help to give a few remarks:

-Markus, the total weight of the scope is almost doubled to what you promised in the first place.

-On a refractor a focuser with only 6cm travel is not very......well....fill in whatever you want:)

-When I asked why the case was not a couple of inches longer to fit the scope, diagonal attached to it, you told me people preffered the shorter case for the tube only. You did not mention that the tube is so short that, according to James' pictures anyway, a very long extension is needed to reach focus, even with a big 2" diagonal! Not good if it is the case! And please, Markus, do not come telling me that people prefer a short tube with an extension one mile long hanging behind it:) Now I understand why the case is so short:) Once again, at least if the configuration in James' pictures is indeed correct and the extension is really needed, otherwise, no problems with this issue....

I think optically and for the rest it will be fine.


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ryderc1
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Reged: 04/15/06

Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Hermie]
      #5560508 - 12/08/12 08:25 AM

Is the dewshield retractable? If yes, it appears that it's necessary to remove the rings in order to retract it since it looks like the scope is very nose heavy and needs the rings to be very far forward on the OTA to balance/mount the scope.

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Sunspot
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Reged: 03/15/05

Loc: Surprise, AZ
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Ambiorix]
      #5560610 - 12/08/12 10:09 AM

James,

Beautiful! I admired that scope there in Tucson, but it never occurred to me to ask Markus if it was for Sale! I could have bought it and saved shipping because we drove down from Phoenix. My loss is your gain! It looks like it is in a good home.

As far as the comment about weight, I thought Markus initially said it would weigh 16 pounds and has gone up to 22 pounds (not quite twice as much as someone commented). Still it's a pretty light scope for a 6" (the Explore Scientific 5" triplet weights 22 pounds and the 6" definitely tops that!).

My almost exclusive use for the scope would be solar and I'm wondering how attaching a Herschel Wedge, 3x barlow and a webcam would affect focus based on the focusing tube length. Of course I would probably replace the focuser with an electric focuser.

Again, congratulations!!!
Paul


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CounterWeight
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Loc: Palo alto, CA.
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560642 - 12/08/12 10:35 AM

James,

Thanks for the fantastic post and image documentation, very much appeciated here. How does the scope feel as far as weight balance and distribution? Will patiently await your visual report though I anticipate a very positive experience there.

Congratulations, and again thank you.


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James Ling
sage
*****

Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #5560911 - 12/08/12 01:41 PM Attachment (158 downloads)

Quote:

I'm surprised that with a doublet objective, the scope is still so front heavy. Or is perhaps the dewshield not extended in those last two images?




Hi Mark...

Yes... When I received the new scope, after I set it up for my own test at home, I did not extend the dew shield, and that is the balance point, which is at the centre of the losmandy dovetail....

Only yesterday when Steve asked me whether the dew shield is retractable, then I extend it, and dovetail need to move forward almost an inch to balance the scope...

And during last night side walk, I extended the dew shield as there are plenty of lamp post around the observing place...(pls refer to following photo , which shows the fully photo of the extended dew shield)

Regards

James Ling
Regards

James Ling


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James Ling
sage
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mr Onions]
      #5560920 - 12/08/12 01:47 PM Attachment (219 downloads)

Quote:

Wonderful set of photos.
Goodluck with your new scope.




Hi Bro...

Thanks for your comments....

Yes... Last night, the 1st outdoor 1st light for this 152 APM ED APO, really again never disappoint both the crowds and everyone present....

This photo taken last night shows the APM ED APO stands out with the apartment right behind it....

REgards

James Ling


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Traveler
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 08/19/07

Loc: The Netherlands
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560927 - 12/08/12 01:51 PM

Great pictures! Thats is a huge scope.

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James Ling
sage
*****

Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Ambiorix]
      #5560937 - 12/08/12 02:01 PM

Quote:

Good looking scope James, good luck with it!

I can't help to give a few remarks:

-Markus, the total weight of the scope is almost doubled to what you promised in the first place.

-On a refractor a focuser with only 6cm travel is not very......well....fill in whatever you want:)

-When I asked why the case was not a couple of inches longer to fit the scope, diagonal attached to it, you told me people preffered the shorter case for the tube only. You did not mention that the tube is so short that, according to James' pictures anyway, a very long extension is needed to reach focus, even with a big 2" diagonal! Not good if it is the case! And please, Markus, do not come telling me that people prefer a short tube with an extension one mile long hanging behind it:) Now I understand why the case is so short:) Once again, at least if the configuration in James' pictures is indeed correct and the extension is really needed, otherwise, no problems with this issue....

I think optically and for the rest it will be fine.




Hi Bro....

I need to clarify one important point here...
The focuser sent to me is not the exact one , for anyone who has placed the order for this new 152 APM ED APO.

APM replaces me with their APM focuser and an extension tube, as the 1st sample is sent to them without the exact focuser...
Perhaps Markus should explain again what will be the exact type of focuser for those who has placed their order...

As for the case, last night, when I loaded it into my saloon car, for the side walk, it took up the whole of the rear passenger car seat...
And for me, I still prefer this length, for my own convenient...especially on the transportation using car.

Regards

James Ling


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James Ling
sage
*****

Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Sunspot]
      #5560958 - 12/08/12 02:18 PM Attachment (162 downloads)

Quote:

James,

Beautiful! I admired that scope there in Tucson, but it never occurred to me to ask Markus if it was for Sale! I could have bought it and saved shipping because we drove down from Phoenix. My loss is your gain! It looks like it is in a good home.

As far as the comment about weight, I thought Markus initially said it would weigh 16 pounds and has gone up to 22 pounds (not quite twice as much as someone commented). Still it's a pretty light scope for a 6" (the Explore Scientific 5" triplet weights 22 pounds and the 6" definitely tops that!).

My almost exclusive use for the scope would be solar and I'm wondering how attaching a Herschel Wedge, 3x barlow and a webcam would affect focus based on the focusing tube length. Of course I would probably replace the focuser with an electric focuser.

Again, congratulations!!!
Paul




Hi Paul...

Thanks for your comments...
And I should say I am very lucky as many people did not know that this scope at Tuscon Astronomy Show is for sale....
Otherwise I will need to wait until early March 2013 for the delivery of the scope that I have placed the order...

As for the weight of this OTA, I am quite happy with it, as is still consider very much lighter than most of my bigger aperture scope...

And you also mentioned that the weight is similar to the ES 5" triplet, really surprised me, coz last night, one of our team member has brought this scope along and put side by side with this 152 APM ED APO, is so much smaller and shorter (FL less than 1000mm)....(pls refer to photo taken towards end of our side walk session)
In fact we are commenting on the case provided by the two scope manufacturers....and mine seems to be the better quality....

REgards

James Ling


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Mr Onions
Two Time International Photographical Competition Winner
*****

Reged: 04/14/07

Loc: Newcastle upon Tyne.
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560965 - 12/08/12 02:22 PM

Your outreach site is like mine,very heavily light polluted but as I only target moon & bright planets it doesn't make too much difference.
Great work you're doing there!
I bet the public were amazed looking through them.
Did the seeing let you use the full aperture?


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James Ling
sage
*****

Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: CounterWeight]
      #5560986 - 12/08/12 02:34 PM

Quote:

James,

Thanks for the fantastic post and image documentation, very much appeciated here. How does the scope feel as far as weight balance and distribution? Will patiently await your visual report though I anticipate a very positive experience there.

Congratulations, and again thank you.




Hi Bro....

Looks like many people in CN is concerned about the weight distribution of this new OTA...
And after one day experience of using it, I can only make the following comments:-

1. Yes, the weight of the lens cell is quite heavy, and even with the mounting rings being moved very close towards the counter cell assembly, you can feel the tilting of the scope when you carry it using the carry handle...

2. If you want to remove the OTA from the mount, is best to have the diagonal, eye piece and finder still mounted on the focuser, otherwise, due to this imbalance, you may drop the scope if you could not catch it on time....

Regards

James Ling


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stevew
Now I've done it


Reged: 03/03/06

Loc: British Columbia Canada
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5560998 - 12/08/12 02:45 PM

Beautiful scope James.
How about a couple of comments on it's performance.
We all want to know how did Jupiter look?
Are you impressed with the images?

Steve


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James Ling
sage
*****

Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: ryderc1]
      #5561003 - 12/08/12 02:48 PM

Quote:

Is the dewshield retractable? If yes, it appears that it's necessary to remove the rings in order to retract it since it looks like the scope is very nose heavy and needs the rings to be very far forward on the OTA to balance/mount the scope.




Hi Bro...

Yes, this scope can be classified as nose heavy, as far as I come to know about this important aspect that many people are looking at...
The mounting ring position that APM set for me , during the delivery, is very close to the dew shield when it is retracted fully backwards or in home position...
And this position is just nice when you add in the 2 inch diagonal, finder, and eye piece....

As such there is no requirement to move the mounting rings further up, when the dew shield is pushed forward...
The balancing is at the dovetail, which is around 12 inches long, or 6 inches from central point, and I only offset about one inch away for the balancing for the tilting of the OTA....

Regards

James Ling


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James Ling
sage
*****

Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Traveler]
      #5561019 - 12/08/12 02:58 PM

Quote:

Great pictures! Thats is a huge scope.




Hi Bro...

Thanks for your comment..
I only took a few photo shots during my little break for last night side walk...

Is non stop from 8pm till 11.30pm....whereby people anxiously wanted to see how Jupiter looks like in this big scope....

Regards

James Ling


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James Ling
sage
*****

Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mr Onions]
      #5561027 - 12/08/12 03:05 PM

Quote:

Your outreach site is like mine,very heavily light polluted but as I only target moon & bright planets it doesn't make too much difference.
Great work you're doing there!
I bet the public were amazed looking through them.
Did the seeing let you use the full aperture?




Hi bro...

Yes, the public are so excited when we are here......
Last night, unlike previously, we only have a few scopes, and the queue is so long....
And this time, we have more than 7 or 8 scopes, so the crowds are now spread around.....between all the scopes...
Although the weather is a bit cloudy, but there are many moments of clear patch of sky, and we are able to let the public see Jupiter and its 4 moons clearly.....

REgards

James Ling


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James Ling
sage
*****

Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: stevew]
      #5561097 - 12/08/12 03:46 PM Attachment (170 downloads)

Quote:

Beautiful scope James.
How about a couple of comments on it's performance.
We all want to know how did Jupiter look?
Are you impressed with the images?

Steve




Hi Steve...

Thanks for your comment...

Hi Steve and All....

As I only use this new scope twice, since I receive it....
This is my little comments on its performance....

1. On the 1st night after I assembled the scope at home, and use it , I only seen M45 and Jupiter, around 3am....
Using the baader zoom ep at 24mm, at 50X, the M45 star field is so much different from what I have seen with any other scopes... the contrast and sharpness of the stars, are so well defined, and that I really want to put this scope for coming February 2013 oversea star gazing activities...
When around 3.30am, Jupiter is visible through my window, I tested it with both the baader zoom ep at 8mm or 150X, and my 4mm ep at 300X, both can distinguish GRS clearly.
I tried higher magnification, and the image start breaking down....

2. On last night side walk, the 152 APM ED APO only shows Jupiter, for nearly 4 hours of non stop queuing....
During the 1st 2 hours, when Jupiter is lower than 45 deg, I only able to use 150X power , to get a sharp image ....
But once Jupiter is high up above 60 deg, I add another 2X barlow to the baader zoom, and increase it to around 250X..., and still get a sharp and crisp image of jupiter...
and its 4 moons are disc like object....

When come to 11pm, when Jupiter is near to overhead, and this is the time whereby the crowds are left with a few , we can really seriously look at Jupiter, and the comment from everyone of us, is indeed FANTASTIC VIEW WE HAVE SEEN HERE SINCE OUR SIDE WALK....
Is almost like total absence of CA, as the edges of jupiter is very crisp....
The view is so sharp , that we put up the bino viewer, and really as what I have read in CN, Jupiter seems become 3D...
As clouds roll in around midnight, as such we did not continue to test it with higher power, and the max power we achieved tonight with such a high contrast is 250X ....

Regards

James Ling


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stevew
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5561106 - 12/08/12 03:52 PM

Quote:


Is almost like total absence of CA, as the edges of jupiter is very crisp....
The view is so sharp , that we put up the bino viewer, and really as what I have read in CN, Jupiter seems become 3D...
As clouds roll in around midnight, as such we did not continue to test it with higher power, and the max power we achieved tonight with such a high contrast is 250X ....

Regards

James Ling



Excellent report James!
Just what we all wanted to hear.
Congratulations on your fine Apochromat.

Steve


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Mr Onions
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: stevew]
      #5561167 - 12/08/12 04:37 PM

You're responding to people's comments with great answers and detail.
Everyone is very much appreciating your time answering them.
Top Man!

I wish I was built like Hulk Hogan so I could use one of these scopes.


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BRCoz
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mr Onions]
      #5561261 - 12/08/12 05:49 PM

Very nice scope. How long is the scope case? The case for my APM 130/1200 just fits in the back seat.

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Traveler
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mr Onions]
      #5561266 - 12/08/12 05:51 PM

Quote:

You're responding to people's comments with great answers and detail.
Everyone is very much appreciating your time answering them.
Top Man!






+1


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Sunspot
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Traveler]
      #5561287 - 12/08/12 06:05 PM

Quote:

Quote:

You're responding to people's comments with great answers and detail.
Everyone is very much appreciating your time answering them.
Top Man!






+1




+2


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GHarris
super member


Reged: 06/06/09

Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Sunspot]
      #5561320 - 12/08/12 06:38 PM

The telescope maker is answering some of the questions posed here, over in the Vendors forum. He isn't allowed to post in the Refractors section since he is the seller.

(I presume I'm not doing anything wrong by pointing this out!)


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orlyandico
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: GHarris]
      #5561515 - 12/08/12 09:11 PM

James, does the binoviewer come to focus without an OCA? i assume it does if you remove the extension tube?

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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: BRCoz]
      #5561809 - 12/09/12 01:52 AM

Quote:

Very nice scope. How long is the scope case? The case for my APM 130/1200 just fits in the back seat.




Hi Bro...

Sorry for the late reply, as I slept at 4am, after my last forum reply (I am 12 to 13 hrs ahead of USA timing)

The length of the case is 115cm or 45 inches..

Since both our scopes are 1200mm focal length, your case could be either the same , or slightly longer...

Regards

James Ling


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Sunspot]
      #5561818 - 12/09/12 02:08 AM

Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

You're responding to people's comments with great answers and detail.
Everyone is very much appreciating your time answering them.
Top Man!






+1




+2




Hi All....

Really thank you so much for all your comments, and this will greatly motivate me to evaluate further on this new 152 APM ED APO performance, before anyone receiving their production unit which will be in early March...

The next scope to scope comparison will be ...

Against my friend, Richard's APM 152 triplet APO, which I have personally seen Jupiter through his scope , 2 years ago....

Regards

James Ling


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: orlyandico]
      #5561827 - 12/09/12 02:21 AM Attachment (123 downloads)

Quote:

James, does the binoviewer come to focus without an OCA? i assume it does if you remove the extension tube?




Hi Bro...

If you are in Singapore, you shouldn't miss yesterday side walk session, as there are so many of our Singastro forum members present, to show both their support for this planned event.....

I am very sorry on the WO bino viewer that Gary last night is so eager to test it on this new 152 APM ED APO..., as I cannot recall we remove the extension tube or not , when observing it with or without the 2X barlow...

he uses the WO bino viewer 1,6X barlow, then change to celestron ultima 2X barlow, to get a much bigger image....

Not sure this close up photo I took last night can figure out , which is which....

Regards

James Ling


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Radim
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5561899 - 12/09/12 05:47 AM

Would be very interesting to compare this new kid to LZOS triplet 6inch ... visually ... not so many LZOS reviews out there ....

Radim


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F60.4
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Radim]
      #5561938 - 12/09/12 07:17 AM

Great thread and thanks to the OP for this.

Yes as Radim says, I'd love to hear how it compares to the LZOS triplet.


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orlyandico
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: F60.4]
      #5561984 - 12/09/12 08:25 AM

James, am overseas. Got the invite from Gary but you know how it is...

According to Markus in the other thread, you can use the BV without an OCA with the extension removed.


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Richard Low
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: orlyandico]
      #5562041 - 12/09/12 09:15 AM

James, my APM/LZOS 152 Triplet was packed and ready to go....but I was stuck in a bad traffic jam driving back to Singapore, so I'm disappointed that I didnt get to see your new APM152ED, and to compare with mine. I hope you can bring it down one of these nights and I will be happy to bring mine over, since I'm only 5 mins drive away

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RGM
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Richard Low]
      #5563064 - 12/09/12 07:59 PM

James, a little off topic - are you still using your Istar 204 f9 or has this replaced it? Can you comment on the views through the 152 compared to the 204.

Great looking scope.


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junomike
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: RGM]
      #5563091 - 12/09/12 08:30 PM

James, I'm interested in more clarification to this statement:

Quote:

Is almost like total absence of CA, as the edges of jupiter is very crisp...




So was there CA on the perimeter of Jupiter? If so, how much?

Just curious as I thought Markus reported zero in focus CA.

Mike


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: RGM]
      #5563466 - 12/10/12 01:44 AM

Quote:

James, a little off topic - are you still using your Istar 204 f9 or has this replaced it? Can you comment on the views through the 152 compared to the 204.

Great looking scope.




Hi Bob....

Sorry for the late reply, as I am now working oversea, and now is lunch break....Thanks for your comment on the new 152 APE ED APO.....

As for your question on the Istar, I think many other CN members, especially those who are like me, as members of ISTARSCOPECLUB, very much like to know how is this ED APO compared to the 8" Istar achro...

Yes. I am still holding on to the 8" ISTAR F9 achro, and it is supposed to be the main star for the night, but since the new 152 ED APO arrives earlier, I think is better to show to those who heard about the scope and wants to see it in public in Singapore....,as well as those who are outside Singapore....

Hi Bob and All....

The following is my comments for the two scopes I owned, the 8" ISTAR F9 and 152 APM ED APO.................

One month ago, at the very same place, the Istar is put up for the Jupiter and M42 night observing, and the full report is in CN outreach section....

The detail of last weekend report will continue in this outreach section, when I have time this evening , after my working hours...

Last weekend , is a pity that M42 is not in such a good situation to get the 152 ED APO to show the trapezium stars in M42,due to heavy clouds over that sector.
And we are interested in picking up star E and F, which the Istar easily picks up both mag 10+ in such a heavily light polluted city... And the best is the Istar does not even have the extended dew shield, while for the 152 APM ED APO, I am extending it out to beat the glaring lights form the nearby lamp posts...

Last weekend, another different situation also arises, GRS is not seen until early morning, so unlike last month the Istar easily picks up the GRS , so easily...., during last month side walk...at around 1.30am.

But last Thursday after midnight, around 3.30am, in my home , from the window, the 152 APM ED APO picks it up easily....during my indoor 1st light test of this new scope after I assembled it...

Since I have already seen through the 8" Istar for 2 years, and now with the 152 APM ED APO, for two occasions, I will give my personal opinion, on these two scopes, which are not being placed side by side, for their performance....

1. CA
The Istar has CA, which is tolerable to some of us, but not to those who are really looking for the perfect scope with zero CA, but for the 152 APM ED APO, it is color free, to most of us, when it is in focus, which I am referring to Jupiter, not the moon or Venus, as i have not tested it yet...
( I will explain on my next CN reply , later )

2. Magnification
The magnification that I can pushed for the Istar has reached 450X , with my 4mm ep, although the image has broken down slightly..., but is still acceptable....
If I will to lower it down to almost 300X, the image is razor sharp and contrast is good....
But for the 152 APM ED APO, at this moment I could not pushed it over 300X and still get a good and razor sharp image.....My best magnification is 300X for both occasions I tested it....
One good comment from one of our snr forum member, is that the APM ED APO , is easily snap on, in focus , when we tested it our on last Saturday.....

3. DSO....
The reason why I brought the Istar to oversea star gazing is simply I wanted to test its wide field on DSO, whereas my C14 at F11, is not suitable for wide field..
There are numerous report from me with regards to the Istar at oversea stargazing trip, in both CN outreach and Istarscopeclub forum.. , which you refer to...
As for the 152 APM ED APO, I only tested it on M45, that night, around 3am, with my baader zoom at 24mm, or 50X, and the view really surprised me that my light polluted area, can see such a good and nice view of this star cluster...You will not believe it , with your own eyes, is not 20 stars, in the field shining , but much more, which should have counted it....
The istar has seen this but in a different location...( overesa star gazing )

And lastly, I do not want to do the scope to scope comparison at this moment, until ISTAR release their raycorr , which I think is a more interesting comparison, as we can subtract away the CA, and see how well the scope performs against the 6" ED APO....

Regards

James Ling


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: junomike]
      #5563589 - 12/10/12 06:05 AM

Quote:

James, I'm interested in more clarification to this statement:

Quote:

Is almost like total absence of CA, as the edges of jupiter is very crisp...




So was there CA on the perimeter of Jupiter? If so, how much?

Just curious as I thought Markus reported zero in focus CA.

Mike




Hi Mike....

under the vendor and group announcement column, Markus reported under this thread, New 6"F/8 APM ED arrived today, the following, which I have not checked upon....

chromaticle aberration: coming from infocuse to focuse, you see the typical deep blue fringe, which gets fully absent in-focuse. The highest power for this test was a Ethos 3.7 mm = 325 power, twice the aperature, normaly called maximum usefull power. Vega is infocuse colorfree

As for my comments on the following with regards to the new scope that I have received...

Is almost like total absence of CA, as the edges of jupiter is very crisp...

This is the actual finding................

1. During our last Saturday night when using the new 152 APM ED APO , at Jupiter, initially as Jupiter is quite low, from 8pm till 10pm, I only use the baader zoom ep at 8mm, which is only 150X....
I even tried the 4mm TMB planetary ep,at 300X, the image starts to breakdown slightly, so I use back my baader zoom ep at 8mm or 150X...
As others just enjoyed looking through the APM ED APO, my friend, after taking closer look, point to me about something he saw form the both edges of Jupiter...
When I took a look at the scope, what I have seen, concur to what my friend has told me, is that on one side of the edge of jupiter , there is a very thin , sort of color in red...., and on the opposite end, there is a very thin, sort of color in green....
My friend told me it could be due to the atmosphere or eye piece...
I immediately took out my Tv 9mm nagler, and still we saw the very slight color of red and green on opposite side of Jupiter...So I guess could be from the atmosphere....

When after 10pm, as Jupiter is rising very high up, I insert my celestron utlima 2X barlow, and together with the baader zoom, I crank up the power to 250X, and the image we have seen is still very crisp and sharp, no breakdown of image at all....
I have to admit I don't realize whether there is still the color at the edges opposite each other...., as i am trying many times, to compare the image contrast of the 152 APM ED APO against the ES127 triplet APO....

By the time around 11pm , knowing that the best moments has come, we insert the WO bino-viewer....and we also try to barlow it.... And the stero effect of viewing at Jupiter also make me forgotten about the color issue....

Perhaps I should seriously check the CA issue on this coming weekend, when i am back from oversea, whereby I can do the scope to scope comparison with Richard's 152 APM Triplet APO....., and do another update again....

Regards

James Ling


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mblack
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5587131 - 12/24/12 12:17 PM

James,

Thanks for reporting in such detail on this scope. I've pre-ordered through the US vendor and thanks to your posts I've a good idea of what to expect.

Quote:

When I took a look at the scope, what I have seen, concur to what my friend has told me, is that on one side of the edge of jupiter , there is a very thin , sort of color in red...., and on the opposite end, there is a very thin, sort of color in green....
My friend told me it could be due to the atmosphere or eye piece...





Yes, that's an atmospheric effect, not the scope or eyepiece.

Please share any further comments/observations you care to on this scope James, it has been great reading so far :>


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Mr Onions
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Reged: 04/14/07

Loc: Newcastle upon Tyne.
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5587236 - 12/24/12 01:26 PM

David you do realize that you too will have to do a series of unboxing photos.
It's imperative.


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mblack
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mr Onions]
      #5587288 - 12/24/12 02:03 PM

Quote:

David you do realize that you too will have to do a series of unboxing photos.
It's imperative.




Happy to oblige, Steve.


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5587295 - 12/24/12 02:12 PM

Hi David....

Yes... I now also agreed to what you have just commented on the CA of this APM ED APO, after I have seen through this scope by myself at home at both the moon and the Sun...during these 2 weeks....

And today from another post, under the topic, APM 6" doublet on OPT's site, one of my astronomy friend who is present during the side walk also commented there is no CA seen on Jupiter...on this APM ED APO...

Hi All....

Sorry that there isn't any update from me, on the APM ED APO, for the past 2 weeks...., which is mainly due to the bad weather for any outdoor scope testing...

Last weekend I used the scope to view the 3 days and 4 days old moon, and it did not show any or even tiny trace of CA that i can see it with my other achros..when viewing the moon.
Today afternoon ( I am 12hrs ahead USA ), I set it up to view the Sun, with my Lunt Solar wedge, and comparing the view with my C6R F8, which I made numerous test on the solar wedge, the 152 new APM ED APO, shows a very distinct disc of the Sun.....
And tonight I used the scope to view the 10 days old moon, and again concur there isn't any trace of CA, even I tilt my sight of view. But due to the sky is very hazy, I will test it again, another day , if weather is better....

As for the APM triplet scope to APM ED scope test on Jupiter, due to the past two weeks of poor weather, both my friend and myself did not meet up to do any testing...

Will keep everyone updated again, once I have any outdoor scope testing....


Regards

James Ling


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mblack
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5587447 - 12/24/12 04:05 PM

Thanks for the update James.

Quote:

And today from another post, under the topic, APM 6" doublet on OPT's site, one of my astronomy friend who is present during the side walk also commented there is no CA seen on Jupiter...on this APM ED APO...





Very encouraging that observation. Hope your weather clears up James, a comparison between the APM 152 doublet and your friends triplet will be quite interesting. The doublet should lag behind, on paper anyway, but to what extent I wonder?

Here's to hoping your skies are clear and this comparison comes to fruition.


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Mr Onions
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5587473 - 12/24/12 04:24 PM

Looking forward to both you guy's futher comments and findings.
I'm pulling my hair out with envy.
And I haven't much to start with.


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dbs
member


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5587915 - 12/25/12 12:11 AM

Quote:

James,

Thanks for reporting in such detail on this scope. I've pre-ordered through the US vendor and thanks to your posts I've a good idea of what to expect.

Quote:

When I took a look at the scope, what I have seen, concur to what my friend has told me, is that on one side of the edge of jupiter , there is a very thin , sort of color in red...., and on the opposite end, there is a very thin, sort of color in green....
My friend told me it could be due to the atmosphere or eye piece...





Yes, that's an atmospheric effect, not the scope or eyepiece.

Please share any further comments/observations you care to on this scope James, it has been great reading so far :>




I have field tested this scope from James on the very night of the public outreach.

I can confirm there is no CA on Jupiter. The "red and green band", is the atmospheric effect which is usual even when one use a SCT or Mak to view that planet. I have viewed Jupiter through all my scopes from SCT to reflectors, and that effect is quite common.

James, didn't have time to tell you that on that night because there are just too many people. But I know that Gary made that observation.

I know James has given his comments about the scope, and they are right on. I am very impress by the image from this scope. James forgot to mention that the image snaps into focus even at 300x or so. I am particularly fussy about CA and ease of focus on an APO. If you need to guess the focusing point, then that APO ain't good enough for me.

There is also a 5" ES triplet nearby for comparison, and the surface on Jupiter is much "whiter" on this 6" scope. However, Jupiter surface details are about the same on both scopes, which also tells me that the ES scope is very contrasty as well. The image on the 6" is very close to white, and the image on the 5" ES is much "warmer", giving an impression that the image on the 6"is "brighter". I am not sure if that's an effect of a triplet or that the triplet was using Plossls at that moment and the 6" was using Naglers and Baader Zoom, but it is still a very lovely image on the 5" ES.

All in all, for 4k, I think Markus has outdone himself. I believe 90% of the buyers will be very pleased with this scope as long they know what kind of weight and handling they need to manage.

James, I can't wait to do a comparison with Richard's LZOS 6" APO. Please contact me me when you guys meet up.

Merry Christmas everyone!

Edited by dbs (12/25/12 12:20 AM)


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: dbs]
      #5588068 - 12/25/12 03:43 AM

James, did you pop each and every single bubble on all of your bubble wrapping??? Enjoy the scope!

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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Rinaldo]
      #5588224 - 12/25/12 09:18 AM

Hi Rinaldo...

This scope come with so much bubble wrapper that I am keeping it for future use, both to protect the big long case, as well as for the scope.....since I have plan to use it for coming February and March travel to Malaysia star gazing expedition.....

As for the scope, I really enjoy using it coz of its light weight and portability....

I can use my GM8 mount instead of G11 mount.......

Regards

James Ling


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Scott BeithAdministrator
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5588328 - 12/25/12 11:06 AM

James that was a great write up on the scope. Congrats on the new gear - it really looks good. Thank you for sharing astronomy with people through your outreach nights.

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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Scott Beith]
      #5589081 - 12/26/12 12:00 AM

Quote:

James that was a great write up on the scope. Congrats on the new gear - it really looks good. Thank you for sharing astronomy with people through your outreach nights.




Hi Scott Beith...

Thank you so much for your comments....

And I wanted to admit that I am really the lucky one to receive the 1st unit , rather than need to wait until March 2013, for the production units....

Hi All....

Although I knew this s/n#002 is being displayed at the Tucson Astronomy show, but from the sample I received, I knew how dedicate APM is handling this shipment, and without any cosmetic defects....
Except one advice to Markus, is that some buyers may not want to see some dust settling onto their precious glass surface....
As for me , is alright, as I can use cotton to move them away.....

Hi Scott Beith and All...

As for the outreach nights that I have participated, I may not do as often as what a few of my other astronomy friends are doing ....

But I always want to add new things , for the outreach activities, and once I have upgraded my other big scope, on its planetary performance, I will bring it out again.....

REgards

James Ling


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Pete-LH
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5589339 - 12/26/12 09:05 AM

Great Report James.
Personally I'm interested in the weight of the OTA. I am looking at downsizing from my G11 to a GM-8. I see the package was 26KG but I did not see the actual weight of the OTA. My apologies if I missed it elsewhere in this thread.
I briefly owned a C6R as well but feel it would be a little heavy for a GM-8. Is this OTA lighter than your C6R?
Regards,
Pete


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Mr Onions
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Pete-LH]
      #5589548 - 12/26/12 11:36 AM

22lbs for OTA according to the posts.

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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mr Onions]
      #5590324 - 12/26/12 09:19 PM

Hi Pete...

Mr Onions is correct...
The OTA itself is 22 lbs...
I cannot recall the exact weight, is around 23 lbs, inclusive of the tube rings, losmandy dove tail, APM focuser, finder and brkts, APM 2" diagonal and extension tube....

As for the C6R , I have not weighed it against the APM ED APO..
Come to this weekend , when I am back from oversea , I do the weight comparison for this 2 OTA again and advice you....

Regards

James Ling


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Pete-LH
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5590966 - 12/27/12 10:46 AM

Thanks James, Mr. Onions in New Castle/Tynes(is that actually New Castle England? I have been there-Work Related)

I should have seen that weight information but was scanning the thread too quickly. My apologies. I am interested though on your thoughts of weight balance versus mount.

For visual as I am aging like everyone, I am trying to determine a minimal setup for the maximum practical aperture refractor and SCT on my GM-8(or Vixen GP). That's why I was interested in your GM-8/APM evaluation.

Right now I'm at a 4" refractor and 8" SCT as being optimum but I have an AP 5" Superplanetary that is fairly light (<20 lbs with finder, rings and average lens). It is OK on the GM-8 although the vibration settling time is close to my limit.


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Pete-LH]
      #5591150 - 12/27/12 12:48 PM

Hi Pete.
Yes, Newcastle upon Tyne, in north east England.
Geordieland.
Capital of Northumberland.
Haidrian's Wall etc.


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Pete-LH]
      #5591316 - 12/27/12 03:05 PM

Quote:

Thanks James, Mr. Onions in New Castle/Tynes(is that actually New Castle England? I have been there-Work Related)

I should have seen that weight information but was scanning the thread too quickly. My apologies. I am interested though on your thoughts of weight balance versus mount.

For visual as I am aging like everyone, I am trying to determine a minimal setup for the maximum practical aperture refractor and SCT on my GM-8(or Vixen GP). That's why I was interested in your GM-8/APM evaluation.

Right now I'm at a 4" refractor and 8" SCT as being optimum but I have an AP 5" Superplanetary that is fairly light (<20 lbs with finder, rings and average lens). It is OK on the GM-8 although the vibration settling time is close to my limit.




Pete

I have my 17 lb ED120 (including diagonal & rings) mounted on a GP, and using a HD Surveyors tripod it handles the scope exquisitely. Damp time is less than 1 second. I can lean against the focuser, it is incredibly solid! Adding the Surveyors tripod made all the difference.


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: SteveG]
      #5591383 - 12/27/12 03:39 PM

Thanks Steve, I see the pic of your setup in the 12/5/2011 Mount Post. I'll look into that. I may send you a PM for more information.

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Pete-LH]
      #5593713 - 12/29/12 01:33 AM Attachment (86 downloads)

Hi Pete...

Hope you are not disappointed with the actual weight I taken today, for the 2 scopes...

1. C6R F8 , OTA with original focuser and tube rings.... 19.2 Lbs.

2. APM 152 ED APO, OTA with AMP focuser and tube rings..... 21.6 Lbs.

Yes... The APM ED APO , is much more heavier , when I carry them , and placed onto my weighing scale....
(Refer to photo) --both are almost the same, except APM dew shield is retractable....

REgards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5593752 - 12/29/12 03:02 AM

Its a beautiful scope James. They all are. We can never have too many refractors. They all exist for a reason. I have a big APM 180 F/6 and love that beast!!

...Ralph in Sacramento


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: aa6ww]
      #5593764 - 12/29/12 03:22 AM

James,
Disappointed, No. I really appreciate your taking the time to compare and send the information and photos. It really gives me an idea on how your new scope handles since I had a C6R and used it on my G-11.
The weights are pretty comparable.


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5593948 - 12/29/12 09:00 AM

Excellent information!! I'm thinking of putting either one or the other of those scopes on an EQ6 mount (for Solar only). This helps my decision process.

Thanks!
Paul


Quote:

Hi Pete...

Hope you are not disappointed with the actual weight I taken today, for the 2 scopes...

1. C6R F8 , OTA with original focuser and tube rings.... 19.2 Lbs.

2. APM 152 ED APO, OTA with AMP focuser and tube rings..... 21.6 Lbs.

Yes... The APM ED APO , is much more heavier , when I carry them , and placed onto my weighing scale....
(Refer to photo) --both are almost the same, except APM dew shield is retractable....

REgards

James Ling




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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Sunspot]
      #5594926 - 12/29/12 07:12 PM Attachment (124 downloads)

Hi All....

Now I also have modified my other 11 Lbs counterweight to fit onto the GM8 counterweight bar, so that the scope can be use at zero degree latitude setting. ( Singapore is at 1 deg N )
So with the 7 Lbs counterweight that come along with my GM8 purchase, goes with the 11 Lbs , it will take the APM ED APO easily...

And as this is done, I can have my other scopes, mounted onto the G11, and I am ready to do my scope to scope comparison with my own scopes against the APM ED APO....

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5599146 - 01/01/13 06:23 AM Attachment (158 downloads)

Hi All.....

After so many weeks, today around 5pm, managed to use the 152 APM ED APO at the Sun, through the Lunt Solar wedge and continuum filter....

Photo attachment shows the details of sunspots taken with 2X barlow, using a canon DSLR..

BTW, tonight if the weather is still good, I will be doing the scope to scope compare with my friend, Richard's 152 APM triplet APO....

REgards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5599149 - 01/01/13 06:42 AM

Nice image James - looking forward to the 152 doublet/triplet shootout!

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5599189 - 01/01/13 08:28 AM

Quote:

And as this is done, I can have my other scopes, mounted onto the G11, and I am ready to do my scope to scope comparison with my own scopes against the APM ED APO....





Very nice, should make for a fun evening. Looking forward to your impressions.


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: F60.4]
      #5599223 - 01/01/13 09:04 AM

Quote:

Nice image James - looking forward to the 152 doublet/triplet shootout!




Hi Bro...

Thanks for the comment....
I have to admit I am a visual guy, and I don't take good astro photos....
Everybody knows the actual view through the eye piece is very much clearer in the details than this photo taken by me...
And if to compare against my C6R F8, yes, there is a difference, although both can show intricate details of the sunspots through the Lunt Solar wedge...

And for tonight's shootout, will be another two to three hours from now....as I am GMT + 8hrs ...
Hope the weather stays as now , coz 2 hours ago clouds and thunders are all over the place...

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5599248 - 01/01/13 09:21 AM

Quote:

Quote:

And as this is done, I can have my other scopes, mounted onto the G11, and I am ready to do my scope to scope comparison with my own scopes against the APM ED APO....





Very nice, should make for a fun evening. Looking forward to your impressions.




Hi David.

I think most CN members in the refractor section, wanted to know how much the difference on the performance between the APM ED APO against the APM triplet APO, as such I will have the 1st shootout between the two APM scopes...

After the 2 APM shootout is done, I will plan to have the APM ED APO shootout against my 3 bigger scopes, and all are on planetary , not DSO...
And that is the reason I wanted to have my 2 losmandy mounts ready for the other shootout...


Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5599675 - 01/01/13 01:57 PM Attachment (132 downloads)

Hi All....

Tonight shootout between the new APM ED APO against the APM triplet APO is a quick and fast setup, compare , and then pack and go..........

Richard and myself have failed to do this over the past few weeks, simply both of us are working, and we could only meet up during weekend or holiday, and we want Jupiter to be as high as possible, under a clear night....
But the weather seems not co-operative with us, even today till the very last few hours....

Tonight we decided to meet after 11pm, after we reconfirmed at 9.30pm, the sky is clear, despite earlier, the clouds and thunderstorms are all the places....

The following photos shows our simple setup, and only 2 of us, not involving any other friends....


Photo 1 shows my friend, Richard doing his APM triplet APO setup...


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5599681 - 01/01/13 02:00 PM Attachment (132 downloads)

Hi ALL....

Photo 2 shows the new APM ED APO setup ready for the shootout.......


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5599702 - 01/01/13 02:14 PM Attachment (111 downloads)

Hi ALL...

Photo 3 shows the shootout is done by using the same eye piece , first over the APM triplet APO, and we viewed at Jupiter and its moons ....


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5599708 - 01/01/13 02:15 PM Attachment (101 downloads)

Hi ALL...

Photo 4 shows the same ep is brought over to the new APM ED APO , and we viewed at Jupiter and its moons....


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5599754 - 01/01/13 02:44 PM

Hi ALL....

This is the brief comments for this shootout.....which are from my personal opinion......

1. The eye piece used is the Lecia zoom with the special threaded barlow, to give both scopes higher than 300X ......

2. The APM ED APO does not shows any CA.......

3. Both APM ED APO and Triplet APO show Jupiter with clearly defined clouds bands....
Tonight no GRS and shadow of Jupiter's moon...to compare the contrast...

4. APM triplet APO shows Jupiter a very clean disc, while the ED APO is a bit softer...but not noticeable to someone who is not trying to spot the difference...

5. Jupiter's 4 moons from the view of the APM triplet is much more distinct as compared to the APM ED APO....

I hope all those who are keen and interested to acquire this new APM ED APO , should have a better understanding on its performance against the APM triplet....

Regards

James Ling

Edited by James Ling (01/01/13 08:24 PM)


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5599801 - 01/01/13 03:13 PM

Thanks James.

This report is what I would have expected from the triplet, that the APM ED APO 152/1200 lags not further behind in the eyes of two observers, is what I am glad to read.

Truly, had the results been radically different, that would have been cause for concern in one of the two ( triplet or doublet) scopes.

After following closely the development of the APM ED APO 152/1200 here on Cloudynights, and with further evidence from test bench sample and now your field reports James, personally I'm feeling this scope will meet the goals laid out for it originally.

Again, thanks James, appreciate your efforts to relate the performance of this new APM 152/1200. Now I have to wait until sometime in March to enjoy the night sky with this scope, but that's OK.


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5599903 - 01/01/13 04:14 PM

I'd love to hear how the view through an 8" SCT with a very good Star Test and which is well collimated, compares directly with this APM 150 ED APO, with respect to the amount of details visible on Jupiter!

Does anyone in your club / locally have an 8" SCT James?

Cheers,

Alistair G.


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5599905 - 01/01/13 04:14 PM

Really enjoying James's thread.
Great read.


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mr Onions]
      #5599923 - 01/01/13 04:30 PM

Thanks for the info James!

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
      #5600455 - 01/01/13 10:23 PM Attachment (66 downloads)

Quote:

I'd love to hear how the view through an 8" SCT with a very good Star Test and which is well collimated, compares directly with this APM 150 ED APO, with respect to the amount of details visible on Jupiter!

Does anyone in your club / locally have an 8" SCT James?

Cheers,

Alistair G.




Alistair G.

I do not have the 8" meade like you, but I do have the ultima 8 GOTO....

If I could not get any of my astronomy friends to do a shoot out between the ED APO against the 8" SCT, I will use mine....

But it will need to wait until weekend, as well as I also need to ensure the scope is well collimated through a star test before the shoot out...

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5600792 - 01/02/13 07:25 AM

Quote:

Hi ALL....

This is the brief comments for this shootout.....which are from my personal opinion......

1. The eye piece used is the Lecia zoom with the special threaded barlow, to give both scopes higher than 300X ......

2. The APM ED APO does not shows any CA.......

3. Both APM ED APO and Triplet APO show Jupiter with clearly defined clouds bands....
Tonight no GRS and shadow of Jupiter's moon...to compare the contrast...

4. APM triplet APO shows Jupiter a very clean disc, while the ED APO is a bit softer...but not noticeable to someone who is not trying to spot the difference...

5. Jupiter's 4 moons from the view of the APM triplet is much more distinct as compared to the APM ED APO....

I hope all those who are keen and interested to acquire this new APM ED APO , should have a better understanding on its performance against the APM triplet....

Regards

James Ling




Very nice James. Your comments relative to the new doublet on Jupiter are remarkably similar to my comparisons of my APM 6" F8 triplet to my old AP 152 F9 "blue-tube" Starfire. At focus the differences are subtle and only really noticable in comparison to each other but a couple of us noticed the sharpness of the 4 moons thru the triplet and that the AP was slightly "warm" relative to the APM...not a bad thing for Jupiter. Both scopes showed Jupiter looking astonishingly like a ball that you could look around and a definite front-to-back arrangement to the moons. Very 3D looking.

Jeff


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mr Onions]
      #5600886 - 01/02/13 09:21 AM

Same here! Many thanks for it.

Quote:

Really enjoying James's thread.
Great read.




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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5601088 - 01/02/13 11:28 AM

Here is my first impression of the APM 6" f/8 Chinese ED Doublet compared with APM 6" f/8 LZOS triplet conducted last night 1 Jan 2013 in Jurong West, Singapore. I would like to extend a note of thanks to our observing buddy James Ling for this opportunity.

It was a quick and casual observation and I will only comment on the optical performance here. We spend about half hour observing time from 11:45pm onwards to observe and compare Jupiter which had culminated at almost zenith, spending a few minutes at a time on one scope and switching over to compare the image in the other scope and vice versa.

We compared using Leica ASPH zoom with Zeiss/Baader Abbe Barlow with 40mm T2 extension tube on both scopes side-by-side, giving a max. magnification of 363x.

Seeing was quite good at 8/10, with occasional moments of calm when the image was sharp and still. We do not have scope cool-down issues here at the tropics.

The APM 6" f/8 Chinese ED Doublet performed well optically though at first glance, both of us had already independently observed that there are immediate subtle differences between both scopes.

The image in the APM 6" f/8 LZOS triplet was noticeably slightly sharper at the same magnification, and showing slightly more planetary detail than the APM 6" f/8 Chinese ED Doublet. The image in the APM 6" f/8 Chinese ED Doublet was slightly softer in comparison. The APM 6" f/8 LZOS triplet was able to hold sharp image at slightly higher magnification than the APM 6" f/8 Chinese ED Doublet.

The image in the APM 6" f/8 LZOS triplet was colourless and neutral in tone, with a tiny tinge of red & blue seen at opposing limbs due to atmospheric dispersion. The image in APM 6" f/8 Chinese ED Doublet was warmer in tone, and Jupiter seemed to present to me a somewhat not-so-clean image. There was no visible purple fringe like the C6R, however both if us noticed a tiny tinge of red glow is visible around the Galilean moons at >300x. There is also a thin green-colour fringe around the bright Lunar edge at 66x magnification.

The image in the APM 6" f/8 LZOS triplet was noticeably brighter compared to APM 6" f/8 Chinese ED Doublet at the same magnification. I was somewhat surprised as I had previously noticed a slightly brighter image in a doublet compared to a triplet. Maybe the difference could be attributed to the difference in star diagonals: the APM 6" f/8 LZOS triplet was using the AP Maxbright diagonal while the APM 6" f/8 Chinese ED Doublet was using the APM 99% dielectric diagonal. In hindsight, we should have conducted the test comparison using the same star diagonal so as to eliminate this variable in our comparison.

These are only first impressions based on a quick casual test. These differences seen are subtle and evident only when we do this A-B test comparison side-by-side. Kindly note that our observation of the optical performance of the APM 6" f/8 Chinese ED Doublet is based on just this one sample #002 and perhaps may or may not be representative of the final production scope.

I am quite impressed with the overall optical performance of the APM 6" f/8 Chinese ED Doublet. I am quite sure that there will be many people, especially those who are value-conscious, who would be satisfied with the optical performance APM 6" f/8 Chinese ED Doublet. For those who are more quality-driven or purist in nature, the APM 6" f/8 LZOS triplet etc would probably be their choice. I am in the latter group and I am happy to stick with my home-built version of the APM 6" f/8 LZOS triplet.



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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5601099 - 01/02/13 11:36 AM

James using the APM 6" f/8 Chinese ED Doublet. Kindly note that the dew shield is not extended in this photo



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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Richard Low]
      #5601140 - 01/02/13 12:08 PM

An even more interesting test would be a comparison between the APM/LZOS 6" f/8 doublet and the new APM ED 6" f/8 doublet. The LZOS doublet is much more expensive, but is there a difference?


Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Astrojensen]
      #5601187 - 01/02/13 12:39 PM

Richard, James,

Thank you for taking the time to conduct these tests and share your results. It's very useful to the entire community.

The results seem to match what was expected, the softness in the image coming from the red defocus as seen in the graphs. Related to that, everyone should commend Markus for all the effort he has put in, and for being forthcoming with showing all the design details for everyone to see. Good job Markus! It would be nice if all manufacturers did this.

It didn't sound like you had a lot of time to conduct the testing and I only saw a brief mention of the moon. Did you have a chance to compare images on the moon? Was the softness in the image still present (or more/less obvious)?

Thank you again,


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
      #5601240 - 01/02/13 01:12 PM

Quote:

I'd love to hear how the view through an 8" SCT with a very good Star Test and which is well collimated, compares directly with this APM 150 ED APO, with respect to the amount of details visible on Jupiter!






Thanks James for the great report.
I would also be interested in comparing the APM 152mm ED APO to a good 8" SCT.


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Saied Mabrouk
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Saied Mabrouk]
      #5601256 - 01/02/13 01:23 PM

Thanks again James, Richard and all for your comments for making this a great thread.
It looks like the year 2013 will be the year of Chinese made 6" (152 mm or 150mm) ED and APO scopes.
I just came across a Skywatcher on Astronomics website called "Quantum 150ED APO 150mm f/7 ED triplet" using FPL-53 glass with carbon fiber tube priced at $6,999.
I wonder if others 6" Chinese ED APOs will appear under different names and sold by different vendors.

I just found the Quantum 150mm F/7 triplet on OPT website and is in stock for $6,995. It is possible other vendors would have it as well.


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Saied Mabrouk]
      #5601620 - 01/02/13 05:18 PM

Thanks both of you for this report. Much appreciated indeed.

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Saied Mabrouk]
      #5602404 - 01/03/13 06:11 AM Attachment (105 downloads)

Quote:

Quote:

I'd love to hear how the view through an 8" SCT with a very good Star Test and which is well collimated, compares directly with this APM 150 ED APO, with respect to the amount of details visible on Jupiter!






Thanks James for the great report.
I would also be interested in comparing the APM 152mm ED APO to a good 8" SCT.




Hi All....

Already spoken to my astronomy friends, and this coming weekend, which is two more days from now, going to do another shoot out at one of my friend's house, whereby he will use his 8" edge HD.

And to make things a little interesting this time, we will use his DBK 31AU03 AS camera to shoot the Jupiter..., and you can see how he reproduce the following photo with his Orion 100 F9 ED using this camera....

Regards

James Ling

Edited by James Ling (01/03/13 06:12 AM)


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5602553 - 01/03/13 08:55 AM

James and Richard - I appreciate the time both of you took to provide us with not only the results of the testing, but also the photos of two great looking scopes. Thanks guys and keep the reports coming!

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Scott Beith]
      #5603101 - 01/03/13 02:15 PM

This comparison was between a $4,000 2-element ED APO and an $11,761 3-element triplet.

I think the 152 ED will trounce the 8" SCT.

A much better comparison would be the ED152 against a TEC140 ($4k vs $5.5k).


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: SteveG]
      #5603390 - 01/03/13 05:12 PM

I agree, comparing the APM 152mm ED F/8 with the TEC 140mm F/7 would also be instructive as they are close in price.
But I am not sure that the 152mm ED doublet will "trounce the 8" SCT".


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Saied Mabrouk]
      #5603497 - 01/03/13 06:36 PM

I would also agree that it's not a foregone conclusion if it is a C8 Edge. Recent Celestron's have been showing very well and even among those there are are exceptional ones. I would not write any recent C8 (Edge or not...) off before hand.

On another note, I mentioned this in the other thread (on color correction).

James, do you have access to a prism diagonal? Especially a quality one, or at least equivalent to the mirror diagonal you will be using?

As I mentioned there, Valery made a comment that a prism would improve the red correction and worsen the blue. It would be a good test to see if there is an effect.

Clear skies,


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Saied Mabrouk
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Gord]
      #5603644 - 01/03/13 08:14 PM

Regarding the prism diagonal, some claim that the Celestron prisms made from BK7 glass does help the Red color correction more than the amount it worsens the blue in ED refractors.
I think it would be worthwhile to try the BK7 prism with the APM 152mm ED.
The 1.25" celestron BK7 prism diagonal is readily available.


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Bill Barlow
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: SteveG]
      #5603649 - 01/03/13 08:16 PM

Or even a comparison between the APM 152ED and a very good sample of a C9.25 given it's slightly different optical design and primary/secondary mirror f ratios. Much larger apertures than a C8 or C9.25 should outperform the APM 152ED by a larger margin.

Bill


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WarrenS
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: SteveG]
      #5603664 - 01/03/13 08:30 PM

Quote:

This comparison was between a $4,000 2-element ED APO and an $11,761 3-element triplet.

I think the 152 ED will trounce the 8" SCT.

A much better comparison would be the ED152 against a TEC140 ($4k vs $5.5k).




Except adding dovetail, rings, finder, and case to match the 152's standard equipment, the TEC costs around $7000, per TEC's website.


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Richard Low
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Gord]
      #5603908 - 01/03/13 11:48 PM

Quote:


On another note, I mentioned this in the other thread (on color correction).

James, do you have access to a prism diagonal? Especially a quality one, or at least equivalent to the mirror diagonal you will be using?

As I mentioned there, Valery made a comment that a prism would improve the red correction and worsen the blue. It would be a good test to see if there is an effect.





James, if we do get the opportunity to do another round of tests together, I will bring the Zeiss prism diagonal. I usually use this with my APM/LZOS 6" f/8 triplet, but that night I brought AP Maxbright diagonal to match with your APM dielectric diagonal.


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Mark9473
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Richard Low]
      #5604136 - 01/04/13 06:20 AM

What I think I recall from previous discussions is that for a colour shift effect from a prism diagonal, you want the "cheaper" BK7 based diagonals, not the high end ones that are said to use other glass types.

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Astrojensen
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #5604516 - 01/04/13 10:44 AM

There is no need to use anything else than BK7 in a prism star diagonal. I would be surprised if other glass types are used in high-end models.


Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark


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Saied Mabrouk
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Astrojensen]
      #5605811 - 01/05/13 12:07 AM

It was said in this thread that the Zeiss prism diagonal uses a higher RI glass than the BK7 glass.
Irrespective of what the prism glass is, it is a good idea that Richard will bring the Zeiss prism diagonal and hopefully James and Richard can report on how the two refractors perform with the prism diagonal as compared to the dielectric mirror diagonal. It will be a valuable piece of information.
My understanding is that the Zeiss 2" prism is rather heavy and it will help move the OTA center of gravity toward the focuser, a welcome mechanical side effect.


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Jeff B
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5606240 - 01/05/13 10:13 AM

You know, that's an excellent image for a 4" aperture.

Very nice.

Jeff


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Jeff B]
      #5606598 - 01/05/13 01:09 PM Attachment (92 downloads)

Hi Jef and All....

Although visually I have not seen through this Orion 100 ED scope, but from the image sent to me, I think it will be interesting to see whether can we image any difference between his ES127 ED triplet and C8 Edge, and my APM ED APO.

We are supposed to meet up tonight at his place for the 3 scopes shoot out, but due to the poor sky and weather condition, with clouds all over the place...We decided to change to tomorrow night, and hopefully the weather will be like last Tuesday , whereby the seeing condition is good for doing the 2 APM scopes shoot out...

In fact tonight I did my own observing at home, using my Ultima 2000 C8, and I can't even get a clear contrast view of Jupiter above 100X....
But I can still see the moon like star that appears in the same Jupiter view, which on that night of the shoot out between the 2 APM, I told Richard there is one more moon like object added to the 4 moons of Jupiter...
And if we knew is a double star, we would have try to split it that night....

Any way, if tomorrow night shoot out is successful, we can clear some of the interesting topics that has been discussed earlier, such as the contrast between the ES and the APM, as well as edge and the APM, and hopefully testing the prism diagonal, which not sure my friend has one, although I have the celestron erect type of prism diagonal...

Regards

James Ling


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EverlastingSky
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5606711 - 01/05/13 02:14 PM

Really looking forward to this upcoming comparison, should be very interesting to say the least, thanks for doing this!

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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: EverlastingSky]
      #5607787 - 01/06/13 05:40 AM

Hi All...

Is just another one and a half hours away from tonight shoot out at my friend's place......

Although weather is similar like last night, with a layer of clouds covering the whole Eastern sector....
But we will proceed for the meet up, unless the weather is becoming worst....

This time Richard's APM triplet APO will be there, and we will have minimum four scopes for shoot out....

My friend, Alfred has 3 mounts standby at his roof-top, so I just bring my OTA, without my losmandy mount....
Much easier this time......and we will start earlier at 8pm....

Will give a brief update tonight when I am back form the shoot out..

Regards

James Ling


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mblack
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5607855 - 01/06/13 07:54 AM

Excellent James, best of luck with the weather.

I have a question if you don't mind. Could you tell me the measurement between the actual center of balance on the tube (mid rings) and the end of the diagonal?

I'm trying to determine if my portable pier is tall enough for the 152/1200.


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5608204 - 01/06/13 12:04 PM

Hi David....

I have just returned home from my friend's house, and took this measurement for you....

The measurement from the center of balance to the diagonal is around 75CM....(focused)

Regards

James Ling


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5608218 - 01/06/13 12:11 PM Attachment (110 downloads)

Hi All....

Tonight weather is not good , with plenty of clouds covering the viewing sector that Jupiter rises....

As Gary and Clifford already arrived at Alfred home, I also proceed , and then follow by Richard....

The viewing deck is at the roof top, and we managed to set up the ES 127 triplet and the APM ED APO.....

This is the photo taken after the 2 scopes are setup....

Regards

James Ling


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5608230 - 01/06/13 12:16 PM Attachment (106 downloads)

Hi All....

Although jupiter is not vey bright , with layer of clouds covering it occasionally, but we still able to get some clear views when jupiter is visible...

This photo showing me doing the visual viewing of Jupiter through the APM ED APO....

Regards

James Ling


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5608236 - 01/06/13 12:18 PM Attachment (93 downloads)

Hi All...

Here is another photo showing me viewing through the ES 127 triplet.....

Regards

James Ling


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5608336 - 01/06/13 01:06 PM

Hi All....

Tonight, we did not setup the edge C8, as well as the APM triplet, simply due to the weather condition is no good, as compared to last Tuesday night...., as well as the time limitation we have....

We only wanted to re-address the reddish speck of CA that is visible from Jupiter moons as seen on last Tuesday night...

Tonight, due to the weather condition , the magnification we can achieve from both scopes on Jupiter before it starts to breakdown is only around 200X..., on most of the time...

The ES is using a 2X barlow and an 8.8mm ep, giving it 215X,
while the APM ED APO is using the 2X barlow and the baader zoom , but not at 8mm, instead at closer to 12mm..., giving around 200X...

This time, we can confirmed the disc of Jupiter moon is solid, and no more reddish speck of CA is visible from the APM ED APO....

So we know that this APM ED APO will not show the Jupiter moons with reddish speck of CA if it is power below 300..., which is also why I didn't notice it during the 1st outdoor 1st light, as well as tonight, since on both occasions I couldn't push the APM ED APO above 300X...

Richard has brought his set of prism diagonal, but due to the weather condition, and we didn't see the CA on the Jupiter moons surface, after it is being setup, for a brief moment of viewing, it is removed....

As for tonight's comparison made between the 5" ES triplet and the 6" APM ED APO, due to the weather condition, it seems that at 200X for both scopes, the ES has the advantage due to its smaller aperture, as the APM is much brighter....(with around 30% more area)

But on the 1st outdoor shoot out , the ES127 ( not this one ) is also powered to around 200X, but the APM ED APO is powered between 250X to 300X, and there don't seem to have much difference in the contrast detail on Jupiter surface....

I would say tonight is still not conclusive ,as we also didn't have the chance to use the CCD camera that we wanted to....simply we know the weather condition will not give good result....

We will do it another night, perhaps on a Friday night, so that we can have more time , to do the shoot out again....

REgards

James Ling


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The Ardent
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5608886 - 01/06/13 05:23 PM

Are you observing with that bright light on?

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Astrojensen
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: The Ardent]
      #5608931 - 01/06/13 05:42 PM

When observing planets, that amount of light doesn't harm observations. I often observe the planets with my outdoor lights on. Makes things a lot easier.


Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark


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idealistic
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Astrojensen]
      #5609142 - 01/06/13 07:59 PM

Ive found that observing Jupiter with that amount of ambient light is actually beneficial. Youre better off not getting dark adapted. My best views of Jupiter have been in daylight, at dawn.

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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: The Ardent]
      #5609672 - 01/07/13 06:30 AM

Quote:

Are you observing with that bright light on?




Hi Ray..

Sorry for the late reply, as after my last posting, I went to sleep for about 4 hours then woke up and set off to work oversea...

As now is evening time , in this country, then I can have some time to do posting in the forum before leaving home from my workplace...

What you have seen from the photo is also partly for photo taking purpose, although we can still see Jupiter under this type of lighting condition....

My friend has 2 sets of lighting....
One is the red type , and this is the normal white / warm light type....

But we still prefer to switch off all the lights at the roof top, and enjoy the night sky.....

I found this place , very ideal to do both visual and photo for astronomy although is not very dark, due to surrounding street lamps...

Will plan more future scope testing here at my friend's roof top....whenever I have the time....

Regards

James Ling


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Live_Steam_Mad
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Reged: 07/24/07

Loc: Moss Bank, St.Helens, England
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5613945 - 01/09/13 03:42 PM

Last night I got my first ever show transit on Jupiter (of Io in this case) through my local friend Jon H's LX90 8" ACF. The shadow of Io was a pretty black very good contrast spot against the disc of Jupiter, very easy to see, and with detail within the cloud bands, very pleasing.

Even at only 250x with my 8mm Radian that we were using I could see fairly easily that the collimation was slightly off. I can't get up the confidence to go messing with the collimation yet (and it's not my scope, I just align it and set it all up for him - Jon is 91).

I am starting to find the standing up all the time to be rather tiring and not very satisfactory ('scope is at lowest tripod setting, and is on a 4" tall tri-legged scope trolley from JMI), I think it's about time we got an observing chair which goes high enough to see from LOL.

When I'm using my 4" Meade SN102 it's very comfortable since I'm sitting down all the time on a chair or on a 6" tall padded step stool.

Also I note that the views of large clusters like M45, M44 are spectacular, but narrow field (can't see the whole cluster at once) which really annoys me, compared to the 4"
Meade SN102 that I have where I see the whole of M45 and a whole lot more besides with the same 32mm Plossl ep.

Thus it has become obvious to me that we could really make darn good use of a TeleVue 55mm Plossl and a Baader 2" Erecting prism and get the whole of M45 in the field of view, plus it being the correct way round LOL.

Anyway I wondered how much detail I would see on Jupiter in comparison to the 6" semi Apo? I'd be interested to hear the result of your 'scope shoot-out.

BTW Jupiter had a red tinge on the left edge and a blue tinge on the right edge of the disc through the 8" ACF when it was at maybe 40 degrees altitude.

Also I noted that the view through my 32mm TV Plossl was only sharp out to 90 per cent with the ACF 8" (I tested using the shadow of Io on the disc of Jupiter).

Finally, the Star Test on this 'scope is pretty good but not perfect. But then the prism diagonal which we are using may be showing some Spherical over correction (so I read) so I'm going to re-test using my visual back and star diagonal from my SN102 (which is definitely a mirror one, I stuck my finger though it to test!) and see what I get on Jon's 8" ACF. I can tell that Jon's diagonal is a prism type since I could see what I believe was the prism top surface when I shone a very bright light down into the diagonal.

Cheers,

Alistair G.


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
      #5614950 - 01/10/13 06:53 AM

Alistair G.

Nice report.....

Yes, this coming Saturday weekend, which is again depending on weather condition, a few of my friends are going to gather at the same house roofing to try our scope to scope shootout....

Alfred will line up both his C8 edge HD and the 8RC for the shootout against the APM ED APO....

Of course we may have other scopes available for the shootout, but we only intend to do a 3 to 4 hours, starting from 6.30pm till 10.30pm....

I really hoipe this weekend the weather turns out good , at least same as the one when both Richard and myself did for the 2 APM shootout...

REgards

James Ling


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nirvanix
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Reged: 06/07/07

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
      #5615284 - 01/10/13 11:14 AM

Hey Alistair, great to hear your friend is still interested in looking at the sky at 91 yrs old

You should take a crack at collimating his scope - don't think it'll be that bad. The red and blue opposing limbs on Jupiter is most likely due to atmospheric refraction. Of course we need our atmosphere, but wouldn't I love a machine that could create a column of still air over my scope.

I love seated astronomy too. It allows me to fully engage my mind at the eyepiece when I'm not worried about balancing on my feet.

I'm enjoying the shootout James and Richard.


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Live_Steam_Mad
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Reged: 07/24/07

Loc: Moss Bank, St.Helens, England
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: nirvanix]
      #5615632 - 01/10/13 02:22 PM

Quote:

Hey Alistair, great to hear your friend is still interested in looking at the sky at 91 yrs old

You should take a crack at collimating his scope - don't think it'll be that bad. The red and blue opposing limbs on Jupiter is most likely due to atmospheric refraction. Of course we need our atmosphere, but wouldn't I love a machine that could create a column of still air over my scope.

I love seated astronomy too. It allows me to fully engage my mind at the eyepiece when I'm not worried about balancing on my feet.

I'm enjoying the shootout James and Richard.




Jon (the soon to be 92 year old) ironically sees better than me in some respects - he has had his fluid in his eyeballs replaced with synthetic fluid, and his eye lenses replaced with artificial plastic rigid lenses. So although he has NO accomodation at all for focussing in his eye, he doesn't wear glasses whilst observing and always sees pinpoints in his 32mm Relevation or my 32mm TeleVue Plossl, even with a 4mm exit pupil in the Meade SN102 (100mm aperture divided by 24x magnification) (or with a smaller exit pupil on the LX90) on M45 for example.

However the odd thing is that he could not see the Polar Cap on Mars in very good seeing when Mars was at it's last Opposition through the 8mm Radian in the 8" LX90 at 250x, even though it was quite obvious to me. He could only just about see the dark markings on the surface of Mars though, which however were also fairly easy to see I thought when I looked.

Some of this may be down to Jon having 1.00 Diopter of astig. in his left (observing) eye. Which is odd, I don't understand how you can have astig. in a supposedly perfect replacement plastic lens? Any Opthalmic Opticians out there care to inform me as to why?

I am 38 but unfortunately I have severe Astigmatism (3.0 Diopters ) in my observing (right) eye, which has probably gone worse again now 3 years after my last eye test. Although I still have sharper eyesight with my glasses on than all of my friends and family. My left eye is 3.5 Diopters of Astig.!

As a result of my astig. I see distinct crosses on nearly every star in the FOV of the 32mm TV Plossl when I have my glasses on! That sucks. It's not the ep's fault though, it's my eyes. TV ep's are 100 per cent quality controlled (they have a guy who tests them individually, I know from an article where they visited the "factory" in NY).

Jon doesn't like the cold one bit, so he wants to get a camera that can image faint objects (so forget webcams unless you can do intricate soldering to surface mount components, and forget D-SLR's with Live View that have no control over shutter in this mode so can only image planets and the Moon, I know since I asked several owners of them) and that can be used remotely (so Jon can stay in the warm house) and where Jon can have a "live" view. So basically I told him there's only really one game in town - Mallincam.

So I told him it's a 100 USD non-refundable deposit, a 6 week wait, and 1499 USD (approx 960 GBP, 1160 GBP when you add VAT at 20 per cent and Clearance Fee and postage) and can only be ordered from Jack's Astro, so import only, to get a 0.5 Megapixel camera, 20x more blurred than his own Sony T500 camera! I like the pictures I see on NightSkiesNetwork but I don't like the pixellated blocky stars...

I also let him know about the new Mallincam Universe camera with 6MP that can have a very long (999 minutes I think it was) integration time just like mallincam and remote control and live view etc. which is a bit more money. Astrogate (Chris in Canada) on NSN apparently has one (so I was told) so we're just waiting until we see it on NSN being used "Live" and then he'll probably buy one.

Personally though I'm almost dreading it in some ways as muggins here will have to set it up and be out in the cold whilst he gets to enjoy the pictures indoors in the warm. I am a visual astronomer (eyeball only), I'm not keen on cameras, I want to see the objects with my own eyes. However seeing those nebulas and galaxies with a UHC filter even from here with the light polluted mag. 4.8 ish skies is an interesting thought.

BTW here are the skies I am dealing with where I live (about 1 mile or so from Jon's, he is in Billinge, St.Helens, and I am in Hillbrae Avenue, St.Helens, England) ;-

https://picasaweb.google.com/101932667412801910198/LightPollutionFromStHelens...

...which reminds me, why does no one mention the Elephant-In-The-Room (the horrendous light pollution) on StarGazing Live (that's on tonight) or Sky At Night?! BTW to catch these shows, check out http://thebox.bz

Cheers,

Alistair G.

Edited by Live_Steam_Mad (01/10/13 02:36 PM)


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Live_Steam_Mad
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Reged: 07/24/07

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5616144 - 01/10/13 07:43 PM

Quote:

Alistair G.

Nice report.....

Yes, this coming Saturday weekend, which is again depending on weather condition, a few of my friends are going to gather at the same house roofing to try our scope to scope shootout....

Alfred will line up both his C8 edge HD and the 8RC for the shootout against the APM ED APO....

Of course we may have other scopes available for the shootout, but we only intend to do a 3 to 4 hours, starting from 6.30pm till 10.30pm....

I really hoipe this weekend the weather turns out good , at least same as the one when both Richard and myself did for the 2 APM shootout...

REgards

James Ling




Here is a picture of our setup, in fact Jupiter observing has only been possible for the last 3 1/2 weeks (it was cloudy for 3 of them though!) since it took me 18 months after Jon bought the 'scope to persuade him to buy the Single Channel Dual Output Hitec Astro dew heater controller and the 8" Dew Not heater strip (which is just a tad too short in actual heating section but still goes around the corrector end of the tube just fine LOL), so for 3 out of 4 nights the optics on the LX90 were fogged over in the last 18 months, during which time I went up to his house maybe 15 times or more, otherwise I would have been up there more often.

And then the darn thing still fogged over the last night but one that I was there, because I didn't realise you need a Dew Shield as well on really bad nights for dew (90+ per cent Relative Humidity), and we get bad nights fairly often unfortunately.

I tried talking Jon into buying a commercial flexible dew shield but was unable to, so I went to the local Tesco supermarket and got a Lenor brand fabric softner cardboard box for free, and held it in place with Jon's belt (!). Here are some pictures of the "Lenor" (LOL) Dew Shield and the 8" LX90 ;-

https://picasaweb.google.com/101932667412801910198/JonHuddartS8LX90BillingeUK...

It uses a trouser belt with an extra hole punched into it to hold the Dew Shield on. Getting it on and off is, perhaps suprisingly, a one man operation, I found. Yes it's me (muggins LOL) who does the setup of the dew shield and the alignment LOL...

Even in 97 per cent humidity with thick fog on Martindale Road down the hill (as I found when I drove there and also when I drove home again), it is still dew / fog free on the optics, when the Dew Not dew heater is on full power.

Even though the cardboard is quite damp afterwards, it's
still intact well enough, and after a day's drying out indoors in a warm place, should be fine again for another night. I'd say that's a total success, for almost no cost.

We run separate power for dew heater to prevent switching spikes and damage to the 'scope electronics. Everything is on mains power at the moment. Anti Cord Wrap is turned ON.

Apparently the 2500mAh NiMH D cells that you can buy and put into the fork arms of the LX90 stay working fine for a couple of nights of use. That is also the case with the Duracell 2000mAh "Stay Charged" AA cells that I use in the SN102, great cells. I use the Vapex 1/2 hour charger WITH auto FAN cooling for the AA cells.

I just got told that "Park Scope" is what I should be leaving it in when we've finished observing (not Sleep scope as I was doing), and you then switch off the 'scope and remove the handset and take the handset indoors to stop the LCD display from going blank (still illuminated red, just nothing on it) like it does sometimes when you come to switch it on in very cold conditions (after it's been stored outside under a cover, with handset still attached like Jon's was), so I was told. Although I never had that blanking happen on the AudioStar on my SN102 but it's stored indoors. All you have to do when you want to observe again is then reconnect the handset and then switch the LX90 on again and it's already remembered it's alignment, which is very nice, and it gets the date / time / location from it's GPS.

BTW the AudioStar handset from our 6 month old SN102's (both of us have one) works great with the LX90 as long as you choose Telescope Type as LX90 8" not StarNavigator 102, and do a "Callibrate Motors", Goto's and tracking were just fine after an "easy" alignment using True North (Polaris) and levelling of the tube with the bubble level / compass thingy and a 2 star alignment (I always make sure the top of the tripod (i.e. top of the fork arm base) is level first, if the 'scope has been moved).

Jon ruined the original #497 AutoStar handset to a fair extent by breaking the little red translucent cover off the top of the handset (how the heck he did that I don't know, maybe he dropped it) and then there was heavy rain and he said over the phone that there was water literally pouring out of the handset (not my doing). However when dried out it worked OK, just that the right hand segment ("bulge") of LCD illuminator didn't work, only the left hand one, but we could still read the display OK, Oh yeah and the map reading illuminator was dead as well, but the 'scope still was able to work fine.

Anyway when we wanted to see the shadow transit of Io the other night, when we came to switch on, the LCD display was completely blank on the AutoStar handset. Red colored, i.e. lit up. But blank.

So I tried swapping the cord (handset to 'scope) end for end, which didn't help.
Then gave up. Now the handset is drying out indoors (only been in dew this time, not actually rain, since cover was on).

Maybe the handset will work again when it's dried out. Thanks goodness we have 2 "backup handsets"!

Can't wait to hear how it turns out with the 'scope shootout 6" semi-Apo versus 8" with large Central Obstruction (34 per cent in our case I seem to remember on the 8" ACF) but well collimated in your case, hopefully! Should be rather interesting!

Cheers,

Alistair G.

Edited by Live_Steam_Mad (01/12/13 02:13 PM)


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
      #5618454 - 01/12/13 04:31 AM Attachment (71 downloads)

Alistair G.

After reading your post, then I realized how lucky I am living at equatorial region ( 1 deg N ), without facing those problems... except dew after midnight....
Hope your handset is alright after drying it again....

Hi ALL...

As now is 2 hours away from tonight's shootout.
The weather seems getting better as this morning is really bad.....
And Alfred already started to setup the C8 edge HD and the 8RC, while another mount is also ready for me, just to bring along my 152 APM ED APO and mounted onto it....

Attached photo shows 3 scopes are all ready, with the 10" Meade on standby ......and all these are not Alfred's only collection, as the C11 edge is not being displayed...in this photo...

Regards

James Ling


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mblack
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5618549 - 01/12/13 07:48 AM

Hi James,

Interested in how this comparison comes off, as many of us on CloudyNights have viewed through excellent samples of Meade and Celestron catadioptric scopes.

Best of luck with those pesky clouds :>


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Live_Steam_Mad
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5619193 - 01/12/13 02:37 PM

Quote:

Alistair G.

After reading your post, then I realized how lucky I am living at equatorial region ( 1 deg N ), without facing those problems... except dew after midnight....
Hope your handset is alright after drying it again....

Hi ALL...

As now is 2 hours away from tonight's shootout.
The weather seems getting better as this morning is really bad.....
And Alfred already started to setup the C8 edge HD and the 8RC, while another mount is also ready for me, just to bring along my 152 APM ED APO and mounted onto it....

Attached photo shows 3 scopes are all ready, with the 10" Meade on standby ......and all these are not Alfred's only collection, as the C11 edge is not being displayed...in this photo...

Regards

James Ling




Wow look at all those lovely CAT's . I have a StarBright (non-XLT, non-edge) C11 with a "perfect" Star Test that I bought from a bloke in Skelmersdale a few miles North of here a while ago (he was changing to a fork mounted C11) but I ran out of money a while back to be able to supply it with a mount (!). And now I am a peasant (poor) LOL.

The C11 OTA is fairly lightweight for what it is (27 pounds if I remember right,about 12Kg), but it's still a bit heavy for lifting to chest height to put it on an e.g. EQ6. I also just saw the size of the EQ6 in the Stargazing Live BBC programme the other night and found it rather intimidating.

Can you get away with putting a C11 on a HEQ5 successfully and have damping times of just about 2 seconds or so? If so I'll buy one when I get some money together.

One day I'll also get up the confidence to take the cast iron 15 pound iron disc out of my Meade 7" Mak OTA (ex-LX50, removed from the fork mount) that I got for peanuts (100 quid / GBP) and put it on a maybe HEQ5, it feels heavier to lift than the C11 at the moment.

Forgot to mention, in those pictures above that I posted you can also see the muck on Jon's 8" LX90 corrector plate (from it being left outdoors permanently, albeit under a cover) and the muck on the primary .

PLUS this horrendous blue clouding, looking like mould! , which was only on the primary, which seemed to be caused by humid air inside the tube, which seemed to
appear after about 3/4 hour and then dissipate slowly later on. I had never noticed that blue clouding on the primary before.

At least the images through the 'scope seem to be unaffected though.

This muck and water marks were due to Jon not having any anti-dew equipment and thus evey time we went to put the covers back on the darn optics were covered in dew and we didn't want to put the end cap on to cover the corrector and then have mold growing in there, but there is dirt all over the primary and corrector, nevertheless. If only Jon had listened to me about the dew shield / heater 18 months ago, we could have had clean optics all the time...

Oh yes and the finder objective and finder eyepiece were filthy (and fogged over to boot). So I cleaned them and then they fogged over 3 more times during our observing session, which was a pity (I just got curious to look through the finder now and again to assess the quality of the finder, something I had not bothered to do before, and noticed that the finder has gross astigmatism, the oval pattern didn't rotate with my head. Which is bad).

From memory it's an Antares right angle finder. It's an illuminated one with double crosshairs and box in the centre (which is VERY useful). I would actually have preferred a straight though illuminated finder, but Jon has neck pains...but then again it's muggins here that aligns it for him, always. He can't seem to get around to figuring out how to. Well, he's to be excused since he is nearly 92.

Can't wait to hear the results of the CAT's (more light, enhances human visual accuity of the features within the belts on Jupiter) versus the 6" semi-Apo (sharper, more jewel like images, no annoying central obstruction). Very interesting comparison since so many people have 8" SCT's.

Cheers,

Alistair G.

Edited by Live_Steam_Mad (01/12/13 02:44 PM)


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5620130 - 01/13/13 02:15 AM Attachment (70 downloads)

Quote:

Hi James,

Interested in how this comparison comes off, as many of us on CloudyNights have viewed through excellent samples of Meade and Celestron catadioptric scopes.

Best of luck with those pesky clouds :>




Hi David, Alistair G. and All....

Last night we really have no luck again, and is even worst than previous weekend...
Around 6pm, thick clouds are all over the whole place, and it starts to rain... and by around 8pm, since the rain has not stopped, so we decided to call off the meet up for the 3 scopes shoot out.....

After 10pm, as the clouds start clearing, I can only use my own scopes and do a simple setup at home, using my C8 Ultima 2000 and the 152 APM ED APO....

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5620158 - 01/13/13 03:15 AM Attachment (128 downloads)

Hi All....

Although I do not consider this C8 Ultima 2000 and 152 APM ED APO, as a shoot out, but I think is worth to mention here my comments with regards to my 2 personal scopes...

1. The C8 Ultima 2000 is manufactured before year 2000, and has only starbright coating unlike the newer one which is XLT coating....

2. The collimation is not perfect, as I tested it last night at Aldebaran at 250X. The concentric rings is still not adjusted until I have 3 full equally spaced rings, but at least is not slew to one side....

3. The cool weather after the early rain, gives a very calm atmosphere although Jupiter is not shining as bright as the night, the 2 APM scopes did the shoot out....

4. As I need Jupiter to be in the Western side, which my 2 setup are pointing to, I waited until almost 12am midnight, then I can comfortably have Jupiter to come into view....

5. The C8 Ultima 2000, is the first to view Jupiter, and with enough cooling time, I only managed to get the best view before image breakdown , using 12.5mm plossl,around 160X...
The surface contrast of Jupiter is not very crisp and lack of details , as compared to the previous weekend view , on both the 5" triplet and 6" ED APO...when the seeing condition is very bad...
The moons of Jupiter, cannot be focused as a round disc, and maybe this is due to the scope still not in collimation...

6. Before I can view Jupiter through the APM ED APO, I thought I am going to be disappointed tonight...
But once Jupiter is spotted from the APM ED APO, the image is much better than last weekend, and I have no problem to power up to 200X, using the 2X barlow and baader zoom at 12mm...
I even drop in my 6mm Vixen LV ep, and the contrast is really sharp and well defined....
The moons of Jupiter are resolved as full disc with no CA spotted at the edges...
I tried to crank the power to 300X, but the image seems to breakdown slightly....

7. Since I have plenty of time, I took out my Canon 550D, and with a 5X barlow, I shot this photo of Jupiter,.....

REgards

James Ling


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5620165 - 01/13/13 03:43 AM

Hi ALL...

8. After I have taken the Jupiter shot through the APM ED APO, I went over to the C8 Ultima 2000 again, and wanted to see how does M42 appears in the scope tonight....
My main focus is zooming at the trapezium stars and the gas clouds surrounding it.....
And the Ultima 2000, with its big aperture, is showing very thick gas clouds , but the trapezium stars although are visible, are not very sharp in contrast...,

9. Once M42, is visible in APM scope view, I look through, and is not difficult to determine the differences....
The trapezium stars are easily focused....and the background view is very nice....
But the gas clouds is not able to compare to the Ultima 2000 rich and thick layers....and this is due to the smaller and lesser light gathering aperture....

10. Lastly with the past few occasions of using the APM ED APO, the best view is still on the night , when it confronts the APM triplet....
It is also the only time that the APM ED APO has went beyond 300X, and still the view is great, and rivals what I have been seeing now even at 200X or 250X....
The only things that I did not understand fully is why the moons of Jupiter is showing the CA on that night, but now it did not happen again....Perhaps is brightness and high power?
As the real shoot out against the other 2 8" SCT, is not carried out, will try to do that in another weekend ...and hopefully the weather does not play hide and seek with us again...

Regards

James Ling....


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Saied Mabrouk
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5623432 - 01/14/13 09:07 PM

Thanks James. Your effort is greatly appreciated.

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Live_Steam_Mad
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Reged: 07/24/07

Loc: Moss Bank, St.Helens, England
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Saied Mabrouk]
      #5623797 - 01/15/13 03:48 AM

Well a couple of nights ago I tried the "Park Scope" that someone had told me about (that I mentioned previously) for use on the LX90. I tried it on my Meade SN102 and it worked great i.e. after I parked it (using Utilities / Park Scope) then powered it off (red light goes out) and unplugged the handbox cable, then waited 5 seconds, then plugged back in the handbox cable, then powered the scope back on again, it remembered the previous alignment and GOTO worked fine, without needing to re-align on anything.

So I went up to Jon's house last night and tried Park Scope on his 8" LX90 and it worked in exactly the same way as above. And I could by doing this swap between AutoStar and AudioStar handsets with ease, depending on preference! Very cool.

And yehay his AutoStar worked fine again once it had dried out for a week. Excellent. Thank goodness.

And I got a great view of the shadow transit of Europa and the GRS in view all at the same time, plus a splotch of cloud which was a definite blue, on the left, on the top belt, to the top left of the GRS, great stuff. And I am getting up the confidence to tweak the collimation but I'll try that when it gets a bit warmer (it was -1C last night). The central obstruction is still slightly above centre in the diffraction rings when out of focus at 250x.

I did another Star Test on Polaris and this time I can see that the inner and outer rings are both slightly brighter on one side of focus than on the other. Must try swapping for the mirror diagonal plus visual back instead of just an SCT prism diagonal to see if it alters the Spherical Aberration.

Will be waiting to hear about your tests on Jupiter with 8" Edge, and normal SCT's versus the 6" semi apo / apo, when you have better weather. Very interesting.

Cheers,

Alistair G.

Edited by Live_Steam_Mad (01/15/13 03:51 AM)


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
      #5623874 - 01/15/13 06:45 AM

Hi Saied Mabrouk.

Thanks for your comment....

Hi Alistair G.

Great to hear that the handset is fine after drying it....
Also nice to hear you are able to enjoy the great view of Jupiter with its GRS and transit of Europa...with the type of cold weather.....

Hi All...

Although the 152 APM ED APO is just an ED APO, but I really want to see how well it performs against those scopes that I can get them to do the shootout....

This coming weekend, Saturday, we are going to attempt another shootout with the 2 8" SCT.....

If the APM ED APO performs well, we may do more shoot out with the 10" Meade , 11" edge , or even my 10" Mewlon...
But again, we are all referring to planetary shoot out....

As for me, I just want to take another decent single photo of Jupiter with the GRS, with my DSLR, without processing it....which is the one I've posted last weekend....when the weather permits....

Regards

James Ling


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Live_Steam_Mad
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5624324 - 01/15/13 12:40 PM

Quote:


Great to hear that the handset is fine after drying it....
Also nice to hear you are able to enjoy the great view of Jupiter with its GRS and transit of Europa...with the type of cold weather.....





BTW One thing that bugs me about the LX90 ACF ;-

I use my friend Jon H's LX90 8" ACF at the moment for when I like to use a larger 'scope. His is stored outside. In future I plan on getting an 8" LX90 ACF myself but I want to be able for it to be taken indoors, because of security concerns, and I am worried about the cool down issue.

Also, I want to be able to be take it to observing evenings and again cool down is an issue.

Two questions come immediately to mind ;-

1) When is Meade going to fit a fan to the LX90 OTA like their competitor offers! You know what, I think I'll write to Meade by email and tell them about this. If enough of us write a short message about this to Meade, maybe they'll make the change EDIT: OK I just sent 2 mails about this, one to Meade's Shopatron website contact address, and one to Telescope House (BCF), the UK importer for Meade, asking them to pass on the request. Since Meade is quite difficult to contact if you are in UK.

2) For those that have an 8" ACF, how long does the cool down take on the it, i.e. until the Star Test is very good, from the 'scope being indoors at 18C / 64F approx., going into outdoors temperatures of 1 or 2 C / 34 to 36 F, for the worst case scenario of winter observing?

I hate that the Celestron "equivalent" (well sort of, but more upmarket)(CPC 800 HD deluxe) is almost DOUBLE the price. I also hate it that the CPC 800 HD Del. is 20Kg (44 Lbs) instead of the 33 lbs (15Kg) of the LX90 8" ACF OTA + fork arms + base. Have to admit I'm not overly keen on equatorial mounts and balancing and counterweights. Hence the want of a Alt Az mount. If only quality larger refractors were available with Alt Az mounts!

If Meade put a fan in the 8" LX90, or if Celestron brought out a CPC 800HD with the LX90's weight, I'd buy one right now.

Hope that the 8" SCT's are cooled (i.e. are showing a very good Star Test at 250x) before the testing on Jupiter's details LOL. Can't wait for the comparo.

Cheers,

Alistair G.

Edited by Live_Steam_Mad (01/15/13 01:05 PM)


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Live_Steam_Mad
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
      #5624548 - 01/15/13 02:35 PM

Oh Dear

I just got a reply from Meade (that was a surprise!) which reads ;-

"There are no announced plans to include a fan on any 8" model, as cool down time on scopes of this size doesn't require their use.

Please contact your UK retailer or Meade Customer Service at US 949-451-1450 for further information; department hours are 7am to 5pm Pacific Time Monday through Friday.

Best Regards,

John Piper
Manager, E-Commerce
Meade Instruments Corp."

Sorry but I don't agree with his views. I want the OTA to cool quickly (within 40 minutes) like you can do with the Lymax Cat cooler on a standard SCT of 9.25", for example, from what I read. Otherwise from what I read I would be
waiting 1 1/2 hours for it to cool. Not good if I want a 30 minute look at Jupiter after bringing it outdoors and then a 10 to 15 minute alignment / tripod levelling...

And if a fan is not needed, why the heck does Celestron sell an OTA which has one built in?!

PS I also found this interesting topic about putting a fan in an LX90 and why you would need it ;-

http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/1,2,3,4,5,8,9,10/Numb...

PS I just replied to the sales person above from Meade, letting them know that they are wrong about the cooling issue, and telling them how long an ACF SCT would take to cool (from what I read) compared to if there was a fan in it that you could run AS AN OPTION.

Cheers,

Alistair G.

Edited by Live_Steam_Mad (01/15/13 03:10 PM)


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XyrcesFenol
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
      #5624638 - 01/15/13 03:23 PM

Maybe it is time to return this thread about APM 152 ED APO to the original topic, it is a really interesting scope.

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: XyrcesFenol]
      #5625132 - 01/15/13 08:29 PM Attachment (94 downloads)

Hi ALL....

Yes... As the 2nd 152 APM ED APO is still not heard much at all, and may only be in March....

I hope I can do more scope to scope shoot out, which I wanted to do one , if possible , before someone else receives their " previous " one......

And that is the one in this photo, has has five open oval holes towards the front of the len cell, which is very effective for cooling, as compared to closed tube....

Regards

James Ling


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chboss
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5627377 - 01/17/13 02:50 AM

James, why compare your ED Apo to SCT's ,which have a completely different aperture and focal length?

I think a comparison to other 6" APO's would make more sense and give a real measure of this scope's performance.

best regards
Chris


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: chboss]
      #5627475 - 01/17/13 05:59 AM

Hi Chris...

I can understand your suggestion , which may also be the same as many other CN members, on the comparison be made against another 6" APO...., sounds logical....

Unfortunately, in my country, there are many people using 5" or smaller triplets APO, and as of what I know , for the 6" APO, one is my friend, Richard, which has the APM 6" triplet APO....

Perhaps I need to ask around, and if there is someone who has one, and willing to do this shoot out, with me, then that will be great....

Regards

James Ling


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chboss
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5627544 - 01/17/13 07:34 AM

Yes I was thinking about Richards APM 152.... I met him about two years ago when staying in Singapore for a few days. Unfortunately there was no time for some stargazing.

Keep the comparison and test results coming I will follow your progress.

best regards
Chris


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: chboss]
      #5643596 - 01/25/13 11:48 PM

Quote:

Yes I was thinking about Richards APM 152.... I met him about two years ago when staying in Singapore for a few days. Unfortunately there was no time for some stargazing.

Keep the comparison and test results coming I will follow your progress.

best regards
Chris




Hi Chris and ALL....

Weather has been bad for the past few weeks after the 1st shootout between my friend, Richard's 6" APM triplet APO, and my 152 APM ED APO....

Today, as of now, noon time (GMT +8), the weather is sunny and seems great , with blue skies and some clouds, which if it continues till this evening, Richard and me will be doing the repeat of the shootout for these 2 APM scopes again.....
Tonight full moon also will be great to test the ED APO.....

Hope all goes smooth and some valuable comparison be made between these 2 APM scopes.....

Regards

James Ling


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zjc26138
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5643623 - 01/26/13 12:11 AM

Hope you have clear skies tonight James. Looking forward to your report as aLways.

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dweller25
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Reged: 08/30/07

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: zjc26138]
      #5657510 - 02/02/13 02:04 AM

Any updates James ?

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: dweller25]
      #5657816 - 02/02/13 09:57 AM Attachment (65 downloads)

Hi David , Zach Coldebella and ALL...

Sorry for not able to provide any update of the 2nd shoot out , at this moment......

Last weekend, Richard is out of town, and back quite late , as such we tried to plan for the next day....

But Sunday weather is not promising, as such we did not meet up for the 2nd shoot out....

Today, weather is quite good, but Richard is probably away to Malaysia again, as I could not contact him...

Perhaps I see whether he will be back tomorrow , and arrange the shoot out, if tomorrow's weather is good.

As for my other plans, I have mounted my 10" mewlon onto the top of this 152 APM ED APO, ready for coming side walk......

Regards

James Ling


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t.r.
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5657923 - 02/02/13 11:09 AM

Thats not on a G-11, is it?

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johnnyha
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: t.r.]
      #5658828 - 02/02/13 08:05 PM

Ay yi yi... that looks a bit precarious!

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mblack
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5658866 - 02/02/13 08:27 PM

Quote:

Ay yi yi... that looks a bit precarious!




Yes indeed. Slippage comes to mind, unless those rings on the refractor are torqued down.

James, I am assuming you have this rig secured, because it looks like a disaster in waiting.



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Moonglum
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5658975 - 02/02/13 09:51 PM

Relax, that's just how he stores them...

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johnnyha
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Moonglum]
      #5658977 - 02/02/13 09:52 PM

I can think of better storage solutions...

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: t.r.]
      #5659114 - 02/02/13 11:24 PM Attachment (68 downloads)

Quote:

Thats not on a G-11, is it?




Hi ALL...

Yes... That's my old Celestron G11, upgraded to G2....
And I am using the GM8 LW tripod....

If just one scope , whether is the 152 APM ED APO or the 10" Mewlon, one 22 lbs counterweight is all I need...

But when I piggy back the 10" Mewlon over the top of my APM ED APO's, I need 3 X 22 Lbs counterweights to balance it....

REgards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5659144 - 02/02/13 11:46 PM Attachment (52 downloads)

Quote:

Quote:

Ay yi yi... that looks a bit precarious!




Yes indeed. Slippage comes to mind, unless those rings on the refractor are torqued down.

James, I am assuming you have this rig secured, because it looks like a disaster in waiting.






Hi All....

Yes... It seems not wise to have 2 scopes mounted vertically, but I just going to do tracking but not going for GOTO slew...during the side walk.....
This setup is for visual, not for AP...

Surprisingly, at RA slew, the motor does not stall, instead it stalls under DEC slew...But I have lowered the speed to 500 for the G2 system....

All the preliminary test are done yesterday before I do the actual outdoor coming side walk......

From the photo I mounted the vixen dove tail bar directly over the 2 mounting rings of the APM scope...
Then I secured the losmandy wide dove tail over the vixen dove tail, so that the Mewlon will be secured by the losmandy wide dove tail....

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5659148 - 02/02/13 11:55 PM

AT THE VERY LEAST I think you need another of those little Losmandy saddles...

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: johnnyha]
      #5659149 - 02/02/13 11:55 PM Attachment (55 downloads)

Quote:

I can think of better storage solutions...




Hi Kirk Schmitt , Johnny and ALL...

For the APM, I leave it on the mount, but with bags of silica gels, placed at both ends of the scope....

For the Mewlon, when not in-use, is kept permanently at all times, inside a electronic dry cabinet.....

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5659865 - 02/03/13 12:08 PM

I have been to Singapore ... you definitely need a dry cabinet there. Great Idea!
I must say you do optimize the capability of your mounts.


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Pete-LH]
      #5691698 - 02/20/13 08:26 PM Attachment (56 downloads)

Quote:

I have been to Singapore ... you definitely need a dry cabinet there. Great Idea!
I must say you do optimize the capability of your mounts.




Hi Pete and All...

I welcome you and all CN members to visit our small city island, Singapore....

And if possible can show our simple side walk location to anyone of you , if you have the time, when visiting our city....(attached photo)

Although our city is light polluted and not suitable for DSO observing, (possible for some, at certain darker spots), and this make the refractor , an ideal equipment ....
In this case the 152 APM ED APO really never disappoint anyone viewing through it , especially Jupiter.....

Last Monday side walk , although Jupiter is much smaller than the December one, but at 200X, the APM ED APO really shows very details on the surface of Jupiter and its 4 moons.

And I can assured anyone who has placed the order for the 152 APM ED APO, will not be disappointed with the views form Jupiter, especially when the atmosphere and seeing is good....

But for those who are very concern on CA, perhaps you will need to fork out a few more thousands of dollars to go for the triplet, coz at last Monday night, on the 9 days old moon, there is a very thin layer of greenish-yellow (CA)that is being observed...
Of course , if I compared this to my C6R F8, the amount is like 1/3 or even smaller, definitely less than 50%....
And in my opinion, anyone that has a chromacor or the raycorr (in the near future), will be able to work well with this scope, on further reducing its CA level....

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5691746 - 02/20/13 08:54 PM

Thanks for the report and the invite James! I'd love to get to Singapore one of these days.

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: zjc26138]
      #5692145 - 02/21/13 02:49 AM

Hi Zach Coldebella .....

Thanks.....

And please send me a PM , before you come over....
And I can make some arrangement.....

And is the same to the rest of CN members.....
As Singapore is just 1 deg N above the equatorial.....
It will be hot and wet, but not very cold , like those in the climate regions......

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5692841 - 02/21/13 02:10 PM

Same thin layer of greenish-yellow I see on the moon with my ED120. Not a problem at all, and no where near the CA you see on an achro. I expect a little CA on a $4K 6" APO.

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: SteveG]
      #5693446 - 02/21/13 08:03 PM

Hi Steve....

Yes, my WO88ED doublet also has a very thin layer......

Hi ALL...

This coming weekend, if the weather is good, I will be doing another shootout at my friend's roof top......

This time is a little interesting...., as I am adding my 8" ISTAR , and using my friend's AP900 mount.....in this shootout.....

REgards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5693460 - 02/21/13 08:08 PM

Hi James,

Have you had the chance to compare the APM 152 doublet with the Edge C8 or the C9.25 SCT yet?

Bill


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Bill Barlow]
      #5693519 - 02/21/13 08:38 PM

Hi Bill....

Sorry the very last shootout at my friend's place is not successful, as such tomorrow we are doing another round of shootout....
The delay is simply due to the poor weather, mainly heavy rains during the past few weeks.....

BTW, my friend has 4 equatorial mounts, and two are on fixed pier, at his roof top.....
So there shouldn't be any problem to have his C8 edge put up again....

I just hope that the weather is good when we do the shootout again.....

REgards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5695627 - 02/22/13 08:58 PM

Hi James,

Sounds like a fun night if the weather cooperates for you.

Bill


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Bill Barlow]
      #5696552 - 02/23/13 12:51 PM Attachment (73 downloads)

Hi All....

This is the set up with the 8" Istar Achro, 6" APM ED APO and 8" edge at my friend Alfred's roof top....few hours ago....

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5696723 - 02/23/13 02:30 PM

Very nice!

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5696896 - 02/23/13 04:04 PM

Quote:

Hi All....

This is the set up with the 8" Istar Achro, 6" APM ED APO and 8" edge at my friend Alfred's roof top....few hours ago....

Regards

James Ling




Hi James- I see your friend has three piers, that's a very nice observatory.


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5697141 - 02/23/13 07:17 PM Attachment (39 downloads)

Hi John Scott Beith and David....

Thanks for your comments....

Hi All...

Yes.. My friend just added the 3rd pier recently....
And have his AP900 on this 3rd pier that I just need to bring my 8" Istar there and mounted onto it.....

The AP900 mount is definitely very much stable with a bigger RA and Dec gear, than my G11....

REgards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5697152 - 02/23/13 07:23 PM Attachment (51 downloads)

Hi ALL...

This is another photo of the other 2 piers.....

The C8 edge HD is pointing at the moon....

While behind me, is the APM pointing at Jupiter.....

REgards

James Ling


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Scott BeithAdministrator
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5697155 - 02/23/13 07:27 PM

That is a fantastic setup.

Do you have anything new about the 152? Are you still happy with it?


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Scott Beith]
      #5697207 - 02/23/13 08:02 PM

Hi James,

Glad to see people enjoying themselves observing instead of waiting for the weather to clear (like here)!

Did you have a chance to try a prism diagonal in the new 152 as well? Also, how was the comparison against the C8 Edge? Looking forward to your report!

Clear skies,


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Gord]
      #5697717 - 02/24/13 02:26 AM Attachment (84 downloads)

Hi John Scott Beith, Gord and ALL....

Sorry about not mentioning any result from last night shootout....

Last night really spent too much time, to bring up my 8" Istar and APM ED APO, up to my friend's roof top...
And after assembled and mounted the Istar onto the AP900, is almost 10pm....

Then we setup the other 2 smaller scopes, and coz the position that the APM scope is mounting onto, the view of the 14 days old moon and M42 is blocked by the canopy structure....
As such the APM is only pointing to Jupiter while the other 2 scopes are pointing at the moon, and then to M42.....
And last night Jupiter view through the APM scope is not promising....which may be caused by the hot weather heat, and is quite low ,although the sky is clear over the Western sector....
I could not power up beyond 100X to get sharp, crisp contrast , which I usually have no problem to go beyond 150X for the past few setup....

And the canopy structure is also blocking the view of Jupiter to both the Istar and C8 edge scopes.....

We are too late, to observe Jupiter last night, as it already setting in the West....after night fall....

AS such we plan to do another shootout, leaving my 2 scopes with my friend, and if tonight the weather is good, we will start early around 8pm...
And my friend will set up the 4th tripod mount for the APM, so that all 3 scopes can go for Jupiter first, then follow by M42 and the 15 days old moon....

I just hope tonight , which is another 4 hrs from now, the weather will be like last night, although now is very cloudy.....

REgards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5698254 - 02/24/13 01:18 PM

Thanks for the update James.
I hope the weather improves for you.

Scott...


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Scott Beith]
      #5698381 - 02/24/13 02:32 PM

Yes I hope the weather improves James ... the comparison between the 8 inch catadioptric and the six-inch Chinese doublet should be really interesting... best of luck.

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5698985 - 02/24/13 09:55 PM

Hi John Scott Beith, David and All....

Last night weather is very cloudy that even the full moon is not visible.....
We called off the shootout, and can only be re-arranged on this coming weekend, as both of us are working, especially I am already now in oversea, and be back again this coming weekend....

Hi David....

My friend's 8 inch catadioptric collimation is checked and confirmed well collimated during last Saturday night, and is ready for the shootout with the APM.....

We did a small shootout between the C8 edge against the 8" Istar, and the Istar has proven that it is a scope that performs better than the SCT , when we point both scopes at M42...., in terms of nebula cloud details and the contrast...
Istar picks up star E easily, but the C8 edge couldn't, even I swap the zoom baader ep over.....

REgards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5699060 - 02/24/13 10:48 PM

Thanks again James for all of your reports.

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Scott Beith]
      #5702831 - 02/27/13 02:05 AM

Hi ALL....

Since last week we did not have a successful weekend for the shootout......

As such, for this coming weekend , we are going to do it on Friday night, till early Saturday morning......instead...

And our prime object will be Saturn, instead of Jupiter..
Just hope weather is fine , as I will be rushing back to Singapore for the shootout....., on Friday night....

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5707964 - 03/01/13 11:20 PM Attachment (67 downloads)

Hi ALL.....

This is a brief report comprises 4 scopes that are set-up last night for the shootout at my friend's roof top....

We started late and almost 12 midnight, as I rushed back from oversea, although the weather seems not promising during early evening time...

We have 3 scopes, setup on the 3 permanent piers, the C8 edge, 5" triplet and 8" Istar....

REgards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5707967 - 03/01/13 11:26 PM Attachment (70 downloads)

The 152 APM ED APO is setup over the other side , on a portable tripod......


Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5707976 - 03/01/13 11:29 PM Attachment (68 downloads)

This is another view showing all the 4 scopes setting up at the roof top....

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5707986 - 03/01/13 11:41 PM Attachment (61 downloads)

The first prime target that we go for is the 20 days old moon....

Although the visual view is so bright, but the surface details are so much , that my other astronomy friend Gary shoot this photo shot through his hand phone and sent to me.....


Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5707993 - 03/01/13 11:49 PM Attachment (110 downloads)

The following photos will show the CA level and its surface detail from both the Istar and APM.....................captured by my friend's HTC ONE S hand phone...

1st photo is from the Istar....

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5707999 - 03/02/13 12:02 AM Attachment (119 downloads)

And this photo is taken from the 152 APM ED APO....
Notice the level CA, which is similar amount as per visual...., this time we have plenty of time to test it with a prism diagonal....
And it seems to improve slightly, but is still visible, so I don't think is worth to go for one, as the current visual CA level is just a small amount...

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5708007 - 03/02/13 12:11 AM

As the APM ED APO setup still permits visual viewing of M42, the great orion nebula, unlike the other 3 scopes are blocked by the canopy structure, we wanted to see whether it can pick up star E in a 20 days old moon night, while the Istar has did that last weekend in a 14 days old moon night.....

And it barely picks up star E , while the Istar did it effortlessly during last weekend....

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5708008 - 03/02/13 12:11 AM

Thanks for the report James!

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: zjc26138]
      #5708054 - 03/02/13 01:00 AM Attachment (77 downloads)

Quote:

Thanks for the report James!




Hi Zach Coldebella ...

Thanks...And the following will be what you are expecting...

Hi ALL.....

This is the final visual report that I am going to comment based on last night that all the 4 scopes that are tested at Saturn.....

As Saturn rises after midnight, and we started viewing this gas giant from around 20 deg from the horizontal level...

We are quite surprised all 4 scopes are able to power up to 200X , without image breakdown....with the cassini division and clouds bands clearly seen....

All three of us, are also busy going round and swapping for the scopes, to ensure that the magnification are quite equal...

The 1st comment here I noticed from the edge is that when Saturn is quite low, the image breakdown badly when you increased it beyond 200X, while the rest of the scope will start to breakdown....

We did not have a clear winner in the first hour of viewing, at 200X magnification....

But as Saturn rises more than 70 deg, from the horizontal level, we also start to increase the power to all the 4 scopes....

The APM ED APO has no problem to stay at 300X with my 4mm TMB ep....without image breakdown...
While the rest of the other 3 scopes are also not lagging far behind....

And finally when Saturn is really high up and overhead, I use my 7,5mm ultima ep with a 2X ultima barlow, and at 320X, is really showing Saturn cassini rings and the clouds bands so sharp , dark and distinct...Jupiter colour tone is also very pleasing .....

The C8 edge is able to show the cassini divisions and the clouds bands clearly..., but the image is a bit soft, and the cassini ring is not as dark as in the APM...., and the clouds bands although is dark, but the bands not as distinct as the APM....

The Istar at its best, I tried my 5X TV barlow, with my baader zoom ep , at 24mm, giving me 375X....
The view is still great, but it suffers the same like the C8 edge, in terms of the cassini division and the clouds bands to the APM....(Is lighter)

The 5" APO, surprisingly performs very well against the APM on Jupiter.... But did not outperform the APM when is viewing at Saturn...
The view is sharp and closely matched to the APM, but the colour tone is not as pleasing as I prefer....

One more interesting finding during last night shootout is the dew....
Out of the 4 scopes, only the C8 edge corrector dew up, while the rest didn't, when towards the end of out shootout session...
Only the APM is using the retractable dew shield, while the Istar and 5" APO did not use any dew shield...

Lastly before the end of our session, my friend , Gary took out his bino viewer, and we viewed the moon and Saturn, through the APM ED APO....
(photo shows me using the bino viewer)

And thank you all of you for reading this report....

Regards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5708650 - 03/02/13 11:54 AM

Hi James,

Interesting report using those four telescopes. From what you say, the APM 152 doublet gave the best visual views of Saturn. It doesn't surprise me the the Edge 8 lagged a bit behind with the 35% CO. I have a SV 102ED doublet and it puts up very sharp/detailed visual views of Jupiter and gives my Meade 8" ACF scope a run for it's money around 200x. Thanks again for taking time to do this side-by-side comparison test.

Bill


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Bill Barlow]
      #5709806 - 03/03/13 12:50 AM

Hi Bill....

Thanks for your comments .....

Hi ALL....

This is the utube link that my friend, Gary took during the shootout session:-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KViuu2_o3o

The video shows the close-up views of the 4 scopes, and is only after I viewed through it, then I can confirmed what magnification being used by the scope at Saturn....

1. C8 edge is using a 12.5mm and 2X ultima barlow, giving 320X.....

2. 152 APM ED APO is using a 7.5mm ultima celestron ep and 2.5X TV barlow, giving 400X.....

And as Saturn is still almost 2 months away from opposition, I can imagine the size of Saturn that I am going to see during end end April....

REgards

James Ling


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5709914 - 03/03/13 03:57 AM

Nice video, nice scopes. I love the finish on the Istar. We are fortunate now to have Jupiter and Saturn positioned so well for our viewing pleasure.

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: nirvanix]
      #5711840 - 03/04/13 01:14 AM Attachment (114 downloads)

Hi Richard.. and ALL...

Richard. Thanks for your comment..

ALL. With regards to the Istar tube finish, is just an adhesive delco film that I purchased from a DIY shop, and pasted it over...Just cost me approx usd20 a sheet....( can see much clearer from this photo)

And hopefully time and weather permit more shootout can be carried out during the coming weekends as weather seems to start to improve.

I do want to see and compare the view at Saturn......with both my 152 APM ED APO and 10" Mewlon.....

Regards

James Ling

Edited by James Ling (03/04/13 01:16 AM)


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5807779 - 04/18/13 09:43 PM

Hello James

I've been reading your article with interest, going back to your first images unpacking the refractor...


Does the case come as standard ...or did you order case as an extra?

Also...

I was looking on the APM website for a straight-through finder with illuminator as you had delivered but can't see one ...is the finder an APM product do you know?

Thanks

Mike


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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mikeyscope]
      #5808137 - 04/19/13 05:19 AM

Hi Mike....

Yes... The scope will come with the same case as shown....
The straight through finder with illuminator is also std, and is in sparkle paint finish...

You will receive every item shown in the photos, except the following:-

1. 2" diagonal is optional....

2. you will receive a different type focuser, instead of the one with a shorter focusing that I received, with an add on an extension tube....

As for the test report , I think you have to ask Markus, coz mine is the 2nd sample , so they sent it for the optics testing.....

This scope still has a potential to improve its performance....
Which once I received my CA corrector which I ordered for my Istar, I will test on it and see whether it will work for the APM ED APO...

REgards

James Ling


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mikeyscope
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5808503 - 04/19/13 11:34 AM

James

Thanks for fast reply ...glad box is standard, it looks quite substantial too!
The finder was my main question as I prefer a straight through viewfinder than right angle but couldn't see anything about the illuminator on the APM website.

Hope the new Istar corrector works out for your scope!

Thanks again...

Mike


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mikeyscope]
      #5809985 - 04/20/13 02:43 AM Attachment (59 downloads)

Hi Mike....

As I just back home from oversea, I check the finder, and there is no brand or model on it, although is very much better than the orion right angle finder that I have....

As for the corrector for my 8" Istar that you have mentioned, I can have the following information, since I just have placed the order and paid for the CA corrector

1. It is not the Istar Raycorr as no one know exactly when the 1st sample will be built....

2. The CA corrector will come with the pre-installed adjustable diagonal....and spacer...

3. It will take a while to build up this full complete assembly , and when I received it, I will not need to do much adjustment...Perhaps in one month time....

4. I think this CA corrector may be able to use on the APM ED APO, so once I received it, I will test it on all my 3 refractors, that is 8" F8.8 Istar, APM 152ED APO and the C6R F8 , as all are having F8 and above....

Regards

James Ling

Edited by James Ling (04/20/13 02:47 AM)


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mikeyscope
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5810487 - 04/20/13 09:54 AM

James

Thanks for posting the finder image ... I assume it's 7x50, anyway that looks fine.
Can I ask how the finder is held in the bracket...are the pins plastic tipped to prevent scratching or does the tube have protective bands around it.
I only ask as my Takahashi 7x50 is scratched & chipped from the holding pins...in particular the front pins though it doesn't help that the white paint used was brittle & easily damaged.

Hope to hear how you get on with the corrector when it arrives.


Thanks again...

Mike


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mikeyscope]
      #5810901 - 04/20/13 01:24 PM

Hi Mike....

Yes... the locking pins are all having plastic tips end.

And the cross hairs are double line type...

As for the corrector, I really like to know how well it can improve my Istar to take on my C14, on the giant gas planet Saturn, which now this week, I am pushing the C14 power to 450X during last Monday side walk and moments ago, Saturday side walk which i just return back from the event.

Regards

James Ling


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Saied Mabrouk
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5840787 - 05/04/13 09:37 PM

Any news about availability of this telescope in USA?

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mblack
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Saied Mabrouk]
      #5840862 - 05/04/13 10:31 PM

Quote:

Any news about availability of this telescope in USA?




You can pre-order through optcorp.com

That's the only USA based dealer, afaik.

I placed a pre order, looking like a June/July delivery.


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Saied Mabrouk
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5840966 - 05/05/13 12:06 AM

I have my OPT pre-order in as well.
The APM site shows the availability of this OTA to be May 5, 2013. I will wait for a call from OPT. When??
http://www.apm-telescopes.de/en/product.html?info=3765&x752c6=kenct7g8pa8...


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Saied Mabrouk]
      #5841155 - 05/05/13 05:29 AM

Hi David and Saied Mabrouk and ALL....

Wow... Looks like I am so lucky to have the scope 6 mths earlier than the actual production run.....

BTW, I should be receiving the CA corrector by end of this month, and once is tested on this APM ED APO, I will give an update on how it goes with it, although my intention is for my 8" Istar.....

Regards

James Ling


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AlienRatDog
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5841309 - 05/05/13 09:03 AM

The Istar CA corrector is finally coming out?

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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: AlienRatDog]
      #5841351 - 05/05/13 09:41 AM

Hi Abe....and ALL.....

No... The CA Corrector is not from Istar.

Sorry for those who thought that is from Istar....as I did not state the details of this CA Corrector earlier, coz I wanted to announce it only when I know the delivery date...

It is actually the chromacorr II, that is modified to suit the Istar.
It will come assembled with the NPZ 2" diagonal, and custom machining of two spacers for proper chromacorr orientation and spacing.

So it will be a plug and use for me, without the need to figure out how to orientate and alignment adjustment.

For me, although it should show drastic improvement, to the Istar, close to ED APO level, but I think there could be a possibilities to use on my other 2 F8 refractors, that is APM ED APO and C6R...

I already have plan to do another shootout at my astro friend's roof top, and we may add 1 or 2 more 10" aperture scopes....
Is just another 3 to 4 more weeks from now...

REgards

James Ling


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Saied Mabrouk
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5841681 - 05/05/13 01:25 PM

Thanks James.
I do not see a good reason for using a CA corrector with the APM ED APO other than for experimentation and curiosity. If much better CA correction is required, one would add the cost of the CA corrector to the cost of the ED APO and go to a triplet or a super doublet.
Using a CA corrector is justified with an achromat like a Synta 6" F/8.
Regards.


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Saied Mabrouk]
      #5879530 - 05/23/13 02:36 AM Attachment (55 downloads)

Hi ALL....

1. Just a little update on the performance of this 152 APM ED APO on the giant gas planet, Saturn during last Monday side walk....

2. Last Monday weather is quite clear, after an early thunder in the morning....

3. As is already almost one month after opposition, and the time is around 8.30pm....Saturn is quite high , at our equatorial region....

4. The baader zoom set at 8mm , with 150X, seems too small for such an occasion, and after 20mins or so, I quickly add in the 2X celestron ultima barlow ...to 300X....

5. Saturn at 300X is so sharp and crisp, with the cassini division so dark and distinct, that all those people who have seen it, wanted to use their hp to snap a photo of it, but I need to stop them, coz the queue is very long....

6. The queue only ends at 10pm......and as Saturn is now high up above.... I tried my 6mm LV Vixen ep with the 2X barlow at 400X, and the view still looks great....

5. And I even tested it with my 4.8mm Nagler ep with 2X barlow, but the view is darker, and the yellow tone of saturn become pale green....But the cassini division is still dark....

6. Is very difficult to relate image breakdown at 500X, although this is empty magnification as many people are saying....but if I have seen other achro, at such a high power, I only claim that breakdown if the image is fuzzy, but for the APM ED APO, is not....

7. But after getting some photo shots, I revert back the magnification with my 9mm nagler with 2X barlow, at 267X , and this provides the best view of Saturn.....

8. This simple report which I put up for the 152 APM ED APO, is to make known to all those who have ordered this scope, that you will not be disappointed with its performance , especially at Saturn....

Regards

James Ling


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Mark9473
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5879555 - 05/23/13 03:39 AM

Given that the focus of this scope has been shifted away from the red to improve the out-of-focus blue, do you agree that the real test for this scope will be on Mars?

Of course Mars is only visible for a few months every two years, so for most people it will not be the prime consideration when ordering a scope.


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GHarris
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #5879717 - 05/23/13 08:17 AM

Thanks for all the discussion of the scope James. I'm going to be getting one sometime in the coming weeks and while I'm not terribly experienced or knowledgeable I will try to chime in a bit with my own views when I can. You've set a great example with all this information and have really helped those of us who were thinking of buying.

Quote:

Given that the focus of this scope has been shifted away from the red to improve the out-of-focus blue...




Are you sure that's the case? I don't think I've read anything definitive about this scope in particular being biased towards blue/away from red correction.

It's a fair question though and of course it would be nice to know, next time Mars is close enough to use for testing (I guess this is only practical to test out at opposition, i.e. around April 2014?).

EDIT: On the topic of red vs blue, not sure if these posts by Markus Ludes were well noted by the community as he's only allowed to post in the vendor's forum. I'm not sure what context to put them into myself either, was slightly confused by the discussion last time this came up.

Edited by GHarris (05/23/13 08:31 AM)


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NHRob
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #5879722 - 05/23/13 08:21 AM

How was the color performance at those high mags?

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mblack
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: GHarris]
      #5879771 - 05/23/13 08:53 AM

James, thanks for your report. Very promising in regards to the potential of the optics, yet not overly so.

Quote:

EDIT: On the topic of red vs blue, not sure if these posts by Markus Ludes were well noted by the community as he's only allowed to post in the vendor's forum. I'm not sure what context to put them into myself either, was slightly confused by the discussion last time this came up.




Yes, this is important. As a buyer, this 'rumor' of color correction was addressed by Markus. Proof will come at the eyepiece for me, but Markus has made it clear that the optics of this 152 doublet were (Edit: it's quite clear going by longitudinal aberration chart that the scope does correct for blue wavelength over red) a traditional design, and that visual wavelengths were favored.

I can only go by James reports and Markus's post from his optic designer.

Edited by mblack (05/23/13 04:14 PM)


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Gord
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5880328 - 05/23/13 02:02 PM

Quote:


Quote:

EDIT: On the topic of red vs blue, not sure if these posts by Markus Ludes were well noted by the community as he's only allowed to post in the vendor's forum. I'm not sure what context to put them into myself either, was slightly confused by the discussion last time this came up.




Yes, this is important. As a buyer, this 'rumor' of color correction was addressed by Markus. Proof will come at the eyepiece for me, but Markus has made it clear that the optics of this 152 doublet were not designed to correct more towards blue over red.

I can only go by James reports and Markus's post from his optic designer.




Hi David,

I have read Markus' comments on the vendor forum and the response from his optical designer, but I disagree with them. I don't think there is any rumor as the tests done by Mr. Rohr and the info shown by Markus himself say this design is blue optimized.

See here:
Rohr test of APM 152ED

The defocus shown for the wavelengths are:

green = 0
blue = 37 micron
red = 287 micron

But getting back to James latest report on Saturn, the scope performed very well he found. And if you look back to the discussion on this that was raised by Valery, he indicated that this would be the case. Saturn, the moon, etc. would not be impacted by this design decision. But Jupiter and especially Mars will be (due to the detail in the red channel).

And yes, it's unfortunate that Markus isn't able to participate here directly. I like reading his input.

Clear skies,


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mblack
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Gord]
      #5880618 - 05/23/13 04:06 PM

Hello Gord,

I worded my post poorly, as even Markus own test plots on his APM listing for the scope (that your citation came from?) show that it is corrected more in the blue wavelength than red.

What I was addressing with my 'rumor' comment was whether some kind of unconventional design compromises were made to 'hide' the blue at the sacrifice of red. And I would like to hear from Markus as well on this, but it won't be here. Too bad.

I've edited my post so as not to confuse anyone besides myself. : >

Since only one of these 152 doublets is actually out in the field, I'll just reserve comment until I can see for myself what sort of color correction it has.


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Mark9473
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Gord]
      #5880657 - 05/23/13 04:22 PM

Quote:

the tests done by Mr. Rohr and the info shown by Markus himself say this design is blue optimized.

See here:
Rohr test of APM 152ED

The defocus shown for the wavelengths are:

green = 0
blue = 37 micron
red = 287 micron



In post nr. 13 of that thread (on page 2), the lens designer himself, Mr. Gerd Dring, explains that a better correction was chosen for blue than for red since the sensitivity for red is 2.25x less than for blue, therefore this option allows to get a better visual impression of colour correction.
edit: I'm not sure how to reconcile that with the fact that optimum Strehl is reached for yellow. If it was a simple colour shift shouldn't that have been on the bluish side of green?

The text is a bit difficult to follow in German, and the online translators appear to struggle with it as much as I do.

Edited by Mark9473 (05/23/13 04:29 PM)


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mblack
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Mark9473]
      #5880684 - 05/23/13 04:32 PM

Quote:

The text is a bit difficult to follow in German, and the online translators appear to struggle with it as much as I do.




Me too

That's why I edited my erroneous earlier post. I'm having a hard time understanding exactly what was achieved vs what was sacrificed. Not for the first time, either.


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5881122 - 05/23/13 09:06 PM Attachment (146 downloads)

Hi All...

Following is a single photo shot taken through the 152 APM ED APO, from my friend Gary's HTC ONE S hp.....at 500X

I must emphasize again that 500X requires a good seeing condition, similar to the one on last Monday's night, as well as Saturn is almost overhead.....

And do not expect the view to be similar as my C14 or Gary's 10" Dob, which I also seen Saturn at or near to 500X during last month side walk...
The APM ED APO view of Saturn is very dim, but u can still see the whole planet, and is not fuzzy...., and strange the cassini division is still dark.....
The colour of saturn appears in my eye is light greenish-yellow , while the C14 is still bright yellowish.., and the 10" Dob is bright and pale Ivory, not yellowish....

Regards

James Ling


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Gord
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: mblack]
      #5881169 - 05/23/13 09:37 PM

Hi David, Mark,

David, I understand what you are saying. As Mark has pointed out with the rational given by Markus, is that this is a design that is weighting the correction towards what the physiological characteristics of the human eye are. You might call it unconventional in a traditional refractor color correction sense, but it's not a new idea.

I understand what the why and the logic behind it, but given the expert opinions (Valery, Roland, Zeiss, the Clarks, etc.) shared on this and the specific historical examples cited indicating that this was not felt to be the ideal design, it seems to me to be questionable. Of course, it's important to keep in mind the targets. If Jupiter and Mars are of little or no interest, then it's not a great concern it seems.

The example that made it clearer to me was explained as this; green is the most important color of all for all targets since it is where we are most sensitive. Blue, red, etc. are all significantly less than green. On a target like Mars, the most sensitivity is still in the green channel, but the details in red are far more than in blue. So if you want to see the sharpest picture of the detail to be seen, you want green and red closest to common focus.

Of course in other situations, blue may be more important so putting them together makes sense. But of course, it comes at the expense of red. The historical approach then has been to put red and blue at common focus as a balanced approach to the two.

As for the best strehl being at yellow in that test, I'm not an expert, but I believe it's a separate thing from the color correction entirely. I think it's simply where the best level of spherical correction was found on this particular sample. As I understand it, ideally you would have that be at green instead, and even better yet have all the colours focus in the same spot AND have a high strehl!

It's all very interesting, but you can see what a challenge it is in terms of coming up with the "best" design. There are a lot of factors at play and different uses to consider as well.

Clear skies,


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Gord
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5881183 - 05/23/13 09:49 PM

James,

That's a great shot of Saturn for a single image on a dim target taken with a camera on a phone! Definitely some good seeing too for a single frame to turn out so good. I'm sure it looks better in person than in this image as well.

Please, send some of that weather this way if you can!

Clear skies,


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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Gord]
      #5881552 - 05/24/13 02:12 AM

Hi Gord...

Thanks for your comment.....

But I would say for a 6" aperture, even at 500X it can still holds well without the image goes fuzzy, is not able to compare to bigger aperture of 8" and above.....in terms of the image brightness.....( I meant planet Saturn )

As for the weather, is not clear sky everyday.....we are now starting to experience lesser rainfall and more sunny day for the next few months.....
So will be great time for astronomy side walk......

Unfortunately, for the whole of this year, I couldn't find the opportunity to travel to oversea darker sky area, to test out this APM ED APO.....except monthly side walk events....

REgards

James Ling


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Saied Mabrouk
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5886427 - 05/27/13 12:31 AM

May be it would be a good experiment to try a quality prism diagonal when Mars time comes.
It would also be interesting to try the prism diagonal when viewing Saturn at X500 and determine if the color shifts slightly toward the red.


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timps
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Gord]
      #5886499 - 05/27/13 02:31 AM

How does it compare to Saturn through your C14 Edge?

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Gord
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: timps]
      #5886843 - 05/27/13 10:52 AM

timps,

Do you mean the image above compared to what I see in the C14 Edge?

Not even close to what I see in the Edge, but then it's just a single frame from a camera phone. This image is actually a lot less than I see in the C8 Edge. Even in very average seeing last night, I was seeing much more details, much better color than this (and way sharper) in the C8 Edge.

The color banding on the surface is much more smooth with more variations of color. The rings have a much more white/bright appearance, especially the inner one which shows an almost silvery appearance. The shadow lines are much more sharply defined.

The C14 Edge takes all that and delivers it on a larger scale with more subtle variations in the color tones (you see more bands and gradation of colors). If you look at the good images taken on the Solar System Imaging forum here on CN, I find those a the nature of appearance and detail I see.

I expect the view in person through these APM's to be better than the image shown above, but like other non-apo's scopes the biggest thing that will be off is the colors as compared to the reflectors and some triplets. The other thing is that regardless of design, color is something that really comes with size. The bigger you go, the better it gets.

Clear skies,


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JimP
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Gord]
      #5886901 - 05/27/13 11:21 AM

Your 152 ED sounds like a wonderful telescope. Using it to show others Saturn makes you a very special amateur. Kudos to you!
As I understood it, Markus wanted to offer a scope at an affordable price that would compete with the Takahashi FS 152. Any thoughts?


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Astrojensen
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: JimP]
      #5887401 - 05/27/13 04:15 PM

Quote:

As I understood it, Markus wanted to offer a scope at an affordable price that would compete with the Takahashi FS 152. Any thoughts?




I guess that is more or less the long and short of it. Seems he has managed to pull it off.


Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark


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johnnyha
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Astrojensen]
      #5887717 - 05/27/13 07:23 PM Attachment (43 downloads)

Quote:

As I understood it, Markus wanted to offer a scope at an affordable price that would compete with the Takahashi FS 152. Any thoughts?




Judging from the Rohr tests (foucault and lyot) compared to the Rohr test of the FS128, and the photo of Saturn, I don't believe this scope is as well corrected as an FS152. Whether it competes price-wise is another call, I believe it does as it's quite a bit less $$.

Tak 128 in the middle...


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timps
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Gord]
      #5887962 - 05/27/13 09:35 PM

Yes Gord, that is what I meant. Thanks for the info, I have been considering whether to buy a 5" Tak or a Large SCT and now that our currency has taken a dive I think I may get more value out of a SCT.

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James Ling
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: JimP]
      #5888309 - 05/28/13 02:26 AM

Quote:

Your 152 ED sounds like a wonderful telescope. Using it to show others Saturn makes you a very special amateur. Kudos to you!
As I understood it, Markus wanted to offer a scope at an affordable price that would compete with the Takahashi FS 152. Any thoughts?




Hi JimP....

This 152 APM ED APO, to me is a great scope to acquire for the price that I paid for....
Although I have not seen through the FS152, but I am sure they should not be too far apart in terms of the optical quality....

Perhaps some other CN members when received theirs in a month or so, can make more comparison against other 6" premium scope...

Hi ALL...

As I will be receiving my chromacorr II soon, as it will be shipped out this week to me, although i know is configured to F8.8 for my Istar, but I will just test it out on both of my F8 refractors, and reports on any improvement....

REgards

James Ling


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beanerds
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5888351 - 05/28/13 05:13 AM Attachment (70 downloads)

Hi James , lovely shot of Saturn there , looks almost exactly the same as mine taken thru my ( well columinated )Takahashi Mewlon 210 about a month ago taken using my HTC one phones camera as well but hand held , raw shot , and 3mm Radian giving 806x , yes at the zenith and an excellent night as well .
Brian .
Quote:

Hi All...

Following is a single photo shot taken through the 152 APM ED APO, from my friend Gary's HTC ONE S hp.....at 500X

I must emphasize again that 500X requires a good seeing condition, similar to the one on last Monday's night, as well as Saturn is almost overhead.....

And do not expect the view to be similar as my C14 or Gary's 10" Dob, which I also seen Saturn at or near to 500X during last month side walk...
The APM ED APO view of Saturn is very dim, but u can still see the whole planet, and is not fuzzy...., and strange the cassini division is still dark.....
The colour of saturn appears in my eye is light greenish-yellow , while the C14 is still bright yellowish.., and the 10" Dob is bright and pale Ivory, not yellowish....

Regards

James Ling




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Saied Mabrouk
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: beanerds]
      #5891393 - 05/29/13 09:33 PM

I believe the original goal (last year) for Markus was that the APM152ED APO to be similar to a Synta 120mm ED in color correction, and in focus similar to Takahashi FS152.
Also, heard it to be equivalent to 6" F/30 achro.


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Jeff B
Carpal Tunnel
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5899358 - 06/03/13 10:42 AM

Quote:

As I will be receiving my chromacorr II soon, as it will be shipped out this week to me, although i know is configured to F8.8 for my Istar, but I will just test it out on both of my F8 refractors, and reports on any improvement....

REgards

James Ling




James:

I think you will be a bit shocked about what you see with the 8" F9 via the Chromacor II. On axis should be essentially color free. Truly impressive.

You will, however, notice some lateral color intruding as you move a few Jupiter diameters off axis at higher powers. That's normal.

Jeff


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James Ling
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Reged: 09/18/10

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Jeff B]
      #5901203 - 06/04/13 07:04 AM

Hi Jeff...

Thanks for the valuable information with regards to the chromacorr II......

I should be receiving by this week, as I have been told that the chromacorr II already reached my country , wtg for custom clearance......

I hope I will be able to pick this up, when I returned back from oversea.......and use it on this coming weekend....

Regards

James Ling


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cw00
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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5919509 - 06/13/13 08:39 PM

Hi folks,
If you are on the waiting list for the APM 152ED Apo, the wait should be over soon. I received an e-mail from Markus over an week ago about my order and it is finally ready. It would have been the first one shipped to US. But because I just picked up a FS-152 on Astromart, I had to decline the offer (otherwise I have to do a lot of explaining to my wife about another refractor showing up on the front door ). I am sure that one is now on its way to its nice new home.
Cheers,
Cheng


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James Ling
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Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: cw00]
      #5920033 - 06/14/13 05:56 AM Attachment (88 downloads)

Wow....

Hi ALL...

Looks like more review reports will be out soon.....


As for the chromacorr II which I received last weekend, I did a simple test by inserting the chromacorr II directly into the back of the focuser....of the APM ED APO, over a roof top object 300M away....and it seems to over correct , and the visual view is worst than the original one without using the chromacorr II....

I know the chromacorr II is already configured for F8.8, with the spacer and special diagonal specially adjusted, for immediate use onto the ISTAR 8" F8.8...
So I do not want to dismantle the chromacorr II from the spacer, until I tested it onto my ISTAR, which is set at this coming weekend, provided the weather is good....

Last weekend, although weather condition is good for the test, but due to my friend's roof top canopy is stuck, damage , and cannot be retract, and is now under repair.....

Below is the photo of the chromacorr II, with the spacer and adjustable diagonal that I received during last weekend...

Regards

James Ling

Edited by James Ling (06/14/13 05:57 AM)


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beanerds
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Reged: 07/15/08

Loc: Darwin Australia
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #5920061 - 06/14/13 06:45 AM

Hi James and lucky you , these Chromocor's are like hen's teeth .
I have one ( a 'O1' I think ) in my Saxon (Synta) 150mm f8 refractor that's in NZ still being used by my nephew and these work very , very well once set up , that can take a lot of trial and error thu , be prepared for this , but it is worth it .
Many an old 2 inch colour filter were dismantled for only the threaded ring to be used as spacers to acheave the 161 mm needed to optimise my Chromocor to my 15omm f8 .

Good luck mate and we all look forward to the results , it should work very well in your Istar once set up .

Brian.


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Saied Mabrouk
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Reged: 03/30/08

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #6193803 - 11/14/13 12:13 AM

Hi James.
You mentioned that "on the 9 days old Moon, there is a very thin layer of greenish-yellow (CA)that is being observed..."
I know it has been a while since you made this observation, but do you recall at what magnification you were observing the moon with the APM 152mm ED APO?
Regards,
Saied


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Saied Mabrouk
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Reged: 03/30/08

Loc: Longmont, Colorado
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: SteveG]
      #6193812 - 11/14/13 12:18 AM

Hi Steve,
Let me ask you also about seeing a layer of greenish-yellow when looking at the Moon using your ED120. Do you recall at what magnification you were using the ED120 when you made this observation?
Regards,
Saied


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James Ling
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Saied Mabrouk]
      #6197519 - 11/16/13 12:38 AM Attachment (37 downloads)

Hi Saied....

I use the Baader hyperion 8mm to 24mm zoom ep , and the setting is at 24mm, so the magnification is 50X...

The very last time I used this scope again is in mid September, for our local lunar festival....
And i showed the crowds both the 15 days old moon and Venus..

Attachment photos showing the scope pointing to Venus...

Regards

James Ling


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James Ling
sage
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Reged: 09/18/10

Loc: Singapore
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #6197525 - 11/16/13 12:48 AM Attachment (48 downloads)

Hi ALL...

This is another photo shot, and for this one is pointing at the moon...

I am sorry for the error made in last post , coz the celebration is for the 15th day lunar moon festival, but the actual event is planned ahead , on a Saturday weekend, and is a 10 days old moon.., not 15 days days old moon, i stated earlier....

Regards

James Ling


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Saied Mabrouk
member


Reged: 03/30/08

Loc: Longmont, Colorado
Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #6197586 - 11/16/13 02:16 AM

Thanks James. We all sure appreciate you sharing your experience with us.
What is confusing me about the moon limb is that on page 10 of this thread (on 03/02/13 12:02 AM) the Moon picture by the 152mm APM ED APO shows a classical but slight purple around the limb. Not yellowish greenish thin layer around the limb. So, I do not know how CA around the Moon limb turns from purple to yellowish greenish color.
Next time you observe the moon, try higher magnification, say X200 or X240 and look at the limb at best focus.
Regards.


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James Ling
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Reged: 09/18/10

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: Saied Mabrouk]
      #6203284 - 11/19/13 09:24 AM Attachment (47 downloads)

Hi Saied...

What you have mentioned is what most of us also been puzzled when we took the photo, whether is using a camera and took the photo directly from the eye piece, or using a DSLR body, and with an attachment directly over the visual back....
The greenish yellow sort of CA, cannot be captured by the camera...Instead it captures the purple colour instead....
It seems that our eye is not sensitive enough to detect the purple colour but the camera does....
I also have a WO88ED scope with me, and the greenish yellow CA levels when viewing at the moon, is almost not there, unless you shift around your eye vision....But when I use a camera to take the picture, the purple colour is also present...But not the greenish yellow colour...(refer to photo attachment)
I do not use the IR/UV cut filter, whenever I took those photos , although I have one...but I can try it out the very next time when I have the chance....
Perhaps my next observation , I can try out the higher magnification and observe the CA level...

Regards

James Ling


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Saied Mabrouk
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Reged: 03/30/08

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Re: APM 152 ED APO #002 new [Re: James Ling]
      #6203949 - 11/19/13 03:03 PM

Thanks James.

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