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Equipment Discussions >> Refractors

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TG
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 11/02/06

Loc: Latitude 47
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: chboss]
      #5624467 - 01/15/13 01:55 PM

Quote:


Did you have the chance to compare your Super Planetary to a 6" f9 EDT T. Back mentions in his text?
I would be interested how big the visual difference is between an f9 and f12 telescope.

best regards
Chris




I don't have an EDT but I did used to own a 6" f/12 SP and now have a 7" F/9 StarFire. Visually, the SF beats the SP in terms of low contrast features seen and I don't think this is entirely due to the extra 1" of aperture. I suspect this is instead due to its better color correction (A-P ads claimed 5x better).

Tanveer.


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aa6ww
professor emeritus
*****

Reged: 10/23/11

Loc: Sacramento, Calif.
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: TG]
      #5624877 - 01/15/13 05:50 PM

Quote:

Quote:


Did you have the chance to compare your Super Planetary to a 6" f9 EDT T. Back mentions in his text?
I would be interested how big the visual difference is between an f9 and f12 telescope.

best regards
Chris




I don't have an EDT but I did used to own a 6" f/12 SP and now have a 7" F/9 StarFire. Visually, the SF beats the SP in terms of low contrast features seen and I don't think this is entirely due to the extra 1" of aperture. I suspect this is instead due to its better color correction (A-P ads claimed 5x better).

Tanveer.




It's the aperture that was giving you more contras. 5x more correction than what? Maybe, maybe, that would show up in astrophotograhy, but visually, its the aperture that is making the contras difference. Doing a side by side on a TEC 140 vs a TEC 160 on Jupiter one night a few years back, the one thing you notice is on the larger glass, the whites are whiter and the darks are darker, just like the laundry detergent commercials claim.... Same effect with a C8 vs a C9.25 At these smaller apertures, every inch adds quite a bit to contras. and light gathering.
On larger apertures, the better contras begins to show up by displaying color. For example, on my C11, vs C14, on Jupiter, with the C14, you notice shades of blue and shades of brown, instead of just gray, and the whites take on different shades also, where some of the whites become more of a peach or tan color. This isn't obvious in the C11. Inside the GRS, you begin to see the swirls you cant see in the C11 when the seeing is excellent, something that seldom happens but when it does, these forums light up with claims of almost unbelievable visual observations and ridiculous high power views unheard of under normal conditions.
Same with a Meade 16 SCT vs C14, in the 16, the veil nebula begins to show shades of blues and violets, not so obvious in the C14. High power views of the Ring Nebula being to show reds like a ring of fire in the 16" SCT.

All of this is what makes this hobby so fun, exhilarating and exciting, and why getting out and using our gear is way more fun than talking about it.

...Ralph


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jrbarnett
Eyepiece Hooligan
*****

Reged: 02/28/06

Loc: Petaluma, CA
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: aa6ww]
      #5624900 - 01/15/13 06:03 PM

When comparing different scopes, one must take care to equalize the magnification when making assessments of relative contrast. A little extra magnification can do a lot to suppress glare, and enhance perceived contrast on bright targets. Larger aperture scopes also tend to have longer focal lengths, requiring use of different focal length eyepieces to achieve a given magnification.

Regards,

Jim


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chboss
professor emeritus


Reged: 03/24/08

Loc: Zurich Switzerland
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: TG]
      #5624905 - 01/15/13 06:07 PM

Thank you Tanveer
That was the information I was looking for.

best regards
Chris


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Max Lattanzi
professor emeritus


Reged: 06/27/07

Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: TG]
      #5624916 - 01/15/13 06:13 PM

Quote:

Quote:


Did you have the chance to compare your Super Planetary to a 6" f9 EDT T. Back mentions in his text?
I would be interested how big the visual difference is between an f9 and f12 telescope.

best regards
Chris




I don't have an EDT but I did used to own a 6" f/12 SP and now have a 7" F/9 StarFire. Visually, the SF beats the SP in terms of low contrast features seen and I don't think this is entirely due to the extra 1" of aperture. I suspect this is instead due to its better color correction (A-P ads claimed 5x better).

Tanveer.




I do have a 180EDT f/9 which was refigured, reoiled and recoated by Roland. On medium-good seeing its performances are visibly superior to the aforementioned 152 f/12 Starfire. Still, this Superplanetary has a spherical and a color correction which is *at least* on par with the EDT. Even better, I would say from its star test, which is an indistinguishable pure white in/out on 1 mag stars.

In my case, the superiority of the 180EDT is totally given by its 1" extra aperture.

-- Max


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TG
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 11/02/06

Loc: Latitude 47
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: aa6ww]
      #5625009 - 01/15/13 07:23 PM

Quote:

Quote:

I suspect this is instead due to its better color correction (A-P ads claimed 5x better).

Tanveer.




It's the aperture that was giving you more contras. 5x more correction than what? Maybe, maybe, that would show up in astrophotograhy, but visually, its the aperture that is making the contras difference.




Actually, I dug in a bit more and it seems that I have misremembered, mixing up Thomas Back's history of A-P lenses, where he mentions a 5x improvement in correction of violet in the SF series over the prior A-P lenses, with A-Ps ads showing the secondary spectrum curve for the SF lenses. Inspecting this ad for the original triplet, it looks like that the secondary spectrum correction wasn't significantly improved in the visual range. I agree that an improvement in violet wouldn't translate to much at the eyepiece but I did notice it visually between the two lenses: the in/out focus diffraction patters of the SF are much cleaner, being clear on both sides of the focus and almost white while in the SP they're fuzzier on one size and green/magenta colored on either side. On very bright stars, in the SP, there's a violet halo and it's much smaller/fainter in the SF.

Perhaps it was that the SF was just better figured. The contrast difference I saw can't be explained by a measly 16% increase in aperture.

Tanveer.


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Napersky
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 01/27/10

Loc: Chicagoland
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: TG]
      #5630673 - 01/18/13 10:14 PM Attachment (63 downloads)

Darren Drake at the new AP Superplanetary

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Napersky
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 01/27/10

Loc: Chicagoland
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: Napersky]
      #5630676 - 01/18/13 10:15 PM Attachment (54 downloads)

Me at the device

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Napersky
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 01/27/10

Loc: Chicagoland
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: Napersky]
      #5630678 - 01/18/13 10:15 PM Attachment (55 downloads)

Another me

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Erik Bakker
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 08/10/06

Loc: The Netherlands, Europe
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: Napersky]
      #5631055 - 01/19/13 05:05 AM

Very nice!

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chboss
professor emeritus


Reged: 03/24/08

Loc: Zurich Switzerland
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: Erik Bakker]
      #5631178 - 01/19/13 09:04 AM

Nice pictures of a great scope!

regards
Chris


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niteskystargazer
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 10/05/09

Loc: 41-43'-28" N 87-42'-39" W
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: Napersky]
      #5631541 - 01/19/13 01:04 PM

Mark,

Congradulations on your new Scope .

CS,KLU,

,

Tom


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Sunspot
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 03/15/05

Loc: Surprise, AZ
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: Napersky]
      #5631582 - 01/19/13 01:30 PM

Those pictures definitely give the image of how large that scope is. I'm envious!

Paul


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bobmarleyou812
sage
*****

Reged: 01/18/08

Loc: CA
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: Sunspot]
      #5631772 - 01/19/13 03:34 PM

...

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TG
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 11/02/06

Loc: Latitude 47
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: Napersky]
      #5635722 - 01/21/13 09:09 PM

Nice! Is the tube 7" in diameter?

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Napersky
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 01/27/10

Loc: Chicagoland
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: TG]
      #5639090 - 01/23/13 03:19 PM

I haven't measured the tube but there may be trouble with the optics more study is needed.

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mustgobigger
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 06/12/07

Loc: Michigan
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: Napersky]
      #5639148 - 01/23/13 04:00 PM

sorry to hear that mark,
what about sending it back.
that much money it should have perfect optics.
ebay has buyer protection plan.
you should still be able to return it up to 30 days
no matter what the seller says about returns.
garys a reputable dealer and should give you no problem.
or at least fix it for you.
hope it all works out and keep us posted.


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mustgobigger
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 06/12/07

Loc: Michigan
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: mustgobigger]
      #5639149 - 01/23/13 04:01 PM

yes the tube is 7" and ota weighs 26lbs.

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Darren Drake
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 10/09/02

Loc: Chicagoland
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: Napersky]
      #5639159 - 01/23/13 04:07 PM

He did measure the OD and it is 6 7/8".

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Napersky
Carpal Tunnel
*****

Reged: 01/27/10

Loc: Chicagoland
Re: AP 6" Superplanetary on AstroMart new [Re: Darren Drake]
      #5639167 - 01/23/13 04:10 PM

Star Test of Sirius shows diffraction spikes. This should not be. Should have been able to go higher power and see detail on Jupiter was very disappointed.

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