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Equipment Discussions >> Refractors

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mmalik
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FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging
      #5600277 - 01/01/13 08:28 PM

A lot seems to have transpired with the big little scope from Takahashi, FSQ-106EDX. I thought it will be worthwhile to have a dedicated discussion around ordering/adapting/using/enhancing this scope for imaging, especially DSLR imaging.

ED Models:
•FSQ-106ED........................(Old)
•FSQ-106ED New “Q”............[with ‘Captain’s Wheel’]
FSQ-106EDX (I, II, III)......[without ‘Captain’s Wheel’]

Note: Discussion is more about FSQ-106EDXIII; also would like to know more about I, II, III specs and other details/differences. Pictures of your imaging setup & experience with adapting the ‘III’ to your needs are welcome!

Pictures Links:
Comparison of old FSQ and New "Q"...
FSQ-106EDXIII...

Here is a relevant quote from OPT... “Remember, the "EDX" version of the FSQ-106ED is the same as the "New Q", but comes with different adapters so that you can attach a camera rotator out of the box. This adapter cuts out 25mm of back focus (178mm vs 153mm) making the EDX much more suitable to photographic use. Adapters for visual use are available.”

Relevant Specs of 106EDX:
•Modified Four Element Double ED Petzval
•‘Reduced’ 153mm back-focus
•88mm image circle
•Accepts new F3.6 focal reducer
•Built-in camera adjuster capable of lifting up to 11 pounds
•4” rack and pinion focuser
•NO ‘Captain’s Wheel’
•530mm FL, f/5


To kick off the discussion, following are some relevant quotes from the DSLR forum....

Quote:

Quote:

Few questions:

@hytham, what’s the difference between FSQ-106EDX and FSQ-106ED?




The EDX is modified for imaging purposes.

The EDX comes with a built in CAA which reduces the amount of back-focus from 178mm to 153mm allowing you to attach a variety of adapters to suit your imaging needs, but does not have the captain's wheel or visual accessories associated with the FSQ-106ED. The purpose was to eliminate any potential flexure in the imaging train with the new casting design and increase the maximum supported weight.




Quote:

Quote:

Thanks for the info; couple more questions:

1. Is there any difference between EDXIII & EDX?
2. Is CC/FF still needed with EDX?
3. How good is the focuser on EDX; can/should it be upgraded to Feather Touch, if yes which one exactly?

If you can post a pic of your EDX, especially the back-end setup, that will be great. Thx




To answer your questions:

1) Yes. Heavier casting design for larger imaging trains. The ED, EDX(I,II,III) can all be used visually, but the progression (again from research and what I have been told) from I - III is the support of larger imaging trains. The III can support 5kg (11 lbs). They're all the same cost, so why not go with the EDX III imaging system instead of the ED was my thought.

2) From the images I have seen produced with it. No. The optics from the ED to the EDXIII are still the same. The quadruplet is supposed to eliminate coma and creates an impeccable flat field right out to the edge of the viewing/imaging area - it's crazy sharp. After using it at a friend’s house to try it out for myself, I was amazed by the beautiful quality of the optics and how clean it was. That is what convinced me to get one. The quality of glass and engineering.

3) No need, IMO. It comes with a 10:1 focusing system that is very smooth with great precision. Those that do upgrade it, want to motorize with the Starizona system whereas the Robofocus can also provide you with the necessary precision with the stock focuser. IMO, it's a matter of subjectivity.

Here are some photos of another individual's set up which is going to be very close to what I will have. Mine is in transit (should be here this week) and don't have all the necessary gear - still deciding on CCD and need to buy the right parts to connect the DSLR.

Link...




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mikeschuster
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5600612 - 01/02/13 12:58 AM

I love my FSQ, but nothing is perfect. A bahtinov mask is a nice tool for checking FSQ image quality. Spend a night slewing the tube across the sky and use the mask to check for collimation, focuser draw tube flexure and defocus as the night cools. Poorly collimated FSQ's may need a trip to the factory. Draw tube flexure can be a problem with heavy loads. Temperature dependent focus is an issue for long narrowband exposures.
Mike


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mmalik
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mikeschuster]
      #5600634 - 01/02/13 01:19 AM

Mike, can you confirm your model? I presume it is NOT 'Q' or, the focus of this discussion, 'X', correct? Thx

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mikeschuster
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5600639 - 01/02/13 01:25 AM

It's a FSQ-106EDXIII. A pic: http://mschuster.zenfolio.com/img/s2/v72/p1360108636.png

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mmalik
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mikeschuster]
      #5600669 - 01/02/13 02:04 AM

Thanks Mike; I am not an owner of 106EDXIII, hence the curiosity to know more about ‘em. I am a bit puzzled to hear about flexure & collimation if that’s the case since that goes counter to the very reason for the new design of 106EDXIII in my opinion. Please elaborate if you like, i.e., your experiences. Regards

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tomcody
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5600992 - 01/02/13 10:44 AM

Quote:

Thanks Mike; I am not an owner of 106EDXIII, hence the curiosity to know more about ‘em. I am a bit puzzled to hear about flexure & collimation if that’s the case since that goes counter to the very reason for the new design of 106EDXIII in my opinion. Please elaborate if you like, i.e., your experiences. Regards



Which model do you own? and what are you trying to learn about the FSQ 106 with this thread?

One correction, the first FSQ 106 was know as "FSQ106" (with a fixed dew shield), followed by the FSQ106N (with a sliding dew shield), both of those models featured florite lenes unlike the newer ED models and both original models featured the same 4" focuser as on the TOA 130 and 150.
In an effort to add additional available in focus, the newer FSQ ED's featured a new smaller focuser (which as you can read has been the topic of many threads regarding focuser problems) In my opinion, Takahashi took a step in the wrong direction with the new focuser, just to add more in focus to the scope and for dubious value as the original FSQ will accommodate the largest FLI camera/filter wheel and Atlas focuser, so all that was gained was the ability to use bino viewers at lower magnification on the New Q, ( I can use binos on my FSQ106N with a barlow or GPC just fine).

Any of the versions of the FSQ will work well with the weight of a DSLR, some people are hanging over 18lbs of camera/filter wheel/focuser on FSQ's and that's where the focuser problems come in, not from light DSLR's.
If you get (don't already have one?) a FSQ, you will need a T adapter for the DSLR and an adapter to mate it with the scope ( the system charts can help you with that) also as the DSLR only uses about 55mm of back focus, you may want a spacer to eat up some of the extra back focus, (Tak has both threaded and slip fit adapters in 72mm or 2" both about 2" long.
Rex

Edited by tomcody (01/03/13 01:37 PM)


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hytham
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5601092 - 01/02/13 11:32 AM

The only issues I have heard of flexure is when individuals exceeded the weight limitation as stated by the manufacturer OR using an older model FSQ.

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hytham
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: hytham]
      #5601094 - 01/02/13 11:33 AM

Ok I lied ... here's one on the EDX III

http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/5352668/Main...


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mikeschuster
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5601209 - 01/02/13 12:52 PM

Quote:

Thanks Mike; I am not an owner of 106EDXIII, hence the curiosity to know more about ‘em. I am a bit puzzled to hear about flexure & collimation if that’s the case since that goes counter to the very reason for the new design of 106EDXIII in my opinion. Please elaborate if you like, i.e., your experiences. Regards




The four lenses in the FSQ function as one unit, each doublet compensates for the aberrations of the other. This compensation gives high image quality, but it makes the system very sensitive to lens spacing, decentering and tilt. My newly purchased FSQ arrived decollimated, it was replaced with a new tube. Good service from TNR! The new one has much better collimation, absolutely fine for imaging, but not perfect. Star testing my 20 year old Genesis gives rounder airy rings.

With my 3 pound camera load, focuser flexure is minimal. I sometimes see a small focus shift after a slew and flip across the meridian. The focuser draw tube, lock and CAA all can be tightened if flexure is a problem. I may eventually replace the focuser entirely with a fixed tube and an FLI Atlas. Electronic focusing and the increase in stiffness will be nice to have.

Mike

Edited by mikeschuster (01/02/13 12:55 PM)


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alocky
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mikeschuster]
      #5601829 - 01/02/13 07:47 PM

Hi guys - I'll chime in on the temperature compensation front. Out here in the desert of Western Australia we get a large temperature change during the night, and I find that I need to refocus every 20 minutes. I attached a robofocus system to my FSQ and timed it to compensate for temp every 10 minutes (in between subs), and have not had a problem since.
I use a bahtinov mask to set focus, then start the compensation.
As for collimating - I draw the line at a doublet. Fortunately during one of the 'deliberate' subs I took with the bahtinov still in place I got a chance to see how flat the field on a full frame chip actually is.
Cheers,
Andrew.


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mikeschuster
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: alocky]
      #5601919 - 01/02/13 08:38 PM

Andrew, thanks for the info. I have gotten good at predicting how much focus changes during my 40 minute Ha subs. So I split the change by purposely defocusing by half the expected change at the start of each sub. My goal is to get perfect focus to happen at the middle of the sub. Of course I can't predict the change with great accuracy, sometimes temp changes in strange and abrupt ways, up or down, but this hack helps in my opinion. With the Atlas I hope to be able to change focus during the sub, by monitoring a probe attached to the tube, or by monitoring camera cooler power, which seems to track temp also.
Mike


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hytham
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mikeschuster]
      #5602143 - 01/02/13 11:19 PM

I'm curious ... Is it at all possible to remove the stock focuser entirely and replace it with another or are you limited to stacking a secondary focuser on to the stock one?

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mmalik
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mikeschuster]
      #5602154 - 01/02/13 11:25 PM

Quote:

@mikeschuster: Spend a night slewing the tube across the sky and use the mask to check for collimation, focuser draw tube flexure...




Quote:

@tomcody: Which model do you own? And what are you trying to learn about the FSQ 106 with this thread?

...the newer FSQ ED's featured a new smaller focuser (which as you can read has been the topic of many threads regarding focuser problems) In my opinion, Takahashi took a step in the wrong direction with the new focuser, just to add more in focus to the scope and for dubious value...




Quote:

@hytham: The only issues I have heard of flexure is when individuals exceeded the weight limitation as stated by the manufacturer OR using an older model FSQ.




Quote:

@hytham: Ok I lied ... here's one on the EDX III

http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/5352668/Main...




Quote:

@mikeschuster: My newly purchased FSQ arrived de-collimated; it was replaced with a new tube. Good service from TNR! The new one has much better collimation, absolutely fine for imaging, but not perfect…
With my 3 pound camera load, focuser flexure is minimal. I sometimes see a small focus shift after a slew and flip across the meridian.




Thanks everyone for your feedback!

I was mainly looking to know specifically EDXIII little better so maybe I could look into investing in one for wide angle DSLR astro imaging. To tell you the truth, I had high hopes to hear praises for the new EDXIII design but those hopes have plateaued a bit after listening to you folks.

It wouldn’t be wrong to presume focuser is weak; with that said, what are the alternatives? Is there a Feather Touch focuser that could be adapted to EDXIII? Although one would hate to do that on $5K+ scope. I wonder if Jesse... resolved his flexure problem, will send him an IM? My encounters with other Taks... have not been pleasing to say the least in flexure domain, like others'....

About collimation, how prevalent is that problem in EDXIII? Yikes!

Also would like to know what are good vendors besides OPT for EDXIII? What is TNR?


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mmalik
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5602167 - 01/02/13 11:31 PM

Quote:

One correction, the first FSQ 106 was known as "FSQ106" (with a fixed dew shield), followed by the FSQ106N (with a sliding dew shield), both of those models featured fluorite lenses unlike the newer ED models and both original models featured the same 4" focuser as on the TOA 130 and 150.




Rex, I have updated my first post to reflect ONLY 'ED' line-up; does it look good now? Thx


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hytham
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5602189 - 01/02/13 11:49 PM

TNR = Texas Nautical Repair

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tomcody
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5602680 - 01/03/13 10:23 AM

Quote:


I was mainly looking to know specifically EDXIII little better so maybe I could look into investing in one for wide angle DSLR astro imaging. To tell you the truth, I had high hopes to hear praises for the new EDXIII design but those hopes have plateaued a bit after listening to you folks.

It wouldn’t be wrong to presume focuser is weak; with that said, what are the alternatives? Is there a Feather Touch focuser that could be adapted to EDXIII? Although one would hate to do that on $5K+ scope.
About collimation, how prevalent is that problem in EDXIII? Yikes!

Also would like to know what are good vendors besides OPT for EDXIII? What is TNR?



For your needs i.e. DSLR imaging, the FSQ106ED (with captain's wheel) would be fine. I doubt that the focuser would ever give you any problems with that little weight on it and the captain's wheel gives you the option of full 178mm in focus for bino viewers ( and it is a great! scope for viewing with), if you want to use the scope visually. The FSQ106EDXIII is over kill for your needs and would just add weight to the imaging package.
One thing to know regarding quality ( namely focuser shift and collimination) is that the scope (if bought new) carries a five year warrantee by TNR, BUT only to the original purchaser. So if quality concerns you? buy new and have five years of coverage!
Rex
P.S. TNR is the US distributor for Takahashi and does all the warrantee work on them.
Also Astronomics is a good Takahashi dealer and the sponsor of the forum you are reading!

Edited by tomcody (01/03/13 01:37 PM)


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Bowmoreman
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5602889 - 01/03/13 12:21 PM

I've had NO issues with the stock (4") focuser on my 2 year old FSQ106ED... it's load is a QSI583WS with loaded filter wheel...

No sag, no miscollimation, no nuthin... in fact, I haven't even had the camera OFF the scope, nor done anything other than minor tweaking of focus (I use Robofocus for remote, motorized focusing) during that entire time.

I've never once noticed any miscollimation, or anything other than perfectly flat, seeing-limited, stars...

BTW: my TOA130 has the same 4" focuser, and there's no sag when using it visually, even when loaded out with my Denkmeir II's and power switch - a heavy and long "moment arm"... again, no issues.

The solidity of the Tak's is one of the reason I chose them.


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hytham
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: Bowmoreman]
      #5603184 - 01/03/13 03:04 PM

Quote:

I've had NO issues with the stock (4") focuser on my 2 year old FSQ106ED... it's load is a QSI583WS with loaded filter wheel...

No sag, no miscollimation, no nuthin... in fact, I haven't even had the camera OFF the scope, nor done anything other than minor tweaking of focus (I use Robofocus for remote, motorized focusing) during that entire time.

I've never once noticed any miscollimation, or anything other than perfectly flat, seeing-limited, stars...

BTW: my TOA130 has the same 4" focuser, and there's no sag when using it visually, even when loaded out with my Denkmeir II's and power switch - a heavy and long "moment arm"... again, no issues.

The solidity of the Tak's is one of the reason I chose them.




This.

Though the only experience I have had directly with them is whilst using my close friend's unit, all of the issues I have seen/heard have been very limited to older units and very, very few new units. I question their set up and the factors that could have lead to it (heavy imaging trains ... etc), but I never rule out a small number of units that may have been missed by QA.

I'm thankfully using a very light set up (ATIK 460EX [400g], and an ATIK EFW2 with 1.25" filter [500g], and a DSLR) so sag is not a concern for me as the overall weight will not exceed 2.5lbs on the stock focuser.

My beef is that the warranty is non-transferable. That really ticks me off because it should be granted if we can prove how the item was shipped and adhered to their 2-day air transport.


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Denimsky
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: Bowmoreman]
      #5603242 - 01/03/13 03:32 PM

Quote:

I've had NO issues with the stock (4") focuser on my 2 year old FSQ106ED... it's load is a QSI583WS with loaded filter wheel...

No sag, no miscollimation, no nuthin... in fact, I haven't even had the camera OFF the scope, nor done anything other than minor tweaking of focus (I use Robofocus for remote, motorized focusing) during that entire time.

I've never once noticed any miscollimation, or anything other than perfectly flat, seeing-limited, stars...

BTW: my TOA130 has the same 4" focuser, and there's no sag when using it visually, even when loaded out with my Denkmeir II's and power switch - a heavy and long "moment arm"... again, no issues.

The solidity of the Tak's is one of the reason I chose them.




Problem is that not everybody is lucky like you. I think that it is matter of consistency. Many people had problems with Tak focusers as you see from the other thread that I started.


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bilgebay
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: Denimsky]
      #5603340 - 01/03/13 04:39 PM

I am one of the lucky ones and I am sorry to hear about your problem. I wouldn't expect the Tak QC to be that inconsistent

Compared to my FT focusers, my FSQ's stock focuser is not buttery smooth when I move it with the large knob but it has almost the same FT feel on the smaller knob. I am not aware of any draw tube sagging so far. I had the opportunity to use both a friend's Captain Wheel version and my own EDXIII at the same time and make comparisons. Neither of the scopes exhibited any problems regarding the focuser.



Hires photo



Hires photo



Hires photo



Hires photo

Some guys are real lucky, huh ?

The above photos show the scopes configured to be coupled to Canon DSLRs.

The heaviest equipment I have tested on them so far is the QSI683WSG-8 which is approx 1.6 kilos. Therefore I cannot speak for heavier equipment owners.

Hope this helps


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hytham
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5603553 - 01/03/13 07:16 PM

Thanks for posting, Sedat!

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bilgebay
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5603980 - 01/04/13 01:10 AM

Quote:



•‘Reduced’ 153mm back-focus






This can be changed easily. It is possible to remove the CAA and regain the backfocus distance lost due to this. If you really have to rotate your FOV, you can do this by rotating the scope within the clamshell.


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D. Perry
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5604011 - 01/04/13 02:21 AM

Hi mmalik,

I wouldn't worry too much about the collimation and focuser issues mentioned here. There are hundreds in the market and only a handful have experienced issues. With an APS-C DSLR you'll get nowhere near the focuser's weight capacity and if there was a slight out-of-square issue, you probably wouldn't notice it on that 22mm imaging diagonal.

This leads me to the question... What camera do you intend to use? If it's any model with an APS-size sensor, I think you're way overdoing it with an FSQ. Most of the large corrected field will go wasted on an APS chip. I think you'd be perfectly happy with a TEC or similar APO with a field flattener and FT focuser. If, on the otherhand, you'll be using a full-size chip (44mm diagonal measurement), the FSQ is hard to beat. It's an amazing astrograph. Yes, the focus will shift with temperature changes but so will every metal tube refractor. And the focuser sag really only comes into play with those who are using filter wheels and heavy cameras like FLI's ProLine.

I've been very happy with my FSQ-106EDX-III. For a fast, 4-inch, highly-corrected imaging scope, there really isn't anything better on the market today. And it's quite versatile, being able to go shorter, longer, and used for visual. But as I mentioned earlier, it's a lot of scope price-wise, and possibly more than an APS DSLR user needs. Also, remember that besides the price of the scope, you'll need to spend a few hundred more for camera adapters, tube rings, and mounting plates.

Here's an image of mine in action (or, getting ready for action):

http://www.californiastars.net/img/equipment/observatory-ap900-fsq.jpg

Best,


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mmalik
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: D. Perry]
      #5604091 - 01/04/13 05:02 AM

Thanks hytham/Rex/David/Donghun/Sedat/Daniel

Sedat, thanks for your pics, they look great.

Daniel, your mount/scope setup is simply immaculate; can't think of anything better. Setup I am contemplating will be quite nominal with a 60Da DSLR and auto-guiding, with possible upgrade to a full-frame DSLR. If you don't mind, I would like to embed the image of your setup instead of just a link. What kind of off-axis guider you are using?

While we are on the subject, I would like hear from folks about off-axis guider options for a typical FSQ106EDXIII+DSLR+ST-i/Lodestar kind of setup.

Everyone, I think most of us understand the sporadicity (I made the word) of focuser flexure; and I think most of us also understand the importance of Takahashi recognizing that it IS a problem regardless.

No one has mentioned yet if FSQ106EDXIII can be adapted to a Feather Touch focuser; not that one would want to replace the original focuser, I am just wondering if it is even possible and if there is a Feather Touch Focuser that meets the specs?

About...

TNR = Texas Nautical Repair = Takahashi America = http://www.takahashiamerica.com

Does above look correct? Is TNR just a distributor or actual Takahashi company in the US with the clout to address equipment re-design issues and NOT just the repairs/warranties? Is TNR a vendor on CN and/or have they ever chimed in on such issues?


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mmalik
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5604119 - 01/04/13 05:40 AM

Quote:

@tomcody: Captain's wheel gives you the option of full 178mm in focus...




Quote:

Quote:



•‘Reduced’ 153mm back-focus






This can be changed easily. It is possible to remove the CAA and regain the back-focus distance lost due to this. If you really have to rotate your FOV, you can do this by rotating the scope within the clamshell.




Captain's Wheel ('Q') vs. Without Wheel ('X' III) ?

Would like to know which one is best option for following two DLSR setups:

1. DSLR+2"Adapter+LPS [+OAG+Reducer]
2. DSLR+2"TeleVue 2.0x Powermate [+OAG]

#2 adds significant back-focus and possibly weight; I am wondering if NO Wheel ('X' III) will be limiting for that kind of back-focus; has anyone tried #2 option with 'NO Wheel' model?

Pictures of both setups below…

1. DSLR+2"Adapter+LPS (This I know isn't a problem)


2. DSLR+2"TeleVue 2.0x Powermate
Components:


Assembled: (This one adds significant back-focus; not sure if NO Wheel ('X' III) will allow such tolerance?)


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5604127 - 01/04/13 05:48 AM

I have already adapted FTF2015BCR to be used in tandem with the original focuser. I have also adapted a Baader 3.25 Click lock visual back.

However, FTF2015 BCR will not be good for the most, especially for those who are using larger sensors. This weekend I will look into adapting a 3" Feathertouch focuser.


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5604139 - 01/04/13 06:22 AM

Go for the one without the Captain's Wheel. This rotator needs very special treatment to remain square. If you rotate it under load there is no guarantee that you will fasten it square to the focal plane.

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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5604598 - 01/04/13 11:28 AM

Quote:


While we are on the subject, I would like hear from folks about off-axis guider options for a typical FSQ106EDXIII+DSLR+ST-i/Lodestar kind of setup



For an good OAG check out the monster Mog on the Astrodon site, there is a seperate article there on using it with a FSQ106.
But- from my experience, you don't need or want off axis guiding at 530mm focal length, its over kill, just get a loadstar or SBIG guider camera and the SBIG guider lens kit and it will produce great results at that focal length. I used both systems and much prefer the guider/lens kit for ease of use and ease of finding a guide star.
Quote:


Everyone, I think most of us understand the sporadicity (I made the word) of focuser flexure; and I think most of us also understand the importance of Takahashi recognizing that it IS a problem regardless.



I think the fact that Takahashi has come out with three versions of the FSQ106ED says that they know about the issue.

Quote:


Does above look correct? Is TNR just a distributor or actual Takahashi company in the US with the clout to address equipment re-design issues and NOT just the repairs/warranties? Is TNR a vendor on CN and/or have they ever chimed in on such issues?



Without contacting Japan directly, yes, they are the go to people for Tak in the US ( and probably had much to do with improving the focusers to this point)
As for contacting them in a forum, they are active on the Yahoo forum "Uncensored TakGroup", "Art1942" is the manager for Takahashi at TNR.

Edited by tomcody (01/04/13 01:45 PM)


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5604830 - 01/04/13 01:40 PM

Quote:


Quote:


Does above look correct? Is TNR just a distributor or actual Takahashi company in the US with the clout to address equipment re-design issues and NOT just the repairs/warranties? Is TNR a vendor on CN and/or have they ever chimed in on such issues?



Without contacting Japan directly, yes, they are the go to people for Tak in the US ( and probably had much to do with improving the focusers to this point)
As for contacting them in a forum, they are active on the Yahoo forum "Uncensored TakGroup", "Art1949" is the manager for Takahashi at TNR.





Art is also a member here on CN (CN profile is "art1942us") and whle he's more active on the Tak Yahoo group, he does chime in here from time-to-time.


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5605797 - 01/04/13 11:54 PM

Quote:

I have already adapted FTF2015BCR to be used in tandem with the original focuser. I have also adapted a Baader 3.25 Click lock visual back.

However, FTF2015 BCR will not be good for the most, especially for those who are using larger sensors. This weekend I will look into adapting a 3" Feather Touch focuser.




Thanks Sedat; we'll look forward to your 3" focuser test.

Question: I if search for FTF2015BCR, I get all these..., which one exactly are you referring to? Thx


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5606042 - 01/05/13 05:34 AM

Thanks Rex/John; let’s see if we hear from Tak.

So has anyone tested DSLR+2" Tele Vue 2.0x Powermate... on NON-‘Captain’s Wheel’, i.e., FSQ106EDXIII; Powermate adds significant back-focus so would like to know if ‘Reduced’ 153mm back-focus will suffice?


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5606296 - 01/05/13 10:43 AM

Quote:

Thanks Rex/John; let’s see if we hear from Tak.



I would not expect any answer other than " call Art or Fred" .
By the way Art is very friendly and knowledgeable if you call him at TNR.
Quote:


So has anyone tested DSLR+2" Tele Vue 2.0x Powermate... on NON-‘Captain’s Wheel’, i.e., FSQ106EDXIII; Powermate adds significant back-focus so would like to know if ‘Reduced’ 153mm back-focus will suffice?



I believe that a Powermate does not change the optical in-focus on a system, it just adds physical length, ( I may be mistaken on this one, but that is the way my extender Q works and from what I read, that is the way Televue describes the Powermate's operation)

I think you should do some research as to what type of system you want to set up before you decide which model of FSQ you want. for example, remember that the 2" nose piece reduces available in-focus by 40 mm when you calculate your in- focus needs.
A rotator (CAA) is most used to frame a guider chip image, but a CAA and OAG both eat up at least 75mm (with adapters) so most systems with a CAA and OAG use an all threaded system to eliminate the 40mm used by a nose piece.
A captains wheel model is great for use with a separate guider/ lens mounted either on the rings or on the finder bracket and used with a DSLR and/or a set of bino viewers as you can rotate the binos with the captains wheel and don't usually need to rotate the DSLR . ( at least I prefer all my images with the same orientation for processing purposes).
Just some things to think about.
Rex


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5606319 - 01/05/13 10:59 AM

I was referring to this one. For heavy loads the rack and pinion version should be preferred but a DSLR and a powermate is not heavy for the crayford one at all.

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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5606491 - 01/05/13 12:19 PM

Quote:

Go for the one without the Captain's Wheel. This rotator needs very special treatment to remain square. If you rotate it under load there is no guarantee that you will fasten it square to the focal plane.




Hi Sedat,
Do you mean the captain wheel or CAA by 'rotator'?

Thank you.


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5607004 - 01/05/13 05:37 PM

Quote:

Quote:


So has anyone tested DSLR+2" TeleVue 2.0x Powermate... on NON-‘Captain’s Wheel’, i.e., FSQ106EDXIII; Powermate adds significant back-focus so would like to know if ‘Reduced’ 153mm back-focus will suffice?




I believe that a Powermate does not change the optical in-focus on a system, it just adds physical length, (I may be mistaken on this one, but that is the way my extender Q works and from what I read, that is the way TeleVue describes the Powermate's operation)

I think you should do some research as to what type of system you want to set up before you decide which model of FSQ you want. for example, remember that the 2" nose piece reduces available in-focus by 40 mm when you calculate your in- focus needs.




Actually, Powermate... ADDS significant back-focus besides physical length. Would like to hear from folks who have tested DSLR imaging through 2.0x Powermate on ‘X’ (NON-‘Captain’s Wheel’) model?


Note: The two DSLR setups I have listed above are what I have been using thus far and intend to use if I were to get an FSQ-106.
1. DSLR+2"Adapter+LPS...
2. DSLR+2"TeleVue 2.0x Powermate...


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5607033 - 01/05/13 05:52 PM

Quote:

I was referring to this one. For heavy loads the rack and pinion version should be preferred but a DSLR and a Powermate is not heavy for the Crayford one at all.




Thanks Sedat; would you be able to post some up-close pics of FTF2015BCR adapted to your FSQ-106, preferably FSQ-106EDXIII. One thing I am not clear about is if whole FTF2015BCR... can be adapted or just the bottom knobs section?


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5608688 - 01/06/13 03:54 PM

Today, I took some photos for you:

First, the picture of the female-female adaptor I made



I am threading this onto the TAR0130



I can then thread on the Baader clicklock visual back to FSQ106. I have originally purchased this for my C11 Edge, to be fitted to the 3.25" at the back of this scope. But I made an adaptor flange and I am able to use it with the FSQ as well.







Now I am fitting the FTF2015 BCR











In this configuration, after the course adjustment, you should lock down the stock focuser (to eliminate all the play of the Tak focuser) and use the Feather Touch for fine focusing. However, the smaller inner diameter may introduce some vignetting depending on your sensor size. I have tried this configuration with QSI683 and didn't notice an objectionable vignetting. Below is an uncalibrated, stretched light frame for you to see what I mean:



Hires photo

Most probably, full frame sensors will have some light fall off in the corners but for the time being I don't have access to such a sensor.




Edited by bilgebay (01/06/13 04:41 PM)


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5608780 - 01/06/13 04:38 PM

This FTF2015 crayford focuser is capable of lifting 8-10 pounds, which is way above my needs for the time being.

For heavier equipment, either the FTF2015BCR-RP rack and pinion version can be used, again leaving the stock focuser in place, or else one of the 3" rack and pinion focusers can be adapted to the FSQ106's body easily.

Here are some photos to give you an idea as to how this 3" focuser compares to the 2" one and the stock focuser



The 3" inner diameter looks more than sufficient and larger than the diameter of the corrector lens.



Edited by bilgebay (01/07/13 02:25 PM)


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5608992 - 01/06/13 06:24 PM

This is great info Sedat and I really appreciate; I am sure it comes handy to lot of folks. More follow-up questions:

•I presume TAR0130 is a spacer that doesn't come with FSQ106, correct?

•The female-female adapter you improvised may not come handy for everyone, so does that mean those folks are out of luck on such FTF2015BCR adaptation? Is there an actual female-female adapter that could be used instead of creating one?

•I can see 2” FTF2015BCR adaptation might be prohibitive for most, notwithstanding any vignetting it may cause on full frame sensors.

•What is the part number for 3" rack and pinion focusers you show?

•I see 3" FT focuser doesn't require TAR0130 spacer, correct? Does it adapt without needed any additional pieces? If yes, this might be the simplest adaptation (i.e., no improvising) if I understand correctly? Does 3” focuser directly thread-on/attach to FSQ-106EDXIII?

•On the flip side, I can already see the advantage of using add-on focusers on ‘Reduced’ 153mm back-focus on FSQ-106EDXIII where they will add quite a bit of back-focus for situations like the one I cite above (adding 2" TeleVue 2.0x Powermate, etc.)

•Last but not least, would heavy 3" FT focuser along with attached equipment cause flexure inherent in the FSQ-106EDXIII design (since stock focuser mechanism stays in place in all of these add-on scenarios)?

Hope you don’t mind my asking all these questions, you have been a great help. Regards


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5610165 - 01/07/13 12:43 PM

Hi again,

Quote:

I presume TAR0130 is a spacer that doesn't come with FSQ106, correct?




This part is not included in the price but can be ordered from TNR or through their dealers. It is an original Tak accessory.

Quote:

The female-female adapter you improvised may not come handy for everyone, so does that mean those folks are out of luck on such FTF2015BCR adaptation? Is there an actual female-female adapter that could be used instead of creating one?




I don't know if TNR has a female-female adaptor. It was too easy to build so I did it. But this is not all you gonna need; you also need an adaptor to fit the dovetail of the FTF2015 focuser which on the outside should have the same thread as TAR0130.

I will share the drawings with Wayne from Starlight Instruments so that they can build this adaptor as an accessory for their focusers.

Quote:

I can see 2” FTF2015BCR adaptation might be prohibitive for most, notwithstanding any vignetting it may cause on full frame sensors.




I am not sure I understand you here correctly. Why would it be prohibitive for most ?

Quote:

What is the part number for 3" rack and pinion focusers you show?




FTF3025B-A is the one I have at hand (came with my TMB92SS) but FTF3015 or FTF3035 can be chosen as well depending on the individual's needs.

Quote:

I see 3" FT focuser doesn't require TAR0130 spacer, correct? Does it adapt without needed any additional pieces? If yes, this might be the simplest adaptation (i.e., no improvising) if I understand correctly? Does 3” focuser directly thread-on/attach to FSQ-106EDXIII?




No, on the contrary, this is the most complicated adaptation. You will need to remove the tak focuser assy and build an adaptor to fit the FT focuser to the rear of the FSQ's tube. Unless I have a really heavy imaging system, I am not planning to go into that. But for those who need something better than Tak focuser, at least there is a solution.

Quote:

On the flip side, I can already see the advantage of using add-on focusers on ‘Reduced’ 153mm back-focus on FSQ-106EDXIII where they will add quite a bit of back-focus for situations like the one I cite above (adding 2" TeleVue 2.0x Powermate, etc.)




This, completely depends on the imaging system you have. For me this configuration is great and it appears it will be fine for you too. But if you consider that the second focuser is eating up the very precious back focus real estate, it can be a great problem for some of the users.

Quote:

Last but not least, would heavy 3" FT focuser along with attached equipment cause flexure inherent in the FSQ-106EDXIII design (since stock focuser mechanism stays in place in all of these add-on scenarios)?




As mentioned above, when the 3" focuser is considered, the stock focuser should be removed from the back of the tube. Otherwise you won't have enough back focus for your imaging system to reach focus( you will need more in_focus but it won't be available)

Hope I have answered your questions satisfactorily.

Clear skies

Sedat


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5611440 - 01/08/13 07:25 AM

Quote:

Quote:

The female-female adapter you improvised may not come handy for everyone, so does that mean those folks are out of luck on such FTF2015BCR adaptation? Is there an actual female-female adapter that could be used instead of creating one?



I don't know if TNR has a female-female adaptor. It was too easy to build so I did it. But this is not all you gonna need; you also need an adaptor to fit the dovetail of the FTF2015 focuser which on the outside should have the same thread as TAR0130.

I will share the drawings with Wayne from Starlight Instruments so that they can build this adaptor as an accessory for their focusers.

Quote:

I can see 2” FTF2015BCR adaptation might be prohibitive for most, notwithstanding any vignetting it may cause on full frame sensors.




I am not sure I understand you here correctly. Why would it be prohibitive for most ?

Quote:

I see 3" FT focuser doesn't require TAR0130 spacer, correct? Does it adapt without needed any additional pieces? If yes, this might be the simplest adaptation (i.e., no improvising) if I understand correctly? Does 3” focuser directly thread-on/attach to FSQ-106EDXIII?




No, on the contrary, this is the most complicated adaptation. You will need to remove the tak focuser assy and build an adaptor to fit the FT focuser to the rear of the FSQ's tube. Unless I have a really heavy imaging system, I am not planning to go into that. But for those who need something better than Tak focuser, at least there is a solution.




Thanks Mr. Bilgebay for all the feedback. I like the engineering side of the focuser adaptations but I also feel some of us just might want to use things out-of-the-box at times after spending hefty sum$ and that’s a disadvantage.

About 2” FTF2015BCR focuser, dovetail adaptor part for FTF2015 sounds complicated. Also what I was referring to is that, as you have said, there is inherent vignetting problem with that setup, especially for full frame sensors, even if Starlight Instruments were to build the accessory for it.

Let me also clarify what I meant about the back-focus; there are two aspects I am talking about, having more “IN” focus when using standard 2” DSLR adapter setup, and having more “OUT” focus when using magnifiers of ‘2" TeleVue 2.0x Powermate’ type. Basically a large focuser displacement is required to fit both scenarios.

About 3” FTF3025B-A focuser, it seems to fit the requirements we talk about (no vignetting, having extensive IN and OUT travel), it also seems more invasive and almost prohibitive, as you mention, plus I am afraid any flexing it may introduce due to its own+equipment weight.

Last but not least, I do feel Tak will be best served by putting Feather Touch focusers by default on these scopes. Keep your comments/insights coming. Regards


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: D. Perry]
      #5611468 - 01/08/13 08:03 AM

Quote:

Here's an image of mine in action (or, getting ready for action):

http://www.californiastars.net/img/equipment/observatory-ap900-fsq.jpg





Daniel, wanted to share great setup of yours and to ask if you could provide the mounting plate and rings specifics/brand/part #s. Thanks in advance. Regards


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5613706 - 01/09/13 01:10 PM

Quote:

Last but not least, I do feel Tak will be best served by putting Feather Touch focusers by default on these scopes




Ditto!


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5613764 - 01/09/13 01:46 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Last but not least, I do feel Tak will be best served by putting Feather Touch focusers by default on these scopes




Ditto!




I'm sure they will sell much more scopes by just doing that!


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: Denimsky]
      #5614368 - 01/09/13 07:41 PM

You know that on the Yahoo Narrowband imaging group, this problem was discussed and the best solution was to have Precise parts machine a custom tube and replace the entire focuser with a machined tube and an FLI Atlas focuser. Problem solved for any weight of camera.
Rex


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5614951 - 01/10/13 06:55 AM

I had contacted Art (TNR) and he asked me to send him a list of questions that he could answer; I have compiled a list of issues/questions. Feel free to add to what I have put together which is sum of all what I feel has been discussed in this and the other... thread. Thx

This thread being heavily focused on FSQ-106EDXIII, most questions are regarding the same:

Flexure:
A well-known and most common problem reported on FSQ-106EDXIII is focuser flexure; please read the threads for details. ED has gone through ‘ED (Old)’, ‘Q’ and ‘X’ models but focuser flexure problem remains to be resolved; some users have suggested the very reason FSQ-106ED has gone through three versions already speaks for the awareness/acknowledgment of the problem by Takahashi. It is true FSQ-106EDXIII focuser may not flex under nominal load but it HAS flexure for practical applications regardless as most have stated in this and other other... thread. Some folks are re-engineering the stock focuser, some have suggested less invasive measures like re-tensioning, re-greasing the focuser, etc. So most important question would be when the stock focuser on FSQ-106EDXIII is really going to be fixed/re-designed for all practical load scenarios?

Defocusing:
Although most understand that some defocusing will happen with temperature changes, there seems to be a consistent problem with FSQ-106EDXIII focuser getting defocussed; some have suggested this being the result of different density materials (thick cast focuser housing/thin focuser tube) affecting clearances, hence the design; others have provided tips how to manually compensate for defocusing, etc. When is FSQ-106EDXIII defocussing under temperature changes going to be addressed?

Collimation:
Poor collimation on some of the FSQ-106EDXIII have been reported. Most of us wouldn’t have expected this problem on such a small/solid looking scope; personally I would rather like NOT even to check the collimation on a scope of this caliber and value, and have the peace of mind that it came collimated. Please comment on what’s being done to fix this problem once for all?

Focuser Adaption:
To overcome stock focuser issues, some users have tried Feather Touch adaption which is neither straightforward nor anomaly free (vignetting being the one, 2” FTF2015BCR focuser requiring complex ring and dovetail adaption with the existing stock focuser, 3” FTF3025B-A focuser adaption, to completely replace stock focuser, being the most complex, etc.), while some are suggesting replacing stock focuser with machined custom tube, etc. Is any re-design effort being made to have FSQ-106EDXIII either adaptable (out-of-box) to specific/certified Feather Touch focuser/s and/or have needed parts designed/available to make such adaptions possible?

Feather Touch ‘out-of-the-box’:
Given the challenges, are there any plans to forgo FSQ-106EDXIII stock focuser altogether in favor of Feather Touch?

Where to buy:
Is TNR best place to buy FSQ-106EDXIII given issues listed above and having the ease of any warranty work that users may need performed on these scopes?

Quality Control:
Given the sporadic nature of some of these issues, is QC being missed on some of the scopes?

Warranty Transferability:
Warranty is non-transferable, and it is a grave concern for most; a can you address that?

TNR Clout:
How much clout TNR has to have above issues corrected, some of which require major design changes? In other words, is TNR just a distributor or much more than that; what are the chances these issues make it to Takahashi Japan in case TNR is not in such an advantageous position?

Regards


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5615557 - 01/10/13 01:37 PM

Have you considered buying a Televue NP-101is?
Given your concerns stated above, you might like it better.


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5615928 - 01/10/13 05:34 PM

Hi mmalik,

Sorry for the delay in responding. Here are some answers to your questions...

- Yes, feel free to embed an image of my scope/mount setup.

- I use SoCalAstro tube rings and dovetail plates. You can find everything at http://www.socalastro.com/Products.htm

- The OAG is the Astrodon MMOAG (Monster Manual Off-Axis Guider). I'm using an SBIG ST-i autoguider and an FLI ML11002-C imaging camera.

- All of this info is on the Equipment page of my site:
http://www.californiastars.net/equipment.php

If you're planning to eventually move to a 44mm diagonal chip then, yes, the FSQ is the best option for a readily available 4" refractor (in my opinion). I honestly don't think you're going to see any issues with the scope and any DSLR.

Keep in mind that all of the issues you're worrying about and that have been discussed here, have been discussed by about 5-6 people in this thread. That represents a tiny fraction of the number of FSQs out there. There are plenty of people imaging with 16803 cameras with 5-pound bodies and huge filter wheels, and they're getting excellent images. There have been a couple people who went to extremes to replace the entire rear cell of the scope but it's not something the vast majority of people are going to need to worry about.

Every scope will have some kind of issue or something about it you might not like. Given that the FSQ already has excellent, corrected optics with an imaging circle of 88mm, and a solid focuser with 10:1 focusing and a focus lock, it's a better starting point than almost all other scopes out there in its class. The TeleVue NP scopes and the discontinued Pentax SDP telescopes are pretty much the only direct competitors. Some of the other manufacturers make excellent scopes but almost none of them are as fully corrected over as wide a field as the FSQ. And while many of them have reducers and field flatteners available, most will still exhibit noticeable levels of vignetting, field curvature, coma, and even CA, on a 35mm format or larger chip. A noteable exception here is Astro-Physics, as they tailor their reducers/flatteners to their scopes and have excellent large format options (get ready to wait 8 years for a new scope though).

Again, all of this is just my 2 cents. I'm partial to Tak, obviously, and have not been disappointed with the 3 I've owned (FSQ-106ED-XIII, FS-60CB, and TOA-130F).

Here are some images from my FSQ:

http://www.californiastars.net/gallery-ngc7000-ic5070-ml11k-fsq.php

http://www.californiastars.net/gallery-ic1318-ngc6888-ml11k-fsq.php

http://www.californiastars.net/gallery-m008-m020-ml11k-fsq.php

Best,


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mmalik
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5616037 - 01/10/13 06:43 PM

Quote:

Have you considered buying a TeleVue NP-101is?




@Jon said it right in another thread...; and I agree.

Plus I have been doing narrow-angle AP and would like to try wide-angle which is not possible/of quality with anything but FSQ-106EDXIII.


Note: Few samples of my narrow-angle AP:
NGC 7331 - Spiral Galaxy In Pegasus...
IC 434, Barnard 33 - Horsehead Nebula...
Horsehead Nebula [Up Close]...
NGC 7023 - Iris Nebula [Up Close]...


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: D. Perry]
      #5622246 - 01/14/13 08:27 AM

Quote:

If you're planning to eventually move to a 44mm diagonal chip then, yes, the FSQ is the best option for a readily available 4" refractor (in my opinion). I honestly don't think you're going to see any issues with the scope and any DSLR.

Keep in mind that all of the issues you're worrying about and that have been discussed here, have been discussed by about 5-6 people in this thread. That represents a tiny fraction of the number of FSQs out there. There are plenty of people imaging with 16803 cameras with 5-pound bodies and huge filter wheels, and they're getting excellent images. There have been a couple people who went to extremes to replace the entire rear cell of the scope but it's not something the vast majority of people are going to need to worry about.




Thanks Perry for your feedback and all the details, very much appreciated. Like your astro-photos.

Perry, no, not worrying, just trying to understand and possibly help address long standing focuser and flexure issues which I do understand are NOT much of a concern with the basic DSLR setup but could be a problem with heavier pay loads.

Everyone, changing gears a bit; I have been doing DSLR imaging and may possibly dabble in CCD imaging. I would like to know about your experience in mounting SBIG CCD STT-8300M Camera + FW8-STT Self-Guiding Filter Wheel specifically to FSQ-106EDXIII? Any pics you could post of your ‘FSQ-106EDXIII + STT-8300M + FW8-STT Self-Guiding Filter Wheel’ setup will be greatly appreciated.

(Note: This is different from older STF-8300M CCD camera and FW5/FW8 filter wheels)


On a side note, in an effort to learn and explore more about CCD imaging, I have created a post in CCD forum on Understanding STF-8300M & STT-8300M...; if you would like to contribute to CCD discussion then no need to respond here; use the link... instead. Regards


Note: My DSLR work here...; some DSLR processing instructions here....


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5622542 - 01/14/13 11:52 AM

I looked at the FSQ-106EDXIII at NEAF and one thing I noticed was how short the focuser travel is. I have gotten used to the ~5" of travel on the AP130EDFGT with a 2" diagonal comfortably fitting in the back of the focuser and lots of in-focus waiting to be used. For photography, I have been needing to add spacers to get to focus, though. With that said, the FT focuser just doesn't complain under any circumstances. I've wondered why a FT complete focuser (replace the 4") doesn't exist for the FSQ-106 series. Very impressive scopes, but the focuser is a bit odd.

Sedat- the Spock on the cabinets is really cool.

-Rich

Edited by Starhawk (01/14/13 11:53 AM)


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: Starhawk]
      #5622578 - 01/14/13 12:17 PM

Ft focusers and adapters are available for all the FSQ106 scopes. Check the Starlight Instruments web site.
Rex


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5622606 - 01/14/13 12:40 PM

I just purchased a 106EDXIII model and hope to piggyback it atop a newly purchased TOA-150 using my 10 year old Paramount ME. I plan on doing NB imaging with the 106 using a QSI683 WSG-8 camera. I'm planning on using Parallax rings and Losmandy plates for the connections. I've had the 106 for a week but am waiting for one last adapter piece (blasted thing!) to hook up the camera. The TPA-150 should be here this week.

Any advice or cautions on this piggyback setup ?

I've moved from a dark site to a LP site with poor seeing and I'll be replacing my Meade 16" LX220R OTA with the TOA-150
Dan


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: Starhawk]
      #5622942 - 01/14/13 03:58 PM

Quote:



Sedat- the Spock on the cabinets is really cool.

-Rich




Finally, someone noticed the poor creature, after 1000 or so views

Thank you Rich


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5622970 - 01/14/13 04:10 PM

Quote:

Ft focusers and adapters are available for all the FSQ106 scopes. Check the Starlight Instruments web site.
Rex




Yes, they do. But the cost is over a grand! If had a heavy image train and a full frame sensor, probably I would bite the bullet and replace the entire focuser. However, the question is why! Why would I throw away the stock focuser for which I paid so much money and why would Takahashi originally NOT supply a focuser, eg FT, to match the optics of this little gem.

Cheers


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5623352 - 01/14/13 08:23 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Ft focusers and adapters are available for all the FSQ106 scopes. Check the Starlight Instruments web site.
Rex




Yes, they do. But the cost is over a grand! If had a heavy image train and a full frame sensor, probably I would bite the bullet and replace the entire focuser. However, the question is why! Why would I throw away the stock focuser for which I paid so much money and why would Takahashi originally NOT supply a focuser, e.g., FT, to match the optics of this little gem.

Cheers




Thanks Mr. Bilgebay, that’s the crux of the matter with FSQ-106EDXIII. I am still waiting to hear from Mr. Art; will ping him. Thx


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5623449 - 01/14/13 09:24 PM

Quote:

Quote:

Ft focusers and adapters are available for all the FSQ106 scopes. Check the Starlight Instruments web site.
Rex




Yes, they do. But the cost is over a grand! If had a heavy image train and a full frame sensor, probably I would bite the bullet and replace the entire focuser. However, the question is why! Why would I throw away the stock focuser for which I paid so much money and why would Takahashi originally NOT supply a focuser, eg FT, to match the optics of this little gem.

Cheers

SEDAT



Please note that I was answering StarHawk's question regarding the availability of a FT replacement focuser. I was not advocating anyone to change their focuser, I like Takahashi focusers!
Rex


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5623857 - 01/15/13 06:00 AM

And I was not reacting to you but Takahashi Hope I haven't upset you.

Regards

Sedat


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5624109 - 01/15/13 10:05 AM

Not upset at all, just wanted everyone to be clear on my posting.
Thanks,
Rex


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mintakaX]
      #5624997 - 01/15/13 07:17 PM

Quote:

I just purchased a 106EDXIII model and hope to piggyback it atop a newly purchased TOA-150 using my 10 year old Paramount ME. I plan on doing NB imaging with the 106 using a QSI683 WSG-8 camera. I'm planning on using Parallax rings and Losmandy plates for the connections. I've had the 106 for a week but am waiting for one last adapter piece (blasted thing!) to hook up the camera. The TPA-150 should be here this week.

Any advice or cautions on this piggyback setup ?

I've moved from a dark site to a LP site with poor seeing and I'll be replacing my Meade 16" LX220R OTA with the TOA-150
Dan



Just one suggestion, you may want to consider a FLI Atlas focuser. The advantages are;
1. you can lock your FSQ focuser and avoid any play
2. The Atlas has the finest step resolution available so you can really dial in the small critical focus zone of the FSQ.
3. The Atlas is only about 2 lbs heavier than the robofocus.
4. The Atlas's very fine resolution, allows you to run real time temp compensation during an exposure.
5. The Atlas/camera combo should be able to be moved easily between the FSQ and the TOA 150, so you can image with both.
Just some things to consider.
Rex


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5625108 - 01/15/13 08:14 PM

Here's what I did to my EDXIII to eliminate focuser issues, plus an FLI Atlas -

Focuser replacement


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: sbradbury]
      #5625120 - 01/15/13 08:23 PM

Very nice! Did Precise Parts make the spacer?

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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5625180 - 01/15/13 08:52 PM

yes, Precise Parts made the focuser length adapter and the CAA length adapter, I shipped him the focuser and he duplicated the dimensions. The two shorter ones are tak 25mm spacers.

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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: sbradbury]
      #5625200 - 01/15/13 09:05 PM

sbradbury, any issues with your setup? The Atlas has been OK?
Thanks,
Mike


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mikeschuster]
      #5625203 - 01/15/13 09:10 PM

The Atlas is an amazing piece of engineering, it's worked very well and I highly recommend it.

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mmalik
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5626570 - 01/16/13 04:48 PM

Following quote from a CCD thread....

Quote:

@pfile: Here's a picture of all the junk attached to...






Imaging equipment above consists of following [I doubt FSQ-106EDXIII can reach focus with this, correct?]
STT-8300M CCD Camera... + FW8-STT Self-Guiding Filter Wheel + AO-8 Adaptive Optics for ST Series...



I know above is bit of a stretch; now consider following:

STT-8300M CCD Camera... [~3 lbs] + FW8-STT Self-Guiding Filter Wheel [~2 lbs] + FSQ-106EDXIII

•Would FSQ-106EDXIII come to focus with this (i.e., without AO) setup?
•Would FSQ-106EDXIII ‘not’ flex with this (i.e., without AO) load?
•Has anyone tested this particular (i.e., without AO) setup? If yes, please post pics if you can and share your experience?

Thx


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mintakaX
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5629739 - 01/18/13 11:16 AM

Quote:

Quote:

I just purchased a 106EDXIII model and hope to piggyback it atop a newly purchased TOA-150 using my 10 year old Paramount ME. I plan on doing NB imaging with the 106 using a QSI683 WSG-8 camera. I'm planning on using Parallax rings and Losmandy plates for the connections. I've had the 106 for a week but am waiting for one last adapter piece (blasted thing!) to hook up the camera. The TPA-150 should be here this week.

Any advice or cautions on this piggyback setup ?

I've moved from a dark site to a LP site with poor seeing and I'll be replacing my Meade 16" LX220R OTA with the TOA-150
Dan



Just one suggestion, you may want to consider a FLI Atlas focuser. The advantages are;
1. you can lock your FSQ focuser and avoid any play
2. The Atlas has the finest step resolution available so you can really dial in the small critical focus zone of the FSQ.
3. The Atlas is only about 2 lbs heavier than the robofocus.
4. The Atlas's very fine resolution, allows you to run real time temp compensation during an exposure.
5. The Atlas/camera combo should be able to be moved easily between the FSQ and the TOA 150, so you can image with both.
Just some things to consider.
Rex




Thanks Rex
I'm using The SkyX Pro on a MacOSX and I need to find out if the Atlas is supported.
Also does the Atlas have a temp sensor ? It seems like a great focuser for the FSQ.
Dan


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tomcody
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mintakaX]
      #5630369 - 01/18/13 06:29 PM

FLI has a plug-in for the SkyX on OSX listed on their support page, don,t know what it includes?
Also FLI lists a optional temp sensor available for the PDF focuser, you may want to check with them to see if one is available for the Atlas.
Rex


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: sbradbury]
      #5631110 - 01/19/13 07:27 AM

With the inspiration from the photo you shared, I've just removed the focuser to see what can be done with the bare tube. I wanted to share the following photo for others to see how the FSQ106EDX looks like sans focuser:





Sorry for the mess on the table promise to tidy up today or tomorrow


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5631134 - 01/19/13 08:02 AM

I wanted to see if it would be possible to use my existing Feather Touch FTF3025B-A 3" rack and pinion focuser. It appears it wont work because the draw tube is hitting the Petzval lens tube. If the inside diameter of FT were only 1mm larger that would be a terrific focuser for this scope. However, the shorter one will be perfectly ok. The part number is FTF3015B-A. This one will have the same travel as the stock focuser and is wide enough not to cause vignetting for the majority of the cameras.





In my case however, if I am to buy a new focuser, I will buy the 3,5" one. There is no point in buying another 3" focuser. Buying a 3.5" will leave me with a more versatile focuser stock for future.

With my current imaging setups, I don't feel the need for this upgrade yet. I will stick to the stock focuser and my FTF2015BCR tandem adaptation depending on the conditions. If I see that these are not upto my imaging needs, I will make the move to the 3,5" Feather Touch.

Atlas focuser is a very good option but I've read somewhere that it has its own problems too.


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5632748 - 01/20/13 08:46 AM

Quote:

In my case however, if I am to buy a new focuser, I will buy the 3,5" one. There is no point in buying another 3" focuser. Buying a 3.5" will leave me with a more versatile focuser stock for future.




Sedat, could you suggest the appropriate part # for 3.5" focuser you talk about; there are three that come up (FTF3515B-A/FTF3545B-A/FTF3545B)? I think 3.5" will look really impressive, aesthetically I mean in comparison to 3.0”, if 3.5” were to properly adapt to FSQ-106EDXIII; would you agree?

Everyone, was wondering if someone may have all the right pieces at hand (i.e., FSQ-106EDXIII & 3.5" FT focuser), and if they could try adapting (3.5” focuser I mean) and reporting results/posting pictures? Thanks in advance!

Sedat, thanks for confirming the 3.0" focuser (i.e., FTF3015B-A); here... is the url. Question: How easy it is by the way to remove the stock focuser from the main scope (the way you show in your pics I mean)? Regards


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5633092 - 01/20/13 12:18 PM

Starlight instruments
Starlight makes an adapter for the FSSQ106ED
(Also: under Related Products, they tell you which focuser fits that telescope)

Edited by tomcody (01/20/13 12:21 PM)


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5633395 - 01/20/13 03:03 PM


Hi Mike,

The parts you will need are this and this.

It is very easy to dismantle the focuser. There is a tiny lock screw on the side of the focuser body, once you undo this you can start rotating the focuser body counter clockwise. Very simple.

3,5" focuser is the way to go definitely.

Clear skies

Sedat


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5633526 - 01/20/13 04:40 PM

Mike- you might also want to have a look at the new thread I have started in the equipment forum.

I have tested the accuracy of the Micro Touch system in combination with the FSQ's stock focuser and put 2 videos together to demonstrate the results.

Sedat


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5633963 - 01/20/13 09:39 PM

Quote:

@tomcody: Starlight instruments
Starlight makes an adapter for the FSSQ106ED
(Also: under Related Products, they tell you which focuser fits that telescope)




Quote:

The parts you will need are this and this.

...

3.5" focuser is the way to go definitely.



Rex/Sedat, this is great; and this does it then. I really didn’t know if there was such a solution already in place that didn’t require custom made parts.

Now all that's needed is some volunteer/s out there who could put these (3.5”) pieces together [FSQ-106EDXIII... + A35-503-FSQ106ED... + FTF3515B-A...] and provide feedback/share pics; I am afraid it might be a while before I am able to purchase/test these components myself. Regards


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5634268 - 01/21/13 01:17 AM

I was wondering if FT A35-503-FSQ106ED... 3.5” adapter has any bearing on EDQ (with ‘Captain’s Wheel’) vs. EDXIII (without ‘Captain’s Wheel’)? Can someone confirm? Would it adapt to both or just one of ‘em? Thx

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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5635222 - 01/21/13 03:36 PM

According to SI website, that adapter is "Known To Fit Takahashi FSQ106ED, 2009 or newer" but looking at the pictures below I am not so sure





I believe you would need a longer adapter to get rid of the Captain's Wheel, which is one of the flex areas. If you leave it in place this defeats the purpose, doesn't it ?

Just to remind, here is FSQ106EDXIII sans focuser



Another possibility is; this adaptor may be good for the Captain's Wheel version and wrong for the EDXIII version since they are mentioning 2009 and EDXIII is a more recent incarnation.



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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5635778 - 01/21/13 09:42 PM

Quote:

I believe you would need a longer adapter to get rid of the Captain's Wheel, which is one of the flex areas. If you leave it in place this defeats the purpose, doesn't it?



Very much agree...


Quote:

According to SI website, that adapter is "Known To Fit Takahashi FSQ106ED, 2009 or newer" but looking at the pictures below I am not so sure.

...

Another possibility is; this adaptor may be good for the Captain's Wheel version and wrong for the EDXIII version since they are mentioning 2009 and EDXIII is a more recent incarnation.



Yes, I read that (2009 stuff...) too and I fear the same thing.


Best would be if someone could just buy ONLY $149.00 adapter [A35-503-FSQ106ED...] and check if it even fits EDXIII? [...and return if it didn't]


Any volunteers? I would have tested myself if I had an EDXIII with me.


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5643925 - 01/26/13 08:08 AM

Was wondering if there is a Starlight Instruments vendor resource here on CN that could answer the question whether A35-503-FSQ106ED... adapter will fit EDXIII specifically?

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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5686462 - 02/18/13 06:14 AM

Quote:

Was wondering if there is a Starlight Instruments vendor resource here on CN that could answer the question whether A35-503-FSQ106ED... adapter will fit EDXIII specifically?




I contacted Wayne at Starlight Instruments regarding above question, and his answer was "Can you measure the threads on the OTA? This adapter should fit, but if you are able to get me the thread dimension of the OTA, this will allow me to confirm that it will fit."

So now my question is the same for Sedat or anyone who could help answer? Thx


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5686961 - 02/18/13 12:50 PM

Hi Mike,

We are exhibiting at a boat show in Istanbul until next sunday. Then I will fly to Austria for CEDIC. The earliest I can take the measurement is like 10th of March. Please PM me if you don't get this info from anybody else.

Cheers


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5687371 - 02/18/13 05:24 PM

Sedat, here is latest from Wayne, "All 3* versions of the FSQ106ED should all have the same thread dimension of the OTA which is M133X1"; what does M133X1 mean, I don't know. Any ideas? If you know what he means then we may not need to measure the threads. Thx


*:
•FSQ-106ED..........................(Old one)
•FSQ-106ED New “Q”............[with ‘Captain’s Wheel’]
•FSQ-106EDXIII.....................[without ‘Captain’s Wheel’]


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5689036 - 02/19/13 02:51 PM

Mike- 133 is the diameter of the thread in mm and 1 is the pitch of the thread in mm again. I cannot confirm this before measuring.

Clear skies.


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5696491 - 02/23/13 12:13 PM

Look forward to your measurements when you can? Thx

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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5727437 - 03/12/13 04:28 AM

Quote:

The earliest I can take the measurement is like 10th of March.






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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5727524 - 03/12/13 06:27 AM

I know I'm on a biz trip. As soon as I reach my obs i will do this.

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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5735701 - 03/16/13 09:02 AM

Quote:

Sedat, here is latest from Wayne, "All 3* versions of the FSQ106ED should all have the same thread dimension of the OTA which is M133X1"; what does M133X1 mean, I don't know. Any ideas? If you know what he means then we may not need to measure the threads. Thx


*:
•FSQ-106ED..........................(Old one)
•FSQ-106ED New “Q”............[with ‘Captain’s Wheel’]
•FSQ-106EDXIII.....................[without ‘Captain’s Wheel’]




Hi Mike,

Finally, I am able to confirm that the thread is M133x1.

To be able to use this thread, you need to dismantle one more part from the rear of the scope:



First, you need to loosen the two 1,3mm socket head lock screws then, unthread the aluminium distance piece.





Then you reach the stainless steel collar where you will see this M133x1 thread





Once you remove the aluminium distance piece and leave the tube only with the SS collars, both EDXIII and ED with Captain's Wheel will be the same. I don't have access to a first generation FSQ106ED so I am unable to confirm whether it has the same carcass as the other two or not.

Just to help visualise the situation, here are 2nd and 3rd generation FSQ106 ED scopes once again:





Hope this helps.

Before I forget, you owe me a beer Mike Removing this last adaptor was a bit risky, I sweated a lot when I was removing it. Since I didn't have any exploded views of the scope, I wasn't sure if it had anything to do with the collimation of the rear lens group. I was lucky! It turned out to be just another adaptor, nothing more

Clear skies

Sedat


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5738014 - 03/17/13 04:42 AM

Quote:

Finally, I am able to confirm that the thread is M133x1.




Thanks Sedat; really appreciate it. I owe you one!


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5744866 - 03/20/13 10:56 AM

Hi all!

Just found this thread...

I have an EDXIII that I bought from OPT and transported to Sweden where I have it on my balcony on top of either the 10Micron GM1000HPS or the GM2000HPS.

I find the focuser a little "untight" and passed by TNR two weeks ago while on a business trip to Houston. The message was clear; the focuser can be adjusted - carefully.

A drop of acetone in the four hex screws at the bottom of the focuser, wait a while, then tighten them exactly the same amount.

All in all, the visit to TNR was very short and very nice (I was on my way to the airport with my collegues waiting in the car). Top guys!


/per


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mmalik
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: Per Frejvall]
      #5745662 - 03/20/13 05:06 PM

Quote:

A drop of acetone in the four hex screws at the bottom of the focuser, wait a while, then tighten them exactly the same amount.




Thanks for the tip. This acetone remedy has been mentioned quit a bit; seems like a viable option for the default focuser. Regards


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5745682 - 03/20/13 05:12 PM

Quote:

Finally, I am able to confirm that the thread is M133x1.




Sedat & all, following is the latest per Wayne Schroeder of FeatherTouch; pretty much validates our conclusion. Thx


"Yes the A35-503-FSQ106ED adapter will fit all versions of the FSQ106ED. The scopes that come with the stock captains wheel must be removed."


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5745734 - 03/20/13 05:32 PM

Following are now "confirmed" pieces of the puzzle if someone could put together and may be share the pics of the setup; if someone may already have this, please post the pics as well and share your experience. Thanks in advance!

FSQ-106EDXIII... (without ‘Captain’s Wheel’)

A35-503-FSQ106ED...

FTF3515B-A...


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5748037 - 03/21/13 05:04 PM

Thanks to Wayne Schroeder of FeatherTouch, here is what an...

FSQ-106EDXIII...
A35-503-FSQ106ED...
FTF3515B-A...

...integration looks like; pretty impressive! ONLY now if Takahashi would also offer one out of the box? Will try contacting Art of TNR; your support will be greatly appreciated. Regards




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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5749254 - 03/22/13 09:17 AM

This is a real beauty! I want to thank you and Wayne to present this as a tangible option to us.

Unfortunately, current owners have already paid for the stock focuser.

Unless, someone has a real heavy rig to hang, he has to contend with the stock focuser.

Another problem I see here is losing the ability to play with the back focus as necessary. When you chose this option, you will be stuck with 1.5" focuser travel.


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5749329 - 03/22/13 09:54 AM

Quote:

This is a real beauty! I want to thank you and Wayne to present this as a tangible option to us.

Unfortunately, current owners have already paid for the stock focuser.

Unless, someone has a real heavy rig to hang, he has to contend with the stock focuser.

Another problem I see here is losing the ability to play with the back focus as necessary. When you chose this option, you will be stuck with 1.5" focuser travel.



What do you mean by " loose the ability to play with the back focus as necessary" ?
Rex


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5756356 - 03/25/13 02:58 PM

Quote:

Thanks to Wayne Schroeder of FeatherTouch, here is what an...

FSQ-106EDXIII...
A35-503-FSQ106ED...
FTF3515B-A...

...integration looks like; pretty impressive! ONLY now if Takahashi would also offer one out of the box? Will try contacting Art of TNR; your support will be greatly appreciated. Regards

Image...




Sedat and all, I have heard back from Art of TNR, he is going to see if Takahashi will consider this; this is what Art said, "I will replay it to Takahashi". Regards


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5756377 - 03/25/13 03:07 PM

Quote:

Another problem I see here is losing the ability to play with the back focus as necessary. When you chose this option, you will be stuck with 1.5" focuser travel.




Don't you think 1.5" travel would be sufficient for standard imaging setup, e.g., a DSLR with an off-axis guider or CCD with an off-axis guider integrated filter wheel? I understand using anything additional, e.g., a magnifier will put you beyond the back focus point. Your thoughts?


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #5756620 - 03/25/13 05:11 PM

I think this will depend on the individual setup. I need to study this but will not have time for a while Mike.

Good to hear that Tak will at least hear about our cries


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5760094 - 03/27/13 12:00 PM

Sedat,
What is the total travel in the stock FSQ106ED focuser? Looking at your pictures it can't be much more than 1.5" ?
Rex


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5760301 - 03/27/13 01:32 PM

Rex, IIRC it should be 3-4 cm as you are guesstimating

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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5760409 - 03/27/13 02:02 PM

Quote:

What do you mean by " loose the ability to play with the back focus as necessary" ?




Rex- The min racked in length of FT system looks like 200mm to me. I don't have the length of the A35-503 adaptor but the focuser is 5.25" (133mm) according to SI website. Looking at the photo above, I am assuming that the adaptor is 70mm long. So, the total length is 203mm or 8".

On the other hand, the Tak focuser+the adaptor is 120mm long without the CAA and 165mm with the CAA.

So, if you have some applications that require more in_focus, like binoviewing etc, the FT system will not allow this. This is what I mean.

Clear skies


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5760412 - 03/27/13 02:04 PM

Quote:

Rex, IIRC it should be 3-4 cm as you are guesstimating



So why complain about the FT being limited to 1.5" of travel?
You can get end caps for both Tak 92mmx1 and 72mmx1 adapter thread sizes, so you can use all the same Tak spacers adapters etc on the FT.
EDIT: just saw your reply ( I think we were both typing at the same time)
From what I see the adapter looks to be about 45mm long in the picture and the 133 mm of focuser length, (I think) includes the 2" compression end cap which is about 20mm long which would give an all up length to the threaded end of the focuser to be the same as the stock focuser with CAA ( at least that is the way that all the other FT's seem to be designed to fit on other scopes? And remember you do not need the Tak CAA as the FT rotates. I may be wrong, but I think the FT is a exact length replacement for the Tak focuser.

Rex

Edited by tomcody (03/27/13 02:15 PM)


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5760502 - 03/27/13 02:44 PM

I am not complaining

I am just saying that if one chooses this option, he needs to be very careful with the back focus requirements. If it is the same length with the stock focuser + CAA this helps but measuring from the photo and interpolating the length of the adaptor I think it is longer. Maybe Mike can check with Wayne and tell us the length of the A35-503 adaptor.

Meanwhile, there has been cases where I had to remove the CAA to provide the necessary space for the imaging train.

The available back focus is 153mm with the CAA and 188mm w/o the CAA. If the FT system is longer than the stock focuser, it means it is eating up the precious back focus real estate. This needs to be considered before going for the 3,5" FT focuser. This all I'm saying.

Clear skies


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5760524 - 03/27/13 02:50 PM

I understand what you are saying, it is a shame that Starlight does not provide better measurements for their adapters and focusers on their web site considering that they are selling to buyers that are trying to adapt or change stock scopes and build custom ones. Drawings and detailed specs are needed to make choices like this!
P.S. I misunderstood you earlier post and thought you were questioning the travel of the FT focuser, not its overall length.
Rex


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5760564 - 03/27/13 03:01 PM

Well, I cannot say that we are using the best method to convey our ideas to each other what's more, English is not my native tongue Probably, I haven't expressed myself clear enough.

Best wishes

Sedat


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5760604 - 03/27/13 03:23 PM

Sedat,
Sorry for my poor choice of words, I should have said questioning not complaining, my apologies.
And yes you are right about the overall available back focus length needing to be carefully considered! The FT focuser definitely is more limited in total available back focus than the stock FSQ106ED focuser and in my opinion, unless the imaging train is very heavy, one knows that the FT will have enough back focus for his needs, or one just owns a problematic focuser which can not be satisfactorly adjusted, the stock focuser is good enough.
Rex

Edited by tomcody (03/28/13 03:17 PM)


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5762131 - 03/28/13 10:32 AM

Sedat,
Can you tell me what the step movement distance is with your Starlight drive and FSQ106ED focuser? I calculated what my FSQ106N would be with one and got 6.9 micron per step.
The way to do this is to measure how far one revolution of the coarse focuser knob moves the focuser and divide this distance by 3000. For my Focuser, the distance moved was 0.820" per revolution.
Note this assumes you have a 10:1 reduction factor on the focuser knob and are driving the reduction knob, one revolution of the fine knob = 300 counts, times 10 = 3000 counts = one revolution of the coarse knob.
So: my FSQ106N = 0.820/3000 = 0.000273" which equals 6.9 micron per step.
Thanks,
Rex

Edited by tomcody (03/28/13 10:38 AM)


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bilgebay
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: tomcody]
      #5762772 - 03/28/13 05:34 PM

Rex - 1 step is 5 microns in my case. The motor is connected to the fine focus shaft. Please have a look at my work here and here .

Best wishes


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #5997275 - 07/29/13 08:47 PM

News to me, but maybe old for others:

http://starlightinstruments.wordpress.com/2013/04/23/takahashistarlight-instr...

I'm curious which Tak models are supported and how warranty work would be covered.


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: hytham]
      #5998260 - 07/30/13 11:44 AM

Yeah Wayne mentioned that to me a while ago. I think this is going to be a welcome upgrade for many Tak users.

Andy


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: andysea]
      #6455402 - 04/08/14 09:34 PM

I can say I am actually enamoured wit the Tak R&P, but then again, I have always been an absolute HATER of ALL Crayfords, no matter who makes them - OK visual, NOT what I want imaging.

THe Vixen FL102S I had for many years but recently sold to help fund my FSQ106EDXIII originally came with a Moonlite. Absolute waste of time - asked the seller if he had the original focuser, which thankfully he DID, and I swapped them out. I upgraded the pinion on it to the newer style and installed the Vixen dual speed unit, and could not be happier - it would hold 5kg at zenith without slipping even a millimeter. Could not say the same for ANY of the Crayfords I ever used!

I won't be touching the focuser on my FSQ - don't really care if it is not exactly silky in rough focuse, so long as the 7:1 works smoothly, which it does. I am fitting a Skysharp Pro unit on it anyway (since there is 40 microns of critical focus on these at the reduced f/3.6), so not an issue.

The only focuser I ever happily replaced was the one on the FS60C - thankfully the prior owner changed it for a Feathertouch, and it was GOOD for that scope (and no need to buy all the crazy priced Tak accessories, and a MUCH better back focus range than the diminutive Tak original).

Anyway, to ech their own, but I do love my Tak focuser. It is perhaps just a TOUCH tight , but that is better than the converse!


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: LewisM]
      #6455773 - 04/09/14 02:07 AM

Lewis, I understand what you mean but, you know, it will be great if FSQ-106EDXIII came pre-installed with FeatherTouch from Takahashi (instead of users retrofitting after the fact). Regards

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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: mmalik]
      #6456183 - 04/09/14 10:12 AM

The time to talk to them about that is NEAF. It would probably be something like shipping an under-build OTA without focuser to Texas Nautical Repair and TNR would arrange for the OTAS to get integrated with Feathertouch focusers.

-Rich

Edited by Starhawk (04/09/14 10:18 AM)


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LewisM
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: Starhawk]
      #6457322 - 04/09/14 08:52 PM

Must remember not to type half asleep at 3 am after newborn wakes you up (re-read my post )

Sharpsky Pro for starters...(best robotic focus system out there in my opinion, without exception - dual temp sensors, manual control, hub that not only controls the motor, but has RCA ports for dew straps as well etc etc. EXTREMELLY well made (much better than Robofocus), and VERY well thought out.

Now if only the clouds that appeared the day the FSQ arrived would disappear...


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: LewisM]
      #6457453 - 04/09/14 09:53 PM

I much prefer the stock focuser on the Tak FSQ-106ED to the Feathertouch that comes on the new Televue NP101is. I've used both quite a bit for imaging and visual. The TV feels rubbery in comparison and has more backlash. I also like the single lever for locking things down on the Tak.

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LewisM
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: sydney]
      #6457481 - 04/09/14 10:15 PM

Agreed Sydney.

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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: LewisM]
      #6514356 - 05/08/14 04:53 PM

mmalik, did you ever hear back from art on the questions you had heard? Did you end up buying the FSQ? If so which version? And what have you noticed with the focuser?

Also has anyone taken possession of a FSQ with the FT focuser instead of stock? How does one go about placing such an order?


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ManojK
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: ManojK]
      #6514389 - 05/08/14 05:13 PM

Also what is the purpose of the captains wheel?

EDIT: Rex responded on a thread I have going: http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=6514544&...

and explained what it does: http://www.cloudynights.com/ubbthreads/showthreaded.php/Cat/0/Number/6514445/...

Edited by ManojK (05/08/14 07:01 PM)


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Leonardo Priami
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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #6522555 - 05/13/14 09:19 AM

Hi All,
I carefully read these posts. I was the owner of a FSQ106 fluorite (2004). It had great correction, but I saw also a lot of vignetting problem, also on a KAF6303, but very important (and no easy to handle) on a KAF16803. The focuser was very stable, but vignetting was not sopportable. So I decided to buy a TEC140 with its field flattner. The first tests I did show a very good correction and an homogeneous illumination up to the corner of the 37x37 chip. Also the FT 3,5" is great (but not excellent).
But the TEC140 is bigger, and focal length near to be twice of 106.
So I'm thinking to downgrade to a 106EDIII. I read about some focuser problem for heavy instruments (as I have - Apogee U16 + Apogee FW)..., I would like to have your thinking about illumination too.

Thanks,

Leonardo


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: Leonardo Priami]
      #6522830 - 05/13/14 12:09 PM

I can' t even imagine that you had a problem with uneven ilumination across a 53 mm circle, yes there is some light falloff from center to edge but that scope was designed to evenly illuminate a 6x7 medium film format and back when it came out, there were numerous test published on how even the field was ( now to be fair the first FSQ106 in 1998? did have a hot spot in the center but the lens was redesigned with the FSQ106N in 2000? to correct that) as film is much more sensitive to uneven illumination this was an issue but with digital and flat correction, I have never heard of anyone other than you complaining of a problem with even illumination, in fact this scope ia a favorite with many large chip imagers due to the big rear lens and the heavy duty focuser.
Rex
P.S. I don't think,you will find a better 4" scope as far as even illumination.
P.P.S. If you want some good answers to your questions? check with the Yahoo narrowband imaging group, many useres of FSQ's ( old and new) and big chip cameras on that group.

Edited by tomcody (05/13/14 12:54 PM)


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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: bilgebay]
      #6522978 - 05/13/14 01:11 PM Attachment (17 downloads)

Hi!
I assure you that the vignetting on the FSQ106 (I had a 2004 model)is important. I tried to use a Monster MOAG with a Lodestar, after adjusting the prism to not cover the KAF6303 (so something about 22/23 mm off axis) I did not find any star! Then I put an eyepiece instead of the Lodestar and the field was black! Then I put a light infront of the scope and I saw 1/3 of "full moon" (!)only 1/3 of light or less.
Putting my eye I saw the internal baffling.
Here attached a shot of M31 taken with FSQ106 and Apogee F9 (KAF6303) so a 27,6 x 18,5 mm. Analizing this picture I can say that it has only 15/16 mm of full illuminated field.

I agree about the great wide corrected field the FSQ106 has. But if it is very corrected, but not well illuminated too.

Leonardo


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TxStars
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Reged: 10/01/05

Loc: Lost In Space
Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: Leonardo Priami]
      #6523219 - 05/13/14 03:23 PM

There is something wrong with that 106.
The illumination is not even centered on the chip.
My guess is that the lens groups are out of adjustment and would need to go back to Takahashi for repair.


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Leonardo Priami
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Reged: 01/25/07

Loc: Italy
Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: TxStars]
      #6523284 - 05/13/14 04:00 PM

Hi, I have done some shots with this FSQ with a Sbig STL11000 and I didn'see the effects of some misalignment. However, also if it was present a little, in my opinion it can not be the cause of vignetting.

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NewAstronomer
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Reged: 09/03/04

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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: Leonardo Priami]
      #6523619 - 05/13/14 07:49 PM

Your bright stars have elongated spikes projecting downward. Perhaps it was loose baffel or miscollimation? Something is wrong.

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Mike Clemens
Frozen to Eyepiece
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Reged: 11/26/05

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Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: NewAstronomer]
      #6523744 - 05/13/14 09:03 PM

Nothing is necessarily wrong with the FSQ. Plenty of assymetrical vignetting opportunities in a monster photographic train. The spikes on the stars are just CCD blooming.

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Leonardo Priami
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Reged: 01/25/07

Loc: Italy
Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: Mike Clemens]
      #6524195 - 05/14/14 02:09 AM

Right Mike!

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Leonardo Priami
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Reged: 01/25/07

Loc: Italy
Re: FSQ-106EDXIII F5 Astrograph for Imaging new [Re: Leonardo Priami]
      #6528215 - 05/16/14 02:46 AM

Nobody can say somethings about illumination performance of the 106EDIII vs. FSQ106 Fluorite?
Takahashi speak about an improvment of illumination...


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