snorkler
Aperture Aficionado
Reged: 10/11/04
Posts: 8244
Loc: Bay Area, California
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See this breaking news. It looks like I'll be doing the first Golden State Star Party this year, along with most of the Bay Area astronomy folks.
[edited thread title...]
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Lotteries are a tax on people who don't understand math - Snorkler
Edited by StarAngel (02/04/07 09:42 AM)
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Alvin Huey
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 10/18/05
Posts: 1529
Loc: NorCal
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Saw that earlier. And I'm heading there too. I attended a couple Lassen Star Parties in the past and it is way darker than SSP. Typical NELM is 7.5
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Clear Skies,
Alvin #26
22" f/4.1 reflector, Takahashi TOA-130S on AP1200GTO (just sold), 30" f/4.3 StarMaster and Antares 6" f/6.5 on Orion SVP
FaintFuzzies | TAC | TAC-Sac
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snorkler
Aperture Aficionado
Reged: 10/11/04
Posts: 8244
Loc: Bay Area, California
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Wow! I could get to like dark skies like that. It's going to be a hassle taking down my scope every morning and setting it out every evening.
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Lotteries are a tax on people who don't understand math - Snorkler
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Alvin Huey
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 10/18/05
Posts: 1529
Loc: NorCal
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Yeah but for what we get it is worth it. 
It is sometimes a full magnitude darker. It was at Lassen NP where I saw M-81 naked eye for the first time.
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Clear Skies,
Alvin #26
22" f/4.1 reflector, Takahashi TOA-130S on AP1200GTO (just sold), 30" f/4.3 StarMaster and Antares 6" f/6.5 on Orion SVP
FaintFuzzies | TAC | TAC-Sac
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Dwight
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 04/06/04
Posts: 928
Loc: Silicon Valley, CA
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Post deleted by Pegster.
Edited by square_peg (02/07/07 06:55 PM)
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BryceSkies
member
Reged: 03/06/05
Posts: 24
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It is great to hear of others experiencing true Bortle Class 1/2 skies and seeing M81 naked eye. I first exprienced this in Death Valley three years ago. I got a bit of ridicule before I heard of others who have also seen it. Hope to see it again this Spring in Bryce.
By the way, the National Park Service is in the midst of a survey of sky conditions at Lassen Volcanic NP. Relevant for all those Golden State Star Party attendees.
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Alvin Huey
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 10/18/05
Posts: 1529
Loc: NorCal
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Hey Chad,
Nice hearing from you! Remember me at TSP last year? I was one of Darrell's observing buddies with the 30" Starmaster setup next or near you.
Do you have some prelim results from Lassen?
Alvin
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Clear Skies,
Alvin #26
22" f/4.1 reflector, Takahashi TOA-130S on AP1200GTO (just sold), 30" f/4.3 StarMaster and Antares 6" f/6.5 on Orion SVP
FaintFuzzies | TAC | TAC-Sac
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121601
super member
Reged: 08/18/04
Posts: 100
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Quote:
See this breaking news.
SSP2007 will be from July 9-16 which overlaps with GSP2007 (http://www.shingletownstarparty.net/). 
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IDA Member
Keep writing those politicians to save our dark skies! Support the 101StoptheCasino Coalition
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miniventures
Something Else
Reged: 09/13/03
Posts: 11037
Loc: Powell Butte, Central Oregon
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This ought to be interesting to watch---especially because of the fact that the SAC party can only support 150 folks.
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LarryC
Volunteer
http://www.sunrivernaturecenter.org
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121601
super member
Reged: 08/18/04
Posts: 100
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Quote:
This ought to be interesting to watch---especially because of the fact that the SAC party can only support 150 folks.
The Shingletown Airstrip is ideal for those with RVs and large scopes since people could leave their setups there without tear down - a real inconvinience for amateurs with larger aperture scopes.
The other attractive feature with Shingletown is that the arrangement allows for better socialization and interaction among participants since all scopes are within a long array.
At Lassen, the three designated sites are quite far from each other.
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snorkler
Aperture Aficionado
Reged: 10/11/04
Posts: 8244
Loc: Bay Area, California
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It looks like there will be two competing star parties for northern Californians that same week in July. One is Shingletown Star party, run by the Shingletown merchants and a new volunteer group of astronomers. Second choice is Golden State Star Party, run by the original Shingletown Star Party founding group of astronomers.
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Lotteries are a tax on people who don't understand math - Snorkler
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121601
super member
Reged: 08/18/04
Posts: 100
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Quote:
It looks like there will be two competing star parties for northern Californians that same week in July.
I trully regret that it will turn out to be a competition. I suspect that Shingletown will be more favored because its overall layout and location is more suitable for a large public star party.
Mt. Lassen's skies are definitely better based on my lone experience in 2004. It was so good, I went there twice in the same year.
Given the large number of amateur astronomer groups in the greater Northern CA, one would hope that a more concerted, unified and galvanized effort would be devoted to addressing the real issue which is light pollution. Already, a number of Southwestern states have enacted light protection laws. Here in Northern CA, the sky keeps getting redder. When I was at Mt. Lassen in 2004, I already saw some degree of sky glow from the direction of Redding even from 6000 ft. Last year, I noted a large number of development with totally unshielding lighting sweeping the areas near Shingletown. In fact at a few points near the airport, there were annoying light posts which glittered the adjacent areas with white glare.
Who knows, in a few years, Mt. Lassen and Shingletown will be CSC green and yellow. When that time comes, the true ownership or origins of both star parties will be irrelevant.
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IDA Member
Keep writing those politicians to save our dark skies! Support the 101StoptheCasino Coalition
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snorkler
Aperture Aficionado
Reged: 10/11/04
Posts: 8244
Loc: Bay Area, California
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Now I'm leaning towards Shingletown. I sure don't want to tear down my scope every day and set it up every evening.
[link to SAC story removed at poster's request]
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Lotteries are a tax on people who don't understand math - Snorkler
Edited by StarAngel (02/10/07 10:40 AM)
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~Steph~
Texas Wildflower
Reged: 06/11/05
Posts: 21649
Loc: North Texas
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Not a scolding or anything, just a pre-emptive thought that I'm sure wasn't even necessary  -- providing links to this info is absolutely fine, but let's not get into discussing any of the issues involved between the two groups and who's right and who's wrong. That's not our purpose here.
Feel free to continue discussing the differences between the two sites and how the details of the star parties might persuade you to go to one or the other, etc., however.
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Steph
10" RCX400 ~~ 4" TV102 ~~ WO ZS80FD ~~ PST
Serenity Observatory 
HansenAstro | CN Member Websites
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snorkler
Aperture Aficionado
Reged: 10/11/04
Posts: 8244
Loc: Bay Area, California
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I've viewed with people from both groups. I wish them all dark, clear skies.
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Lotteries are a tax on people who don't understand math - Snorkler
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Alvin Huey
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 10/18/05
Posts: 1529
Loc: NorCal
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Quote:
This ought to be interesting to watch---especially because of the fact that the SAC party can only support 150 folks.
Quick correction: SSP (hosted by SAC) can handle far more than 150 folks while the GSSP can handle only 150.
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Clear Skies,
Alvin #26
22" f/4.1 reflector, Takahashi TOA-130S on AP1200GTO (just sold), 30" f/4.3 StarMaster and Antares 6" f/6.5 on Orion SVP
FaintFuzzies | TAC | TAC-Sac
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miniventures
Something Else
Reged: 09/13/03
Posts: 11037
Loc: Powell Butte, Central Oregon
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Whoops, thanks for that Alvin--my mistake.
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LarryC
Volunteer
http://www.sunrivernaturecenter.org
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121601
super member
Reged: 08/18/04
Posts: 100
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Quote:
By the way, the National Park Service is in the midst of a survey of sky conditions at Lassen Volcanic NP. Relevant for all those Golden State Star Party attendees.
Where can we access these findings when they come out?
Thanks.
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IDA Member
Keep writing those politicians to save our dark skies! Support the 101StoptheCasino Coalition
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Rich N
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/22/04
Posts: 5303
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, Calif...
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Depending on how the mods feel about it, I suggest the subject line of this thread be changed since it is inaccurate. There will
be a Shingletown Star Party this year.
I've been to a number of the Lassen star parties and at least the first three SSP events. Last year I was on the SSP organizing
committee up until about a month and a half before the event. I found out I wouldn't be able to attend the SSP and had to spend
time on another project. I wanted the committee to have time to replace me with someone who would be attending the SSP.
I agree with StarAngle about not getting into a discussion of who is right and who is wrong. I will say that you aren't getting
the GSSP side, for that reason, and that's fine with me. I would also say that in my opinion the change this year at the SSP had
nothing to do with the quality of last year's Shingletown star party. The people who did attend last year's SSP said it was the
best SSP.
One reason we moved from Lassen to Shingletown was that the Lassen events were so successful we needed more room. One thing
different about this year's Lassen (GSSP) we will have one entire, very large, campground for our group. If we have more people
attending then there are the several other camp sites at Lassen for the extra attendees. The two sites, Shingletown and Lassen,
are very different. I much prefer Lassen even though it means I have to spend 30 minutes setting up and then 30 minutes taking down
my refractor. Even when I attended the SSP I spent most of the day at Lassen. I've found the Lassen star parties much more fun from
the point of view of a social event because of the way the camping was set up. I have many fond memories of star parties at Lassen.
All the best,
Rich
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~Steph~
Texas Wildflower
Reged: 06/11/05
Posts: 21649
Loc: North Texas
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Quote:
I will say that you aren't getting the GSSP side, for that reason,
Rich, if you have a link to some *official* document posted by the GSSP group that gives 'their side' of the story, you can add that link. It's only fair to allow links to both sides. All I ask is that discussions of those 'sides of the story' on both sides, who's right, who's wrong, etc. stay off of CN. In the end, it's all speculation on the part of anyone not directly involved (and likely some of them too, really ).
And you have a valid point about the thread title, it hadn't even occurred to me.  Thanks for that.
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Steph
10" RCX400 ~~ 4" TV102 ~~ WO ZS80FD ~~ PST
Serenity Observatory
HansenAstro | CN Member Websites
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snorkler
Aperture Aficionado
Reged: 10/11/04
Posts: 8244
Loc: Bay Area, California
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Interesting. The original link was the GSSP side of the story, but it's been revised to avoid all mention of the dispute. When I first posted it, it gave the GSSP side of the story, and it wasn't until message #1391918 in this thread that I found/posted the SSP side of the story. The original link is/was http;//shingletownstarparty.org That link leads you to the GSSP page.
It's truly a sad falling-out. Half of my observing buddy circle is boycotting both events this year. That can only hurt everyone: both sets of star party organizers, and the observers.
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Lotteries are a tax on people who don't understand math - Snorkler
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Rich N
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/22/04
Posts: 5303
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, Calif...
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Thank you, StarAngel! Happy to help.
Rich
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Rich N
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/22/04
Posts: 5303
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, Calif...
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Quote:
Interesting. The original link was the GSSP side of the story, but it's been revised to avoid all mention of the dispute. When I first posted it, it gave the GSSP side of the story, and it wasn't until message #1391918 in this thread that I found/posted the SSP side of the story. The original link is/was http;//shingletownstarparty.org That link leads you to the GSSP page.
It's truly a sad falling-out. Half of my observing buddy circle is boycotting both events this year. That can only hurt everyone: both sets of star party organizers, and the observers.
Hi Darrell,
I see no reason for someone to boycott the star parties. It's not as if a turf war is going to break out at the star parties involving roving gangs of amateur astronomers who prefer one site over another. We are a pretty peaceful bunch.
All the best,
Rich
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121601
super member
Reged: 08/18/04
Posts: 100
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I see no reason for someone to boycott the star parties. It's not as if a turf war is going to break out at the star parties involving roving gangs of amateur astronomers who prefer one site over another. We are a pretty peaceful bunch.
All the best,
Rich
I strongly urge people who are currently contemplating NOT to be discouraged in participating in either one of these star parties. In my opinion, the dark skies of Mt. Lassen and Shingletown remain one of the two best accessible locations to observe in Northern CA. While there are certainly other larger and “visible” events in the limelight like the TSP or OSP, the Shingletown & Mt. Lassen regional area also offer many recreational amenities and attractions not easily found in places like Ft. Davis or Prineville which both amateur astronomers & whole families can enjoy. After all, star parties are planned to be truly community events. Many of us who hold dark skies dear to our souls do not own vast isolated private lands or estates and cannot travel hundred of miles to remote natural vistas where only a minority can savor pristine skies.
I am worried and saddened by the potential negative impressions that some of the posts will project to outside readers, who have not been at these sites. Since I visited these places in the Summer & Fall of 2004, I have made a very strong personal effort to promote visual astronomy, particularly dark sky observing. At that time, I didn’t observe with anyone. It only took one clear, moonless steady night in Sept, 2003 at the “devastated area” of Mt. Lassen to convince me that everyone should be given a chance to see the Milky Way as Nature intended our eyes to bear witness.
Clear dark skies,
Renato
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Rich N
Post Laureate
Reged: 09/22/04
Posts: 5303
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area, Calif...
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At this point I think it should be known that there is one person who has been the primary mover and shaker in the Lassen, Shingletown, and CalStar (Lake San Antonio) star parties, Mark Wagner. He is also the one who thought of and developed TAC (The Astronomy Connection). TAC has been so successful it has been copied (something Mark is very happy about) in the Sacramento, CA area, Southern California and other parts of the country.
I mention this because I think Mark Wagner deserves to be known for the hard workd he has done that lets so many of have a great time observing with others of a like mind. Many of us have helped Mark, but Mark was the brain child of these events and the one who saw them through to successful completion.
Sincerely,
Rich
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Alvin Huey
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 10/18/05
Posts: 1529
Loc: NorCal
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Quote:
While there are certainly other larger and “visible” events in the limelight like the TSP or OSP, the Shingletown & Mt. Lassen regional area also offer many recreational amenities and attractions not easily found in places like Ft. Davis or Prineville which both amateur astronomers & whole families can enjoy. After all, star parties are planned to be truly community events. Many of us who hold dark skies dear to our souls do not own vast isolated private lands or estates and cannot travel hundred of miles to remote natural vistas where only a minority can savor pristine skies.
Renato,
I have to disagree with the your assesment that TSP does not cater to whole families. I've seen several families there last year. My family plans to go to TSP starting in 2009 or 2010 ( my youngest is the same age as yours and want to wait 'till she is old enough to make the 1500 mile trip by car). TSP offers cabins "on-site" for whole families and the surrounding areas do have attractions, such as Big Bend NP. BTW, Prude Ranch has everything "on-site" for people to enjoy, such as a swimming pool, real food that is paid for as part of the nightly stay, free wireless internet access, etc. They even have a basketball court ( I was a little surpised.).
OSP - yes, no way for my fam to enjoy that one.
Okie-Tex and El Dorado Star Party both have amenities on-site.
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Clear Skies,
Alvin #26
22" f/4.1 reflector, Takahashi TOA-130S on AP1200GTO (just sold), 30" f/4.3 StarMaster and Antares 6" f/6.5 on Orion SVP
FaintFuzzies | TAC | TAC-Sac
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121601
super member
Reged: 08/18/04
Posts: 100
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The Shingletown Star Party web site has now been updated with more specific info.
See: http://www.shingletownstarparty.net/index.html .
For the specifics on the nearby GSSP, the website is:
http://www.goldenstatestarparty.org/ .
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IDA Member
Keep writing those politicians to save our dark skies! Support the 101StoptheCasino Coalition
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snorkler
Aperture Aficionado
Reged: 10/11/04
Posts: 8244
Loc: Bay Area, California
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I suppose it's pertinent to mention the impending doom of dark skies near Mt. Lassen, with the planned addition of 4000 new homes on Dyer Mountain this summer.
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Lotteries are a tax on people who don't understand math - Snorkler
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121601
super member
Reged: 08/18/04
Posts: 100
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Quote:
The Shingletown Star Party web site has now been updated with more specific info.
See: http://www.shingletownstarparty.net/index.html .
For the specifics on the nearby GSSP, the website is:
http://www.goldenstatestarparty.org/ .
There is road construction affecting the general area. If you enter the park from the south, you may experience delays within the park, on the way to Lost Creek, of up to 20 minutes.
If you want to take Highway 44 (recommended), the following map shows the preferred detour:
http://tinyurl.com/3yolpg
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IDA Member
Keep writing those politicians to save our dark skies! Support the 101StoptheCasino Coalition
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121601
super member
Reged: 08/18/04
Posts: 100
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Here's a link to the SSP photos taken by one of the talented astrophotographers.
> I took a bunch of pictures of the goings on at Shingletown > all last week.
> I've uploaded the pictures to the link below. If you guys
> want me to update
> the captions (they are the best I could do), let me know.
> Enjoy
http://tinyurl.com/23kepq
> Teri (Smoot)
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