skybsd
Post Laureate
Reged: 02/01/08
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: APM M.Ludes]
#5455162 - 10/04/12 02:06 PM
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I read interested email exchanges on the refractor forum of my new China ED, beeing compared with others . I am wondering why nowhere in the world I can find a few reviews or open testst of such true apos.
How can that european person compare something he has never seen and nobody knows how good it really is ?
Anyway in a few days we have our first sample and in 4 weeks we shop it to the big new world in Tucson
Keep on with the progress, Markus.., Don't waste your time worrying about empty distractions..,
Best..,
Regards,
skybsd
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APM M.Ludes
Vendor (APM Telescopes)
Reged: 05/01/03
Loc: Germany
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: skybsd]
#5455467 - 10/04/12 05:47 PM
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I see on the refractor discussion about my 152 ED some false price infos of a 140 mm, maybe you like to check the manufacturers own price info here and say something
http://forum.astronomie.de/phpapps/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/947736/gonew/1/CFF_Telescopes_Oilspaced_Apoch#UNREAD
140 mm = Euro 5,990
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APM M.Ludes
Vendor (APM Telescopes)
Reged: 05/01/03
Loc: Germany
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: APM M.Ludes]
#5456320 - 10/05/12 10:32 AM
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Nice discussion on the refractor forum and Pal brings it up.
Maybe Pal and the others shall read the start of this new Chinese 152 ED then the discussion ends .
From beginning on it was stated it cannot be a true Apo, from beginning on it was stated our LZOS Doublet has a colorcorrection about equal to a 6"F/40 achromat and this Chinese ED the colorcorrection of a 6"F/30 achromat, which means about 25 % less good then the LZOS Doublet.
We can call the chinese 152 ED a Semi-Apo, this would be right and ok, but then many other refractors called EDApo would need to be renamed also into Semi-Apo.
Regards the strehl of this chinese 152 ED it is calculated as follow:
Polychromatic strehl at fixed focuse 555 nm is 84.4 %
Polychromatic Strehl at polychromatic focuse is 87.3 %
Both are not bad for such a cheap glas doublet ED of such big aperture and fast speed.
Also if you buy a 6"F/30 Achromat plus a mount which carry it really well, it will cost more then if you buy the fast 6" ED plus a mount which carry this short scope well.
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Ira
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 08/22/10
Loc: Mitzpe Ramon, Israel
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: APM M.Ludes]
#5456382 - 10/05/12 11:21 AM
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I guess no one wants to read 15 pages of discussion. 
/Ira
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APM M.Ludes
Vendor (APM Telescopes)
Reged: 05/01/03
Loc: Germany
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: Ira]
#5456797 - 10/05/12 04:09 PM
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News : TNT Express deliver the first sample only at 15. october to me, due 10 days national holiday in China right now.
In any case it will be time enough to make it to the Show in Tucson and before testing by Mr. Rohr :-) and myself
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sg80
member
Reged: 07/29/07
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: APM M.Ludes]
#5461223 - 10/08/12 08:29 PM
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You gave the truth from the start you told us what you could do in that price range. f30 color correction.3.75x the color correction of an f8 scope.I think f20 would have been okay at the eyepiece.it would not have much more color than my 80mm f11.4 refractor. keep pressing on.I think when all is said and done you,ll have a winner on your hands. and if I ever come up with some funds.I,ll get one.no problem.I think it will be a great scope at the eyepiece
Edited by sg80 (10/08/12 08:31 PM)
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SeattleScott
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 10/14/11
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: sg80]
#5461496 - 10/09/12 12:52 AM
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I once heard a wise man say that color correction is not the only correction one should be concerned about with a refractor. I have a Chinese 100ED and it is virtually color free, but the star test leaves a little to be desired. So what if there isn't a blue halo if you can't see the Cassini division? That is where these new scopes should shine, great contrast from precision optics. And light weight! I certainly do not know of any other ED or Apo scopes at the same price point with that much aperture, much less so lightweight. It is encouraging to see the innovation!
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Live_Steam_Mad
member
Reged: 07/24/07
Loc: St.Helens, Merseyside, England
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: APM M.Ludes]
#5488910 - 10/25/12 04:23 PM
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Had any chance to Star Test with clear skies or on an interferometer or artificial star yet Markus? What is the 1st sample like?
Regards,
Alistair G.
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APM M.Ludes
Vendor (APM Telescopes)
Reged: 05/01/03
Loc: Germany
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: Live_Steam_Mad]
#5490071 - 10/26/12 11:38 AM
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the first sample was interferometrical tested with 95.6 % strehl and we have this sample in Tucson at the show.
Infocuse it shows a hard white airydisc at 300 power
On this first smaple Mr. Rohr have had to take it apart and release the cell a bit and correct the orientation.
everything was reported to the manufacturer to prevent us such work in future.
In Tucson at the show we will set up a high quality artificial star, so everybody is welcome to do his personal startest.
I dont know if there wil be later in the evening on saturday a night time observing, but if it will be, we will have the scope out and you can watch Jupiter and you can do your own startest there under real sky
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saemark30
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 02/21/12
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: APM M.Ludes]
#5490506 - 10/26/12 04:19 PM
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The Meade 178ED were notorious for their collimation problems.
Will this new 6" f/8 solve the issues even if moved or transported?
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SeattleScott
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 10/14/11
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: saemark30]
#5491049 - 10/26/12 11:40 PM
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The expectation is yes. APM has a little more experience making large refractors than Meade.
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WarrenS
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 03/04/08
Loc: Orange County New York
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: SeattleScott]
#5491337 - 10/27/12 08:44 AM
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The expectation is yes. APM has a little more experience making large refractors than Meade.
I'd say yes, you could get anything up to a 20" APO refractor from them! 
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APM M.Ludes
Vendor (APM Telescopes)
Reged: 05/01/03
Loc: Germany
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: saemark30]
#5494583 - 10/29/12 12:38 PM
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wel I will comment that the follow way:
1, the first smaple did not missalign on the way from china to me , from me to Mr.Rohr, from Mr. Rohr back to me.
2, the cell is very much diffrent then what Meade used , so the risk for a missalignment is not more or less than in any modern doublet Apo
3, I want to sell this scope to make a bit money, I do not want to sell and ship it, to receive claims and pay backshipping and not to pay money for repairs, so I try to make this scopes in this aspects as perfect as possible , final result: no waste of time and money for claims :-)
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APM M.Ludes
Vendor (APM Telescopes)
Reged: 05/01/03
Loc: Germany
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: APM M.Ludes]
#5507087 - 11/06/12 03:29 PM
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the second sample was tested by a original twymann interferogram send to us.
with all errors includet it turned out with 94.7 % strehl, not bad.
Taking out a 1/5 wave astigmatism ( Mr. Rohr told me under sky its a invisible error ) the strehl would go up to 98.8% , wow
Mr. Rohr told me the optics in this condition we can sell without getting any complain :-)
however I asked the manufacturer to tune a bit more on the astigmatism to come closer in result to the real quality of the glas
see you this weekend in Tucson with the 152 ED live !!
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dbs
member
Reged: 07/09/09
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: APM M.Ludes]
#5507387 - 11/06/12 06:55 PM
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the second sample was tested by a original twymann interferogram send to us.
with all errors includet it turned out with 94.7 % strehl, not bad.
Taking out a 1/5 wave astigmatism ( Mr. Rohr told me under sky its a invisible error ) the strehl would go up to 98.8% , wow
Mr. Rohr told me the optics in this condition we can sell without getting any complain :-)
however I asked the manufacturer to tune a bit more on the astigmatism to come closer in result to the real quality of the glas
see you this weekend in Tucson with the 152 ED live !!
Hi Markus, remember to post some photos of the event with your scope!
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Arizona-Ken
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 08/31/08
Loc: Scottsdale, Arizona
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: dbs]
#5513834 - 11/10/12 11:40 PM Attachment (111 downloads)
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Markus with the scope at the Tucson show.
Arizona Ken
Edited by Arizona-Ken (11/10/12 11:40 PM)
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dbs
member
Reged: 07/09/09
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: Arizona-Ken]
#5513970 - 11/11/12 03:52 AM
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Markus with the scope at the Tucson show.
Arizona Ken
Lovely!
Is that with the focuser rack all the way out?
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Traveler
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 08/19/07
Loc: The Netherlands
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: Arizona-Ken]
#5514019 - 11/11/12 06:23 AM
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Thanks Arizona Ken!
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Arizona-Ken
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 08/31/08
Loc: Scottsdale, Arizona
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: dbs]
#5514113 - 11/11/12 09:03 AM
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Lovely!
Is that with the focuser rack all the way out?
Yep! Dew shield extended, too.
I seem to remember Markus was quoting a US price of $3990(?) I am not much of a refractor wienie when it comes to construction details, but it appeared to be nicely made.
We had a nice conversation; Markus is a really nice fellow. I like him because he is always trying to develop eyepieces or scopes to meet amateur needs.
He was very proud that, in his words, "The scope started as a discussion on Cloudy Nights in April, and here it is, in November, ready to buy. No one else in the industry does that."
Arizona Ken
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Astrojensen
Post Laureate
Reged: 10/05/08
Loc: Bornholm, Denmark
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Re: New 6" F/8 ED Doublets from APM Telescopes
[Re: Arizona-Ken]
#5514556 - 11/11/12 02:12 PM
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He was very proud that, in his words, "The scope started as a discussion on Cloudy Nights in April, and here it is, in November, ready to buy. No one else in the industry does that."
And he has right to be proud of it. It's true and it's amazing.
Clear skies!
Thomas, Denmark
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