Kim Miau
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 07/17/06
Loc: Malaysia
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: Brooklyn]
#2594933 - 08/21/08 10:00 AM
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I agree with brooklyn. I find a smaller telescope can amaze the people greater. Let's say, more cost-effective. A 80mm refractor or 8" newtonian/dobsonian is quite cute enough to attract the public and you can proudly tell people that how affordable it is.
(Sorry if I made any stupid comment)
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Astrosetz
professor emeritus
Reged: 10/05/03
Loc: Wisconsin
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: Kim Miau]
#2714368 - 10/23/08 01:45 PM
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I love my 8" Hardin for outreach -- it's a great example of how good a telescope can be had for the price of a video game system. It's a perfect scope for sidewalk astronomy, as I mentioned in an earlier post.
That being said, the views are nothing like the 22". Nobody has problems seeing M13, and everyone gets excited about the view in the 22" (or our club's 20" in our new roll-off roof observatory). Looking through the 8", some people are excited, some people are disappointed. The general public doesn't have years of observing experience so what they can see through any given scope is going to be a lot less than the scope's owner, which is why I think a big scope is a great outreach instrument when the situation makes that possible.
In our large roll-off observatory, we have a 4.25" Dob, a 6" Criterion Dynascope, a 9.25" fork-mounted Celestron, and a 10" Dob -- in addition to the 20" steel fork-mounted giant. Having smaller scopes next to a big one gives people a sense of perspective and what they can expect, which I think is a good thing -- especially when joining the club gives anyone access all of these scopes.
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dave b
Post Laureate
Reged: 05/10/05
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: Astrosetz]
#3072979 - 04/28/09 02:07 PM
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i like to set up a little 10" dob just to let the kids get a chance to see how easy it is to move around the moon surface.
but nothing wows the crowd like a big dob. in fact a few people who have joined the club have done so after becoming inspired that we built the 30" ourselves.
most of the public has blown their night vision lighting cigarettes, checking their cell phones or whatever so a big, bright image is needed.
a big dob is handy to produce a bright image even in a light polluted state park or school yard. usually the public outreach nights are nowhere near a dark site. the Veil will be invisible in my 10" but nice in the 30".
tracking is important too, because people will look through an eyepiece and say "wow!" even it the scope has moved off target. ive seen this a million times, adults and children.
GOTO is great because without fail people will return to the scope and say "ya know, my wife did not get to see the Catseye..." with GOTO you dont mind letting zipping over to another object and returning.
cotterman makes nice outdoor rolling stairs that are good for a big club scope.
but some people are not going to climb stairs or ladders - even one step up. there is nothing you can do for that small segment of the population. just like some people will not pet a cat because they are scared of them. they can still use the 10" scope.
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LAAS
newbie
Reged: 05/28/09
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: asaint]
#3189332 - 06/29/09 05:12 PM Attachment (96 downloads)
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Bigger in some cases is not bad. Big telescopes are crowd pleasers for their size. Desite the fact that views at most public events deminish the large aperature, the telescope itself can inspire.
http://img41.imageshack.us/i/childv.jpg/
http://img20.imageshack.us/i/gp1f.jpg/
http://img20.imageshack.us/i/gp2p.jpg/
Edited by LAAS (06/29/09 05:15 PM)
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Ohioastro
member
Reged: 06/12/09
Loc: Ohio
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: desertstars]
#3198123 - 07/04/09 06:48 AM
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I use a NGT 12.5 that generates great wide field views, as it functions much like a dobsonian, and is very forgiving with "grabbing". It also has the rotating secondary which readily allows positioning of the eyepiece for vertically challenged folk.
Edited by Ohioastro (07/06/09 06:57 AM)
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skywatcherjan
member
Reged: 11/11/08
Loc: Belgium
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: Kim Miau]
#3225296 - 07/18/09 02:50 PM
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Last time I went out to a public seeing I was very happy with my 12" skywatcher dob. About 300 people showed up to look through the scope so : I was very pleased I did not have to worry about any technical flow eg: power, computer, polar alignment, expensive precision mount... People always seem to bump into the mount anyway so polar alignment is useless... My conclusion: reasonable aperture and no electronics works best.
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square_peg
Postmaster
   
Reged: 03/26/04
Loc: Maple Valley, WA
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: skywatcherjan]
#3225339 - 07/18/09 03:20 PM
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Dobs work great but the nudging can get to be a nuisance. With a small crowd I take the time to show each one how to nudge the scope. This gives them great pleasure as they begin to feel comfortable with the scope.
But for large crowds a tracking scope with good eyepiece placement is best. An EQ Newt can be good if it's not too high and has rotating rings to place the focuser in good position. Fork mounted SCTs are great when they're tracking well. EQ mounted refractors can be good at mid-altitudes but get less convenient at zenith or at the horizon if it's on a mount extension.
A dob on a tracking platform can be really good if it's not too tall. I think tall ladders are better left to more advanced observers. One or two steps on a sturdy stool are the most I want newbies to have to deal with.
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Old Rookie
sage
Reged: 09/05/08
Loc: North Central Ohio
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: square_peg]
#3325984 - 09/10/09 12:25 PM
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Our club owns and operates a 31" f/7 equatorially mounted telescope. Runs with Megastar 5.0. We use a Mite-E-Lift with a 1,000 pound capacity to raise 4 people up the eyepiece that's anywhere from 16' to 18' above the ground. Most generally we have a Nagler 17mm T4 in the focuser. When I hear a loud "WOW" when someone looks at a Messier object through this combination, I just stand back and smile.
Lines on public nights are usually 30 to 40 deep and we can just about accomodate anyone who wants a look. We don't forget anyone however. We have club dobs set out in aperatures ranging from 4" to 10". Members bring their personal scopes and they run the gamut from 8" SCT's to Obsessions.
My opinion? Big is good!
John
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TimD
Pooh-Bah
   
Reged: 02/16/05
Loc: CA USA
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: desertstars]
#3331962 - 09/13/09 06:31 PM
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Of all my scopes the 8 inch LX90 go to I got a few years ago is best for me when introducing objects to the public. The go to makes it quick to get on target and the rear viewing height is low and easy to reach for almost all.
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omahaastro
sage
Reged: 08/30/06
Loc: Omaha, NE
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: TimD]
#3331995 - 09/13/09 06:46 PM
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I actually let kids use the hand controller on my 10" SCT to pan across the surface of the Moon. They LOVE it!
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Kim Miau
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 07/17/06
Loc: Malaysia
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: TimD]
#3332971 - 09/14/09 09:20 AM
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Quote:
Of all my scopes the 8 inch LX90 go to I got a few years ago is best for me when introducing objects to the public. The go to makes it quick to get on target and the rear viewing height is low and easy to reach for almost all.
I agree with that. I find it easier for kids to reach than a dobsonian.
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ragebot
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 08/26/05
Loc: Tallahassee, FL, USA
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: asaint]
#3338537 - 09/17/09 12:50 AM
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Hi all,
Warm weather is here and I'm sure many of us will be asked to have a public observing night by somebody or some organization.
OK, money no object - what are the top 3 best telescopes to use when you are doing an open public night observing program?
Allister
A couple of years ago my club's prez presented me with a certificate for a bunch of outreach hours. We have a monthly outreach program at a local park, an open to the public semi-dark site monthly event at a larger park away from down town, and monthly real dark site event open to the public about 20 miles from town. We also go to local schools, state parks, Scout events, and other stuff where club members bring their telescopes and put on a dog and pony show.
Some of the club members are credited with hundreds or even thousands of hours spent at these events; while some members bring their telescopes for the first time. Some events are object specific, like the Jupiter one a couple of weeks ago or the Mars thing a couple of years ago, or the ever present Spring Messier Marathon. Some of the events are close to a 120 volt outlet while others are in the middle of nowhere.
Bottom line it is the best OTA and mount is object and event specific. The first thing I ask about an event is if there is power, and if not if the club can bring the Honda generator. Next question is about the phase of the Moon, since even at a dark site the light pollution from a bright moon greatly limits which DSOs you can observe. Local light pollution is also a consideration, a downtown park close to a busy 4 lane commercial street will have lots of peeps at the telescope; but the objects you can view are limited.
I have probably left out some other major considerations, not the least of which is if it is getting dark at 6:00 PM and I need to grab a Big Mac on the way to the site after leaving work and will be rushed setting up I may use a grab and go as opposed to a Newt on a GEM. The last thing I will mention is some locations restrict things like laptops and other display devices used with electronic assisted observing.
That being said my most used rig, conditions permitting, is an 8in Newt mounted on an Atlas GOTO mount, with a Scopetronix EP threaded to a Nikon 4500 with the output displayed on a 1900X1600 LCD. I put lawn chairs around the whole thing, put the LCT on a folding table get the Moon in the FOV, grab a kid, sit him/her in a lawn chair and let the kid fly over the surface of the Moon using the hand paddle. Other club members have 12 or 14 in dobs, c11s and c14, and a big fork mounted Meade; but I always have the longest lines, and I often have to admonish the grownups that the kids get first crack at the paddle. This setup gets my first place as the biggest crowd pleaser. I can also slew to stuff like Jupiter, Mars, Saturn, and M42; but not much else will really hold the crowds interest.
If the light pollution is not ad DefCon 5 levels I will set up my MallinCam on a c11. Stuff like M57 or M27 simply blow peeps away. Even the less colorful stuff gets major interest and if you can blab about how far away stuff is peeps will stay longer. I have also used the 8in Newt on the Atlas for this, but the c11 with a Meade 3.3 focal reducer seems to provide better views. Tie between a c11/Losmandy (which my bud owns) and my 8in Newt/Atlas (which I own) only because I own the newt for the silver.
My bronze is a dark horse. I have a Meade AR5 stopped down with a Baader 90mm ERF and a SO <3A HA filter behind a top of the line Moonlite focuser. I like the Nikon 4500 output to a LCD because it is color; but a DMK B&W camera can get more detail, especially if you stack and post process the image (I know that is not really observing, but I do have pix at the table under the tent where the LCD is). I personally spend more time observing the Sun than at night, and do lots of solar outreach. I know David does some solar stuff and am wondering if any other guys here do any solar outreach?
I also use my ED80 on an iOptron MiniTower strong side with an Orion 90 Mak on the other side with dual LCD displays. I put a MallinCam on the ED80 and the Nikon on the Mak; but this is my grab and go outreach setup.
I dont really try to "teach" peeps how to use a telescope, or how to star hop; I am just trying to get them interested in observing. I do however pass out cheat sheets with bullet points of objects of interest (produced by my c11 bud) and the web site of the club and a blurb about the next club meeting.
YMMV.
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aerospacedu
journeyman
Reged: 09/16/09
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: desertstars]
#3357238 - 09/26/09 03:18 AM
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I have a pair of Celestron C8s. One is the Celestron Faststar and i am surprised it seems to have been forgotten here. My technique is to use one C8 for visual observing and the Faststar for on the spot astrophotography. People are very amazed when they can see Orion visually through one scope and then in full detail using the Sbig ST7 at the f2.3 secondary mirror position on the Faststar. What really blows the mind are pics of M51 that take about 30 seconds to integrate using Faststar. I think the combination of electronic imaging and eyepiece observing really adds impact. The other nice scopes are 12 inch Dobs for the kids to experiment with. Last but not least I dearly love my trusty PST solar scope in Ha. It never fails to amaze and is so easy to set up and use.
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Blind-Cyclops
sage
Reged: 11/28/05
Loc: Kitchener, ON, Canada
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: aerospacedu]
#3394319 - 10/17/09 10:34 AM
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Hello folks,
I think three factors need to be considered when bringing a scope to an outreach star party:
1) Observing from within a light-polluted city or out in the darker country side?
This will usually dictate what observing you will be doing and will have some affect on which scope you bring (if you have more than one type)
2) What's up tonight? DSO / Lunar / or both?
Again, the objects/targets will affect your scope selection.
3) What type of scope do you have?
One that is more suitable for lunar (high powered narrow FOV) or DSO observing (wide FOV)?
(this is probably not a valid question as question #2 covers this decision, but some may think it is separate and important)
I usually take my Maksutov when there is more than a 1/4 Moon for "in-city" star parties -- lunar observing.
My refractor is used for less than 1/4 Moon evenings -- DSO observing. (see my signature for my scopes)
I have also found that people seem to have a better observing experience with a 2 inch EP rather than a 1.25 inch. (what are your feelings re: the EP size for star parties?
Just one side note -- if I may... I always set up my 20x80mm binoculars on a tripod to help explain how to get started... and have a 10x50mm binocular for hand held use to show the difference between hand and mounted binos. As well, I have a couple of binocular stargazing books close at hand to show folks I'm not just pulling their leg about binoculars. And they usually get the point when looking through the 20x80's given the number of WOW's, Golly-gee-wiz's...
Edited by Blind-Cyclops (10/17/09 10:38 AM)
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aerospacedu
journeyman
Reged: 09/16/09
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: Blind-Cyclops]
#3411188 - 10/26/09 01:34 AM
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Here is something we do for our public nights that seem to work very well. On several occasions i have set up a rear projection screen and "beam" the signal from a webcam hooked up to my scope directly to the screen. This really only works for the moon or planets with the webcam but i have done same with the Fastar. This works well on the big nights with large crowds. Positioning of the screen is important so as to minimize impact to other telescope operators and not create too much ambient light. We use a low powered projector for the purpose and a phillips toU pro on the back of the 8" celstron. To make it bigger, when conditions permit, we use a 2x barlow. The advantage of the screen is that many people can see the action simultaneously. The screen has been invaluable for those times when the viewing conditions are marginal. If the clouds get in the way then i switch over to planetarium software like starstrider, celestia or starry night and keep the show going with a presentation on the night sky. The crowd really love it and it saves disappointment if the sky is not as we like it to be. Of course this has to be organised with the general consensus of other operators but in our experience they have been very supportive because when they are clouded out at least they too have an alternative for the public. I find the rear screen solution better because it produces less reflected light and allows a set up where the crowd can stand right in front to get the detail.
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square_peg
Postmaster
   
Reged: 03/26/04
Loc: Maple Valley, WA
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: aerospacedu]
#3411201 - 10/26/09 01:48 AM
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Good idea!
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Brian L
professor emeritus
   
Reged: 11/17/08
Loc: The garden paradise of Pittsbu...
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: desertstars]
#3414341 - 10/27/09 03:46 PM
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Can't go wrong with a garden variety fork-mounted 10-12" SCT with goto. The less time you have to spend finding objects, the longer you will hold the attention of the uninitiated observers.
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Matthew Ota
Hmmm
Reged: 04/30/05
Loc: IngleHood, California
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: Brian L]
#3414461 - 10/27/09 04:52 PM
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Goto SCTs are popular at oureaches as children and teenagers are fascinated by the technology.
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Doug Reilly
professor emeritus
   
Reged: 07/29/08
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Re: Top 3 public demonstration telescopes
[Re: Matthew Ota]
#3930826 - 07/19/10 08:39 AM
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My top three:
1. Any scope with decent optics. 2. Any scope in reasonably good collimation with a reasonably sturdy and smooth mount. 3. Aperture commensurate with sky darkness or lack thereof.
As this thread demonstrates, opinions on size and type vary, and likely each type of scope not only attracts different types of amateur astronomers, they also attract different types of star partygoers. I just took my best friend to Rochestarfest and we looked a bit through the 20" dob...but he gravitated toward the new 8" RC mounted on an AP goto mount in the dome...it was a cool tech thing.
Personally, I use small scopes because that's what I tend to observe with. But that's usually in reasonably dark skies. I'd like to do more sidewalk astronomy downtown where light pollution is not good, in that case, a larger scope with goto or dscs might be nice.
I recall that John Dobson prescribes large, simple telescopes to open up as much of the universe to the public as possible. He also sometimes has to fight inner-city light pollution. Given that large aperture has been an elite privilege, I agree with his desire to "spread the wealth".
So there's a lot of ways of looking at it (and through it), but I think the three points I made above work pretty well, combined with my last point:
4. Any scope with an enthusiastic, competent operator with a burning desire to show the universe to people who have never seen it.
Formula for success!
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