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Equipment Discussions >> ATM, Optics and DIY Forum

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llanitedave
Humble Megalomaniac
*****

Reged: 09/26/05
Posts: 10923
Loc: Amargosa Valley, NV, USA
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: rboe]
      #1409676 - 02/07/07 10:41 AM

A question for all these "minimalist" open truss dobs. I'm ultimately planning for a 16" similar to one of these to be in my future. My only concern is the lack of baffling and the possibility of glare. Is there a set of "portable baffles" one can use at sites where there is some outside light? Is baffling in the eyepiece drawtube alone sufficient? Is it a matter of external screening?

--------------------

"S.O.E." (Sauron's Other Eye) 16" Royce conical mirror: A permanent work in progress.
10" Homebuilt dob, old Coulter mirror


Next Project: The "Eye of Sauron" Observatory!


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jgraham
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 12/02/04
Posts: 5603
Loc: Dayton, Ohio
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: llanitedave]
      #1409691 - 02/07/07 10:51 AM

My 16.5" isn't exactly minimalist, but the bulkheads were designed to act as baffles and I also have a set of thin plastic sheets that I attach to the truss using binder clips. This eliminates much of the stray light, dew, and cross-currents.

-John

--------------------
-John
================================================
Homebuilt scopes from 4.25-16.5"
Meade LXD75-N6/SN6/SC8, DSX-90, ETX-60BB, ETX-125PE, DS-2130
Orion StarBlast, BinoViewers, Coronado PST
Rebel XT/XTi, DSI Pro (I & II), DSI, LPI, Electronic Eyepiece, Phillips SPC900NC
Tasco 60mm Refractors


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PierreDesvaux
member


Reged: 11/06/06
Posts: 62
Loc: Paris, France
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: jgraham]
      #1409916 - 02/07/07 12:44 PM

I have a baffling in the eyepiece drawtube (a rotating disk with several holes of various sizes, which I can adjust), plus a dark socket wrapping all the trusses if necessary, but I use it very scarcely...Baffling and light protections are useful when there are lights in the neighbourhood...In my countryside, fortunately, there are a very little.
Baffling is not of a major necessity in dark skies.


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Alan1956
super member


Reged: 02/07/05
Posts: 128
Loc: Albuquerque, NM, USA
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: PierreDesvaux]
      #1410977 - 02/07/07 09:46 PM

Dave,
You ask a hard question, that has a grey answer. I did lots of analysis on my 12", and published it here: http://www.xmission.com/~alanne/DS3Baffling.html.

Since I made my 16" (and frankly, I don't have as much experience with it), I have modified my opinions a bit. Currently, I believe the following:

* What was stated in the Sky and Tel article April 2001 is a great start, but is incomplete.

* Light that reflects off of something, not into your eyepiece, is irrelevant. An example is side light on your clean primary mirror. Light that scatters off of something, and can get to your eyepiece, is relevant. An example is the ground behind your secondary in a light polluted location.

* What you want is for the lens of the eyepiece to see no stray light at all. This is at the eyepiece lense - which is a point INSIDE the focuser tube. We can partially approximate this by looking in the focuser tube with our eyes. When you do this, if you see anything that isn't black or sky, you have work/fixing to do.

* Baffling or shrouds behind the secondary is the most important addition that you can make. I use a large baffle that is foam core poster board that is bent. I then use some flat black felt paper (I forget where I got it - AstroSystems?). I believe that shrouds are then irrelevant. See the picture of Deep Space 4 - my baby - a few posts above here.

* Having a medium or longer focuser tube, and a non reflective inside to this focuser tube, is the next most important thing to stop reflections. I have been amazed at how dark the sky looks using my FeatherTouch focuser. They actually machined ridges inside of it that act like numerous baffles.

* I put black electrician's tape over the trusses, and blackened the secondary edges and holder. Not sure if it helped at all, but it made me feel better.

* I made the top of the mirror box a fairly dark stain. Once again, I don't think it helps much, but it makes me feel better.

That's about it. I find this scope gives as dark of backgrounds as any, unless there is a moon out or streetlight near - AND - I am placing the secondary where I am getting lots of reflection off of the back felt.

By the way, the advantage of only having a removeable baffle is that about half of the time, the baffle stays in the car. That way, the wind just blows through the scope without creating any vibrations. New Mexico can get windy some times!

Alan Scott


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llanitedave
Humble Megalomaniac
*****

Reged: 09/26/05
Posts: 10923
Loc: Amargosa Valley, NV, USA
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: Alan1956]
      #1410989 - 02/07/07 09:57 PM

Thanks, Alan. On my scope, I think it's the spider vanes that are most affected by the wind. I'm not sure how to address that.

I started thinking about it a few nights ago, when I had stepped away from the eyepiece to check the star chart, and turning back towards it I was almost dazzled by the reflection of Sirius coming from a slight angle through the front of the OTA. I began to wonder what effect dust on the mirror would have towards any light that's not exactly in the optical cone. The baffle that you have is a nice big size. but I worried that light coming in from different angles either onto the primary OR secondary can scatter off dust and reduce image contrast. It's nice to know that doesn't seem to be a problem.

--------------------

"S.O.E." (Sauron's Other Eye) 16" Royce conical mirror: A permanent work in progress.
10" Homebuilt dob, old Coulter mirror


Next Project: The "Eye of Sauron" Observatory!


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tonyd
member
*****

Reged: 05/12/04
Posts: 76
Loc: Springfield, OR
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: llanitedave]
      #1411124 - 02/07/07 11:15 PM Attachment (131 downloads)

Here's a picture of my just finished 'medium' scope: an Amart 6" OTA needing a base. Had fun making it; practice (and mistakes) before I tackle rebuilding my bigger dob. Had a great 1st (other people) light at our club meeting the other night.

--------------------
Rebuilt 12.5" Truss tube dob -
- balanced for Denk binos
6" Hardin dob OTA w/homebuilt base
William Optics Megrez 80SD F6.0 refractor
11 X 56 Oberwerk binocs


Edited by tonyd (02/07/07 11:17 PM)


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llanitedave
Humble Megalomaniac
*****

Reged: 09/26/05
Posts: 10923
Loc: Amargosa Valley, NV, USA
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: tonyd]
      #1411128 - 02/07/07 11:17 PM

Oh, THAT scope!

--------------------

"S.O.E." (Sauron's Other Eye) 16" Royce conical mirror: A permanent work in progress.
10" Homebuilt dob, old Coulter mirror


Next Project: The "Eye of Sauron" Observatory!

Edited by llanitedave (02/07/07 11:32 PM)


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tonyd
member
*****

Reged: 05/12/04
Posts: 76
Loc: Springfield, OR
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: llanitedave]
      #1411148 - 02/07/07 11:27 PM

Hmmm...Attaching the picture makes it easier to...picture.
Definitely pleased on its motions, reduced weight (from a stock one), and overall appearence. Has given me (some) confidence on starting next project.

--------------------
Rebuilt 12.5" Truss tube dob -
- balanced for Denk binos
6" Hardin dob OTA w/homebuilt base
William Optics Megrez 80SD F6.0 refractor
11 X 56 Oberwerk binocs


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llanitedave
Humble Megalomaniac
*****

Reged: 09/26/05
Posts: 10923
Loc: Amargosa Valley, NV, USA
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: tonyd]
      #1411165 - 02/07/07 11:33 PM

I love the star charts on the rocker box, Tony!

--------------------

"S.O.E." (Sauron's Other Eye) 16" Royce conical mirror: A permanent work in progress.
10" Homebuilt dob, old Coulter mirror


Next Project: The "Eye of Sauron" Observatory!


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Jim Svetlikov
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 10/06/03
Posts: 2033
Loc: Crescent Beach
Re: Is the Schief easier to build? new [Re: rwiederrich]
      #1415805 - 02/10/07 11:20 AM

Here's my 10" f/4 separated and together, the chair is inside the pedestal in the second pic.




--------------------
It is better to build a boy than try to mend a man.


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ctcables
Vendor (Reco Labs)


Reged: 11/14/06
Posts: 149
Loc: Oregon
Re: Is the Schief easier to build? new [Re: Jim Svetlikov]
      #1416873 - 02/10/07 10:04 PM Attachment (105 downloads)

Nice fast scope, looks very portable.

--------------------
Telescope
F4.5
14.6 inch Fused Quartz Mirror strehl .996
18 PT carbonfiber mirror cell
Antearies Quartz secondary
2 strut carbonfiber
Feather Touch focuser
Main scope is 31 lbs
Time to build off and on for a year.


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dawsonian2000
member


Reged: 07/26/06
Posts: 78
Loc: Riverview, FL, USA
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: jgraham]
      #1417191 - 02/11/07 03:40 AM

Great pair of instruments you have there, John! When you rebuild your 10" f/6.7, do you plan to incorporate a clock drive?

--------------------
Clear Skies, Forever!
Mel Dawson
The Vega Sky Center
10" (250mm) F/5.65 Fork Mounted Newtonian Reflector
3.5" (90mm) F/11.1 "Vixen-Spec Modified" Konus GEM Refractor
3.1" (80mm) F/6 Super ED APO Triplet Refractor
4.5" (114mm) F/8 Cosmos (Grampus) GEM Newtonian
2.4" (60mm) F/16.7 Tasco 7te-5 Refractor
2.4" (60mm) F/15 Jason Discoverer 313 Refractor
http://www.vega-sky-center.com



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jgraham
Postmaster
*****

Reged: 12/02/04
Posts: 5603
Loc: Dayton, Ohio
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: dawsonian2000]
      #1417505 - 02/11/07 09:38 AM

Mel; yep. With a lighter OTA driving the polar disk should be relatively easy even with the pipe thread southern bearing. I plan on using a curved-bolt drive with the mechanism tucked away in the space between the deck and the R.A. shaft. I've built curved bolt drives on other GEM pipe thread mounts and they work fine for visual observing.

-John

--------------------
-John
================================================
Homebuilt scopes from 4.25-16.5"
Meade LXD75-N6/SN6/SC8, DSX-90, ETX-60BB, ETX-125PE, DS-2130
Orion StarBlast, BinoViewers, Coronado PST
Rebel XT/XTi, DSI Pro (I & II), DSI, LPI, Electronic Eyepiece, Phillips SPC900NC
Tasco 60mm Refractors


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Moki
super member


Reged: 11/06/05
Posts: 358
Loc: Dallas, GA
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: rwiederrich]
      #1418277 - 02/11/07 04:07 PM Attachment (130 downloads)

8 in. F7 finished today. First light tonight!

--------------------
"In questions of science, the authority of a thousand is not worth the humble reasoning of a single individual." Galileo

12.5" F5.3 Dob on EQ platform
8" F7 planetary Dob / EQ Platform

Current ATM projects:
Xtal-Controlled EQ platform motor drive
8" F6 Dob for club
Motorized focus for planetary
10" F6 Ultralight PushTo


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kingjamez
scholastic sledgehammer
*****

Reged: 10/03/06
Posts: 939
Loc: Washington D.C.
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: Moki]
      #1418313 - 02/11/07 04:27 PM

oh... I really really like it Moki!!!

-Jim

--------------------
C8 on Atlas with EQMOD, BO 91mm Triplet, ETX125 UHTC
Celestron Onyx 80mm
Canon Xsi Modified w/IDAS
Gen 3 NightVision Eyepiece
8mm, 13mm Ethos
Aspiring Optician
Watch my Wiimote control Atlas:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PnmkygmGNiM


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philipdo
sage


Reged: 12/06/06
Posts: 205
Loc: Flanders, Belgium, Europe
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: Moki]
      #1418413 - 02/11/07 05:29 PM Attachment (105 downloads)

Largely but not entirely homemade 200 mm Kutter Schief. Made the optics and the OTA. The latter was constructed with commonly available materials such as wood, aluminum, threaded rods ... and handtools only.

--------------------
-philip doutreligne

-ETX 90
-Kutter Schiefspiegler 200/4000
-Orion Atlas mount

http://users.telenet.be/philipdo


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Don H
member


Reged: 12/28/06
Posts: 17
Loc: Midwest US
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: philipdo]
      #1432843 - 02/18/07 11:25 PM Attachment (129 downloads)

Hi all,

Here's a few of mine... First time I've posted here. I have read CN reviews for years, but usually hang out in AMart's ATM Forum, most often only reading. There seems to be way more going on here than the last time I checked in...

These scopes are a 12.5" f/5.9 with a 1" thick Pyrex mirror, an 11.3" with a web backed blank from the 1930's made by a guy named Buttles, a 14" BVC (one of five a friend and I made), and a couple of 6 inchers. Made the mirrors in all of them, plus a 10, 11, 16, 18.5, and some other 8s, 10s, 12s, whatever, lots of scopes. I've slowed down the past year or so, but I do have a finished 13" mirror that I'm trying design a scope around to fit in the hatch of a small 2 seater car. I think I may be asking for ideas soon...

Thanks,
Don


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John Carruthers
Skiprat
*****

Reged: 02/02/07
Posts: 1752
Loc: Kent, UK
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: rwiederrich]
      #1433260 - 02/19/07 09:10 AM Attachment (121 downloads)

A simple 10" F6.1, mostly from scrap, though the Crayford was scratch built by friend with access to CNC gear :-)

--------------------
Jc

ATM 10" F6.1, 1/25th wave spec (max wavefront error +/- 1/12.6 in zone 4 of 6, sodium light )
6" F7 spec
127mm F9.4 Refractor
10 x 50 bin
ETX80 (finder)
Canon 20D
and a curious mind



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rwiederrich
Goldfinger
*****

Reged: 11/17/05
Posts: 6190
Loc: Bremerton Washington
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: Moki]
      #1433692 - 02/19/07 01:12 PM

Quote:

8 in. F7 finished today. First light tonight!




DANG! that is cool.

What kind, if any, flexure do you experience?

Is that tube ring rotatable?

I luv it....

Great job, very well executed.

Rob
Gold Mtn Observing Center

--------------------
www.goldmtobservingcenter.com
Providing a great place for amateur astronomers, and ATM's to come and enjoy their hobby.



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rwiederrich
Goldfinger
*****

Reged: 11/17/05
Posts: 6190
Loc: Bremerton Washington
Re: Post a picture of the scope you made new [Re: philipdo]
      #1433708 - 02/19/07 01:17 PM

Quote:

Largely but not entirely homemade 200 mm Kutter Schief. Made the optics and the OTA. The latter was constructed with commonly available materials such as wood, aluminum, threaded rods ... and handtools only.




That is a fantastic scope.

Nice close-up.

I like how you added the smaller scope on the counter arm.
Seams kinda familiar...

Rob
Gold Mtn Observing Center

--------------------
www.goldmtobservingcenter.com
Providing a great place for amateur astronomers, and ATM's to come and enjoy their hobby.



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