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Observing >> Deep Sky Observing

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Brian Albin
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Reged: 08/22/06
Posts: 476
Loc: Western Oregon
What do Veteran Observers view?
      #1788228 - 08/20/07 05:11 AM

Some of you have done a good deal of observing. Do you run out of new targets and spend all your time now looking at things you have seen before?

What would you like to look at if you had a different observatory location or a more revealing telescope?


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novbabies
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Reged: 06/05/05
Posts: 15678
Loc: Northern Georgia!
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: Brian Albin]
      #1788306 - 08/20/07 06:56 AM

I do spend time with old sky-friends at every opportunity. Their visual impression changes every time depending on exact sky conditions, the magnification or EP I use, the telescope - so it's an ever changing panorama of views that I can get. I also make lists of objects I have NOT seen, and will go for them when fancy strikes. When fancy strikes, it's usually either galaxies or planetary nebulae, although lately with the boon of the 40mm Paragon, open clusters have taken on a brand new fascination for me !

As Don (Starman1) will tell you, there are over 10,000 objects acquirable by a 12" reflector - more than enough, reallym, for a lifetime of observing pleasure!

--------------------
Good Seeing!

Mark

Orion 12" XTi f/4.9


VERY old Edmund 6" f/8 reflector
Assorted binoculars


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John Kocijanski
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Posts: 1488
Loc: Monticello, NY
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: Brian Albin]
      #1788339 - 08/20/07 07:46 AM

Quote:

What would you like to look at if you had a different observatory location or a more revealing telescope?




More galaxies.

--------------------
John
Deep Space Observer 10 * SPC-8 * C102 HD f/10 * XT 4.5 * AT1010N * PST *


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walt r
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 02/13/07
Posts: 2419
Loc: Doylestown, PA
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: John Kocijanski]
      #1788701 - 08/20/07 12:16 PM

My primary observation targets are variable stars, mostly Mira's that are on the AAVSO's 'needed' list. I always find it amassing how dynamic they are.
Next are the many other objects. Galaxies are nice but I'm becoming partial to Planetary Nebulas. Each are very different, some bright, some dim and many show color nicely. Doubles are fun and a test of conditions.

If I had a darker site/bigger scope I would be going fainter on these objects.

walt

--------------------
Walt

Obsession 18" f/4.45 #1370 AN/SC
MK67 Deluxe 6" f/12 Mak-Cass, Super Polaris GEM, JMI MicroMax DSC
DIY 60mm f/6 Achromat
Cookbook 245 CCD


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Cygnus_x1
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Reged: 11/17/04
Posts: 2119
Loc: Isle of Wight, England
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: walt r]
      #1788722 - 08/20/07 12:24 PM

Galaxies, especially groups of galaxies, planetary nebulae and star clusters.

--------------------
Visual Deep Sky Observing
Visual Astronomy blog
Fotopic astronomy gallery My photos from astronomy events, etc

8x42 binoculars 'light thimble'
4" refractor and 4" Meade SCT 'light cups'
12" Dobsonian 'light bucket'

Various TeleVue eyepieces


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sgottlieb
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Reged: 07/22/07
Posts: 243
Loc: SF Bay area
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: novbabies]
      #1789260 - 08/20/07 04:21 PM

Quote:

As Don (Starman1) will tell you, there are over 10,000 objects acquirable by a 12" reflector - more than enough, really, for a lifetime of observing pleasure!




I'm currently pretty close to that total -- 9804 different deep sky objects -- mainly in an 18-inch reflector.

Although I've nearly reached the end of the line as far as NGC objects north of -40 degrees, I can't imagine running out of targets once you really delve into clusters of galaxies. Still, I always enjoy revisiting familiar eye-candy objects, just to either soak in the view or look for new details.

--------------------
Steve Gottlieb
18" f/4.3 Starmaster
Adventures In Deep Space - New article on MASH planetaries
7500+ NGC/IC Visual Descriptions
NGC/IC Project


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Alvin Huey
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Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: sgottlieb]
      #1789514 - 08/20/07 06:02 PM

Yah, I'm a "list" kinda guy. Or a somewhat structured plan of stuff to look for. Notice that I said for, not at.

I'm working on re-observing and observing new Abell Galaxy Clusters. I'm starting to work on the Shabakzian (sp?) chains. Also to finish off my planetary nebulae (> 7") and globular cluster survey. Also like to look for the lesser known stuff.

I'm done with Hicksons, Arps and five more Abell PNe's left.

For some reason I don't go back to eye candy as much as I did before as I felt that I'm wasting precious observing time and being "blinded" at the same time.

--------------------
Clear Skies,
Alvin #26
22" f/4.1 reflector, Takahashi TOA-130S on AP1200GTO (just sold), 30" f/4.3 StarMaster and Antares 6" f/6.5 on Orion SVP
FaintFuzzies | TAC | TAC-Sac


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Cygnus_x1
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Reged: 11/17/04
Posts: 2119
Loc: Isle of Wight, England
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: Alvin Huey]
      #1789525 - 08/20/07 06:11 PM

Shakhbazian galaxy groups, now that is seriously deep stuff, making Hicksons and Arps look like easy, easy pickings.
There's some good stuff on the Shakhbazians on Andreas Domenico's Deep Sky site

--------------------
Visual Deep Sky Observing
Visual Astronomy blog
Fotopic astronomy gallery My photos from astronomy events, etc

8x42 binoculars 'light thimble'
4" refractor and 4" Meade SCT 'light cups'
12" Dobsonian 'light bucket'

Various TeleVue eyepieces


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AlanK
super member


Reged: 01/26/07
Posts: 130
Loc: Auckland, New Zealand
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: novbabies]
      #1789619 - 08/20/07 06:55 PM


I go for new stuff - mostly galaxies on every observing session and maintain an ongoing target list of several
hundred non observed objects. From what Starman1 was saying about total objects for a 12inch, I should be able
to keep going for some time! The only time I ever look at the bright seen before stuff is when its no good for anything else such as partly cloudy weather - looking through the gaps.

--------------------
Clear skies!

12.5 inch f5.4 reflector
18 inch f4.5 Obsession #1637
Auckland NZ
6,116 deep sky objects incl 4,268 ngcs

If it's up there, I'll look for it!


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Starman1
Vendor - Scope City
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Reged: 06/24/03
Posts: 10960
Loc: Los Angeles
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: Brian Albin]
      #1790274 - 08/21/07 12:22 AM

Quote:

Some of you have done a good deal of observing. Do you run out of new targets and spend all your time now looking at things you have seen before?

What would you like to look at if you had a different observatory location or a more revealing telescope?



Half new objects, half old friends--every night out. 10,500+ objects in log, now. Thousands more to go.
15,000 objects visible to 8", 30,000+ to 12.5", hundreds of thousands to 32"+.
Running out of objects is a sign of light pollution--understandable but unacceptable to someone wanting to plumb the depths of what's visible in his scope. It's why I drive 100miles (secondary site: 180 miles) to an observing site every month.

--------------------
Don Pensack
12.5" Truss Dob, 5" Maksutov
Sustaining Lifetime IDA member, TeleVue junkie


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Alvin Huey
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Reged: 10/18/05
Posts: 1534
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Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: Starman1]
      #1790289 - 08/21/07 12:32 AM

Quote:

15,000 objects visible to 8", 30,000+ to 12.5", hundreds of thousands to 32"+.
Running out of objects is a sign of light pollution--understandable but unacceptable to someone wanting to plumb the depths of what's visible in his scope. It's why I drive 100miles (secondary site: 180 miles) to an observing site every month.




A true Deep Sky Observer!

--------------------
Clear Skies,
Alvin #26
22" f/4.1 reflector, Takahashi TOA-130S on AP1200GTO (just sold), 30" f/4.3 StarMaster and Antares 6" f/6.5 on Orion SVP
FaintFuzzies | TAC | TAC-Sac


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Brian Albin
Seeker


Reged: 08/22/06
Posts: 476
Loc: Western Oregon
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: Alvin Huey]
      #1790360 - 08/21/07 02:07 AM

There is such a consensus about not going back to things seen before, I suppose this reveals that we use telescopes because of a desire to explore.

When it is said that a certain number of objects are visible in a particular size of scope, I take it visible means just barely.
Do any of you look at such things? Maybe for the accomplishment of having found it? Or do you prefer to spend your nights looking at objects in which you can see more detail?


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Tele
sage


Reged: 11/01/05
Posts: 206
Loc: Eastern Oklahoma
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: Brian Albin]
      #1790394 - 08/21/07 03:28 AM

I spend some time pushing the envelope, looking for the dimmest thing I can see on a particular night.

Then I'll spend some time looking for detail in brighter objects, I love spiral structure.

Then I'll spend some time with old friends like the swan or the trifid. I enjoy using different eyepieces and filters as well as different scopes on the brighter stuff. To me they are a lot like my favorite songs though I have seen of heard them a thousand times I always enjoy the ambiance they bring to my existence.

--------------------
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds the most discoveries, is not "Eureka!", but "That's funny..."
-- Isaac Asimov
14" f4.56 Homemade dob w/ Raycraft Optics
8" f5 Homemade dob w/ Orion Optics
4" f10 Homemade off axis dob w/ DGM optics
10 x 60 Apogee Binos w/ neb filters


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bicparker
Pooh-Bah


Reged: 02/07/05
Posts: 1438
Loc: Plano, TX
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: Brian Albin]
      #1790405 - 08/21/07 04:02 AM

I'm like Alvin. On a good night, I tend to ignore the eye candy and observe the fainter things instead, because I hate to lose those things a great night can bring.

My primary lines of observing are mostly galaxies and galaxy clusters, though I do enjoy some of the more interesting planetary nebulae and globs from time to time.

--------------------
Bic Parker
17.5" f/5 dob
10" f/10 SCT
5" f/8 refractor
80mm f/6 refractor
66mm f/6 refractor
Plus a few others out of the rotation


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AlanK
super member


Reged: 01/26/07
Posts: 130
Loc: Auckland, New Zealand
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: Brian Albin]
      #1790411 - 08/21/07 04:14 AM

I quite often observe things that are barely visible (a minimum level would be something visible at least 25% of the time with averted vision). For myself, it is the accomplishment of having found the object using the old fashioned star hopping technique and rarely relying on POSS or finder charts other than to verify the observation afterwards.

--------------------
Clear skies!

12.5 inch f5.4 reflector
18 inch f4.5 Obsession #1637
Auckland NZ
6,116 deep sky objects incl 4,268 ngcs

If it's up there, I'll look for it!


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Starman1
Vendor - Scope City
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Reged: 06/24/03
Posts: 10960
Loc: Los Angeles
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: Brian Albin]
      #1790908 - 08/21/07 11:24 AM

Quote:

When it is said that a certain number of objects are visible in a particular size of scope, I take it visible means just barely.
Do any of you look at such things? Maybe for the accomplishment of having found it? Or do you prefer to spend your nights looking at objects in which you can see more detail?



I have seen literally hundreds (if not thousands) of objects that are "at the limit". Often, they are companion objects to my targets (satellite galaxies or other memebers of a group), or simply very low surface brightness, thus hard to see.
One could argue I'm looking at objects that are really beyond the aperture of the scope I'm using, but I see it as an observing challenge.
I often get full write-ups of details on these ultra-faint objects.
How?
Even objects so faint they appear as "breath on the eyepiece" can have some details noted:
--shape
--orientation on the sky
--superimposed/nearby stars noted
--brighter centers?
--accompanying objects?
--held what % of the time with averted vision?
--relative brightness to nearby objects?
--size in the field?
If you make those notes about the objects at the limit, you will be able to go back later and determine the difficulty of the observation and may be able to contribute to a conversation about the visibility of the object in a certain size of scope when asked by someone doing a project.
One thing is for certain--you will never know if a certain object is visible in your scope unless you look. I can't tell you how many hundreds of objects supposedly beyond the sizes of scopes I've used I've been able to see, while other objects supposedly visible were not found. You won't observe at the limits very long before you realize the positions and descriptions of a lot of objects are not accurate (at least the ones often found in books). Fortunately, we are in a golden era of amateur astronomy, and great reference books exist (like the Night Sky Observer's Guide of Kepple and Sanner, or Star Clusters by Archinal & Hynes, or Steinicke and Jakiel's Galaxies and How to Observe Them).

Why look for objects at the limit? One very obvious reason: to teach yourself how to see things at the limit of vision. This pays off in spades when looking at brighter objects because many more details will be seen and noted. Spending so many years with a small scope looking at faint galaxies means that when I look at a bright object these days my notes may run to a full page of writing about the object. Sometimes I just give up and appreciate it for what it is, and take no notes at all.
A recent view of M17 through an O-III filter on a very dark night showed the Swan shape was merely a bright knot in a nebula over a degree wide. So many waves and tendrils of gas were visible that I had to move the scope several eyepiece fields before I was sure I wasn't still looking at nebula. Much of that nebula was about as bright as the very faintest galaxies that only pop in and out. I credit all those years of looking at faint fuzzies for the ability to see the stuff in the first place.
[Note: long time exposures show M16 nd M17 are bright parts in the same nebula, so some aperture will probably see this]

--------------------
Don Pensack
12.5" Truss Dob, 5" Maksutov
Sustaining Lifetime IDA member, TeleVue junkie


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galaxyman
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Reged: 04/04/05
Posts: 1171
Loc: Limerick, Pa
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: Starman1]
      #1791095 - 08/21/07 01:09 PM

So many galaxies, so little time or clear Evil Orbless nights!

Karl
E.O.H.

Chesmont Astronomical Society
22" F/4.5 Dob
12.5" F/4.8 Dob
8" F/9 Refractor(The Beast)
6" F/6.5 Refractor(Mini-Beast)

--------------------
So many galaxies, so little time!


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LumpyDarkness
sage


Reged: 08/06/07
Posts: 311
Loc: San Francisco bay area
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: Brian Albin]
      #1791113 - 08/21/07 01:18 PM

Quote:

Some of you have done a good deal of observing. Do you run out of new targets and spend all your time now looking at things you have seen before?




I re-observe targets and try picking out new detail. I also regularly include new challenging targets. Variety is fun.

Quote:

What would you like to look at if you had a different observatory location or a more revealing telescope?




New location? Somewhere south of latitude zero would provide lots of new targets! :-)

--------------------
Mark Wagner

18" f/4.5 Dob
The Astronomy Connection: Observing Reports - updated 12/1/08
Adventures In Deep Space: updated 12/1/08
Join us in June at California's Golden State Star Party



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Tele
sage


Reged: 11/01/05
Posts: 206
Loc: Eastern Oklahoma
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? new [Re: LumpyDarkness]
      #1791420 - 08/21/07 03:50 PM

What would you like to look at if you had a different observatory location or a more revealing telescope?

My first choise of new location would be somewhere on the other side of the galaxy.

Barring that I would settle for my own private observatory in Peru, with about 80 meters of aperture.

--------------------
The most exciting phrase to hear in science, the one that heralds the most discoveries, is not "Eureka!", but "That's funny..."
-- Isaac Asimov
14" f4.56 Homemade dob w/ Raycraft Optics
8" f5 Homemade dob w/ Orion Optics
4" f10 Homemade off axis dob w/ DGM optics
10 x 60 Apogee Binos w/ neb filters


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Cygnus_x1
Sketcher Extraordinaire
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Reged: 11/17/04
Posts: 2119
Loc: Isle of Wight, England
Re: What do Veteran Observers view? [Re: Tele]
      #1791463 - 08/21/07 04:03 PM

A 25" scope located in Australia's outback would be ideal...great observing, great birding, what could be better?

--------------------
Visual Deep Sky Observing
Visual Astronomy blog
Fotopic astronomy gallery My photos from astronomy events, etc

8x42 binoculars 'light thimble'
4" refractor and 4" Meade SCT 'light cups'
12" Dobsonian 'light bucket'

Various TeleVue eyepieces


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