Spaz
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 01/19/07
Posts: 758
Loc: New Zealand
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Pardon my vulgarity, but I have to say that reading this thread is like seeing somebody get kicked in the nuts.  
Good luck with Celestron, I'm sure you won't need it. And it looks as if you've had all the bad luck for this year already.
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bbriggs
sage
Reged: 01/09/06
Posts: 204
Loc: Graham, Wa.
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Well I hastily grabbed my eyepiece case off a table with the lid still open and sent my 31 nagler bouncing across a stone patio. I still think about that sickening clackity clack noise it made. Outside of a few dents on the outside it was no worse for the experience. My brother also dumped his 18" mirror out of the cell and put a nice chip in the edge. One thing you should consider is getting a personal articles floater on your homeowners insurance for your astro gear. Usually is costs about .85/$100 of value and will cover anything that happens.
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18 f4.5 home made newt
14.5 f4.5 homemade newt w/Zambuto
16x70 Fujinon Binoculars 20x110 Garrett Binoculars
Denk II power x switch 21's and 14's
31, 17, 9 Naglers
Televue Ranger
Astrogizmos Portable Observatory
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Mike Clemens
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 11/26/05
Posts: 2601
Loc: Alaska @ 61N -149W
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> costs about .85/$100 of value
Per what time period?
Thanks, Mike
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ngc2289
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 04/13/05
Posts: 1707
Loc: SouthTexas
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Quote:
Good luck with Celestron, I'm sure you won't need it. And it looks as if you've had all the bad luck for this year already.
Yeah but there are only 15 more days then it is a whole new year!!!  
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Mike Traub(Mr. Congeniality): I've learned that I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy it!:Shipfitters mottos; Cut to suit, pound to fit, paint to hide!: If it dosen't fit get a bigger hammer!......Retired and BROKE!!!!!Refractors are like a fine wine!They just get better with age!!!!!! :SV102ED(Light Hawk):SV Nighthawk Classic(Tenchi[Heaven&Earth]):Vixen GP: SV M-1 & AT Voyager alt-az mounts.
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Jon Isaacs
Postmaster
Reged: 06/16/04
Posts: 12070
Loc: San Diego, California
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Quote:
Of course you're right, it was carelessness and haste. Also cold and dark. Also, I didn't extend the tripod legs like I normally would, to keep it low for the setting crescent moon, so I was mounting below my eye level as well. All bad.
Sorry to hear about your difficulties, over the years I have had a similar problem or two but never with a refractor.
Even when done carefully, it is not so easy to install a heavy OTA on the mount using the dovetail. it is quite possible to think it is correctly installed when in reality it is cocked and can slip out with disasterous results... It is difficult to see the dovetail because it is underneath the tube itself and you are holding the tube to be sure it doesn't drop. Doing it at night makes it more difficult to really be sure that everything is solid before letting loose of the OTA.
A good way to avoid this problem is to avoid using the dovetail. Rather, install the dovetail and rings once inside where the light is good and you can see exactly what you are doing. Tighten everything so the dovetail and rings are secure. Then when you setup, you open the rings, place the scope in the rings, flip them over and tighten them up. Everything is right in front of you and it more difficult to make a mistake. And, since there are two rings, even if you get one wrong, the other one is there as a back up.
THat said... I normally use the Dovetail but over concrete I would consider avoiding it's use.
I hope you are able to resolve the issues with your objective. Before getting too concerned, you might try to get another opinion, maybe someone here in this forum who lived nearby.
Jon
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SAL
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 09/13/03
Posts: 2093
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Reading all these posts is beginning to make me paranoid. I almost fell when I tripped on the tripod with my 5-inch Burgess achromat one night while dismounting it to put in back in the case. I now take a minute to fully survey the area prior to hoisting the OTA free from the mount to insure I can slowly take the required steps without tripping over the tripod, equipment cases, etc.
Going slow seems to be the best prevention, especially when taking my Dob up and down our basement stairs with each use. 
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Stellarvue 102BV (Feather Touch focuser)
Burgess 1278 (MoonLite CF2B focuser)
Hardin 10-inch Dob (GSO Crayford Focuser)
7x50 Binoculars
The heavens are telling of the glory of God; And their expanse is declaring the work of His hands. (Psalms 19:1 NASB)
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Danno2006
sage
Reged: 01/25/06
Posts: 440
Loc: Ontario, Canada
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Usefull thread on "not what to do"
Good tips on the dovetail and surveying your work area. I have a head mounted LED light coming to allow easy inspection to make sure that dovetail is set exactly where it should be set.
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deSitter
sage
Reged: 12/09/04
Posts: 468
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Of course you can remove the scope from its cradle, mount the cradle and make sure that is secure FIRST, then put the scope into the cradle and clamp down the rings. It's not exactly safe hoisting a large, heavy refractor up high on a mount and then trying to glance around to make sure the dovetail has properly seated itself. I skip my own advice for my 5" which is relatively light (15 lbs) but would never try it with anything bigger - and I'm pretty stout. Placing the bare tube into the open rings is easy and safe.
-drl
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Mike Clemens
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 11/26/05
Posts: 2601
Loc: Alaska @ 61N -149W
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I find it safest to use a tip-in saddle, and put the scope, already in rings, into the saddle. This lets me cradle the entire scope with both arms and continue to do so even while fastening it down, until it is in the saddle and secured. I can even run my finger around the saddle-to-dovetail "interface" while still cradling it with both arms, verifying the gap all around is proper thickness. I have found that putting scopes into and out of rings is a prime source of paint damage.
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scope dog
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 07/26/04
Posts: 1131
Loc: USA, NJ
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Just be glad it's not a $10,000 scope. Prepare for the worst, enjoy the best. When I had my Vixen na120s, I didn't like how smooth the scope was past the lens to the dew shield, this scope cold slide right out. My Santel I installed a set screw to prevent slip at dovetail.
Aluminum contracts, and the dia of the tube seems to occur faster then the rings that hold it. That what I found.
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Jim Fusco
Astreya 152mm F/7 SAPO
Santel MK91
Astreya-SAPO
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deSitter
sage
Reged: 12/09/04
Posts: 468
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Well I had a real horror story. My SN-10's dovetail plate was attached to one of the rings with the wrong bolt at the Chinese factory, which finally came apart by slipping the too-loose threads. The sound of the scope bouncing off the tripod leg, then coming loose completely and bouncing off the driveway, was sickening. Amazingly, the corrector plate was not damaged and could have been salvaged (the tube and focuser were toast). But, Meade replaced the entire OTA out-of-warranty. That defective bolt had been waiting to fail the entire time I'd had the scope out. After that, I invested in a better dovetail bar and made sure the rings were secure.
As for rings and paint, a far greater threat to the tube finish is ink transfer from the fresh felt that lines the rings, to the clear-coated paint - particularly visible on white tubes. I know of no way to remove that - any suggestions?
BTW, many thanks again to Meade for being so generous.
-drl
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mikey cee
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 01/18/07
Posts: 2073
Loc: bellevue ne.
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Carefull don't be sayin' "Chinese factory" we might offend some of our international readership!  Mike
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Mike 10x50 sears tower binocs, 3" f/10 edmunds reflector, 2.4" f/11.7 manon refractor, 6" f/8 jaegers refractor, "The 8 Ball" 8" f/13.3 brandt refractor, 3" f/15.8 sans&streiffe refractor, 3.1" f/15 selsi refractor(towa 339), 2.4" f/15 sears refractor, selsi 30x30mm spyglass, criterion 5-draw 25x45x75x spyglass(1957).
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rusirius6278
Carpal Tunnel
Reged: 11/03/06
Posts: 1722
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Quote:
I find it safest to use a tip-in saddle, and put the scope, already in rings, into the saddle. This lets me cradle the entire scope with both arms and continue to do so even while fastening it down, until it is in the saddle and secured. I can even run my finger around the saddle-to-dovetail "interface" while still cradling it with both arms, verifying the gap all around is proper thickness...
very safe, Mike...my Vixens came this way already...with the carrying handle/rings already on the scope, positioned at the ota`s COG...making it a simple matter of placing the scope/rings/handle/dovetail plate on to the mount as you describe and tightening the knobs as tight as they`ll go.
but i keep my scope mounted on a home-made scope-buggy...regardless, i make sure to check the tightness of the knobs both before and after each use.
Jim
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current scopes
Vixen ED103SWT
Vixen ED102S
C-102AZ/HD
StarMax 127
Jason 60/11.7
UO HD Abbe Orthos - 5mm, 6mm, 7mm, 9mm
Older UO Ortho - 4mm
Celestron 2x Ultima Barlow
and many other scopes i`ve been fortunate enough to check out...
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Spaz
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 01/19/07
Posts: 758
Loc: New Zealand
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Quote:
Carefull don't be sayin' "Chinese factory" we might offend some of our international readership! Mike
Yeah, coz, ya know, American factories never make mistakes, right?
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Don W
Postmaster
Reged: 05/19/03
Posts: 12723
Loc: Wisconsin, USA
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Keep the politics out of Cloudy Nights.
The Moderators
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Jack Knetzger
member
Reged: 12/04/07
Posts: 34
Loc: Plano, TX
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Wow, this is a great idea. I tried it this past weekend and worked like a charm in the cold setting up. For me, much easier to put the OTA in the tube rings and close those screws, no ambiguity about the placement. So pre-mounted dovetail it is.
BTW, had 2 spectacular nights with "Frosty", looking at Mars and the Moon. Moon looks amazing in a refractor. While my 13" dob has twice the resolution, no amount of downstopping/filtering produces the same pleasant-to-look- at for long times, low-eyestrain image that the C6 gives. Good seeing, spent 1/2 hour with a 7mm nagler slowly traversing the rills, half-shadowed craters, and the flat areas with the motorized control. The flat areas were particularly more interesting than in the dob, which tends to really blow them out. Also got a wonderful view of M42 with and without a lumicon nebular filter, again interesting and different looking than in the fast dob, but obviously not as tendrilly.
No respense yet from Celestron on the replacement lens, but Frosty's hanging in there.
Thanks for all the mounting advice and sharing your horror stories. Sounds like it could have been alot wor$e.
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TMB130SS 5.1" f/7 apo
C6-R 6" f/8
ASGT Goto+GPS
Coulter Odyssey I 13.1" f/4.5
Coronado PST
Seibert BN 21mm Binoviewers, TV Nagler EPs
9 guitars, 4 amps, 2 beagles
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Jack Knetzger
member
Reged: 12/04/07
Posts: 34
Loc: Plano, TX
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No, not the C6-R, it's still has the same crack, but I've been using it every clear night.
Nope, I'm getting a new 5" refractor OTA tomorrow (see sig). Had to downsize
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TMB130SS 5.1" f/7 apo
C6-R 6" f/8
ASGT Goto+GPS
Coulter Odyssey I 13.1" f/4.5
Coronado PST
Seibert BN 21mm Binoviewers, TV Nagler EPs
9 guitars, 4 amps, 2 beagles
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AV in CMH
sage
Reged: 11/07/05
Posts: 262
Loc: Columbus Ohio
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What is the view like?
Ever consider masking just he area damaged?
Good luck with your next scope.
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chazcheese
professor emeritus
Reged: 11/21/04
Posts: 545
Loc: Phoenix, Az
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Oh man this brings back bad memories. I had an Orion 4" Mak with a stripped bolt/screw on the mounting block (I didn't know this at the time), found out when I mounted the Mak on my Sanford/Davis mount and didn't tighten the locking screws on the alt/az. Well of course the mount tipped forward when I let go after tightening the 1/4x20 screw, it was like slow motion the Mak just dropped corrector first onto the cement sidewalk...CRACK!!! Completly shattered the corrector, but the mounting block was still on the mount? Called Orion the next day and they quickly sent me a return shipping number and sent a new 4" Mak at the same time, recieved the new Mak three days later and then a couple of days after that Orion called and confirmed that the screw was indeed stripped. Did I mention that the original Mak was a second and that Orion sent me a new one, that's awsome service if you ask me. Needless to say from that day on I check and double check all locks are locked and all screws are tight before I do any observing. Man thats a horrible sound that expensive glass makes when falling on something hard.
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chuck
10" Orion xt
8" Meade LX200 mount/2080 OTA
C4R on CG5
Vixen ED80Sf on Porta Mount
AT-1010
PST
12X63 mini giants
15x70 Skymasters
Virgo Bino mount on Sanford/Davis tripod
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Time on my hands
sage
Reged: 07/07/06
Posts: 255
Loc: Central Oregon
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Quote:
Nope, I'm getting a new 5" refractor OTA tomorrow (see sig). Had to downsize
That is a rather drastic way to solve the problem but I hope we will be happy with the new OTAs! My C6R is great but I am looking for FABULOUS! Latest word on mine is arrival in Portland (150 miles away) at dinner time Friday with a projected delivery of Monday. Hot sunny weekend forecast with RAIN moving in Tuesday and continuing through the rest of the week. Figures 
Did you ever hear from Celestron?
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Thomas
TMB 130 SS [Delivered 5/19, waiting for clear sky]
C6-R/Atlas [Favorite]
127 Mak/AT Voyager [Grab and Go]
NexStar 8 GPS XLT
Firstscope 80EQ
I LOVE hard work...I could watch it all day long!
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