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Equipment Discussions >> Video and Electronically Assisted Astronomy

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Mr. Bill
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Reged: 02/09/05
Posts: 2487
Loc: Just passing through.....
Re: Analog Video Technology (Part 6a) new [Re: ccs_hello]
      #2105138 - 01/08/08 11:22 AM

And they say a picture's worth a thousand words....



--------------------
Mr. Bill

Oberwerk 100BT 45 degree + Hercules fork mount
15x70 AP binos + Paragon p-mount
120mm f/5 Orion achromat + Moonlite focuser
140mm f/5.7 Vixen NeoAchro Petzvel refractor
150mm f/6.5 Antares achromat
150mm f/8 "bent" homemade achromat
8 inch Orion newt with f/5 Swayze mirror
10 inch f/4.7 Orion newt + Paracorr
15 inch f/5 Discovery split tube
26mm Nagler, 17mm Nagler, 13mm Ethos, 8mm Ethos
Member IDA

"Life's too short to look through "almost as good" eyepieces"



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jayscheuerle
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Reged: 01/16/06
Posts: 2739
Loc: S. Philadelphia, PA
Re: Analog Video Technology (Part 6a) new [Re: Mr. Bill]
      #2105293 - 01/08/08 12:38 PM

A great tool for both setting up monitors and evaluating them is the THX Optimizer DVD, which includes a multi-burst signal.

info here.

This is available on DVDs that have been THX certified (I use mine from Pixar's "The Incredibles" DVD. There's a list of DVD's that have the test on the site.

This is also a nice tool to use when taking pictures of your monitors like the ones posted here. Apples to apples, so to speak. - j

--------------------


12" Green Goblin (trusser w/Protstar secondary and OWL refigured primary)
6" f/5 Eero2 ball-scope
6" f/5 Frankenscope
Garrett Optical 10x50 binos
Edmund 8" yoke-mounted red-tube reflector
Edmund 6" GEQ red-tube reflector (on loan to Dad)

Facts are stubborn things.


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Alicatt
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Reged: 03/28/07
Posts: 95
Loc: Wick, Scotland / Eksel, Belgiu...
Re: Analog Video Technology (Part 6a) new [Re: jayscheuerle]
      #2105507 - 01/08/08 02:24 PM

I use Digital Video Essentials to set up mine and to set up my home theater system and video projector I also use a Spyder Pro monitor calibration tool to set up my computer monitors / Projector.
Joe Kane's Video Essentials
Spyder Pro 2


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jayscheuerle
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Re: Analog Video Technology (Part 6a) new [Re: Alicatt]
      #2105766 - 01/08/08 04:31 PM

Nice stuff, Alicatt. Does the Spyder work with non-VGA analog monitors?

The Joe Kane's Video Essentials looks similar to the THX Optimizer.

--------------------


12" Green Goblin (trusser w/Protstar secondary and OWL refigured primary)
6" f/5 Eero2 ball-scope
6" f/5 Frankenscope
Garrett Optical 10x50 binos
Edmund 8" yoke-mounted red-tube reflector
Edmund 6" GEQ red-tube reflector (on loan to Dad)

Facts are stubborn things.


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Alicatt
member


Reged: 03/28/07
Posts: 95
Loc: Wick, Scotland / Eksel, Belgiu...
Re: Analog Video Technology (Part 6a) new [Re: jayscheuerle]
      #2106049 - 01/08/08 06:45 PM

it works through USB so should, it works with my projector is DVI / HDMI HD 720p with also component, S-Video and composite NTSC/PAL.
I'll have to dig out a THX cert disk and have a look.


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skyguy88
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Reged: 11/13/06
Posts: 61
Re: Analog Video Technology (Part 6a) new [Re: ccs_hello]
      #2146135 - 01/25/08 11:20 PM

Quote:

Bill,

Mine is KWorld 1440 TV Box. For the test, I fed signal into its composite input but not noticed C-signal leakage into the Y-channel.
I have not yet noticed difference on composite vs. S-video. Probably I am not "exercising" it hard enough .

But I would not say that specific box is THE determining factor. I think the computer monitor resolution is the key factor. Its resolution is much, much better than a traditional LCD video monitor . This leaves a lot of headroom for the 'converter" box.

I have a hunch that the new winner is already here and it's cheap.
In the 2007 BF sale a month ago, there was a 19" Wide LCD HDTV on sale for $199 in C.C. (normal price $230-$270.) That device has an ATSC digital tuner, a NTSC tuner, composite/S-video/component/HDMI inputs, and computer VGA input. That is all-in-one contained within one LCD display. But I ran out the $ ...
Well, price will drop on these LCD monitors anyway.

Clear Skies!

ccs_hello




ccs,

I just tried a kworld 1680ex tuner box on a 20 inch (4 X 3) desktop monitor. Great combination. I had previously tried the 20 inch as well as a couple of 17 inch monitors driven by the output of my laptop. Those were disappointing. The new combination displaying the MCH s video output is a big step forward. Unfortunately, my first test was cut short by a heavy dose of frost. I did get a good look at M42 and M1 before the ice came and the views were spectacular. I do a lot of public events so I am interested in the biggest display that I can use effectively. This looks like a winner. And when I'm not using the monitor, It does a really nice job as a TV set. Altogether, a well spent $70.

Bill


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skyguy88
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Reged: 11/13/06
Posts: 61
Re: Analog Video Technology (Part 6a) new [Re: skyguy88]
      #2146187 - 01/25/08 11:49 PM

I should mention that my experience with kworld has not been what I might have hoped. I'm delighted with what the product does but their qc needs help. The system shipped with batteries for the remote control. They were dead. The dc adaptor had damaged leads. I spent a lot of time trying to find a 5 volt dc supply. I was ready to send the whole thing back when I found a 5v adaptor in the bottom of an old junk box. Meanwhile, Tiger direct had no interest in helping me to get an adaptor from Kworld and Kworld still hasn't responded to my email after almost 2 weeks.
Nonetheless, I'm delighted with the way the tuner works on the MCH. I'll post more impressions the next time the sky clears.

Bill


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ccs_hello
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Reged: 07/03/04
Posts: 2686
Re: Analog Video Technology (Part 7a) new [Re: ccs_hello]
      #2201908 - 02/19/08 01:30 AM

Part 7a

I'd like to discuss converting analog video into digital format for storage/record-keeping, post-processing, or printing purposes.
This is commonly known as video capturing.

First, few caveats:
- There are many video capture cards/devices with various designs/quality/models-versions
- even with the same vendor and same model number, the chipset may change, the included internal memory size may change, and the software driver may change
- software driver may not work correctly and/or may crash your PC occasionally
- when low compression rate, high spatial resolution, and high frame rate options are chosen, it adds a lot of load on the bus where data is transferred, on the CPU, on the
memory consumption, and on the harddisk access rate/usage


Still feel compelled, then check vendor's return policy and start experiment

================================================================

For a color video camera running in long exposure mode (e.g., 1 second exposure), IMO, there really isn't worthwhile to perform full video capture. Note that In one second interval, NTSC video has approx. 60 fields or 30 frames while a 1-sec long-exposure video has:
- one useful-new information frame and 29 identical (redundant) frames, or
- one useful-new information field and 59 identical (redundant) field*

* In long exposure mode color video camera, a field-integration mode on interline-interlaced CCD is used. After that read-out, the next field no longer has information from CCD to use, so it has to replay the previous field's information, and so do the next 58 fields, i.e., 29 * {odd field + even field}.
The visual proof is in one of the Astro Video Image Gallery picture where a plane flew by causing a slanted line. Using pixel peeping (and discount the JPEG artifacts), the line showed double-line structure, and when jumping to the next line grid, it's always in a 2-line unit fashion.


It is quite ironic. In early days, built-in compression (even a partial function) capture devices are highly desirable, can have a very high price tag, and were very hard to find.
In recent days, for astro video capture application, low or minimum compression capture devices are highly desirable, can have a high price tag (due to supply and demand), and the reliable ones are very hard to find.


Next section I will try to explain the format and interface methods.


Clear Skies!

ccs_hello


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ccs_hello
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Posts: 2686
Re: Analog Video Technology (Part 6a) new [Re: jayscheuerle]
      #2251747 - 03/11/08 11:20 PM

I'd like to add another possible test pattern source, in addition to:
- use a professional video test pattern generator
- use the video test DVD (check your library as well

Another option, if PC's VGA card has a NTSC analog video out connector:

I would suggest go to this site:
http://www.lynxxx.nl/barco/downloads/index.html

Download this file:
http://www.lynxxx.nl/barco/downloads/crtat2.zip

then run the "crtat" program to see various patterns it can generate.

Also, please download your own copy of these patterns:
http://www.lynxxx.nl/barco/patterns/

Great job there!

Clear Skies!

ccs_hello


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Dnns_shrdn
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Reged: 11/02/07
Posts: 13
Loc: NW Oregon Coast
Re: Analog Video Technology (Part 6a) [Re: ccs_hello]
      #2403095 - 05/18/08 03:02 AM

Well after reading a good bit of this mahvelous treaties I must say this thickheaded old retired GI is still a bit confabulated as to what device to use. I have a Sony Hyper HAD color camera that I'm going to fiddle with and I want to feed the video to my laptop. Most of the devices I've looked at have tuners and FM and other do-dads. I just want something that will convert the (probably) NTSC video to something the laptop can display and record for later processing into an image that will pass as something in space.

--------------------
Dennis,
Coastal Oregon


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