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Mr Q
sage
Reged: 02/25/08
Posts: 330
Loc: N Central New Mexico
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edz - Just read a lot of the sticky posts on binoculars at the head of this forum and was amazed at statement(s) that most binos have no way of adjusting the objective lenses for proper collimation.
I have owned four pairs of binos (all different manufactures) and each one had provisions for objective lens adjustment. I'm posting this info just in case this tip has not been posted before.
There is usually a rubber or plastic "guard" that screws onto the ends of each barrel to, I assume, protect the objective lenses when the binos are placed upright on a flat surface. On three of these binos, these "guard" coverings were removed by unscrewing them from the barrel body. Once removed, you can look at the inner edges of the objective lens holder. There, you will find a locking ring that's screwed down against the objective lens, holding it in place.
Each locking ring has two slots opposite each other, where a tool can be inserted to unscrew the ring. Great CARE must be taken so as not to scratch the lens while loosening the ring just enough to allow the lens to spin inside its housing. I carefully used a jeweler's screwdriver in each slot and gently tapped the angled screwdriver(s) so as to move the ring in a counter clockwise direction enough to unscrew it about 1/2 to 3/4 turns. Once done, the lens can be spun inside its housing for collimating (the lenses are concentric along their edges which allow for axial adjustment when spun in their holders).
To collimate each lens, I held the binos just below my eyes while I stared at the sky (a star) with infinity focus. Keeping this eye focus, I then placed the binos to my eyes and could detect the non-merging images, which your eyes try to converge by focusing in a different manner. Once the "infinity stare" is mastered, you can now spin each objective lense so as to converge the double star images. Sometimes both lenses had to be adjusted but usually only one needs to be adjusted. To spin the lens, I washed my finger tips with alcohol to remove any oils/acids and used my finger tips to spin the lenses while looking through the binos at a fairly bright star.
Once the objectives are adjusted properly, the locking rings can be re-tightened carefully to a "snugged-down" tightness to finish the collimation.
I never had to adjust the prism screws since the exit pupils were round in all the binos I collimated.
I found that this collimation method is quick, easy and though risking lense scratches, works very well. On one pair right from the store, one locking ring was loose while the others had to be collimated to some degree.
I hope this info helps those with a collimating problem and solves the mystery you have (?) regarding the adjustment of the objective lenses in most any brand binoculars (my Orion "Little Giant" 10x70s have these locking rings).
A well-collimated, Mr Q
-------------------- What goes around, comes around, eventually.
Meade DS-10(10" newt)
10x50, 10x70 binos
Edited by EdZ (05/27/08 01:21 PM)
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KennyJ
   
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 10031
Loc: Lancashire UK
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Mr.Q ,
There are special tools which ought to be used for the procedure which you describe .
Sadly , in the cases of most of the binoculars discussed in this forum , requiring alignment adjustments , spinning the objective lenses alone would NOT solve the problems encountered .
Kind Regards
Kenny
-------------------- Two eyes and a preference to use both
Zeiss 7 x 42 BGAT
Captain's Helmsman 7 x 50
Nikon 10 x 42 Superior E
Swift Audubon Kestrel 10 x 50
Helios 15 x 70 Observation
Strathspey 20 x 90
Televue 76 APO
Zeiss 85 Diascope
Helios 102 f5 refractor
Various eyepieces barlows tripods mounts etc.
Panasonic Lumix DMC - TZ5 digital camera
Edited by EdZ (05/27/08 01:22 PM)
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Mr Q
sage
Reged: 02/25/08
Posts: 330
Loc: N Central New Mexico
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Kenny - Since I have owned four different makes of binos, and all had tis adjustment feature, I assumed (wrongly?) that all binos had them. On three of the four binos I had, adjustment of the objectives in the manner I described solved the collimation problems very well. Mr Q
-------------------- What goes around, comes around, eventually.
Meade DS-10(10" newt)
10x50, 10x70 binos
Edited by EdZ (05/27/08 01:22 PM)
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KennyJ
   
Reged: 04/27/03
Posts: 10031
Loc: Lancashire UK
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Mr.Q.,
It could well BE that , in your case , the four binoculars concerned happened to be of an " older fashioned " ( read mechanically SUPERIOR ! ) design .
In which case , I truly hope so :-)
Kenny
-------------------- Two eyes and a preference to use both
Zeiss 7 x 42 BGAT
Captain's Helmsman 7 x 50
Nikon 10 x 42 Superior E
Swift Audubon Kestrel 10 x 50
Helios 15 x 70 Observation
Strathspey 20 x 90
Televue 76 APO
Zeiss 85 Diascope
Helios 102 f5 refractor
Various eyepieces barlows tripods mounts etc.
Panasonic Lumix DMC - TZ5 digital camera
Edited by EdZ (05/27/08 01:22 PM)
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EdZ
Professor EdZ
   
Reged: 02/15/02
Posts: 12345
Loc: Cumberland, R I , USA42N71.4W
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Many of the Chinese binoculars have a plastic retainer ring that is screwed and GLUED to hold the objective lens in place.
It would help if you would list the models that you are describing. I'm certain they are the exception and not the rule. Of the 50-60 binoculars I've owned, I can count on one (maybe two) hand(s) those that have an adjustable objective lens cell.
edz
-------------------- Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21
Edited by EdZ (05/27/08 01:23 PM)
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Mr Q
sage
Reged: 02/25/08
Posts: 330
Loc: N Central New Mexico
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edz - Since two of these pairs have been sold several years ago, all I can remember is that one was a Focal (?) 20x60 and the other pair (?), both bought at a department store chain, probably K-Mart.
The other two I presently have are a Focal 10x50 and Orion (Little Giant) 10x70. The present 10x50s did need some objective adjustment (metal locking rings) but the Orions, having no problems, have not been attempted to be adjusted so they may have cemented rings but they look/feel like metal.
The tutorials at the head of this forum are very informative and I learned a lot from them. It seems that these four binos are indeed the exception to the rule as far as objective locking rings go. This would explain why the "tip" wasn't mentioned in the tutorials. Thanks for the info and enjoy reading this forum, since I augment my scope observing with bino observing. Mr Q
-------------------- What goes around, comes around, eventually.
Meade DS-10(10" newt)
10x50, 10x70 binos
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EdZ
Professor EdZ
   
Reged: 02/15/02
Posts: 12345
Loc: Cumberland, R I , USA42N71.4W
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typically, objective collimation is accomplished in better binoculars by eccentric rings that actually hold the objective in position, but allow tuning it to change the position of the center of the lens.
These various binoculars that simply have a retaining ring that can be loosened and retightened and that allow you to wiggle the objective lens are not really intended to be adjusted at the objective. You get lucky if you have just enough room to center objectives in this instance.
I have a pair of older Celestron 20x80s that I and trying to center this way. What makes it more difficult is the retaining ring is on the inside. So the entire objective lens cell must be removed to tighten/loosen the retaining ring. The objective can be moved ever so slightly.
edz
-------------------- Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21
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Mr Q
sage
Reged: 02/25/08
Posts: 330
Loc: N Central New Mexico
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edz - Thanks for the info. As usual, on CN, you always seem to learn something new on each visit. Years ago when I bought a pair of 10x50s on sale at a department store, one of the objectives were loose (locking ring) but a quick adjustment made them good to go. My friend was interested in getting the same model on sale and did so. Sure enough, the objectives were out of alignment and after another quick adjusting, they too were good afterwards. Today? No more buy, bring home and test, unless a no questions asked return policy is in effect! I was always satisfied with the binos I had bought over the years but with the info in this forum? Now I'm seeing more and more defects in design and alignment right from the factory but so far, my present binos seem to be good enough for my observing. Sometimes more knowledge can be a mixed blessing indeed! Mr Q
-------------------- What goes around, comes around, eventually.
Meade DS-10(10" newt)
10x50, 10x70 binos
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DJB
Pooh-Bah
Reged: 02/23/05
Posts: 1225
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Hi EdZ,
I have several older models that use the objective rings. By several, I mean seven. However, the point is that these are older models--not too common today. I concure.
Best regards, Dave.
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pcad
Pooh-Bah
   
Reged: 01/17/05
Posts: 1466
Loc: Connecticut
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Has anyone found prism adjustment screws on roof prism binoculars? What is the most common method for adjusting collimation for these models? The few I've had apart are mostly older or very inexpensive. They've all, without exception, been adjustable at the objectives. Is this still true in todays roof prism models?
Peter
-------------------- Peter
Telescopes 25 - 318 mm
Binoculars 15 - 88 mm
Microscope 50x - 1000x
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Mr. Bill
Carpal Tunnel
  
Reged: 02/09/05
Posts: 2614
Loc: Just passing through.....
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The correct tool for this job is pictured...a spanner wrench. I got mine from Edmund Optics. It comes with three tip pairs and two spanner bars, the long one will span 7 inches. I have found it an invaluable tool for working on my refractors.
As far as binoculars, my BT100 has an eccentric lens cell that could be rotated to correct for a centering misalignment, but I have never attempted this. I loosened the outer retaining ring that was overtightened to correct some astigmatism apparent in the left barrel at high power...43x.
BTW, I corrected for conditional collimation by using a illuminated reticle eyepiece, focusing and centering the crosshairs on a distant light in the valley below (6 miles away) and switching back and forth between barrels adjusting the non dominate eye barrel (in my case the left) against the dominate barrel, using the prism adjustments. This is quite precise and easy to do.
Checking against star images with one barrel defocused and the other focused shows the star superimposed and centered on the extrafocal image. This is IMO a good "quick and dirty" check for collimation and is more precise than Oberwerk's collimation procedure.
-------------------- Mr. Bill
10x50 Fujinon FMT-SX binos
15x70 AP binos + Paragon p-mount
Oberwerk 100BT 45 degree + Hercules fork mount
120mm f/5 Orion achromat + Moonlite focuser
140mm f/5.7 Vixen NeoAchro Petzvel refractor
150mm f/6.5 Antares achromat
150mm f/8 internal diagonal homemade achromat
8 inch newt with f/5 Swayze mirror
10 inch f/4.7 Orion newt + Paracorr
15 inch f/5 Discovery split tube
26mm Nagler, 17mm Nagler, 13mm Ethos, 8mm Ethos
Member IDA
Edited by Mr. Bill (05/28/08 05:33 PM)
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Mr. Bill
Carpal Tunnel
  
Reged: 02/09/05
Posts: 2614
Loc: Just passing through.....
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A picture of the binocular with the bezel removed. The retaining rings are clearly seen.
I loosened the outer ring to relieve some pinching....I assume the whole lens cell could be rotated using the inner retaining ring, but haven't attempted this. If you wanted to do this, I would suggest making a witness mark so you could get back to the original orientation.
-------------------- Mr. Bill
10x50 Fujinon FMT-SX binos
15x70 AP binos + Paragon p-mount
Oberwerk 100BT 45 degree + Hercules fork mount
120mm f/5 Orion achromat + Moonlite focuser
140mm f/5.7 Vixen NeoAchro Petzvel refractor
150mm f/6.5 Antares achromat
150mm f/8 internal diagonal homemade achromat
8 inch newt with f/5 Swayze mirror
10 inch f/4.7 Orion newt + Paracorr
15 inch f/5 Discovery split tube
26mm Nagler, 17mm Nagler, 13mm Ethos, 8mm Ethos
Member IDA
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StarStuff1
sage
   
Reged: 04/01/07
Posts: 403
Loc: East Tennessee
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Quote:
Has anyone found prism adjustment screws on roof prism binoculars?
Peter
About 14 years ago I purchased an new binocular, a Fujinon "2000" 7X35 porro model. Very nice for a small binoc. Foolishly I loaned them to a co-worker for his trip to the Indy 500. He dropped them on the concrete and knocked them out of alignment. I removed the covers off the top of the prisms to see if anything was loose. Voila! There were the collimating screws. Collimation was EZ.
Since then I have seen several Chinese porros with alignment screws. The only roof prism model that I have opened up was adjusted by turning the objective lens cells.
-------------------- Two dozen eyepieces, a dozen binoculars, a half dozen refractors, two reflectors and a homemade Image Intensifier Eyepiece (IIE). All products subject to change by the owner at any time.
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BillC
on a new path
   
Reged: 06/04/04
Posts: 2082
Loc: Washington, USA
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INTERESTING. In speaking with people who have several binos with eccentric ring collimation adjustments (cept for the cheapese), you'll probably hear things like: "What's a collimation thread?"
Please excuse them. They probably have never needed to know.
Cheers,
Bill
-------------------- William J. Cook, Chief Opticalman, USNR-Ret.
Founding Editor, Amateur Telescope Making Journal
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ronharper
scholastic sledgehammer
Reged: 02/14/06
Posts: 964
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One reason roofs (at least the common Schmidt-Pechan prism type) are so "rugged" is that the path of light though the prism is not dependent upon the orientation of the prism. So tweaking the prisms, were it possible, wouldn't do anything. Neither would a slight prism shift from a good slam.
It is unfortunate that things have got to a state where miscollimation is a common problem. That is surely the worst problem a binocular can have, that I can think of. How can you possibly critique color cast, for example, when your eyes are killing you? But there are many slightly worse, but not adjustable, problems that people could be complaining about, if only their binoculars were properly collimated. Maybe miscollimation is a blessing in disguise. Ron
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pcad
Pooh-Bah
   
Reged: 01/17/05
Posts: 1466
Loc: Connecticut
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Thanks Ron and Bill,
I thought the same thing about the S-P roof prism binoculars. Objective based collimation is much more common than we think since most of the roof prism binos use it. The astronomical community prefers porro binoculars and so we see prism based collimation adjustments, and the need for adjusting the prisms, all too often.
Peter
-------------------- Peter
Telescopes 25 - 318 mm
Binoculars 15 - 88 mm
Microscope 50x - 1000x
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