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BobinKy
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Reged: 04/27/07
Posts: 856
Loc: Country road
Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: EdZ]
      #2474850 - 06/21/08 07:49 PM

Quote:

EdZ wrote:

Craig is currently working on a book about the ancient Babylonian constellations. He has also begun work on a book about the Milky Way.




This looks very interesting. Can you tell us more?

--------------------
Bob
38° Kentucky, USA



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btschumy
Think Astronomy
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Reged: 04/13/04
Posts: 1102
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Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition [Re: EdZ]
      #2476803 - 06/22/08 09:04 PM

I have also been in contact with Craig Crossen and I can confirm what Ed says. There is indeed some disagreement between Mr. Crossen and Willmann-Bell. Crossen believes this book to be unauthorized. I'm a big fan of Crossen's books but I will not be purchasing this edition.

--------------------
Bill Tschumy
Where is M13? Freeware -- Add a new dimension to your observing.


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Rick Woods
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Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: btschumy]
      #2573917 - 08/11/08 09:21 AM

This subject has also come up on the Stellar Media forum. Rather than repeat things we've been told, I wonder if we could persuade Mr. Crossen to comment in his own words on the legitimacy (or lack thereof) of the "Second Edition" of Binocular Astronomy? If, as I understand to be the case, the new book is being misrepresented as a work of his, then his side of the story should be told.

Mr. Crossen, what's the deal with this new book? And will there be a genuine second edition that IS authorized?
Thanks!

--------------------
- Rick
14" LX200GPS
8" Meade 826C


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Crossen
member


Reged: 07/14/08
Posts: 20
Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: Rick Woods]
      #2574160 - 08/11/08 11:32 AM

I have had nothing to do with the preparation of the book Willmann-Bell is advertizing as a 2nd edition of "Binocular Astronomy". The reason is simply that Willmann-Bell stopped paying my royalties on the original edition of the book in the autumn of 2005 (though, I've been told, Wil Tirion has continued to receive his half of the royalties). There is a contract; but if Willmann-Bell took a legal action to set its provisions aside, I wasn't informed--let alone given a chance to defend myself.
In April of last year (2007) Willmann-Bell sent an e-mail message to me (copying Wil Tirion and Robert Reeves) stating their intention of doing a 2nd edition of Binocular Astronomy with or without me. In that message they explained to Wil and Robert that they were withholding my royalties because they believe "Sky Vistas" is a competing book with "Binocular Astronomy." Anticipating my response, they said that if I did not cooperate, they would hire what they called "highly competent talent" to redo the book, charging the expense to me--which, because they were already confiscating my royalties, was an empty threat.
Now, I have not seen this so-called 2nd edition of Binoc Astro and therefore cannot make any statements about it. The old edition, having been written in the mid-to-late 1980s, was badly out-of-date in both astronomical data and in constellation history (though not in the basic observations, of course). The same would be true of any old manuscripts of mine that were still sitting around Willmann-Bell's offices: the most recent astronomical data in those texts dates to the late 1980s and early 1990s before Hubble and Hipparcos flew; and the constellation history material in them has been outdated by my own more recent research in that area. Willmann-Bell announced this unauthorized 2nd edition in May of this spring, barely a year after threatening to get "highly competent talent" to redo the book. It is my opinion that it would be impossible for any mercenary to do all the research necessary to update Binoc Astro, and then rewrite the book, in a year. But I suppose anything is possible. However, there is a good deal on constellation history that would be out-of-date or incomplete anyway since that material has not yet been published by me.
To answer Mr. Woods question about an authorized 2nd edition of Binoc Astro: Yes, one is in the process of being written: the Autumn Chapter has been completed and several people have already seen and commented upon it. Gerald Rhemann has agreed to supply photos for it in B&W (to keep the cost of the book down). However, under the present circumstances I doubt that any American publisher, fearing a nuisance law-suit from Willmann-Bell, would publish it. That means that it will have to be published abroad.
I hope these statements will clarify the status of "Binocular Astronomy." From the reactions of the readers of my sample chapter on the Autumn Constellations, I believe that the authorized 2nd edition of "Binocular Astronomy" will have all the virtues of the first edition but plenty of new virtues of its own.

Craig Crossen

Edited by Crossen (08/11/08 11:42 AM)


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EdZModerator
Professor EdZ
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Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: Crossen]
      #2574327 - 08/11/08 12:43 PM

Thanks Craig for your first hand response. In the mean time, forum members might seaarch out a copy of "Sky Vistas", by Crossen and Rhemann. Not similar to Binocular Astronomy, but outstanding in its own right.

edz

--------------------
Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21


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KennyJ

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Posts: 9799
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Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: EdZ]
      #2574412 - 08/11/08 01:26 PM

We are much indebted to you , Craig , for your honest and forthright summary of this , it must be said , somewhat unsavoury and unsatisfactory state of affairs .

I'm sure all members here will join me in wishing you all the very best in all future publication which you authorize .

Kind regards
Kenny

--------------------
GRAND PRIZE for NON - INTELLECTUAL CONTRIBUTIONS
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GardnerPacificCA
super member


Reged: 07/26/07
Posts: 131
Loc: California, USA
Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: KennyJ]
      #2574542 - 08/11/08 02:32 PM

The Acknowledgements page and the back cover About This Book description sure appear to give credit to Craig Crossen for the Second Edition material. I just bought this 2nd Edition a couple weeks ago...

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All the best,

Gardner

Meade LX200R 10" UHTC GPS
Orion Astroview 120ST EQ
Canon 10x42L IS WP Binoculars


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Rick Woods
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Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: GardnerPacificCA]
      #2574618 - 08/11/08 03:19 PM

Evidently, the credit didn't extend to actually paying him.

--------------------
- Rick
14" LX200GPS
8" Meade 826C


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Wes James
Carpal Tunnel
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Reged: 04/12/06
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Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: Rick Woods]
      #2574626 - 08/11/08 03:23 PM

Quote:

Evidently, the credit didn't extend to actually paying him.




What a shame... doesn't speak well for Willmann-Bell. Not to mention that- according to Mr. Crossen- the statement is false to boot.
Wes


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Fiske
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 03/14/04
Posts: 1847
Loc: Missouri / United States
Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: Wes James]
      #2574891 - 08/11/08 05:18 PM

Craig:

Just want to say I have been a longtime fan of Binocular Astronomy. I have the first edition and think it is one of the best and most user-friendly guides to the night sky. I'm disappointed to learn that the Willmann-Bell people have behaved in this manner and will not be purchasing the second edition. Good luck with the new books you are working on!

--------------------

Fiske Miles
Nikon 8x42 LX / 12x50 SE Binos
Mini Borg 60ED, TV-101, AT80Ach, XT-8, C11/CI-700, 22-Inch Dob
Way too many Nagler eyepieces
http://www.fiskemiles.blogspot.com/
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BobinKy
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 04/27/07
Posts: 856
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Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: Crossen]
      #2575201 - 08/11/08 07:42 PM

Craig--

[I asked this same question in the Stellar Media thread.]

Do you have any plans to publish your research of ancient Mesopotamian astronomy?

--------------------
Bob
38° Kentucky, USA



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Crossen
member


Reged: 07/14/08
Posts: 20
Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: BobinKy]
      #2580546 - 08/14/08 09:34 AM

To BobinKy:
A few years ago I completed an illustrated text on the relationship between the Greek and the Mesopotamian heavens and star-myths--but I regarded it as a work-in-progress. It was publishable as it stood--but since then I have discovered so much more that it needs to be revised. Its basic approach--which has never been done even in scholarly literature--is the original Mesopotamian forms of the Greek constellations, thereby establishing (with the help of some Mesopotamian texts--and a little archaeology too) how many of the 51 constellations we have inherited from the Greeks originated in Mesopotamia.
I think the ideal way for me to publish this material would be in two forms: a scholarly book (with all the scholarly apparatus that such books need) and as a series of articles in one of the magazines--12 articles, each focused on one zodiacal constellation and the area of the sky around it. The text as it now stands is someplace between scholarly and popular and I'm not sure it doesn't fall between the two stools. However, I think it's been a long time since even Sky&Tel did a long-running series of this sort: and from what I've seen in the magazines (and from what I read in the recent CN forum about the magazines) the kind of article series I have in mind doesn't fit well in the present editorial philosophies of either magazine. But I admit I haven't yet run the idea past Sky&Tel--mostly because I wouldn't have the time right now to rewrite the book, or to write a series of articles.
Anyway, that's where things stand on that project. Thanks for asking.

Craig Crossen


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Txiasaeia
newbie


Reged: 08/13/08
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Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: Crossen]
      #2580704 - 08/14/08 11:02 AM

Craig, what you've got there sounds absolutely fascinating. This year I'll be doing "Mythology of the Week" and "Mythology of the Solar System" units with my grade 9 and 10 English students, respectively. Since I've also done ANE poetry in the past with a few higher level classes, it would be very interesting to draw in Mesopotamian star-myths too. (I know it sounds strange to combine English lit and astronomy, but from where I'm sitting, I'm much more interested in the mythology behind astronomy than the physics.)

If you ever decide to publish your work, whether as a book or as articles, please let us know! I'd be very, very interested in reading what you've written.


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Fiske
Carpal Tunnel


Reged: 03/14/04
Posts: 1847
Loc: Missouri / United States
Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: Txiasaeia]
      #2580794 - 08/14/08 11:41 AM

I was a lit major in colledge. Combining astronomy with English sounds GREAT to me!



--------------------

Fiske Miles
Nikon 8x42 LX / 12x50 SE Binos
Mini Borg 60ED, TV-101, AT80Ach, XT-8, C11/CI-700, 22-Inch Dob
Way too many Nagler eyepieces
http://www.fiskemiles.blogspot.com/
www.fiskemiles.com


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Jay_Bird
professor emeritus
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Reged: 01/04/06
Posts: 657
Loc: Nevada 36N 115W
Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: Fiske]
      #2581087 - 08/14/08 01:49 PM

I really look forward to seeing the book, and such a series of monthly or quarterly articles - I hope that such a series in S&T does work out.

I've wondered if the magazines could add space for one more column each month, split between 2 or 3 authors & topics, to allow several new bimonthly or quarterly features in that space... your updated mythology feature is a great example of what could be added, even if it took a 2-year cycle to cover the sky.

--------------------
'these things stand like stone - kindness in another's troubles, courage in your own' Gordon


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Shortymx
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Reged: 10/31/07
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Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: Crossen]
      #2581147 - 08/14/08 02:15 PM

Mr. Crossen has responded to the question of his authorization of the "second edition". It would be interesting to hear Willman-Bell's coments also.

--------------------
Shortymx


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EdZModerator
Professor EdZ
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Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: Shortymx]
      #2581699 - 08/14/08 06:09 PM

Quote:

Mr. Crossen has responded to the question of his authorization of the "second edition". It would be interesting to hear Willman-Bell's coments also.




Although, if so, we would take extra special care to not have a public viewing of private matters. It is not usual to have an airing of differences, however the question was asked so I allowed it.

But keep in mind, what all sounds like great suspense material that people thrive on is not necessarily the best for a public forum.

edz

--------------------
Teach a kid something today. The feeling you'll get is one of life's greatest rewards.
member#21


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BobinKy
scholastic sledgehammer


Reged: 04/27/07
Posts: 856
Loc: Country road
Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: Crossen]
      #2581879 - 08/14/08 07:48 PM

Craig--

Thank you for speaking on your research of ancient Mesopotamian astronomy. What you described in the post above is much needed in both scholarly literature and popular literature, as you stated. You know more about this than me, but a publisher on the periphery of astronomy, such as National Geographic, may provide the publishing support (articles and book format) to reach an interesting blend of historic, scientific, popular, and general readership. I join the others here who hope you publish your research some day.

--------------------
Bob
38° Kentucky, USA



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Crossen
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Reged: 07/14/08
Posts: 20
Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: BobinKy]
      #2588140 - 08/18/08 10:27 AM

I would like to thank all those who wrote the encouraging posts above. This is the kind of thing an author likes to carry into a publishers' office with a new manuscript! (or, these days, to e-mail with the electronic text.)

My 'day job' is editing books and articles for scholars and journalists here in Vienna who want to publish in English, and right now I'm booked solid through November. But when I can see the surface of my desk again I will take up the problems of rewriting my constellation history manuscript and how and where to publish it.

I've had a tendency to drag my feet about finishing the book because I keep finding new information. For example, I've long known that the image of the Winged Horse came to Greece from Mesopotamia. But that does not necessarily mean that the constellation itself did. My assumption was that the constellation of Pegasus was a Greek invention. But just two weeks ago, while rereading a journal article, I realized that I had in my hands the necessary evidence that the constellation of Pegasus was indeed invented in Mesopotamia.

It's very hard, with I book of this nature, to say, "Well, that's it. Finished!"--because in your heart you know it really isn't and never will be.

Thanks again.

Craig Crossen


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Joe Ogiba
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Re: Binocular Astronomy, Second Edition new [Re: Crossen]
      #2588475 - 08/18/08 01:25 PM

Craig,

Great job on the first edition.

Joe


--------------------
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